Question How should I connect my fans ?

[lojikal]

yeah even still the U12A in Australia is $230aud vs $150aud for the cooler master 240mm AIO the OP posted ..
mind you im not a fan of cooler master AIO's personally they use the grooved cold plate not shiny smooth !!

I often tend to recommend Noctua not only for the quality coolers but the excellent customer support which is why I think they're somewhat priced on the high end.

 

[Excelso]

yeah even still the U12A in Australia is $230aud vs $150aud for the cooler master 240mm AIO the OP posted ..
mind you im not a fan of cooler master AIO's personally they use the grooved cold plate not shiny smooth !!

Well I didn't even find any U12A for sale in my country lol.
But yeah, any good Noctua cooler here costs R$ 1000+, while this Cooler Master was like R$ 400.

 

[ilukey77]

I often tend to recommend Noctua not only for the quality coolers but the excellent customer support which is why I think they're somewhat priced on the high end.

100% for air cooler noctua fantastic but to a point customer service is useless on a air cooler

I also used a deep cool ak 500 digital with the U12a fans in a push pull config i dare say on a 5800x3d the stock Deepcool AK 500 digital with its stock push fan will be great on 5800x3d

i payed 148aud from ali express no issues ..

In fairness with the push pull on the 7800x3d its temps were only a few degree higher than the NH U12A
and you get the temp readout and a little RGB on the fin stack cover !!

 

[ilukey77]

Well I didn't even find any U12A for sale in my country lol.
But yeah, any good Noctua cooler here costs R$ 1000+, while this Cooler Master was like R$ 400.

ali express Deepcool AK500 digital is another decent air cooler !

 

[Zerk2012]

Well I didn't even find any U12A for sale in my country lol.
But yeah, any good Noctua cooler here costs R$ 1000+, while this Cooler Master was like R$ 400.

Their way overpriced for that you get!
Any of these would work good not a clue what you can get for a decent price.

https://pcpartpicker.com/products/compare/CwqPxr,9T92FT,hYxRsY,GpbRsY/

I would put all of these above the u12a in performance

 

[ilukey77]

Their way overpriced for that you get!
Any of these would work good not a clue what you can get for a decent price.

https://pcpartpicker.com/products/compare/CwqPxr,9T92FT,hYxRsY,GpbRsY/

dual fin stack can get in the way .. noctua is the only company ive found that you know exactly what cooler works with what motherboard ..
as ive looked at most of them you listed and its a guessing game to which one would fit on my Rog crosshair x670e gene ..
Now 100% noctua is expensive but atleast you get some idea of fitment ..

The d15 on my board is hit and miss the deep cool assassin iv wont the ak620 fouls on the Gen z m.2 expansion that i use for extra space ..
so my reasoning on the U12a is it great fitment and the AK500 digital is bigger but did not foul on anything either !!

 

[Excelso]

I think I'll stick to my cheap Cooler Master AIO
It should be enough to my use case and it would be a pain to have it returned, wait an eternity for a refund and then buying another cooler and waiting for it to arrive.

 

[Zerk2012]

dual fin stack can get in the way .. noctua is the only company ive found that you know exactly what cooler works with what motherboard ..
as ive looked at most of them you listed and its a guessing game to which one would fit on my Rog crosshair x670e gene ..
Now 100% noctua is expensive but atleast you get some idea of fitment ..

The d15 on my board is hit and miss the deep cool assassin iv wont the ak620 fouls on the Gen z m.2 expansion that i use for extra space ..
so my reasoning on the U12a is it great fitment and the AK500 digital is bigger but did not foul on anything either !!

100% wrong the only thing that matters is memory clearance.

The m.2 on that motherboard is below the memory slot so nothing like you said for him.

B550M AORUS ELITE (rev. 1.0/1.1/1.2) Key Features | Motherboard - GIGABYTE Global

Lasting Quality from GIGABYTE.GIGABYTE Ultra Durable™ motherboards bring together a unique blend of features and technologies that offer users the absolute ultimate platform for...

www.gigabyte.com

 

[lojikal]

100% wrong the only thing that matters is memory clearance.

+1.

 

[ilukey77]

100% wrong the only thing that matters is memory clearance.

maybe have a look at a rog crosshair x670e gene and tell my where to put my gen z m.2 expansion if it fouls with the cpu cooler !!

so not 100% wrong input that board into the noctua website and see what is says about which cooler works with which board some d15s dont etc etc..

tell me where on the sythe or deepcool website where it tells you which boards the fuma 2/ ak620 will work with ?

It doesnt !!

There is even a youtube video of someone putting a ak620 on a gene board that clears memory but sticks out past the memory which would obviously foul on the Gen z m.2 card !!

Unless you have personally used everyone of them coolers on the OP board its a guessing game !!

 

[ilukey77]

100% wrong the only thing that matters is memory clearance.

The m.2 on that motherboard is below the memory slot so nothing like you said for him.

B550M AORUS ELITE (rev. 1.0/1.1/1.2) Key Features | Motherboard - GIGABYTE Global

Lasting Quality from GIGABYTE.GIGABYTE Ultra Durable™ motherboards bring together a unique blend of features and technologies that offer users the absolute ultimate platform for...

www.gigabyte.com

my point is you have no definitive way of knowing if them coolers will fit 100% so making recommendations of dual tower coolers is not smart being as there is no info on any of there sites other than Noctua if they will fit 100%

would have thought a ambassador would give smarter advice !!

 

[Karadjgne]

Pump uses molex/Sata adapter directly to the psu.
AIO fans go to cpu_fan header.
Rear fan goes to sys_fan 1.
Front fans go to sys_fan 2.

but you have only got 3 fan headers right?
the AIO pump should always run at 100%
unless youre trying to run a 13900k with a 240mm rad the rad fans can be controlled by the system 1 or 2 fan header so they will not need full speed and you can still set a curve on the system 1 or 2 headers correct ?
and the rest of the fans can run at a set speed anyway ..

OR
100% dump the aio fans and pump fans together onto cpu fan header and they will all change together based on the cpu temp!!

I usually attach the aio pump to cpu fan header and the aio rad fans to a system fan header at a set speed to keep noise down and then link the rest of my fans to the last system fan header and set them at a decent fan speed !!

There's 2x problems with the 'OR'...
First is WHERE. Sys_fan headers get their temps from the motherboard components, case temps, so are essentially useless for cpu control, it's not hard to have 40°C case temps and 100°C cpu temps and the aio fans on the sys_fan header are running at less than half speed. Aio fans Must go to cpu_fan header to respond to cpu temps as needed.

Vendor directions are a 'cover your a**' situation. The older pumps generally had half the expected life of the fan, so we're pretty much going to fail first. Vendors put the pump on cpu_fan header because of the cpu security notification that if it detects rpm at 200 or below, it can/will refuse to boot to protect itself from overheat. Today's pumps are much better designed, longer expected lifespans that can exceed fan expected lifespan, so the better option for almost all circumstances is not Vendors covering their a**es but fans on cpu_fan and pump on sys/aux/pump_header or if must, psu direct.

The second is POWER. Almost all *_fan headers are 1A rated, which means 4x fans at most with many fans actually needing a powered splitter to get all 4x,per header. You take a major risk by using 5x fans or more on any *_fan header, so mixing front 3x and pump, aio and pump, 3x front and 2x aio fans, either way all on 1x header is asking to burn up the motherboard.

 

[Excelso]

Ok guys, searching in another threads I found this post.
Is this person correct? If I connect the rad fans and the pump with a splitter to the cpu_fan header, will the pump be monitored and run at 100% while the fans can still be controlled by the cpu temperature?
If so, this is the perfect fit, ain't it?

 

[lojikal]

Ok guys, searching in another threads I found this post.
Is this person correct? If I connect the rad fans and the pump with a splitter to the cpu_fan header, will the pump be monitored and run at 100% while the fans can still be controlled by the cpu temperature?
If so, this is the perfect fit, ain't it?

Good Morning Excelso. Yes that could also work.

 

[Excelso]

Good Morning Excelso. Yes that could also work.

So just do be extra sure.
I connect the two rad fans with each other using the Y splitter that comes with the AIO, then I connect them with the pump using another Y splitter that I have, plugging the pump in the 4 pin header, then I connect the end on the cpu_fan header.
And by doing that, no matter what the rad fans speed is set at, the pump will always go 100%? I didn't know 3 pin connectors worked like that xD

 

[Karadjgne]

Ok guys, searching in another threads I found this post.
Is this person correct? If I connect the rad fans and the pump with a splitter to the cpu_fan header, will the pump be monitored and run at 100% while the fans can still be controlled by the cpu temperature?
If so, this is the perfect fit, ain't it?

No. Never put the pump and fans under the same header control. The way it works is there are 4 pins in the header, 4 wires on 1 side of the Y and 3 wires on the other. That's 12v, G, tach, pwm. The component gets 12v and G, the motherboard reads the rpm on the tach, bios determines whether the rpm needs to go up or down according to temp presented and changes the pwm signal to match.

If you put pump and fan on the same splitter, either the fan or the pump will be connected to tach and pwm will change both simultaneously the same percentage.

So if the pump has a 40%-100% range, and the fan has a 20%-100% range, at idle the fan is going to be close to 20% speed, and the pump will be at the exact same % speed, meaning the pump is Not working at all until the temp rises high enough to spin the fan at greater than 40%. Or vice versa.

And many of the lower end pumps are designed to run at 100%, no control. Also take into consideration that the pump has a motor load that's @ 200ma for a basic pump and that can double or triple with led or oled pump screen varieties. Most fans are by themselves @ 200ma, 300ma+ for rgb fans, so a 240mm AIO with rgb and rgb pump can easily be right at or above the 1000ma rating for a header.

Pump to psu.
Fans to cpu-fan.

 

[Excelso]

No. Never put the pump and fans under the same header control. The way it works is there are 4 pins in the header, 4 wires on 1 side of the Y and 3 wires on the other. That's 12v, G, tach, pwm. The component gets 12v and G, the motherboard reads the rpm on the tach, bios determines whether the rpm needs to go up or down according to temp presented and changes the pwm signal to match.

If you put pump and fan on the same splitter, either the fan or the pump will be connected to tach and pwm will change both simultaneously the same percentage.

So if the pump has a 40%-100% range, and the fan has a 20%-100% range, at idle the fan is going to be close to 20% speed, and the pump will be at the exact same % speed, meaning the pump is Not working at all until the temp rises high enough to spin the fan at greater than 40%. Or vice versa.

And many of the lower end pumps are designed to run at 100%, no control. Also take into consideration that the pump has a motor load that's @ 200ma for a basic pump and that can double or triple with led or oled pump screen varieties. Most fans are by themselves @ 200ma, 300ma+ for rgb fans, so a 240mm AIO with rgb and rgb pump can easily be right at or above the 1000ma rating for a header.

Pump to psu.
Fans to cpu-fan.

My pump doesn't have the 4th pin, so from my understanding, it won't get any pwm signal and will just run at 100% no matter what. Isn't that right?
Also I can be totally wrong but I thought the leds took energy from the argb header.

 

[Karadjgne]

How many wires on your pump wire? Normally there's 3/4 or 1, depending on whether it gets power from the header or power from Sata, the single wire being the tach, which if the pump is Sata powered, it doesn't require a tach at all, that's just for cpu_fan hookup for security.

RGB isn't always rgb. The older led fans get power from the fan, many rgb fans get 12v from the fan since the RGB is controlled from the ground side, and there's multiple cheap case fans that look like they are argb, but are in fact nothing more than led fans with colored leds that do not change colors. Some fans were even RGBW, since Bright White is next to impossible to reproduce with RGB, only ARGB or DRGB has that inate capability, so the RGB was header powered but the voltage for the W came from the fan.

With RGB there's no exacting standards, not like there is with Sata or usb, it's only recently that ppl are adopting a more uniform design so they can sell their stuff to multiple motherboard designs instead of being proprietary like everyone was at the beginning. Advertising will often say RGB, but show a picture of a rainbow fan, which is ARGB, totally different wiring.

My rule of thumb is to expect the worst, every time, plan on it, and if or when the worst doesn't happen, bonus.

 

[Excelso]

How many wires on your pump wire? Normally there's 3/4 or 1, depending on whether it gets power from the header or power from Sata, the single wire being the tach, which if the pump is Sata powered, it doesn't require a tach at all, that's just for cpu_fan hookup for security.

RGB isn't always rgb. The older led fans get power from the fan, many rgb fans get 12v from the fan since the RGB is controlled from the ground side, and there's multiple cheap case fans that look like they are argb, but are in fact nothing more than led fans with colored leds that do not change colors. Some fans were even RGBW, since Bright White is next to impossible to reproduce with RGB, only ARGB or DRGB has that inate capability, so the RGB was header powered but the voltage for the W came from the fan.

With RGB there's no exacting standards, not like there is with Sata or usb, it's only recently that ppl are adopting a more uniform design so they can sell their stuff to multiple motherboard designs instead of being proprietary like everyone was at the beginning. Advertising will often say RGB, but show a picture of a rainbow fan, which is ARGB, totally different wiring.

My rule of thumb is to expect the worst, every time, plan on it, and if or when the worst doesn't happen, bonus.

I really don't understand your point.
I have everything listed on my first post. My AIO model have a pump with a 3 pin header, so when it is connected to a pwm header it'll get constant 12V without a pwm signal to regulate it, so it'll run 100% full speed.
At the same time, by connecting it together with the fans using a splitter, I can ensure that the fans are still controlled by the cpu temperature, they just won't send signal back to the mb to report failure, instead the PUMP will, which I find totally fine because I can just look inside my case to see if the fans are working or not, but I want my pump to be monitored closely by the system.
About the leds, its model specifically says "ML240L V2 ARGB", which is just the V2 model but instead of 12V RGB leds, it comes with 5V ARGB ones.
Looking at my motherboard's manual, it says each d_led header can provide a total of 5A (5V), or 5000 leds total, which I definitely do NOT have.

I just didn't know how a 3 pin connector works, I thought that if I connected it together with some 4 pin fans it would get it's speed changed together, but further research proved that so long I set the header to pwm mode on the bios, the pump will just run full load all the time.

 

[Karadjgne]

Ok. A pwm splitter has 2 cables. 1x cable has 4 wires, a 12v+,G, tach and pwm signal. The other cable has 3 wires, 12v+, G, pwm signal.

When you put 2x pwm fans on a splitter, the header only receives 1 tach reading, there's only 1 tach wire, but sends the pwm signal to both fans.

Your pump is not pwm, it's analog. It has 12v+, G, tach. Your fans are pwm. If you put the fans on the 4wire side, the rpm of the fans gets read on the tach and changed by pwm. The pump has zero affect or monitor since there is no tach for it on the 3 wire side of the splitter, the connection kills the tach feed. It's the fan that gets monitored.

If you put the pump on the 4wire side, to use the tach to monitor pump rpm, it kills the pwm signal, there's nothing to control the fans as the tach doesn't change under a pwm header. If you change the header to analog/voltage then the pump rpm can be changed by voltage, but that also changes the fan rpm by voltage too.

A header only reads 1 input, only controls 1 output, that being whatever the pin location points to. If the pins point to a fan, everything pwm on the splitter is controlled and monitored as if it was that particular fan. An analog pump as control/monitor has zero ability for control as it has no pwm. So any pwm fans on the splitter whether it's a 2,3 or 4way splitter with ganged splitters afterwards, are stuck at 12v+ constant.

 

[Excelso]

Ok. A pwm splitter has 2 cables. 1x cable has 4 wires, a 12v+,G, tach and pwm signal. The other cable has 3 wires, 12v+, G, pwm signal.

When you put 2x pwm fans on a splitter, the header only receives 1 tach reading, there's only 1 tach wire, but sends the pwm signal to both fans.

Your pump is not pwm, it's analog. It has 12v+, G, tach. Your fans are pwm. If you put the fans on the 4wire side, the rpm of the fans gets read on the tach and changed by pwm. The pump has zero affect or monitor since there is no tach for it on the 3 wire side of the splitter, the connection kills the tach feed. It's the fan that gets monitored.

If you put the pump on the 4wire side, to use the tach to monitor pump rpm, it kills the pwm signal, there's nothing to control the fans as the tach doesn't change under a pwm header. If you change the header to analog/voltage then the pump rpm can be changed by voltage, but that also changes the fan rpm by voltage too.

A header only reads 1 input, only controls 1 output, that being whatever the pin location points to. If the pins point to a fan, everything pwm on the splitter is controlled and monitored as if it was that particular fan. An analog pump as control/monitor has zero ability for control as it has no pwm. So any pwm fans on the splitter whether it's a 2,3 or 4way splitter with ganged splitters afterwards, are stuck at 12v+ constant.

I think you're mistaken in the last part.

If I connect the pump on the 4 pin wire, the header will receive the rpm of the pump and monitor it for possible failures. At the same time, it'll deliver 12V and a pwm signal to the fans so that they can control their speed.

The pump doesn't have a pwm pin, so it won't get it's speed changed, but the fans have, so they will.

I think the situation you described occurs if I set the cpu_fan header to "auto". That way it'll send a pwm signal and use pin 3 to see if the fan got it's speed changed. If not, now it knows it's a 3 pin fan and will change to DC mode, controlling everything on the splitter with voltage.

I'm not doing that, I'll set the header to pwm, that way it'll read the CPU temperature and send a pwm signal to change the fans speed accordingly. The fans will get that signal, the pump will not.

 

[Karadjgne]

If I connect the pump on the 4 pin wire, the header will receive the rpm of the pump and monitor it for possible failures.

Yes.

At the same time, it'll deliver 12V and a pwm signal to the fans so that they can control their speed.

No.

It'll deliver 12v+, yes, but the pwm signal is based on the Pump tach, not the fan. There will be zero control of the fans or any other equipment on any other leg of a 2, 3 or 4 way splitter. Everything responds to the pwm signal based on whatever is hooked upto the 4pin wire. There is No tach wire in any leg other than the primary, 4 wire leg.

So if the pump is running 100%, the fans run 100%, if the pump runs 50%, the fans run 50%. There's no way to get the pump at 100% and have the fans run at any lesser % because the 2, 3, 4 legs are tied to only the output, the input comes from #1 which has the tach, and pump.

The pump doesn't have a pwm pin, so it won't get it's speed changed, but the fans have, so they will.

So the pump runs 100%. The fans have zero control because there's no tach hookup for the fans.