[SOLVED] i think i shorted my power supply and i bought i new one.

[helpDiscoDrago]

system:
amd ryzen 7 3800x (3.9-4.5ghz)
ati rx 5700xt
16 gig ram 3400 mhz
dvd writer
7200 rpm western digital blue 64 mbyte cache
am4 gigabyte mobo b450m
power star 650w psu (i think i fried it’s fuse and i have a corsair 650w more expensive arriving tomorrow).

i initially forgot to plug in anything to the 8 plug cpu power on the mobo. all the fans and lights worked and the computer power button made that so.

then i realized i did not plug anything into cpu power. i plugged the 4 pin had from my cheap 650w psu into the 8 pin and it worked only to show lights and fans spinning.

i then thought the computer may not be showing anything because not enough power to my amazing awesome mystery ryzen 7 cpu. its a brand new build and i havent seen even bios yet.
i plugged in 6 pin to the 8 pin and...

the cpu fan lit up, monitor again showed nothing good, then the cpu fan light dimmed to about 40% of its luster. then it all went poof and will not turn on no matter what even.

i originally considered the hdmi cable (15 years old) to be broken. i have new one coming tomorrow.

i understand motherboard is not easy to fry at all especially after less than 20 seconds first turn on and less than 5 seconds for the 4 pin try and basically 3 seconds for the 6 pin failure.

i doubt the cpu is fried because i want to believe in good things and maybe also god.

please help i cannot wait until tomorrow to understand my life.
thanks.

 

[helpDiscoDrago]

In the end, this is your responsibility. If you didn't know how to hook it up, it was your responsibility to get someone who did. Returning it because you broke it is unethical.

Like I said, "You messed up. I sometimes mess up too. Learn from it. Tomorrow is another day."

i am not trying to be adverse, i do take your opinion well, but i dont know if the cpu is harmed or not. if i find out its broken i will try and return it under basic electrical malfunction. i am appaled that the pcie 6 pin is so convenient to plug into a system that has plenty of examples where 4 pins and 3 pins (and adapters) are commonly interchanged. i otherwise have no recourse, what else am i suppose to do as a consumer who thought he could get a neat computer for gaming? all i saw was 3 pins fit into 4 pin pwms and fans are dynamically voltage controlled and molex and pwms are interchangeable via adapters and 4 pins do fine in 8 eps plugs unless not powerful enough... i mean i have no basis of knowing that i made a destructive mistake. i cant levy the motherboard company against the power supply company or the amd company (which i love actually because its been the underdoggo). i dont know what else to do just waste $1000+ dollars because the pins fit just fine and no one really told me otherwise? am i not a victim of sorts? i mean i tried and im not too too dumb. honest mistake versus inability to distinguish otherwise. if amd is gracious i would accept, otherwise i am significantly more poor than i was a week ago.

 

[digitalgriffin]

i am not trying to be adverse, i do take your opinion well, but i dont know if the cpu is harmed or not. if i find out its broken i will try and return it under basic electrical malfunction. i am appaled that the pcie 6 pin is so convenient to plug into a system that has plenty of examples where 4 pins and 3 pins (and adapters) are commonly interchanged. i otherwise have no recourse, what else am i suppose to do as a consumer who thought he could get a neat computer for gaming? all i saw was 3 pins fit into 4 pin pwms and fans are dynamically voltage controlled and molex and pwms are interchangeable via adapters and 4 pins do fine in 8 eps plugs unless not powerful enough... i mean i have no basis of knowing that i made a destructive mistake. i cant levy the motherboard company against the power supply company or the amd company (which i love actually because its been the underdoggo). i dont know what else to do just waste $1000+ dollars because the pins fit just fine and no one really told me otherwise? am i not a victim of sorts? i mean i tried and im not too too dumb. honest mistake versus inability to distinguish otherwise. if amd is gracious i would accept, otherwise i am significantly more poor than i was a week ago.

Sorry, no you arent a victim. Its your own fault for taking on a task for which you didnt seek appropriate help. No one forced you to use the pcie.

Once my car computer threw an error code which i misread as a maf intake sensor. I had two identical makes of cars only separated by one model year. So I swapped the sensor from one car to the next to test it. In between model years ford swapped pins and protocols even though the connector was still the same shape.

I blew out the abs brake computer and sensors. $4000 damage. Thats my fault not fords.

I don't mean to sound like a hard nose jerk. Its just one of those lessons you have to suck up.

You can try returning the parts one at a time to amd, but they do test the components that are returned and they KNOW if you violated spec. Then it becomes their descretion to replace it.

 

[USAFRet]

1. Warranty is for manufacturers defects. Not if you break it.
2. Everything comes with a user manual. If not in the box, online somewhere.
3. Those connectors are keyed to only connect to the proper item. It is possible to force it, but then you create conditions like this.
4. Not all power supplies are created equal. Protection circuits are often lacking in the cheap ones. They can be sold cheap for a reason. Draw too much power, or make the wrong connections, and they can easily burn out other components.
5. There is no way to know what may or may not have been cooked, until you get a working PSU of good quality and proper capacity in there.

 

[helpDiscoDrago]

where is there a forum for appropriate help on what not to do? i read somewhere else, on tom’s website, after figuring out the 6 pin was a problem, that the 8 pin worked fine then thereafter. its a closed discussion i think it works from google search: 6 pin pcie into 8 pin eps port.

i didnt even know i needed help. the 4 pin allowed all the fans and lights to work and the cd rom worked even before i plugged the 4 pin, but then i tried the 6 pin because with the 4 pin nothing would boot. this tells me the processor required more power so i thought, well, 8 pin does more than a 4 pin why not the 6 pin being better than the 4 pin. i had no understanding of reverse polarity or anything. i swear there is such thing as being a victim even if you slipped and fell without any push. im not blaming anyone else, im just saying this sucks and you’re right about amd’s potential discretion. i just hope for the best no matter what because i am a simpleton.

 

[digitalgriffin]

where is there a forum for appropriate help on what not to do? i read somewhere else, on tom’s website, after figuring out the 6 pin was a problem, that the 8 pin worked fine then thereafter. its a closed discussion i think it works from google search: 6 pin pcie into 8 pin eps port.

i didnt even know i needed help. the 4 pin allowed all the fans and lights to work and the cd rom worked even before i plugged the 4 pin, but then i tried the 6 pin because with the 4 pin nothing would boot. this tells me the processor required more power so i thought, well, 8 pin does more than a 4 pin why not the 6 pin being better than the 4 pin. i had no understanding of reverse polarity or anything. i swear there is such thing as being a victim even if you slipped and fell without any push. im not blaming anyone else, im just saying this sucks and you’re right about amd’s potential discretion. i just hope for the best no matter what because i am a simpleton.

What they are likely referring to is using a 8 pin pcie instead of a 6 pin. Some video cards will not work unless you use an 8 pin PCIe.

You aren't a simpleton. I have made bigger mistakes and I have multiple degrees. Stupid mistakes aren't limited to the young. Just learn from it and hope for the best. Next time get someone with some experience to help you configure and assemble your system.

 

[helpDiscoDrago]

What they are likely referring to is using a 8 pin pcie instead of a 6 pin. Some video cards will not work unless you use an 8 pin PCIe.

You aren't a simpleton. I have made bigger mistakes and I have multiple degrees. Stupid mistakes aren't limited to the young. Just learn from it and hope for the best. Next time get someone with some experience to help you configure and assemble your system.

it is appreciated. youre right about your points, i was just hoping that break line symetry in basic circuits would allow for a 12 volt denotation to seem reversed when in fact the pci6 pin would just close the circuit and impede the psu dynamically. the fact that the fans were working the the color changed to a lower value would indicate that i somehow fried the fans, which is neigh impossible i would think because hard wires do not snap at low temperatures alone. i hope for the best and i appreciate the time you took to engage my fragility. i am really hoping i dont have to buy a new cpu, gpu and mobo. i would think my ram is solid like hardwiring. also if there was going to be a fry out, wouldnt it happen much quicker than the few seconds i had? im thinking the original response about psu rail outage is most likely although i cant be certain until i put in the new psu. the fact that the fans dont work but the mouse lit up indicates to me that the psu mains was defused and otherwise everything else is copacetic. i really doubt this ordinary moment could fry a top designed cpu. amd is awesome and intel is genius.

 

[digitalgriffin]

it is appreciated. youre right about your points, i was just hoping that break line symetry in basic circuits would allow for a 12 volt denotation to seem reversed when in fact the pci6 pin would just close the circuit and impede the psu dynamically. the fact that the fans were working the the color changed to a lower value would indicate that i somehow fried the fans, which is neigh impossible i would think because hard wires do not snap at low temperatures alone. i hope for the best and i appreciate the time you took to engage my fragility. i am really hoping i dont have to buy a new cpu, gpu and mobo. i would think my ram is solid like hardwiring. also if there was going to be a fry out, wouldnt it happen much quicker than the few seconds i had? im thinking the original response about psu rail outage is most likely although i cant be certain until i put in the new psu. the fact that the fans dont work but the mouse lit up indicates to me that the psu mains was defused and otherwise everything else is copacetic. i really doubt this ordinary moment could fry a top designed cpu. amd is awesome and intel is genius.

You keep circling back to the same questions hoping for a different answer. The answer is not going to change. For the third time "no ifs ands or buts." Theres a very high likelihood of your components being burnt out. There is a small chance you may come out unscathed. I doubt it. Some components might still work but that is iffy. You're just going to have to wait it out. Absolutely nothing we say here is or is not going to save you. I will say this absolutely for the last time. We cannot help you one way or another.

When your new psu arrives hook it up, see what happens. If it doesnt work, THEN we can help you narrow down what is fried.

Be sure to include the full details of your system. Make and model of psu, cpu, motherboard, video card, memory, hard drive.

 

[jonnyguru]

i think the corsair cv 650w will do the trick. at 80 bronze it seems basic but reliable enough. i do declare you’ve help me understand that i have toasted the power supply. this is acceptable to me but:

Motherboards use special fuses called polymeric positive temperature coefficient thermistors; in English, this translates into "a fuse that will reset itself." These fuses protect the motherboard from frying every time a larger amount of electricity surges through the computer power supply.

—— from Techwalla. this also makes sense because the motherboard expects current to flow at very high rates involving heating / cooling and potential surges. it encourages me to believe that the silicon holds everything very nicely and the fiberglass wouldnt allow too much spiking. from a materials science perspective it seems sound, that i did not possibly actually fry the motherboard. my understanding is Volts = Current x Resistance so the actual 15 volt value you spoke of could be either sharp current (unlikely because its senseless engineering for a psu to produce dangerous amounts of current when all that is needed is a balance with decent resistors) versus the likely path taken -> the silicon and wiring has natural resistance as well as resistor units to cause an increase valuation of R while the I ampere value is slightly higher and possibly reversed. then the voltages would read a string negative off of moment / as well as a near triplication of reverse flow of current.

it seems wild that i even thought id make any sense trying to figure that out...

according to Quora - cpu processors do not have fuses. fuses are considered servicable parts. the hard wiring of a cpu, however delicate, is designed to withstand extreme conditions.

if current is able flow for yearhours with a circuit designed to balance voltages long term, the actual current I in amperes is actually factored by significant amounts of exposure. with heat and ion electricity considered, the motherboard must be unbelievably resilient and the cpu must be like a tank. resistors resist current which gives apparent voltage multipliers, but resistors will stop a current dead in its track as fuses truly example - zero snap electricity. therefore, the resistor would have to appear as a more significant resistor unit (air) and the current would stop and the values would fail as mathematics. i think this is true because i just recently found out the two details about cpu and motherboard - one has no fuse at all and is itself a potential air fuse, the other has fuses specifically designed to reseat itself to avoid repeated harm.

Yeah.

Good luck with that.

It's good that you're reading up on the technology, but there is no perfect world. And these fuses don't take into account someone putting +12V through the ground plane.

 

[Karadjgne]

Think of it this way. A transformer (there's multiple of them on a motherboard) will take that 12v input and change it to 1.2v output, in a circuit going left to right. A 10:1 change in voltage.

Same exact transformer, same exact circuit, if you put 12v in the right to left direction, it becomes 120v, a 10:1 change in voltage.

By putting high voltage to ground plane, you essentially shoved 12v in the back door, potentially making parts of the motherboard see 120v instead of the cpu normal output of @ 1.2v

And that's if you didn't overload every single mosfet on the way out, sensitive diodes designed for 1 way electrical signal and any number of the 200+ million nanometer sized transistors in a cpu.

 

[helpDiscoDrago]

what i figured is the (thanks to you all btw) sense pin of the pcie is designed to indicate to the psu if voltage is high/low/off/on i think. the powerstar psu i was using has uvp, ovp, and opp. so the under voltage should be indicated at that point and the over voltage could be indicated as well as over power calculations being nulled.

im thinking it just shut my psu down thru some sort of elaborate inductor or semiconductor capacitor. i believe this would function as a proper diode and create zero current in the psu but over those few seconds i observed the cpu fan light hit a hard dim to about 40% visibility brightness. i dont see how a 12 volt value shot thru a ground would produce anything other than a reverse current value thru straight wire throughout the length of the focal circuit. the ground is simply designated as current acceptance without adjustment and basic transistor gates allow for a logic gate via amplification and control and a ground wire in parallel to series adaption. its like christmas lights that are smart and simply dont light up if the electricity is too much because it would hit heat calculation in the resistors too high. also, the only thing that would destroy circuitry properly is harsh heat.

i dont deny that cpu processors can minimize the scope of this heat factor, but thats assuming the darn thing even turned on, which according to my monitor and overall system it doesnt seem like any proper power was produced. this would make it impossible for reverse currents to have perpetrated throughout the cpu and voltage calculations at best would be just straight wire zero with random location for voltage readings as nominal. the parallel ground would simply have no current because the cpu processor to psu circuit was not completed properly (sense pin denomination for pcie). the psu really would then absorb the grounded current into a backwash and the fuse would kaput, once achieved beyond alloted voltage(s). so i believe the diode exists, and also is instrumental in the psu’s uvp/ovp/opp features.

i mean, how could the psu accept a strong reverse current or voltage? if the current cannot be accepted, due to diode circuitry, then the voltage wouldnt matter at all because v = ir and i is zero in such a case. i am stressing a bit because i dont want to have to go thru the entire process again, but i do believe that industry standards insure psu design to be overall safe. if voltage and current could be so substantially and directly and immediately reversed, how could any of the computer components be safe at all? the outlet safety designs would be in question and a person may electrocute to death if industry standards were not applied to the very basics...

i hope this is correct enough, i will keep yall informed.

 

[digitalgriffin]

what i figured is the (thanks to you all btw) sense pin of the pcie is designed to indicate to the psu if voltage is high/low/off/on i think. the powerstar psu i was using has uvp, ovp, and opp. so the under voltage should be indicated at that point and the over voltage could be indicated as well as over power calculations being nulled.

im thinking it just shut my psu down thru some sort of elaborate inductor or semiconductor capacitor. i believe this would function as a proper diode and create zero current in the psu but over those few seconds i observed the cpu fan light hit a hard dim to about 40% visibility brightness. i dont see how a 12 volt value shot thru a ground would produce anything other than a reverse current value thru straight wire throughout the length of the focal circuit. the ground is simply designated as current acceptance without adjustment and basic transistor gates allow for a logic gate via amplification and control and a ground wire in parallel to series adaption. its like christmas lights that are smart and simply dont light up if the electricity is too much because it would hit heat calculation in the resistors too high. also, the only thing that would destroy circuitry properly is harsh heat.

i dont deny that cpu processors can minimize the scope of this heat factor, but thats assuming the darn thing even turned on, which according to my monitor and overall system it doesnt seem like any proper power was produced. this would make it impossible for reverse currents to have perpetrated throughout the cpu and voltage calculations at best would be just straight wire zero with random location for voltage readings as nominal. the parallel ground would simply have no current because the cpu processor to psu circuit was not completed properly (sense pin denomination for pcie). the psu really would then absorb the grounded current into a backwash and the fuse would kaput, once achieved beyond alloted voltage(s). so i believe the diode exists, and also is instrumental in the psu’s uvp/ovp/opp features.

i mean, how could the psu accept a strong reverse current or voltage? if the current cannot be accepted, due to diode circuitry, then the voltage wouldnt matter at all because v = ir and i is zero in such a case. i am stressing a bit because i dont want to have to go thru the entire process again, but i do believe that industry standards insure psu design to be overall safe. if voltage and current could be so substantially and directly and immediately reversed, how could any of the computer components be safe at all? the outlet safety designs would be in question and a person may electrocute to death if industry standards were not applied to the very basics...

i hope this is correct enough, i will keep yall informed.

When you reverse the current through an integrated circuit you burn it out in a few milliseconds. The answer does NOT change no matter how much you want it to.

Can we lock this thread? Seriously. I think this guy is starting to play a joke. That or he doesn't understand plain English. "No ifs ands or buts" and "There's nothing we can do for you."

Im really trying to be sympathetic but this is starting to get annoying.

 

[helpDiscoDrago]

When you reverse the current through an integrated circuit you burn it out in a few milliseconds. The answer does change no matter how much you want it to.

Can we lock this thread? Seriously. I think this guy is starting to play a joke. That or he doesn't understand plain English. "No ifs ands or buts" and "There's nothing we can do for you."

Im really trying to be sympathetic but this is starting to get annoying.

i mean you can shut down the thread but im telling you that the 12 volts sent to ground wire in a circuit results in zero voltage, stopped current and also zero watt power. i dont know what i said to come off poorly, i believe you have a bad moment with me somehow? dont worry about the thread i am going to try the psu and if nothjng else a new mobo. you dont have to be harsh about it at all. if i have wronged you i am sorry, but i dont know how i could’ve. bye?

 

[USAFRet]

Lets all take a deep breath, step back, and see what happens with a NEW power supply.

Nothing else can be done, guessed or discussed until then.

 

[helpDiscoDrago]

Lets all take a deep breath, step back, and see what happens with a NEW power supply.

Nothing else can be done, guessed or discussed until then.

ok. i receive a new psu tomorrow, thanks for the support

 

[John Chesterfield]

am i not a victim of sorts? i mean i tried and im not too too dumb. honest mistake versus inability to distinguish otherwise. if amd is gracious i would accept, otherwise i am significantly more poor than i was a week ago.

No, you have been remiss by not reading up sufficiently first and arming yourself with the right info.

It sucks, but you messed up by not doing that. You can't claim to be a victim if you didn't clue yourself up. Moreover, those connectors are keyed so that you can't put them in the wrong connection points. You must have forced something.

So as said above, you need to suck it up and hope that nothing is damaged. If it is, not ethical to return it as this has happened due to your own inability to put the kit together competently and not because the components were faulty. People who do that make hardware prices higher for the rest of us.

Hopefully the only thing that is damaged is your old PSU but if that's not the case, harsh lesson in not rushing to do things without knowing properly what you're doing.

 

[helpDiscoDrago]

No, you have been remiss by not reading up sufficiently first and arming yourself with the right info.

It sucks, but you messed up by not doing that. You can't claim to be a victim if you didn't clue yourself up. Moreover, those connectors are keyed so that you can't put them in the wrong connection points. You must have forced something.

So as said above, you need to suck it up and hope that nothing is damaged. If it is, not ethical to return it as this has happened due to your own inability to put the kit together competently and not because the components were faulty. People who do that make hardware prices higher for the rest of us.

Hopefully the only thing that is damaged is your old PSU but if that's not the case, harsh lesson in not rushing to do things without knowing properly what you're doing.

lol, ive already been past this how was i supposed to know the pins that indicate everything plugs in so smooth without any effort is a problem? and you’re the ignorant one telling me that the pcie6pins have the ultimate potential to destroy me, my home, my face, my leg, and your discretion. seriously man get off your high horse.

the grounds have all necessary line work and circuitry to defuse all voltage to maintain zero voltage energy. do you not know what zero voltage energy is, it means the current cannot flow whatsoever through those plugs. i had been misled by people who apparently do not understand electrical engineering and have not themselves looked up the information to have a sensible and decent discussion.

i am literally the outright owner of amd and ati radeon products i can do whatsoever i wish with these components even if i choose to be a decent enough customer who made an honest mistake. money doesnt solve the fact that i didnt ever myself engineer motherboards or processors by hand, BUT THEN AGAIN NEITHER DID YOU APPARENTLY.

the ground wiring is for safety of the psu and the component assembly design paradigm that implements diodes, capacitors, advanced flux capacitors and induction elements. this manages what would normally be a very dangerous basis of power station electricity that is sometimes process from low energy nuclear plants. i repeat, nuclear plants. to tell me that industry standards disregard the extreme need for safety and focus only on the consumerism of this matter is a real slap in YOUR face.

PLEASE LEAVE ME ALONE THAT I AM TRYING TO COMMUNICATE KINDLY WITH DECENT ENOUGH FOLK IN THIS FORUM. I am receiving my power supply today and i will make a go at it. are you simply an aggressive person looking for an internet quarrel as you hide behind a falsetto scream? please do not disturb me again i am asking directly i have been NOTHING BUT POLITE TO EVERYONE AND YOU HAVE ATTACKED ME WITHOUT ANY PERSONAL CAUSE.

i mean we are strangers, whats your problem. i dont even know if ANYTHING is broken yet because of how power supplies interact safely witu cmos standards. cmon man leave me alone and let me speak with mannered people.

sorry to mods for this but i cant just accept people ridiculing me for something i havent even done wrong. period. there was no instruction manual with the power supply. the plugs went in super easily, its not always “keyed differently” as everyone has assumed mine is. please pleaee leave me be!

 

[John Chesterfield]

Oh dear.

 

[USAFRet]

OK, that's enough.

No more comments until the OP comes back with whatever happens with his new power supply.
No comments from ANYONE.


Thank you.

The only reason I'm not closing this completely is because we all want to see what happens.

 

[helpDiscoDrago]

OK, that's enough.

No more comments until the OP comes back with whatever happens with his new power supply.
No comments from ANYONE.


Thank you.

The only reason I'm not closing this completely is because we all want to see what happens.

apparently john chesterfield was just being straight and arrow with me. i apoligize i was so stress...

the psu works the computer is installing windows as we speak, mr chesterfield would you like a gift?

would all the mods like a gift?

 

[Nemesia]

apparently john chesterfield was just being straight and arrow with me. i apoligize i was so stress...

the psu works the computer is installing windows as we speak, mr chesterfield would you like a gift?

would all the mods like a gift?

Glad replacing the PSU fixed your issue!

 

[helpDiscoDrago]

i was contentious

 

[Phaaze88]

Can you play games at all, etc?

 

[helpDiscoDrago]

i loaded csgo i will
be playing ghost recon breakpoint with the boiz...
also must install nfs rivals.
goodie

 

[John Chesterfield]

apparently john chesterfield was just being straight and arrow with me. i apoligize i was so stress...

the psu works the computer is installing windows as we speak, mr chesterfield would you like a gift?

would all the mods like a gift?

I'm just happy for you that the PSU solved it. You're okay for the gift though, I have enough PSUs around here and they're not even broken!

I was only being straight with you, it can be a harsh lesson, I've had a few of those, most notably with a Duron processor with exposed die. I didn't read up on how to properly mount the heatsink and cracked the die.

Needless to say I never did that again. But good that you're up and running, enjoy the new rig.

 

[helpDiscoDrago]

now if i could only get the ram to the purchased speed (3400mhz)... its stook at 2133 IGNONIMOUS...