Intel Coffee Lake Coming October 5, Here Are The Details

[Upgrademe]

Preorder up when?

 

[JackNaylorPE]

What matters is the bottom line and where sales are concerned, AMD is currently outselling Intel regardless of AMD's performance deficit in games. Having the fastest gaming CPU does you no good if most people choose to go with the company that offers much better performance per dollar.

Were it not for Ryzen turning up the heat, Coffee Lake would likely have ended up with 30-50% price markups compared to the 7000 series instead of 5-10%. It remains to be seen if Intel adding two cores across most of its lineup will be enough to maintain its current price points or if Ryzen will force Intel to drop prices to halt its market share losses. I suspect AMD will lower the MSRP of most of the Ryzen lineup by $25-50 after Coffee Lake launches to maintain its lead on performance per dollar.

Mass market PCs sold in Walmart are not the typical THG audience. Yes, Ryzen will be big at Walmart and big box stores. And Ryzen is a solid choice for the folks with a mix or gaming and multi-threaded uses. But in the sector where its all about gaming, the hype does not stand up to scrutiny. I'm not criticizing the CPU, it has its niche market. I am criticizing the hype which alleges its the answer to all things.

Best performance per dollar .... only if ya work hard to frame it correctly.

My pint of orange juice that I get from the Deli at lunch costs less than last year... but my "pint" only contains 14.5 fluid ounces now.
My 1 pound box of pasta costs less than last year... but my "1 lb box" now only contains 13 ounces

Not apples and apples.

Sure I can make a AMD gaming build for less than a Intel build .... but apples and apples ? Not a chance. Let's count the ways.

1. Performance just is pretty close but not quite there for 1600x vs 7600k
https://tpucdn.com/reviews/AMD/Ryzen_5_1600X/images/perfrel_1920_1080.png
2. The performance gap widens factoring in overclocking ... 1600x overclocking is pitiful
3. 7600k is $20 less on newegg
4. The "ya don't need a cooler" thing goes away if overclocking"
5. The MoBo price difference goes away when ya make sure that the MoBo includes gaming standard ALC 220 sound and FPS worthy LAN Solution. AMD pulled the OJ / pasta thing here.
- Cheapest ATX Z270 board w/ ALC1220 = $120
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128972
- Cheapest ATX AM4 w/ ALC1220 = $120
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813144031

So... so far the faster Intel 7600k build is $20 cheaper.

6. Higher power draw isn't free.... AMD vs Intel CPU and GPU ... lets do the math

Vega 64 w/ 303 watts - 1080 w/ 184 watts = + 119 watts

6.a AMD fans like to say ya save the cooler costs but what about the extra PSU costs ?

+ Ryzen 1600x system of 270 watts - 7600k w/ 244 = +26 watts
https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/AMD/Ryzen_5_1600X/17.html

145 watts x 36 hours per week x 52.17 weeks per year x $0.1322 avg US elec residential utility cost x 3 years / (1000 watts per kwh x 85% {PSU eff) = $127 ... $23 of that for CPU.

The Scythe Mugen Max is $37 ... more than paid for by our $23 electricity savings and or $20 CPU savings.

So apples to apples, the 7600k gaming build is $6 ahead ... and ....

-Woot ... second monitor option thru IGP for the monitoring utilities, Discord, gaming web sites etc.
-Performs slightly faster outta the box
-Performance gap widens w/ OC
-Allows a 2nd GFX card
-No Memory frequency options / memory compatibility issues
-No complicated (memory, HPET, CCX, SMT, and power profile) issues

So yes, the Ryzen boxes will sell well on the shelves of BestBuy and Walmart ... but considering the above, it simply does not live up to the hype as being "best bang for the buck gaming box" for the "build your own" crowd. To get the price down, it just just makes ya give up too much.

They made a wise move in offering a CPU line that can compete in gaming and do other things well. And like every "all purpose option" it does many things well but it's not the best when purposes are more focused. And gaming is one of those purposes.

For Intel, right now that ya gotta spend $389 for an all purpose CPU like the 7800x and, yes, its a better choice in video editing and gaming than what Ryzen has to offer at $399 (1700x) or $499 (1800x).
https://www.pugetsystems.com/pic_disp.php?id=42852&width=649

So until October 5th at least the "do many things well < $389 CPU cost " niche is all AMD ,,, at least for the next 2 weeks or so. But in the primary gaming niche, Ryzen a) didn't really change anything and b) it's only going to be cheaper when ya stop caring about things that many gamers do care about.

 

[zoridon]

Not sure why you only selected an ATX motherboard. I use micro ATX for example and AMD has intel beat by about $20. But I do agree AMD will have to drop prices by 10 to 15 percent across the board to maintain and or gain any more market share.

 

[InvalidError]

Mass market PCs sold in Walmart are not the typical THG audience.

The THG audience is of no importance where market forces putting pressure on Intel to do better are concerned and nothing does this better than actually losing market share. With AMD accounting for more than 50% of CPUs sold by Newegg, Amazon and other etailers, Intel has many reasons to get worried.

 

[ibjeepr]

Mass market PCs sold in Walmart are not the typical THG audience.

. With AMD accounting for more than 50% of CPUs sold by Newegg, Amazon and other etailers, Intel has many reasons to get worried.

Where did you find that info?

 

[InvalidError]

Mass market PCs sold in Walmart are not the typical THG audience.

. With AMD accounting for more than 50% of CPUs sold by Newegg, Amazon and other etailers, Intel has many reasons to get worried.

Where did you find that info?

Just search for AMD market share, you'll find plenty. Youtubers and other reviewers who post affiliate links to etailers get reports on what people end up buying while following their affiliate links, which is how they get their numbers on the distribution of CPU sales to their visitors.

 

[popatim]

Lets not forget that Gears of War, to my knowledge (I don't play it), DX12 and multithreads decently AND that these new CPU's have 25% more cores then Kaby...
I will wait for the reviews as anxiously as everyone else though. LoL

 

[ibjeepr]

Mass market PCs sold in Walmart are not the typical THG audience.

. With AMD accounting for more than 50% of CPUs sold by Newegg, Amazon and other etailers, Intel has many reasons to get worried.

Where did you find that info?

Just search for AMD market share, you'll find plenty. Youtubers and other reviewers who post affiliate links to etailers get reports on what people end up buying while following their affiliate links, which is how they get their numbers on the distribution of CPU sales to their visitors.

There is nothing out there I could find giving sales figures for those outlets and the the highest market share I could find was 20%. But if you can point me to it I'd be interested in mining that info.

 

[nikoli707]

This honestly feels like the first justifiable upgrade since my 5 year-old 3770k that's still going strong (overclocked to 4.5Ghz, though). The 1080ti I recently installed is finally causing my system to show a little age. CPU usage has gone up significantly, but the frames are still excellent. If the 8700k can edge out the 7700k in gaming, then it should be pc-game-streamers' dream CPU. I'll wait for the always-impressive review from this site, however.

i feel the same with a 2600k. been at 4.5-4.6ghz for years without issue. even a 7700k@4.9ghz really doesn't outpace it much, obviously there is a difference. It will be interesting to see its overclocking capablity. i wouldn't expect 5.0ghz across all cores but bumping all core turbo bins up 0.3ghz seems realistic.

 

[derekullo]

Mass market PCs sold in Walmart are not the typical THG audience.

. With AMD accounting for more than 50% of CPUs sold by Newegg, Amazon and other etailers, Intel has many reasons to get worried.

Where did you find that info?

Just search for AMD market share, you'll find plenty. Youtubers and other reviewers who post affiliate links to etailers get reports on what people end up buying while following their affiliate links, which is how they get their numbers on the distribution of CPU sales to their visitors.

All I could find about AMD's market share was:

https://www.tweaktown.com/news/58252/amd-took-10-4-cpu-...

http://wccftech.com/amd-takes-10-4-cpu-share-intel-q2-2...

https://www.cpubenchmark.net/market_share.html

And their mentioning of 31% market share in 2nd quarter of 2017.

How do you interpret any of those 3 links to mean AMD has 50% of the cpu market share?

 

[nikoli707]

when i bought my 2600k in mid/late 2011 in prep for skyrim/battlefield 3, i never thought that 6 years later i would still be rocking it. i guess blame amd/lack of competition. in a way its not all amds fault... industry has pushed more for ultra low wattage parts more than high end and it makes sense. but i have been tempted recently by the r7 1700(overclock it to 3.9ghz and have a nice day)... but i really wanted to see what intels answer is. we will have to wait for reviews but come very early 2018 i will be finally be upgrading my cpu/mobo/ram/nvme.

 

[Sleepy_Hollowed]

I hope it gets a very through QA, I don't want to see any hyper threaded bugs, or temperature issues on anything but water-cooled. That could increase the costs and/or complexity quite a bit for those looking for a smaller case to put the beast in.

As of right now, Threadripper is quite the value proposition all around, if these can come down a bit in price to compete then that'd be great, but I doubt it.

 

[InvalidError]

And their mentioning of 31% market share in 2nd quarter of 2017.

Quarterly numbers are averaged, which dilutes and delays trends, especially on parts that haven't even been on the market for a whole quarter.
http://wccftech.com/amd-cpu-sales-overtake-intel-first-time-decade-germanys-largest-e-tailer/

 

[asim1973]

Those moaning about a new Chipstead and motherboard, you're not supposed to upgrade every year but every few years, I moved to laptops from desktops and I upgrade every 4 to 5 years and that's how it should be. Intel don't force you to upgrade every year, idiots think they have to.

 

[ibjeepr]

Mass market PCs sold in Walmart are not the typical THG audience.

. With AMD accounting for more than 50% of CPUs sold by Newegg, Amazon and other etailers, Intel has many reasons to get worried.

Where did you find that info?

Just search for AMD market share, you'll find plenty. Youtubers and other reviewers who post affiliate links to etailers get reports on what people end up buying while following their affiliate links, which is how they get their numbers on the distribution of CPU sales to their visitors.

All I could find about AMD's market share was:

https://www.tweaktown.com/news/58252/amd-took-10-4-cpu-...

http://wccftech.com/amd-takes-10-4-cpu-share-intel-q2-2...

https://www.cpubenchmark.net/market_share.html

And their mentioning of 31% market share in 2nd quarter of 2017.

How do you interpret any of those 3 links to mean AMD has 50% of the cpu market share?

There is info out there about 1 European retailer named Mindfactory shows their sales percentage of CPUs was just over 50% AMD. From what I can gather, that seems focused on Germany mainly.
https://www.extremetech.com/computing/255122-european-retailer-shows-amd-stealing-significant-market-share-revenue-intel

 

[InvalidError]

There is info out there about 1 European retailer named Mindfactory shows their sales percentage of CPUs was just over 50% AMD.

Some reviewers (don't remember which ones) commented on stats from their Amazon affiliate reports saying that their trends agreed with MindFactory. And then you have German Amazon which shows the approximate number of units sold in its listings where in barely a month of availability, ThreadRipper has already outsold the most popular CPUs on x99 despite x99 having a whole year's lead on sales.

 

[Midnitte]

"As if in swift response to AMD's nearly year-long Zen onslaught, Intel will release the desktop parts (S Series) of its 8th Gen Coffee Lake CPU on October 5, a mere 10 months after unsheathing Kaby Lake."

And that's exactly why I will prefer AMD everytime. Plus, the whole USB key thing.

 

[derekullo]

I just remembered Steam also recorded processor type and made easy to read graphs.

http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/processormfg/?sort=pct

I would assume Steam has a larger sample size than Mindfactory.de

It shows a spike to 20.28% for AMD in April when Ryzen 5 series was released.

Followed by a slow decline to 18.05% in August



What is also saddening is 36% of Steam users still use a dual core as of last August.

http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/cpus/

 

[elbert]

AMD will have to lower their 6 core to around $170 to match quad core unlock. That quad core unlock i3-8350k probably will beat the locked i5 in games. The Ryzen 7 1700 will have to match the i5 8600k price. That leave the Ryzen 7 X versions to match the new i7's. May be the time for AMD to bring out the Ryzen 1920 for $399ish. The higher end 12 and 16 cores aren't effected by this so they are fine as is I guess.

The i3 8350k tho is going to be a killer budget gaming build CPU. It may be the one CPU AMD has a hard time under pricing to match performance.

 

[shrapnel_indie]

AMD will have to lower their 6 core to around $170 to match quad core unlock. That quad core unlock i3-8350k pribably will beat the locked i5 in games. The Ryzen 7 1700 will have to match the i5 8600k price. That leave the Ryzen 7 X versions to match the new i7's. May be the time for AMD to bring out the Ryzen 1920 for $399ish. The higher end 12 and 16 cores aren't effected by this so they are fine as is I guess.

The i3 8350k tho is going to be a killer budget gaming build CPU. It may be the one CPU AMD has a hard time under pricing to match performance.

Maybe. It also depends on actually how much gain Intel CPUs have in perfomrance AND how well they will overclock, and under what conditions that they will. It could turn out they suck at overclocking.

 

[InvalidError]

I would assume Steam has a larger sample size than Mindfactory.de

MindFactory's numbers are month-by-month sales and it sells chips by the thousands monthly, which should make it fairly representative of recent sales trends. Steam numbers on the other hand are for their entire active user base which includes countless older systems.

When discussing the topic of market pressure on Intel to release substantially better chips to counter AMD's recent and quite substantial market wins, sales from several years ago don't matter. Month to month, quarter to quarter on new sales is where the new money is. Not systems that are already on/under people's desks.

 

[photonboy]

Shrapnel_Indie,
So far the RUMORS are that Coffee Lake overclocks better than previous, and we may see many get 5.3GHz relatively easy.

If we had say 15% architectural advantage, AND a 5.3GHz vs 4GHz difference in clocks vs Ryzen then the performance per core might be 50% higher! Wow...

By my rough estimate that gets about the same TOTAL performance as a Ryzen R5-1600 (6C/12T) CPU when using 100% CPU usage.

(The numbers don't seem to make sense when I compare DIFFERENT WAYS though... either way, the i3-8350K may end up a great gaming CPU for the medium/high gaming budget... it's also hard to justify the extra $100 to add hyperthreading to an already 6-core, unlocked CPU. the i5-8600K.. especially if it's mainly meant for gaming as more than SIX fast cores is unlikely to matter.)

 

[kyotokid]

...dual channel memory and only W10 support...ho hum.

 

[muffindell]

Is it me missing something, or have others failed to notice despite a 50% hike in cores the 8700k is only 25% faster than the 4 core 7700k?

 

[MichaelElfial]

FAIZANALI1997, I suppose the pentiums (may be even cellerons) will take the niche left by the former i3-s. We've seen some 2(4) pentium chips in Kaby lake, I expect this to become now main stream, seems logical.