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Titanius
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i5 will have Dual-Channel DDR3 support with its memory controller. It will lack Hyper-Treading (for the 2.6 and 2.8, not sure about the 2.93). Its a Quad-Core CPU, basically the same as the i7 and its Turbo mode won't go as high as the i7. I heard that i5 might have less L3 cache than the i7 also.
P55 will have a maximum of Two PCI-E 16X 2.0 slots (one at 16X, two at 8X each).
P55 will have a maximum of Two PCI-E 16X 2.0 slots (one at 16X, two at 8X each).
duzcizgi
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With the integrated graphics controller i5 might justify the pricing, as long as it gives some decent performance, preferably higher than today's GMA graphic controllers.
Still, as we know, PhII is about 20% slower than i7 at the extreme and as i5 is a little stripped down, it might well fall below PhII based systems.
Still, as we know, PhII is about 20% slower than i7 at the extreme and as i5 is a little stripped down, it might well fall below PhII based systems.
TheZander
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[citation][nom]Tindytim[/nom]And the 2 most expensive i5's cost as much as the 2 least expensive i7's. What the hell is that about?[/citation]
It's because the i5's also contain a graphics chip, I believe, adding to the cost. And there's no way motherboards are going to be $250 from the get go. They will be 150-ish, 200 max I'd say. Look at all the recent cuts Intel chipset boards, especially older P35 boards. There are some dang good boards for under $100 now. The price per GHz seems to be on par with i7, although I was expecting them to be a little bit cheaper than these announced prices as well.
It is very interesting that they're going "backwards." If anything, however, this should REDUCE the cost of board manufacturing - no integrated graphics needed on the board at all. "Core i5 microprocessors will feature an integrated dual-channel DDR3 memory controller, integrated PCI-Express graphics controller and Direct Media Interface controller for communication with Intel P55 chipset."
I guess i7's are still going to be the most "hardcore" with triple channel compatibility and insane overclockability. i5's are really being released to deal a blow to AMD right now. They need more solid and modern competition for Phenom II, which is really taking it to Core 2 Quad right now dollar for dollar.
It's because the i5's also contain a graphics chip, I believe, adding to the cost. And there's no way motherboards are going to be $250 from the get go. They will be 150-ish, 200 max I'd say. Look at all the recent cuts Intel chipset boards, especially older P35 boards. There are some dang good boards for under $100 now. The price per GHz seems to be on par with i7, although I was expecting them to be a little bit cheaper than these announced prices as well.
It is very interesting that they're going "backwards." If anything, however, this should REDUCE the cost of board manufacturing - no integrated graphics needed on the board at all. "Core i5 microprocessors will feature an integrated dual-channel DDR3 memory controller, integrated PCI-Express graphics controller and Direct Media Interface controller for communication with Intel P55 chipset."
I guess i7's are still going to be the most "hardcore" with triple channel compatibility and insane overclockability. i5's are really being released to deal a blow to AMD right now. They need more solid and modern competition for Phenom II, which is really taking it to Core 2 Quad right now dollar for dollar.
I read some of this stuff and wonder what people are thinking.
Intel needs solid competition for the Phenom II?????????? The Earth is flat? The Sun is cold? You're smart?
The Core 2 is considerably faster, and is a lot smaller than the Phenom II. In other words, outside of a few workloads, it's dramatically better. There's no comparision. It's cheaper to make too.
Phenom II is competitive on price though, because AMD is losing money. Intel does not more a "modern" processor to compete with the Phenom II. They could lower prices and destroy them. Even if they priced their Core 2s the same at the same clock speed, they'd seriously hurt the "modern" Phenom II, because it can't compete clock normalized.
The i5 is a good move. Actually, it made a lot of sense to release a high end chip first. What's the point of releasing a mediocre chip and then going higher? At the initial release, there would not be so much reason to buy them. This was typically how it was done long ago. The new chip would be very expensive, and high end. They would release lower end versions that moved them to the mainstream. Examples are the 386sx, 486sx, 8088, 80188, 80288 (the latter two were used mainly in embedded apps though, and rarely if ever in computers).
The i5 could offer better performance than the Core 2 at similar price points. If lower the price of the processors, and also the motherboard, the combination puts them much more squarely in the price range of the lesser Core 2, and the much lesser Phenom II. So, it could be a very popular and important release since it could finally bring Nehalem into more mainstream pricing.
Intel needs solid competition for the Phenom II?????????? The Earth is flat? The Sun is cold? You're smart?
The Core 2 is considerably faster, and is a lot smaller than the Phenom II. In other words, outside of a few workloads, it's dramatically better. There's no comparision. It's cheaper to make too.
Phenom II is competitive on price though, because AMD is losing money. Intel does not more a "modern" processor to compete with the Phenom II. They could lower prices and destroy them. Even if they priced their Core 2s the same at the same clock speed, they'd seriously hurt the "modern" Phenom II, because it can't compete clock normalized.
The i5 is a good move. Actually, it made a lot of sense to release a high end chip first. What's the point of releasing a mediocre chip and then going higher? At the initial release, there would not be so much reason to buy them. This was typically how it was done long ago. The new chip would be very expensive, and high end. They would release lower end versions that moved them to the mainstream. Examples are the 386sx, 486sx, 8088, 80188, 80288 (the latter two were used mainly in embedded apps though, and rarely if ever in computers).
The i5 could offer better performance than the Core 2 at similar price points. If lower the price of the processors, and also the motherboard, the combination puts them much more squarely in the price range of the lesser Core 2, and the much lesser Phenom II. So, it could be a very popular and important release since it could finally bring Nehalem into more mainstream pricing.
JAYDEEJOHN
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Itll have 16x pci lanes for the graphics. Its dual channel DDR3. Itll have a very low power draw. It has turbo. Only the 2.66 model wont have HT. The 57 boards will be following the the 55s, with a better igp in them.
It looks to have the same perf as i7, in most apps, just not the tri channel, and of course limited pci lanes
It looks to have the same perf as i7, in most apps, just not the tri channel, and of course limited pci lanes
duzcizgi
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@jaydeejohn: i5 chipsets or boards don't have IGP, as the IGP is integrated into CPU. About this, "touché" from intel againts AMD. Thing need to see is, how does this IGP on i5 compare to AMD's 780 IGP.
If it performs better, with the 95 W of power envelope for IGP+CPU, it might call trouble for AMD. If not, well, intel sells it anyway with "intel inside" program.
If it performs better, with the 95 W of power envelope for IGP+CPU, it might call trouble for AMD. If not, well, intel sells it anyway with "intel inside" program.
apache_lives
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[citation][nom]duzcizgi[/nom]With the integrated graphics controller i5 might justify the pricing, as long as it gives some decent performance, preferably higher than today's GMA graphic controllers.Still, as we know, PhII is about 20% slower than i7 at the extreme and as i5 is a little stripped down, it might well fall below PhII based systems.[/citation]
Clock for clock the i7 is faster then Core2's - it cant fall below a Phenom II performance wise, as for pricing vs performance - we shall have to wait
Clock for clock the i7 is faster then Core2's - it cant fall below a Phenom II performance wise, as for pricing vs performance - we shall have to wait
duzcizgi
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[citation][nom]apache_lives[/nom]Clock for clock the i7 is faster then Core2's - it cant fall below a Phenom II performance wise, as for pricing vs performance - we shall have to wait[/citation]
Sorry, I wasn't clear in my previous post. I was comparing price-wise. Not clock for clock. I don't care at which speed the CPU runs, as long as it gives me the comparable/favorable performance at that given price point.
i5 will take a hit as it doesn't have 3 channel DDR3 but 2 channel DDR3 controller, making memory bandwidth-wise equal to PhII. The decisive point will be whether at a given price point i5 better or worse than competitor or not? In the segment it targets, cost is the most important. I expect mo-bo for i5 would be so cheap that they'll even throw it in as bundle for the CPU you buy. (the chipset's introduction price is $40-ish and with all the other necessary capacitors & connectors added, I guess the net cost of initial batches of mo-bos will be around $50, selling for a mere $60.) $196 for CPU+IGP + $60 for mo-bo + $40 for 2 GB DDR3 and another $100 for the rest of the necessary stuff, you can have a PC sufficient for office for about $400 + taxes. Not bad, I can say. and this is the introductory pricing. As time goes, the prices will drop significantly.
Sorry, I wasn't clear in my previous post. I was comparing price-wise. Not clock for clock. I don't care at which speed the CPU runs, as long as it gives me the comparable/favorable performance at that given price point.
i5 will take a hit as it doesn't have 3 channel DDR3 but 2 channel DDR3 controller, making memory bandwidth-wise equal to PhII. The decisive point will be whether at a given price point i5 better or worse than competitor or not? In the segment it targets, cost is the most important. I expect mo-bo for i5 would be so cheap that they'll even throw it in as bundle for the CPU you buy. (the chipset's introduction price is $40-ish and with all the other necessary capacitors & connectors added, I guess the net cost of initial batches of mo-bos will be around $50, selling for a mere $60.) $196 for CPU+IGP + $60 for mo-bo + $40 for 2 GB DDR3 and another $100 for the rest of the necessary stuff, you can have a PC sufficient for office for about $400 + taxes. Not bad, I can say. and this is the introductory pricing. As time goes, the prices will drop significantly.
heres deal go here http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/255975-28-intel-core-benchmarked
it preforms identically and sometimes better than i7 and will be cheap as a platform itself. what does this mean? ram and MB wont cost 500-600 total. more like 300 for performance edged models (speculation). were told to expect entry level i5 to be under $200
it preforms identically and sometimes better than i7 and will be cheap as a platform itself. what does this mean? ram and MB wont cost 500-600 total. more like 300 for performance edged models (speculation). were told to expect entry level i5 to be under $200
Tindytim
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It performs better, yes, but it have integrated video on die, and an onboard PCI-e controller, limiting the i5 platform to 16 PCI-e lanes. How many motherboard manufacturers are even going to include a PCI-e x16 bus? You're certainly not going to be running a Tri-SLI setup, and that's the only way you're going to see a benefit in a gaming applications. Since Tom's is only about gaming, they'll probably stick with the i7.
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