Intel: No Linux for You, Clover Trail

[COLGeek]

Does this mean WIntel is a couple again? Seems kind of arrogant and strange given all of the choices and what competition has to offer these days - but just maybe that's the answer right there .

Just because MS and Intel have "dated" others, doesn't mean there was a point where they weren't a "couple".

 

[Zingam]

Fuck Linux.... ehm.... well, fuck Intel!

 

[Old_Fogie_Late_Bloomer]

http://www.extremetech.com/computing/136276-intel-clover-trail-atom-chips-cannot-run-linux

Hell, I don't even know what this article is saying. Either the chip won't work, period, or the battery life will be so low as to make it not worthwhile.

[citation][nom]neblix[/nom]I think you guys are overreacting by a magnitude of 100.This family of atoms is not supporting Linux. No where did it say "Intel processors are not supporting Linux anymore HERPDERP HUEHUE"[/citation]

No, I disagree. There is exactly zero overreacting going on here. Anyone who wants to buy a Clover-Trail-based, inexpensive, netbook-like device and put Linux on it...can't. Microsoft is locking Linux out of any ARM-based Windows 8 device, and now Microsoft and Intel are more or less locking Linux out of the low-end x86 market, as well.

Let me say that again. Any ARM-based Windows 8 device, and any low-end x86-based Windows 8 device running Clover Trail--which will most likely be basically all of them--are being prevented by design from running Linux.

 

[Old_Fogie_Late_Bloomer]

It's bad enough you can't buy a computer these days without being forced to buy the Windows license...Microsoft is really taking it to the next level, here. :-\

 

[ojas]

Yay now all the hippy tech sites are suggesting that "Intel is terrified of ARM". *facepalm*

 

[matt_b]

[citation][nom]COLGeek[/nom]Just because MS and Intel have "dated" others, doesn't mean there was a point where they weren't a "couple".[/citation]
They've relaxed their exclusivity to one another over the past several years, the proof is in their business practices. To come right out and say that this new chip has Windows 8 exclusivity written all over it not to mention integrated with some of the CPU's handling just sounds like the old days. Why even lock out other OS choices by saying this is basically a chip designed around one specific OS - how odd does that sound?

 

[Wisecracker]

Brazos-2 will likely kick CT Atom/PowerVR graphics to the curb, anyway, and Kerala/Kabini will finish the job in Q1-13 (especially with a new UVD)

OR ... when Silverlight ever gets their HW acceleration sheet together ...

 

[blazorthon]

[citation][nom]Old_Fogie_Late_Bloomer[/nom]It's bad enough you can't buy a computer these days without being forced to buy the Windows license...Microsoft is really taking it to the next level, here. :-\[/citation]

Actually, you can buy computers that have no OS or have Linux on them by default from a lot of places. Even dell.com has several models with Linux options for online orders and there are several companies who sell laptops with Ubuntu and a few other versions of Linux.

 

[DSpider]

The heck is wrong with you, Intel? What, there aren't any ARM distros out there? Gimme a break...

 

[mstngs351]

For Pete's sake you guys. Intel has a lot of models and expecting them to make everything set up for linux is like expecting Ford to make every vehicle capable of holding 8 people. There are market niches that can be filled by product X while having product Y fill others. The article even pointed out Intels continued support with other CPU's. Stop being entitled tools.

 

[belardo]

Looks like some of the retardation of Microsoft has spread to intel.

Wait, doesn't ATOM CPUs completely suck compared to the AMD E-Class of CPUs which have more powerful CPU/GPU performance with less power?!

 

[belardo]

What happens when Windows8 fails? What happens then?

AMD needs to step up their Linux game big time... Windows8 is going to cause some serious hurt.

 

[blazorthon]

http://www.itworld.com/hardware/295714/intel-reverses-course-bringing-android-clover-trail-chips-tablets

Maybe Clover Trail will support Android.

[citation][nom]belardo[/nom]Looks like some of the retardation of Microsoft has spread to intel.Wait, doesn't ATOM CPUs completely suck compared to the AMD E-Class of CPUs which have more powerful CPU/GPU performance with less power?![/citation]

Clover Trail should be a huge improvement over current Atoms.

 

[Old_Fogie_Late_Bloomer]

[citation][nom]blazorthon[/nom]Actually, you can buy computers that have no OS or have Linux on them by default from a lot of places. Even dell.com has several models with Linux options for online orders and there are several companies who sell laptops with Ubuntu and a few other versions of Linux.[/citation]
Sure, sure. Go ahead and find me a link to any Dell laptop besides the Latitude 2120 that has a Linux option. And by the time I'm done up-speccing it to something reasonable, and factor tax on top, why am I going to buy this laptop from Dell when I can get a ThinkPad X131e for the same price? The specs are markedly better, despite the fact that the Windows license is factored in on the cost of the ThinkPad.

What the heck is the point of buying less computer for more money in order to use a free operating system?

 

[blazorthon]

[citation][nom]Old_Fogie_Late_Bloomer[/nom]Sure, sure. Go ahead and find me a link to any Dell laptop besides the Latitude 2120 that has a Linux option. And by the time I'm done up-speccing it to something reasonable, and factor tax on top, why am I going to buy this laptop from Dell when I can get a ThinkPad X131e for the same price? The specs are markedly better, despite the fact that the Windows license is factored in on the cost of the ThinkPad.What the heck is the point of buying less computer for more money in order to use a free operating system?[/citation]

http://configure.us.dell.com/dellstore/config.aspx?oc=mlb1957_fcn&model_id=precision-m4600-n&c=us&l=en&s=biz&cs=555

http://configure.us.dell.com/dellstore/config.aspx?oc=mlb1975_fcn&model_id=precision-m6600-n&c=us&l=en&s=biz&cs=555

I thought that one link wasn't enough, so I went for two. Also, the point isn't to use a free operating system. The point was that Linux is an option for those who want it and look around.

Here are some other links:
http://www.linuxcertified.com/linux_laptops.html
http://www.thelinuxlaptop.com/products_new.php
http://linuxpreloaded.com/

 

[Old_Fogie_Late_Bloomer]

[citation][nom]blazorthon[/nom]http://configure.us.dell.com/dells [...] biz&cs=555http://configure.us.dell.com/dells [...] biz&cs=555I thought that one link wasn't enough, so I went for two. Also, the point isn't to use a free operating system. The point was that Linux is an option for those who want it and look around.[/citation]
This links prove my point, not yours. Here are two laptops (from the Large Enterprise business line, I might add): one costs over $2100 and is hopelessly overpriced, and the other costs over $1600 and is absolutely spanked in value when compared to a ThinkPad T530, which is more-or-less-seamlessly plug-n-play with Ubuntu/Kubuntu Linux.

 

[Guest]

Belardo - no! AMD E series is no where near Clovertrail in terms of power. I like AMD but this is a completely different market. These are SoC chips which have lots of functions built into them that do more than just CPU/GPU anyway. The combined power portfolio is FAR lower than what AMD has out right now. These are chips that can run on a phone OR tablet. AMD is looking to build chips that fit into a tablet in '13 but it will be more of a niche. They are looking to put out a tablet platform that is higher performing than ARM/Atom (though not nearly the same batterly life) and cheaper than i3/i5/i7 (though less performance). Intel will counter with Haswell which will push IvyBridge prices towards AMD's price end. This is precisely why we need AMD in the market. They represent the middle level product above ARM/Atom and under highend i7/i5 but cheaper. There is still a market for that and their intro into that market on the tablet side will force Intel to lower prices of Ivy and we will all win for it!

 

[Old_Fogie_Late_Bloomer]

[citation][nom]blazorthon[/nom]Here are some other links:http://www.linuxcertified.com/linux_laptops.htmlhttp://www.thelinuxlaptop.com/products_new.phphttp://linuxpreloaded.com/[/citation]
The first two sites you linked absolutely fail in the value department. I haven't had a chance to explore the last site extensively but the first two just continue to make my point, not yours. Why am I going to spend more to get the same hardware when a little careful shopping allows me a painless Linux installation experience?

 

[Guest]

blazorthon: May I ask in what parallel universe that it is fair and reasonable to pay $1500 for a crappy dual core i5 processor, and a 1366x768 screen just to avoid getting a copy of Windows by default with the machine? Whose payroll are you on to be posting this propaganda?

Or, in line with Old Fogie's point, you could save $500 and get a better CPU by getting a regular Windows laptop.

 

[Wisecracker]

Belardo - no! AMD E series is no where near Clovertrail in terms of power. I like AMD but this is a completely different market. These are SoC chips which have lots of functions built into them that do more than just CPU/GPU anyway. The combined power portfolio is FAR lower than what AMD has out right now. These are chips that can run on a phone OR tablet. AMD is looking to build chips that fit into a tablet in '13 but it will be more of a niche. They are looking to put out a tablet platform that is higher performing than ARM/Atom (though not nearly the same batterly life) and cheaper than i3/i5/i7 (though less performance). Intel will counter with Haswell which will push IvyBridge prices towards AMD's price end. This is precisely why we need AMD in the market. They represent the middle level product above ARM/Atom and under highend i7/i5 but cheaper. There is still a market for that and their intro into that market on the tablet side will force Intel to lower prices of Ivy and we will all win for it!

This is called Intel Fanboy denial.

 

[blazorthon]

[citation][nom]Old_Fogie_Late_Bloomer[/nom]This links prove my point, not yours. Here are two laptops (from the Large Enterprise business line, I might add): one costs over $2100 and is hopelessly overpriced, and the other costs over $1600 and is absolutely spanked in value when compared to a ThinkPad T530, which is more-or-less-seamlessly plug-n-play with Ubuntu/Kubuntu Linux.[/citation]

blazorthon: May I ask in what parallel universe that it is fair and reasonable to pay $1500 for a crappy dual core i5 processor, and a 1366x768 screen just to avoid getting a copy of Windows by default with the machine? Whose payroll are you on to be posting this propaganda?

Or, in line with Old Fogie's point, you could save $500 and get a better CPU by getting a regular Windows laptop.

I never said that Dell has the best prices, only that they have Linux options. You're acting as if I praised Dell as a savior for Linux or something like that when I did no such thing. I simply used them as examples.

 

[Old_Fogie_Late_Bloomer]

[citation][nom]blazorthon[/nom]I never said that Dell has the best prices, only that they have Linux options. You're acting as if I praised Dell as a savior for Linux or something like that when I did no such thing. I simply used them as examples.[/citation]
An example of what? That you can pay 1.5x to 3x times the price of a comparable laptop for the privilege of not having to install Linux yourself? How hard would it be for computer builders to sell the same laptop 5-10% cheaper with no OS on it?

 

[Cazalan]

An odd move for Intel but with the rapid pace they've taken for Atom it somewhat makes sense. Not committing to have to support two different platforms, cuts down on the workload and get them quicker to market.

 

[blazorthon]

[citation][nom]Old_Fogie_Late_Bloomer[/nom]An example of what? That you can pay 1.5x to 3x times the price of a comparable laptop for the privilege of not having to install Linux yourself? How hard would it be for computer builders to sell the same laptop 5-10% cheaper with no OS on it?[/citation]

Windows isn't too expensive for the OEMs. System builders could make a laptop specifically for Linux or with it as a free option, but it wouldn't sell overly well (at least not packaged with Linux), that builder would need to have employees that have at least a little Linux experience, and they'd have to either provide customer support for it (meaning they'd need to hire more experiences Linux users) or explain to customers why it doesn't have customer/technical support. I don't like it anymore than you seem to, but liking/disliking something isn't enough to change it.

 

[chewy1963]

The thing about Linux is that it is mostly written in C or a derivative thereof and once a decent compiler is written for Clover Trail, porting Linux over to it should be relatively painless. One of the great strengths of Linux is it's portability.