News Intel's Core i3-12100 Demolishes The Ryzen 3 3300X In An Early Review

[jacob249358]

Chinese publication XFastest reviews an engineering sample of Intel's unreleased Core i3-12100 Alder Lake processor.

Intel's Core i3-12100 Demolishes The Ryzen 3 3300X In An Early Review : Read more

Definitely still need cheaper motherboards but it's good to see someone caring about the budget end of things. Comparing it to the 3300x is kind of scuffed but it's not like AMD has released anything else comparable. But I still would've liked to see a comparison to the i3 10100 or even something like the r5 3600

 

[-Fran-]

Sure. Intel currently has no CPU that is cheaper than the 3300X ($330 in amazon and $350 in NewEgg) and outperforms it. Oh wait...

I don't get this point of yours.

If the market deems the price of this CPU to be higher of even the 5600X, then I do not believe for a second it's AMD's fault (so your other comment about "telling" Lisa applies) and it's just an issue of these CPUs having a cult of sorts? Maybe it being EOL'ed has to do with it? Some form of unkown quality? I mean, even I am baffled a supposedly $120 part has a higher street price than another that uses the same platform and beats it handedly in every possible metric (5600X/5600G). It just doesn't make sense and it is definitely not the rule.

AMD doesn't care about the lower end market and I fully agree there (writing on the wall and stuff), because OEMs are taking all their stock, so they, it seems, can make do with slightly better parts for consumers instead? Or something? At the end of the day, in the 60W range, the 5600G and 5600X are perfect fits and OEMs are happy with the 5300G. I'd imagine the're still selling like hot cakes to OEMs as they haven't had the need to move them to consumer channels, which is a shame. Nothing much we can do there other than hope AMD releases them to the DYI market. Even then, if they're good value, the price will increase to match demand and circle jerks gallore

One point you cannot dismiss is this: AMD's current low end platforms are actually good. Much more than Intel's because of one simple fact: B chipsets are cheap, quality and you can pair almost any CPU you want with them and only have less connectivity as a trade off (PCIe3 for B450 vs PCIe4 for B550; less lanes). When you go rock bottom, I'd say AMD is in a slightly better position with their A chipset vs Intel's H, but CPU selection wise, only due to power requirements, AMD can give people better upgrade options than Intel. For low end PCs, that's a non-trivial advantage. Check historical (and current) prices of Intel's i3, i5 and i7 lines. A person that would've wanted to move from their i5 7600 to an i7 7700K wouldn't be able to do much, if at all, using either a B or H series platform (no XMP, no CPU OC) and most of those wouldn't even support high power delivery.

Kind of a long answer, but the lack of context is sometimes baffling (EDIT: in general; not to the quoted message).

EDIT: One thing I forgot to mention, which I hope Intel realized and already accounted for... They have a golden opportunity for feature parity with AMD by adding more than just XMP for their B and H chipsets. Intel wanted to keep all those good things locked to the Z platform because money (can't blame them; AMD allowed them to do so for years), but had to give in with the B560 and allow XMP, so with the potential B660 I hope they also allow K-SKU and memory overclocking. It also feels like a stupid shortcoming from Intel still pushing locked SKUs where AMD has their full lineup, from top to bottom, fully unlocked (except A-series chipset IIRC).

Regards.

 

[evdjj3j]

EXTRA EXTRA, READ ALL ABOUT IT!

Intel Alder Lake utterly destroys AMD 286.

 

[Eximo]

Chiplet yields are good, simple as that. Target is 8 cores per chiplet, which would be 50% yield to get a quad core. No sense taking working 6/7 core chiplets, cutting them down to make a less profitable product. Takes a lot of chiplets to make Epyc chips, and you need the best of the bunch for high end Ryzen, just nothing left to make a low end product with them. So you are left with Athlon and G series products to try and fill the low end market. Already established process node, again, not likely to make any significant numbers of quad core parts. And then we run into the GPU shortage issue, and 5600G and 5700G are staying at a high price.

 

[-Fran-]

Chiplet yields are good, simple as that. Target is 8 cores per chiplet, which would be 50% yield to get a quad core. No sense taking working 6/7 core chiplets, cutting them down to make a less profitable product. Takes a lot of chiplets to make Epyc chips, and you need the best of the bunch for high end Ryzen, just nothing left to make a low end product with them. So you are left with Athlon and G series products to try and fill the low end market. Already established process node, again, not likely to make any significant numbers of quad core parts. And then we run into the GPU shortage issue, and 5600G and 5700G are staying at a high price.

Thanks for making that point. I completely forgot the yields side, which is even more telling/important.

Regards.

 

[Eximo]

Thanks for making that point. I completely forgot the yields side, which is even more telling/important.

It is surprising that AMD hasn't just designed a quad core, but there really isn't a need. Seems everyone is moving away from them.

Intel didn't bother with 11th gen quads for desktop. And doesn't look like they plan a quad core die this time around either. 12th I3's are cut down 6 core dies. So only four CPU dies this go around and only two for desktops. 8P+8E and 6P only.

 

[Why_Me]

Definitely still need cheaper motherboards but it's good to see someone caring about the budget end of things. Comparing it to the 3300x is kind of scuffed but it's not like AMD has released anything else comparable. But I still would've liked to see a comparison to the i3 10100 or even something like the r5 3600

$250 USD atm

 

[JamesJones44]

I'm more interested in the 65 vs 60/77 power usage numbers. If intel is usually running closer to 77 than 60/65 then that also must be factored in to some (minimal) extent.
I'd like to see the benchmarks (just for laughs) adjusted for a per watt performance and see how close things are then.
Obviously if you're buying a desktop system, that extra 12w isn't going to play a role in the decision, but for an apples vs apples comparison, it could be interesting.

Even AMD exceeds their numbers on the regular, just not as much as Intel. Last I saw all of the 3xxx and 5xxx CPUs ran above their advertised TDP but respected what AMD calls there PPT of 142w. AnAndTech had a nice writeup on it. There probably pretty close in this comparison since Intels MTP thus far seems to be close to the max and the AMD 3xxx series seems to run about 20-30% over their TDP limits under load.

 

[-Fran-]

It is surprising that AMD hasn't just designed a quad core, but there really isn't a need. Seems everyone is moving away from them.

Intel didn't bother with 11th gen quads for desktop. And doesn't look like they plan a quad core die this time around either. 12th I3's are cut down 6 core dies. So only four CPU dies this go around and only two for desktops. 8P+8E and 6P only.

I don't think AMD could justify the SoC cost if they need to price the chiplets under a certain price. That's why they're still relying on single-chip designs for the mobile and low end stuff. I have the feeling Zen4 and beyond won't have desktop 4 cores at all, just like Zen3 doesn't because of chiplet cost and, worse, 3D cache.

Not sure if it's good or not, but I guess that speculation makes sense. I think they'll keep using the APUs to fill the lower end and laptop space for the foreseeable future, sadly. And as you mentioned, given the yields they may not even have the capacity to give the DYI market 4c/8t Zen4 CPUs/APUs and keep them OEM only. Does AMD have anything lower than a 4c/4t for Desktop in any market? I don't remember any TBH. Their embedded stuff would be the only thing that comes to mind.

Regards.

 

[rtoaht]

I don't get this point of yours.

If the market deems the price of this CPU to be higher of even the 5600X, then I do not believe for a second it's AMD's fault (so your other comment about "telling" Lisa applies) and it's just an issue of these CPUs having a cult of sorts? Maybe it being EOL'ed has to do with it? Some form of unkown quality? I mean, even I am baffled a supposedly $120 part has a higher street price than another that uses the same platform and beats it handedly in every possible metric (5600X/5600G). It just doesn't make sense and it is definitely not the rule.

AMD doesn't care about the lower end market and I fully agree there (writing on the wall and stuff), because OEMs are taking all their stock, so they, it seems, can make do with slightly better parts for consumers instead? Or something? At the end of the day, in the 60W range, the 5600G and 5600X are perfect fits and OEMs are happy with the 5300G. I'd imagine the're still selling like hot cakes to OEMs as they haven't had the need to move them to consumer channels, which is a shame. Nothing much we can do there other than hope AMD releases them to the DYI market. Even then, if they're good value, the price will increase to match demand and circle jerks gallore

One point you cannot dismiss is this: AMD's current low end platforms are actually good. Much more than Intel's because of one simple fact: B chipsets are cheap, quality and you can pair almost any CPU you want with them and only have less connectivity as a trade off (PCIe3 for B450 vs PCIe4 for B550; less lanes). When you go rock bottom, I'd say AMD is in a slightly better position with their A chipset vs Intel's H, but CPU selection wise, only due to power requirements, AMD can give people better upgrade options than Intel. For low end PCs, that's a non-trivial advantage. Check historical (and current) prices of Intel's i3, i5 and i7 lines. A person that would've wanted to move from their i5 7600 to an i7 7700K wouldn't be able to do much, if at all, using either a B or H series platform (no XMP, no CPU OC) and most of those wouldn't even support high power delivery.

Kind of a long answer, but the lack of context is sometimes baffling (EDIT: in general; not to the quoted message).

EDIT: One thing I forgot to mention, which I hope Intel realized and already accounted for... They have a golden opportunity for feature parity with AMD by adding more than just XMP for their B and H chipsets. Intel wanted to keep all those good things locked to the Z platform because money (can't blame them; AMD allowed them to do so for years), but had to give in with the B560 and allow XMP, so with the potential B660 I hope they also allow K-SKU and memory overclocking. It also feels like a stupid shortcoming from Intel still pushing locked SKUs where AMD has their full lineup, from top to bottom, fully unlocked (except A-series chipset IIRC).

Regards.

Thank you for writing the novel while keeping a safe distance from the point being made in my previous comment.

 

[VforV]

Alder Lake is selling so bad, at least in the shops I watch in the EU...

There is local shop that sells 12600k for 3-4 days now at the lowest price I could find, 285 euro (VAT included) and they are not selling it, the stock has not budged. Not to mention the other shops that have it at MSRP...

Alder Lake is really not a great sale success for intel, too many hindrances to adopt it and it shows that they are not selling like hot cakes, certainly not as good as Zen3 was selling at launch and maybe not even as good they sell now, after 1 year (?)...

 

[-Fran-]

Thank you for writing the novel while keeping a safe distance from the point being made in my previous comment.

Well, I did start by saying I didn't get your point

Alder Lake is selling so bad, at least in the shops I watch in the EU...

There is local shop that sells 12600k for 3-4 days now at the lowest price I could find, 285 euro (VAT included) and they are not selling it, the stock has not budged. Not to mention the other shops that have it at MSRP...

Alder Lake is really not a great sale success for intel, too many hindrances to adopt it and it shows that they are not selling like hot cakes, certainly not as good as Zen3 was selling at launch and maybe not even as good they sell now, after 1 year (?)...

I'm also keeping an eye on the major UK parts sellers and they don't seem to be moving much and they're keeping the 3-10% discounted prices. I'd like to see the usual German site's sales statistics and combine it with the Steam survey (lol) and see of there's a dent on either.

Where else can you find that information somewhat easily? Amazon's best sellers?

Regards.

 

[OriginFree]

On a per Watt basis. Nope, AMD isn't able to match. In the 12900K vs 5950x match, I originally thought that the 5950x is severely hampered by its TDP limit. But this is not really the case.

View: https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/ju1dnp/amd_ryzen_9_5950x_overclocking_benchmarks_timespy/


Someone has oc the 5950x to 4.75GHz on all cores.... 31617 is a really good result but its just ~4400pts higher than 12900K. Power seems to be ~260W on R20 (assume R23 is similar). So, despite having 16 cores and 32 threads, its not really much faster than 12900K. Now, imagine 12900K has 16 Pcores instead of 8P/8E.....

Sorry my mistake for not being clear.
I was just wondering if the 12100 that was benchmarked was usually running closer to the 77 watts vs the 60 watt number.
IF it's usually pushing 77, or so ,then it's drawing 20% (give or take) more than the 3300X.
Again, IF it is using 20% more power to get 20% more performance that seems far less impressive of a "demolishing".

I don't really care about the 12900K vs 5950x as it's not related to this news item. But thanks for sharing.

Overall good on you Intel. Now if you REALLY want to stick it to AMD, you should cut your prices in half and sell your discrete video cards at cost. That will teach them.

 

[TerryLaze]

Alder Lake is selling so bad, at least in the shops I watch in the EU...

There is local shop that sells 12600k for 3-4 days now at the lowest price I could find, 285 euro (VAT included) and they are not selling it, the stock has not budged. Not to mention the other shops that have it at MSRP...

Alder Lake is really not a great sale success for intel, too many hindrances to adopt it and it shows that they are not selling like hot cakes, certainly not as good as Zen3 was selling at launch and maybe not even as good they sell now, after 1 year (?)...

This one CPU alone means that intel sold at least 1000 of these CPUs to your region since that is the lowest amount of CPUs intel sells...that's completed sales with intel getting the money for them.
If alder is a good seller or not will be shown by intel's next few quarterly reports since bulk im/exporters will only buy more batches if they sell the old ones.

 

[TerryLaze]

Sorry my mistake for not being clear.
I was just wondering if the 12100 that was benchmarked was usually running closer to the 77 watts vs the 60 watt number.
IF it's usually pushing 77, or so ,then it's drawing 20% (give or take) more than the 3300X.
Again, IF it is using 20% more power to get 20% more performance that seems far less impressive of a "demolishing".

On these benches 77W all the time because they are all heavy multithreading.
But then again ryzen 65w CPUs draw 88w under heavy multithread.
https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3491-explaining-precision-boost-overdrive-benchmarks-auto-oc
"Default for Socket AM4 is at least 88W on motherboards rated for 65W TDP processors."

 

[waltc3]

Always interesting to compare PPW, eh? I saw some rather naive guy on another site trying to compare a 65W 6-core 5600X to an i5-12600k --that was 10 cores (6+4) and uses at least 3x the power (150W, intel says.)--and he thought he was being clever... AMD is still pressing substantially ahead in the PPW categories. It's absolutely critical for the server markets, and EPYC blows Alder Lake out of the water in PPW....

And in a ~couple of months AMD is going to bring up something more recent than a year-old Zen 3CPU to compare to Intel's brand-new Alder Lake! Zen 3 3d-Vcache is going to be a monster own its own--and then comes Zen 4 with DDR5 and PCIe5--and then will come AMD PCIe5 GPUs, etc. PPW is likely not that critical for gaming, but power consumption is a fairly big deal today for laptops and servers--and a lot of gamers are very particular about power consumption--more so than I would have thought! We'll know what's what between AMD and Intel in the next 3-6 months. Way too early to make judgements at this point...

 

[cyrusfox]

Always interesting to compare PPW, eh? I saw some rather naive guy on another site trying to compare a 65W 6-core 5600X to an i5-12600k --that was 10 cores (6+4) and uses at least 3x the power (150W, intel says.)--and he thought he was being clever... AMD is still pressing substantially ahead in the PPW categories. It's absolutely critical for the server markets, and EPYC blows Alder Lake out of the water in PPW....

And in a ~couple of months AMD is going to bring up something more recent than a year-old Zen 3CPU to compare to Intel's brand-new Alder Lake! Zen 3 3d-Vcache is going to be a monster own its own--and then comes Zen 4 with DDR5 and PCIe5--and then will come AMD PCIe5 GPUs, etc. PPW is likely not that critical for gaming, but power consumption is a fairly big deal today for laptops and servers--and a lot of gamers are very particular about power consumption--more so than I would have thought! We'll know what's what between AMD and Intel in the next 3-6 months. Way too early to make judgements at this point...

Alder lake is not a server product... That is Sapphire Rapids. The Alder Lake mobile line up is coming (6P+8e or 2P+8e), and it appears Intel will be doing quite well against against Mobile Ryzen(5000), the real challenger to best though is the M1.
Server is a whole different ball game that takes generations to infiltrate and change contracts, stability and support wins over price and efficiency for a majority AMD is still on the way up, but hasn't really impacted Intel in terms of margins, revenue, or profitability yet.

 

[jacob249358]

Always interesting to compare PPW, eh? I saw some rather naive guy on another site trying to compare a 65W 6-core 5600X to an i5-12600k --that was 10 cores (6+4) and uses at least 3x the power (150W, intel says.)--and he thought he was being clever... AMD is still pressing substantially ahead in the PPW categories. It's absolutely critical for the server markets, and EPYC blows Alder Lake out of the water in PPW....

And in a ~couple of months AMD is going to bring up something more recent than a year-old Zen 3CPU to compare to Intel's brand-new Alder Lake! Zen 3 3d-Vcache is going to be a monster own its own--and then comes Zen 4 with DDR5 and PCIe5--and then will come AMD PCIe5 GPUs, etc. PPW is likely not that critical for gaming, but power consumption is a fairly big deal today for laptops and servers--and a lot of gamers are very particular about power consumption--more so than I would have thought! We'll know what's what between AMD and Intel in the next 3-6 months. Way too early to make judgements at this point...

No one cares too much about CPU tdp unless it's a big jump. It's all about prices to performance and that's why someone would compare a 12600k and 5600x. Don't be silly

 

[Stardude82]

The i3-10100 demolish the stock 5300G pretty soundly in gaming when Tom's looked at the 5300G not too long ago. Adding another 10% to the margin makes sense.

I personally would like to see a 8 E-core chip with similar cache.

 

[Why_Me]

Always interesting to compare PPW, eh? I saw some rather naive guy on another site trying to compare a 65W 6-core 5600X to an i5-12600k --that was 10 cores (6+4) and uses at least 3x the power (150W, intel says.)--and he thought he was being clever... AMD is still pressing substantially ahead in the PPW categories. It's absolutely critical for the server markets, and EPYC blows Alder Lake out of the water in PPW....

And in a ~couple of months AMD is going to bring up something more recent than a year-old Zen 3CPU to compare to Intel's brand-new Alder Lake! Zen 3 3d-Vcache is going to be a monster own its own--and then comes Zen 4 with DDR5 and PCIe5--and then will come AMD PCIe5 GPUs, etc. PPW is likely not that critical for gaming, but power consumption is a fairly big deal today for laptops and servers--and a lot of gamers are very particular about power consumption--more so than I would have thought! We'll know what's what between AMD and Intel in the next 3-6 months. Way too early to make judgements at this point...

People who are worried about power consumption more than performance should stick to laptops.

 

[JamesJones44]

Sorry my mistake for not being clear.
I was just wondering if the 12100 that was benchmarked was usually running closer to the 77 watts vs the 60 watt number.
IF it's usually pushing 77, or so ,then it's drawing 20% (give or take) more than the 3300X.
Again, IF it is using 20% more power to get 20% more performance that seems far less impressive of a "demolishing".

I don't really care about the 12900K vs 5950x as it's not related to this news item. But thanks for sharing.

Overall good on you Intel. Now if you REALLY want to stick it to AMD, you should cut your prices in half and sell your discrete video cards at cost. That will teach them.

The 3300x has a max power draw of 80 watts despite having a 65 watt TDP (remember TDP is not power draw). AFAIK, only the K based processors can be pegged at PL2 watts, but for argument sake, even if this was, it doesn't matter since the max power draw of a 3300X is 80 watts.

link to info https://www.anandtech.com/show/15774/the-amd-ryzen-3-3300x-and-3100-cpu-review/2

 

[Conahl]

People who are worried about power consumption more than performance should stick to laptops

those that think like this, need to understand, that what the US charges for power, is not the same every where else.

 

[VforV]

I'm also keeping an eye on the major UK parts sellers and they don't seem to be moving much and they're keeping the 3-10% discounted prices. I'd like to see the usual German site's sales statistics and combine it with the Steam survey (lol) and see of there's a dent on either.

Where else can you find that information somewhat easily? Amazon's best sellers?

Regards.

It's been like this since the launch everywhere. Alder Lake is not selling great and that's a fact, numerous reports said so already.
I'm just curious how long will this last... will it sell as bad up to Raptor Lake too? Because that would be a big fail.

People who are worried about power consumption more than performance should stick to laptops.

People who are not worried about HIGH, VERY HIGH and ABSURDLY HIGH power consumption are ignorants.

At the rate CPUs and GPUs are increasing power consumption each gen, we will not only need to change the PSU every upgrade, but also the air conditioning in our rooms... not to mention that at some point the electricity costs will double or triple (if that did not happen already).

Yes, IGNORANTS (on high horses, blinded by more money than sense).

 

[RodroX]

Ok that was expected. I mean we all knew a 12th gen core i3 will probably beat the old R3 3100 and 3300X.

Sadly we still have the same porblem we have since 2020, gpu prices are a complete mess and usually imposible to get.

 

[jacob249358]

It's been like this since the launch everywhere. Alder Lake is not selling great and that's a fact, numerous reports said so already.
I'm just curious how long will this last... will it sell as bad up to Raptor Lake too? Because that would be a big fail.

People who are not worried about HIGH, VERY HIGH and ABSURDLY HIGH power consumption are ignorants.

At the rate CPUs and GPUs are increasing power consumption each gen, we will not only need to change the PSU every upgrade, but also the air conditioning in our rooms... not to mention that at some point the electricity costs will double or triple (if that did not happen already).

Yes, IGNORANTS (on high horses, blinded by more money than sense).

Ignorant? It's called having an opinion. Just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't make them ignorant. Maybe it's you who is ignorant?