News Intel's Core i9-14900K Delidded: 12C Temperature Reduction

[abufrejoval]

Uhh, maybe don't question my reading comprehension, when you appear to know less about the chip than I do.
This, and original Raptor Lake can go up to 115C. If Intel's engineers say 95C is fine, then 95C is fine; I'm not going to take some stranger's word that it isn't true, at least not without proof.

Sorry, evidently in fact my reading comprehension tripped...

 

[punkncat]

It hasn't clicked yet that temperatures like this are ok, but clueless personal feelings are getting in the way of that.

I'm going to end up busting my head open from all the facepalms caused by 'temps too high' threads.

I am not comfortable with temps that high being a new normal. The room I use for work and play cooling/AC cannot deal with those temperatures and remain comfortable or money conscious for the entire house.

Even since Ryzen 2XXX R7 variant I have to trick my system by blowing the air out of that room onto the thermostat. It works well enough to make the office comfortable but also helps when I change my bedroom on the other end of the house to the meat locker....

Alongside other pressing needs for electricity as we phase out ICE and so forth, this is not heading in a workable direction.

 

[Phaaze88]

I am not comfortable with temps that high being a new normal.

I figure many won't be. The option to adapt is there... or a leash can be put on it, if it makes one feel better, at a minor performance loss, which no one likes to hear[even if the chip is operating outside its optimal spec out of the box]. If the silicon can tolerate it, cool(no pun). It's not like it's flesh and bone, which can't tolerate nearly as much.

The room I use for work and play cooling/AC cannot deal with those temperatures and remain comfortable or money conscious for the entire house.

Are you relating operating temperature to the heat dispersed into the room? 'Cause that's not how that works. Your comfort, and ambient temperature is influenced by the power used. The energy used doesn't just disappear, it moves. You could have 2 14900Ks rendering for an hour:
A)No power limits, using up 300w, and hanging around 85C on all cores, on a custom loop.
B)Long and short power limited to 200w, and hitting the 100C default with an air cooler.
Sample A is going to warm things up faster, as it's using and releasing more energy into the room on average.
One could argue that the Sample A would finish a task faster, so Sample B would be the bigger heater instead... but would it really? The previous gen has been shown to not lose much in the way of enforcing lower power limits.

Those 4090s, with their impressive thermal management, are still dumping around 300w or more into a room. Someone's room definitely isn't getting uncomfortably warm because their fancy new cpu has a few cores running at higher temperatures than the gpu core in a game.

Even then, a PC still pales to what a refrigerator can do to a room.

 

[punkncat]

Are you relating operating temperature to the heat dispersed into the room? 'Cause that's not how that works. Your comfort, and ambient temperature is influenced by the power used.

Actually, that is EXACTLY what it does. When discussing these 100* operating temps under load, we aren't discussing on idle. We are talking about a piece of hardware that runs that hot as acceptable. When it is running even a portion of that you are straight dumping hot air out of the case that has (in part) been heated by that 100* C component. Even aside from the power supply and graphics card.

I promise you that I know and realize the thermal change in the office. I actually put together another low power system with spare parts just so I don't have to have the i9 running with us while we work. It gets uncomfortably warm. Now, a month or two from now and I will likely be inclined to swap back over for a month or so. We are on a heat pump. They are terrible when it gets really cold. I can turn the i9 on and just doing average stuff the office becomes the warmest room in the house in minutes.

 

[TerryLaze]

I am not comfortable with temps that high being a new normal.

They are not the new normal, just as this article showed, you can get a 5.6Ghz all core overclock and still be at 93 degrees.
100 is the limit for the super lazy people that just want to go with default mobo settings and get an automatically overclocked CPU.

Actually, that is EXACTLY what it does. When discussing these 100* operating temps under load, we aren't discussing on idle.

That's not what he said, you can get 100 degrees as 100W or at 400W and at 400W you will get much more heat in the room than at 100W even though the temp will be 100 in both cases.

 

[helper800]

Those 4090s, with their impressive thermal management, are still dumping around 300w or more into a room. Someone's room definitely isn't getting uncomfortably warm because their fancy new cpu has a few cores running at higher temperatures than the gpu core in a game.

Even then, a PC still pales to what a refrigerator can do to a room.

As someone who lives in California and closes the door in my PC room, I can tell you it can get uncomfortably hotter room to room. My whole PC setup, which includes monitors, KB/M, WAP/Modem, and PC, dumps around 700 watts into the room while playing games. It is around 10-15 F hotter in my PC room than the other rooms of the house. When I lived more inland it would regularly get to 110+ F in the summer. Playing games in the summer basically turned my room into a slow cooker oven...

 

[punkncat]

They are not the new normal, just as this article showed, you can get a 5.6Ghz all core overclock and still be at 93 degrees.
100 is the limit for the super lazy people that just want to go with default mobo settings and get an automatically overclocked CPU.

That's not what he said, you can get 100 degrees as 100W or at 400W and at 400W you will get much more heat in the room than at 100W even though the temp will be 100 in both cases.

The logic is dizzying on that supposition.

 

[Phaaze88]

The energy used is converted into heat until it reaches some kind of equilibrium, that's a basic part of thermodynamics.
Temperature is a concept to help us understand thermodynamics, it does not tell us about the energy generated by an object.


I'm no teacher, and I certainly don't have a great vocabulary... I don't know how to make this one any easier.
Like, if someone starts a thread about their room getting toasty during a gaming session or other, the first things I'm going to ask about is what the hardware in the room consists of and whether air conditioning is present or not, not what the temperature of anything is.

After that, I'm going to request that person to lower the power limit on their gpu, which tends to be the largest energy guzzler in a PC focused on games, and to use frame caps, as that also increases energy use. I'll also request they figure out a means to direct the PC's heat energy directly out of the room if they're not working with air conditioning, or to buy an AC if it's not too much trouble.

 

[helper800]

The energy used is converted into heat until it reaches some kind of equilibrium, that's a basic part of thermodynamics.
Temperature is a concept to help us understand thermodynamics, it does not tell us about the energy generated by an object.


I'm no teacher, and I certainly don't have a great vocabulary... I don't know how to make this one any easier.
Like, if someone starts a thread about their room getting toasty during a gaming session or other, the first things I'm going to ask about is what the hardware in the room consists of and whether air conditioning is present or not, not what the temperature of anything is.

After that, I'm going to request that person to lower the power limit on their gpu, which tends to be the largest energy guzzler in a PC focused on games, and to use frame caps, as that also increases energy use. I'll also request they figure out a means to direct the PC's heat energy directly out of the room if they're not working with air conditioning, or to buy an AC if it's not too much trouble.

To do the math of calculating the amount of temperature increase from dumping heat into a room by any device you need to know several things. The first thing you would need to know is the area of the room that is being heated, the barometric pressure of the room, and the exact amount of energy being dumped into it. A room will reach an equilibrium temperature at specific constant heat outputs based on how insulated the room is, the materials used in the construction of the room, airflow, and a few others. Typically, the smaller the room, the faster it reaches equilibrium temperature and the higher that temperature will be at the same amount of heat being dumped into it. The larger the difference of the ambient temperature outside of the room to the temperature inside the room the harder it is to maintain temperatures inside the room. I could be incorrect on on some point, please correct me if I am wrong, but that is the general information required to calculate temperature increases in rooms due to devices.

 

[Order 66]

I am not comfortable with temps that high being a new normal. The room I use for work and play cooling/AC cannot deal with those temperatures and remain comfortable or money conscious for the entire house.

Even since Ryzen 2XXX R7 variant I have to trick my system by blowing the air out of that room onto the thermostat. It works well enough to make the office comfortable but also helps when I change my bedroom on the other end of the house to the meat locker....

Alongside other pressing needs for electricity as we phase out ICE and so forth, this is not heading in a workable direction.

I understand that sentiment, but if the chip is designed to run that hot, I have no problem letting it. I should mention that I have my PC in the basement where it is always cold, so any extra heat to warm up the room is great.