Linux Gaming Will Increase '30-fold' with Steam Machines

[demonhorde665]

some of you saying 20 fold is reasonable and i think even that is a stretch. 20 fold 30 fold .. means 20 x or 30 x , that means multiply the number of linux gamers now by 20 or 30 and both number predictons look stupid when you look at the market. This is just linux geek wet dreaming and stroking. consider these facts:

1. hardcore console gamers have already ivnested their 400-500 bucks on one of the new consoles.

2. hardcore PC gamers have likely already invested 1500-2000 dollars on a gaming rig. that they most likely built themselves, thus they are not that interested at all in pre-built systems like a steam machine.

3. the more casual console gamers that usualy wait a year or two before gettign a new console will likely not hear about steam machines .. or they wil hear all manner of scare stories and misinformation about it so wil avoid much like console gamers avoided the orginal xbox for a few years.

4. casual PC gamers will not need a steam machine even if they hear about them and the machine not being a windows machine may frighten them off.

5. Non gamers that look to buy presents for gamers around x-mas and other holidays will most likely go the biggest name brands they can think of.

Now don't get me wrong , i'd love to see steam machines take off and do well, but today's market is just to full of competition. you got 3 varieties of consoles, smart phones, tablets, handhelds.thenther are pc's which steam machines are. point being there is already every flavor of gaming device a user could want out there. I don't think the road ahead looks very good for steam machines. What valve needs to do now is invest heavily into advertising for every xbox1, PS4, or WiiU comerical valve needs to have 4 comericals of their own running to really get word out to the general public.

 

[rokit]

I am all for Linux being a bit more popular for gaming, so that we could forget about wine for newer games. But i just can't see it without massive AAA games pushed in it. It shouldn't be just some developers it must be some big companies like EA, Activision, Ubisoft and so on. Only then i can see bright future for Linux gaming.

 

[Haravikk]

I'm definitely still excited about Steam Machines, and intend to get one. I'm not so sure about SteamOS; I expect Linux ports will still take a while to really pick up speed, but in the mean time a Steam Machine with Windows should make a great alternative to more traditional gaming PCs, and switching to SteamOS will be good whenever it gets enough support from major titles.

 

[back_by_demand]

When SteamOS give increased performance over Windows it may happen, but if you think asking people to pay extra for less then will increase sales then you will be sadly let down

 

[therogerwilco]

Unreal Tournament tried for years.

 

[Wisecracker]

"Steam Machine's OS is going to be unparalleled in PC gaming," Diana said.

Diana said that the launch of the Steam Machines next year will likely increase Linux gaming 20 to 30 fold "overnight."

hyperbole [hahy-pur-buh-lee]
noun Rhetoric.
1. obvious and intentional exaggeration.
2. an extravagant statement or figure of speech not intended to be taken literally

 

[cub_fanatic]

Here is what I want from Steam OS: I want to be able to use any controller or mouse and keyboard that I want, not the ridiculous looking Steam controller, I want Steam OS to use way less resources such as CPU, RAM and drive space vs Windows 7/8, I want to be able to use my AMD GPU, I want to be able to play every single game I own not just Linux games. If I can play the same Windows games on Steam - figure out a way to get it working like using something like Wine or some other virtual machine OR simply release a Steam OS version of those games which can be downloaded using the same key you used for your Windows game which would be the ideal way to go IMO - and those games run better because the OS is using less CPU and RAM overall due to less background processes and it equates to higher framerates and better performance of those games then I will immediately switch to Steam OS for gaming and use my laptop for everything else.

 

[nukemaster]

Here is what I want from Steam OS: I want to be able to use any controller or mouse and keyboard that I want, not the ridiculous looking Steam controller, I want Steam OS to use way less resources such as CPU, RAM and drive space vs Windows 7/8, I want to be able to use my AMD GPU, I want to be able to play every single game I own not just Linux games. If I can play the same Windows games on Steam - figure out a way to get it working like using something like Wine or some other virtual machine OR simply release a Steam OS version of those games which can be downloaded using the same key you used for your Windows game which would be the ideal way to go IMO - and those games run better because the OS is using less CPU and RAM overall due to less background processes and it equates to higher framerates and better performance of those games then I will immediately switch to Steam OS for gaming and use my laptop for everything else.

AMD cards/mouse/keyboard will work on steam machines as far as I know. It is just optimized for controllers.

By nature this streamlined OS will use less resources. How much the translates into game performance has yet to be fully seen.

Valve's steam platform is mainly a storefront and distribution center. They can not FORCE game makers to remake games for Linux and many emulators create too much performance hit.

They are opening a door, but the chances of ALL games is very low at this time.

 

[cub_fanatic]

Here is what I want from Steam OS: I want to be able to use any controller or mouse and keyboard that I want, not the ridiculous looking Steam controller, I want Steam OS to use way less resources such as CPU, RAM and drive space vs Windows 7/8, I want to be able to use my AMD GPU, I want to be able to play every single game I own not just Linux games. If I can play the same Windows games on Steam - figure out a way to get it working like using something like Wine or some other virtual machine OR simply release a Steam OS version of those games which can be downloaded using the same key you used for your Windows game which would be the ideal way to go IMO - and those games run better because the OS is using less CPU and RAM overall due to less background processes and it equates to higher framerates and better performance of those games then I will immediately switch to Steam OS for gaming and use my laptop for everything else.

AMD cards/mouse/keyboard will work on steam machines as far as I know. It is just optimized for controllers.

By nature this streamlined OS will use less resources. How much the translates into game performance has yet to be fully seen.

Valve's steam platform is mainly a storefront and distribution center. They can not FORCE game makers to remake games for Linux and many emulators create too much performance hit.

They are opening a door, but the chances of ALL games is very low at this time.

That is good news, last I heard was that it was Nvidia only and possibly Intel iGPU compatible. Hopefully if it becomes mainstream enough most of the major AAA game makers will release Steam OS versions of all their future games just like many of them do with OSX and consoles. I wonder if they will stop releasing future Valve games on Windows when the OS is ready for download forcing PC owners to use their OS if they want to play their newest games?

 

[nukemaster]

The Nvidia only was for the early beta.

As far as them removing games from Windows. It would be a bit extreme.

Gabe Newell has made is dislike of Windows 8 very clear in the past. Then again I am sure Sony made its dislike of VHS(and later HD DVD) well known too. The fact that Windows 8 has its own built in store and could take some sales from steam may be scary.

He even went as far as to blame Windows 8 for PC sales declines. Its not like the up-rise in cell phones and tablets(devices that give users the most wanted computer features[Internet/Chat]) could have any effect in this.

Either way pushing exclusives like that would most likely hurt them more than anything.

OSX -> Linux should be easy for game developers(it is already OpenGL most of the time.).

 

[burkhartmj]

Kinda silly.
Linux gaming is very much alive, let me know how many android games are out there?

When people think "Linux", they always think desktop Linux. But there are tons of Linux-based systems, it's very popular.

Bugs and delays are common in Linux, it's just part of the experience. It takes a bit more energy to make it function, which is fine if you are familiar with the system.

The thing is, Linux is free. Microsoft and DirectX most certainly have some licensing fees associated. Open GL is free. Developing for a free is a good investment. If the world wants to do away with copyright (thanks, Tesla), we might find ourselves a lot more productive.

This argument is utterly irrelevant. Yes, when we're saying Linux here we're referring to desktop Linux, because that's what we're talking about, not Android. You can't lump candy crush on a smartphone with Left for Dead 2 on a gaming computer. This is like saying Apple gaming is thriving because people play a lot of games on their iPhones, the nature of the platform matters in this discussion, not merely the kernel being used.

Now, to the real topic of this thread. I'm looking forward to seeing what Steam Machines does, but people seem intent on missing the point that this isn't to replace Windows on a computer, but rather to replace an Xbox or PS4 in the living room. SteamOS is as versatile as the Playstation OS [which is to say, exponentially less than even your average Linux distro, much less Windows], it's not meant to be used as your primary computer. Sure, this OS will inevitably lead to a considerable uptick in Linux games, so if you DO have a standard Linux distro on your desktop you'll benefit from its existence, but this initiative is wholly focused on building a compelling system for Steam games to operate in a living room environment in order to supplant their real competition, consoles.

If I used this, it'd be on a NUC with a run of the mill Logitech wireless controller while using the [already impressive] network streaming features in Steam.

 

[fuzzion]

We shall have to see.

3 major considerations

-DX12 said to have an average of 38% performance improvement for GPUs running dx11 for Nvidia Cards and certain AMD cards.

-Performance of the steam console. At $499 do not expect much.

- Driver performance. Also read comments from the founders http://www.alexstjohn.com/WP/2014/06/08/direct3d-opengl-metal-full-circle/

 

[somebodyspecial]

30 fold from a nearly 0% market share is still low.

and no, I'm not trying to put down the idea of steam machines, I think it's awesome, but so far what have we seen? delayed OS launch, OS installation problems, OS optimization problems (almost all AAA titles have similar or lower FPS compared to Win8), and repeated controller delays. heck even Alienware's newest 'steam machine' will run Win8.1 out of the box. and NO, i'm not interested in buying a $500+ device just to play linux only titles.

at the end of the day, I expect steam machines to take off SLOWLY, with people who already own gaming PCs experimenting dual-booting Steam OS, and their market-share will grow ONLY if they perform well.

It's not easy making an operating system, especially one for games! Its going to take a long time especially when you look at the size of Valve in terms of employees its not even that big.

Every title I've seen has had improved performance on Linux, some benchmarks are close to 50% better than Windows.

You must also bear in mind this device isn't for traditional PC gamers, its a bridge between console and PC keeping simplicity of a console but the best features of PC gaming (possible customization, kb/mouse etc)

Gabe is a billionaire though, and probably growing faster than anyone knows. Look at steam user accounts now that they serve linux and mac. Android next I'd bet. They could narrow the parts they support to say 5vids from AMD and 5 from NV etc and keep tighter control of the market, but still give a choice from low to high. Cpu's can be done this way also to make sure we're at or above consoles always. Though compatibility isn't the problem it used to be on PC anyway. Also note how much Gabe hates MS appstore, windows 8, directx and just Microsoft period. He has no love for them and has voiced it many times. The sheer # of users on steam gives him massive power to push something until it's right. This guy thinks seriously LONG TERM, so he's not planning on winning next year. He's thinking 10-20yrs down the road and laughing inside as steam users continue to give him more power yearly. They had 65mil last year, now already over 75mil! That is stupidly awesome gains.

He can afford to give away linux games with porting paid for by the windows side for a long time just like Google/amazon have no need for money from hardware (they get it from ads/books/movies etc). He has no need for money at this point and no shareholder to make happy as a PRIVATE company. He can take as long as he needs for years just breaking even or at minimal profit. As long as wages are paid he doesn't have to care one bit. The # of linux games on steam is growing monthly and I'm sure they're porting like mad and anything on opengl on any platform is fair game if it's popular enough to warrant a port. I'd guess halflife3 will come with steamos which may be partially responsible for the delay. Can you imagine how many people would install steamos if it wasn't on windows for even a year? You could count me in as a steamos install if that was the case...LOL. He'd get many just delaying a windows version for a year or maybe NEVER since he doesn't need any money as a billionaire. Microsoft has shareholders and can't pull this type of crap that a heavily funded private company with the #1 distribution outlet by miles can do. I predict Steam/Valve wins vs. DirectX in the end. It's just a matter of time and how far MS goes down. At some point I don't see any games being made for DX. OpenGL goes everywhere, Dx means more work to anywhere else and until you can port from it your product is stuck with windows sales only. Best for devs to go OpenGL unless you're microsoft themselves. 😉 Note also how much google, NV, well all of ARM/android will further push OpenGL for the same reason. iOS and mac is the same story. OpenGL. Microsoft has no ability to strong-arm any of these like a netscape.

 

[rds1220]

I wish Linux would overall work to be better in gaming not just in the console field but also in the general PC gaming field. I am still using Windows 7 and I plan to continue to use it for awhile. After that though I don't know what I'm going to use. Windows 8 and the whole Metro UI is crap and I refuse to buy it. Mac really doesn't support games and neither does Linux so you can see where I am kind of stuck. If games were more Linux friendly and if there more/better hardware driver support I would switch to Linux in a second and never look back at MicroS**t and their Metro UI.

 

[surphninja]

What an extreme exaggeration. This nothing more than a marketing pitch by someone who is heavily invested in the success of steam machines.

If Linux support increases, it will either be because developers just want to support the platform, or because valve will be incentivizing devs in some way. Instead, it would be nice if they offered some incentive for gamers to buy a steam machine.

In their current form with their current price, steam machines are so pointless that they make the Ouya and Wii U look like good choices. There's no pro's and any number of con's. Anyone tech savvy enough to even be aware of steam machines knows that they're better off spending the money building their own machine that'll have way more functionality and less limitations. And you'll never be able to convince tech laymans to purchase a steam machine over one of the established consoles.

 

[somebodyspecial]

We shall have to see.

3 major considerations

-DX12 said to have an average of 38% performance improvement for GPUs running dx11 for Nvidia Cards and certain AMD cards.

-Performance of the steam console. At $499 do not expect much.

- Driver performance. Also read comments from the founders http://www.alexstjohn.com/WP/2014/06/08/direct3d-opengl-metal-full-circle/

Nvidia already showed you could get that perf from DX11 as shown by their starswarm improvement vs. mantle. They also showed you can do it with OpenGL on stage months ago and had a whole crowd of devs watching rather than being next door in the VR speeches. Devs were taking notes clearly. They apparently had no idea you can already do with OpenGL what they are planning with Dx12 for the most part (and that was features from years ago, never mind 4.4 which adds more stuff).

I don't see alex saying much about opengl other than the mac comments. Mac's metal gets 35 lines for a triangle while he says in the comment section OpenGL took him 45. Not sure someone out there can't do better than that either. Mac's only have 10% or less anyway and is going down slightly so it won't matter even if they do try to drop opengl, which they will be forced to support or lose games (which in turn kills many mac sales). The ports are only happening massively due to OpenGL. You can't just abandon that or to use Alex's words "you slit your throat" 😉 Nvidia is pushing opengl, so perf will be there in steam or android as that is the point of moving desktop gpu to mobile to begin with. They bragged any feature or optimization done on drivers for the PC will bleed over to mobile. You don't say stuff like that for nothing.

 

[captaincharisma]

if i were to get a steambox i would just install windows 7 on it and use the steam client. that way i have access to all games availible on steam

 

[nukemaster]

Yes you would.

Just remember not all steam boxes will be as fast as some of the high end desktops on the market.

SteamOS is about something that is easy to use in the living room. Personally i think steam big picture already covered that.

I am however interested in the steam controller as I have yet to see a controller I like. Sony's controllers(PS3) feel good in my hand, but I have not used them on a computer.

 

[tobalaz]

I'd build one, but I'm past buying prefabbed anything.
I don't want to be limited on future upgrades by vendor limitations.

 

[nukemaster]

Valves own steambox prototype uses regular hardware. It has an mITX board with 90 degree riser to keep the video card low and uses a SFX power supply you can get at most online stores.

Silverstone sells a similar style case for those who want to DIY a steambox that still is similar in size. I am almost sure SilverStone makes the case as well because I saw some silverstone parts in the steam boxes they sent out.

 

[vancedecker]

...from 0 to 30 is a 30 fold increase, true

(...please spare me your personal dear diary entries about all the gaming you currently do using WINE. lol.)

Don't get me wrong, I love steam and want this to succeed badly. xbox and playstation have grown fat and lazy, and completely lost touch with what users want and/or need.

It's now all about fat old greedy corporate executives who like to play farmville and/or john madden football XXXIV making stupid corporate decisions....

At the very least, Steam will inject some badly needed competition back into the industry.

 

[vancedecker]

The less Linux people involved the better.

This isn't about Linux. Linux is just a convenient platform.

The Linux community has a bad habit of sabotaging themselves with endless dogmatic nonsense and an inability to design anything useful outside of the command line...with a few exception i won't get into.

And yes, all you fools and shills telling everyone how you don't see the point, there is a market and there is a point, and if they do it right, it will be awesome. Their rethinking of the controller and other things proves they are at least going in the right direction.



(p.s. dear tomshardware, please add edit capability to comments, wtf!? at the very least temporary edit ability for small errors and additions, what is this 2003? comon people.)

 

[boletus]

It's highly unlikely I would buy a Steam Machine, since I only game on PC. Nothing against consoles, but I don't even own a TV, and cannot justify the extra expense, space, & etc. for a another gaming device.

But I will certainly dedicate a drive or create a partition for Steam OS on my PC, just to check it out. If it can in anyway wrest some control of the gaming industry from Sony and MS, I am all for it. Why? Because their greedy, slimy exclusivity deals (timed or not) with publishers like Rockstar and Bethesda exemplify the worst aspect of the video game industry, letting greed and power manipulate and control the market at the expense (literally and figuratively) of gamers everywhere.

It kills me when I hear gamers get behind these exclusivity deals, like they are somehow better off for owning console xyz, when those games would be available for more platforms if Sony/MS could not bribe publishers into screwing their customers.

Not buying into that would create actual competition, which would benefit gamers by reducing prices and increasing choices. And that's one of the main things I like about Steam; they devote their efforts to increasing choices for gamers, not limiting them. Imagine that!

 

[somebodyspecial]

if i were to get a steambox i would just install windows 7 on it and use the steam client. that way i have access to all games availible on steam

Does the steam client runs steamos games? I thought you'd have to have a dual boot with steamos to run those games, or even a tri-boot to run pure linux games? IF all games are so far, also on windows, then I guess what you said would work, but at some point (I'd say halflife3) they will put out games that are on steamos ONLY and NOT on any other platform just to push steamos. Halflife 3 should be very good at getting us to install SteamOS if exclusive and denied elsewhere for a while or a year etc I'd think. I know I'd install if it was even say 1/2 price on steamos vs. a win version if they released both at once. A discount to get you to try steamos so to speak. I'll bite either way at some point on steamos added to my pc as another bootOS (already have xp32/64/win7x64, why not one more...LOL). Sorry not a steam user, so this might just be a dumb set of questions/statements.

 

[nukemaster]

At current I think most if not all games run on Windows. With many also on OSX and Linux. Steam OS is just a more TV oriented OS(but it still has much more functions for those who want it). For most users running it like a console it is very similar to just using an off the shelf PC with big picture mode.

Making an exclusive may cause many problems for Valve. Look at how people reacted to MS with it Halo 2 for Vista only thing(and it was only a DX9 game anyway).