[SOLVED] Looking to "become" more of an audiophile... Where to start?

[Yeldur]

Edit: Due to my hours of work etc etc. I'm unable to go with a speaker system, I'm looking to improve my quality when using headphones

Hi all,

I've recently began pondering a full system upgrade but, I figure, whilst I do that, why not improve my audio quality along with it. I'm into my music quite a lot and am looking to go "one step further" - The trouble is, I'm a bit lost of where to begin.

Currently, I'm sporting Philips Fidelio X2's which I was previously recommended by a user from this forum, and they have been (and still are) a fantastic investment, but besides that I've got nothing else, just the headphones with a connection into the computer.

I've noticed the following error comes up after I plug my headphones in, I'm not really sure what it means but at a guess, I'm going to say that whatever I'm connecting to isn't "powerful" enough?

Either way, can anybody offer me any tips on how to get into improving my audio quality experience?

For the record, price is not an issue within reason, I'm not looking to spend £5,000 or something on an audio upgrade.

Primary usage is going to be for gaming, however I listen to a lot of music alongside it so it's reasonable to say that this is the secondmost "important" thing - Thought I'd include that info in case it was relevant.

 

[jay32267]

I play games and listen to music a lot with my systems and I'd recommend some speakers and a subwoofer.

The subwoofer is great for both music and especially games.
You get real boomy explosions.

On my one system...which is for a bedroom....I have two of these....

https://www.amazon.com/Klipsch-Pack...t=&hvlocphy=9005448&hvtargid=pla-806832056078

One of these.

https://www.amazon.com/NAD-316BEE-Integrated-Amplifier-Phono/dp/B07D3BS3BL

and one of these

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000092TT0/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

[Yeldur]

I play games and listen to music a lot with my systems and I'd recommend some speakers and a subwoofer.

The subwoofer is great for both music and especially games.
You get real boomy explosions.

On my one system...which is for a bedroom....I have two of these....

https://www.amazon.com/Klipsch-Pack...t=&hvlocphy=9005448&hvtargid=pla-806832056078

One of these.

https://www.amazon.com/NAD-316BEE-Integrated-Amplifier-Phono/dp/B07D3BS3BL

and one of these

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000092TT0/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

As much as I'd love to get a proper speaker system set up, It's not something that I can actually do unfortunately due to other people being in the house alongside my hours of work (Late) I'm usually up when others are sleeping, so headphones realistically are the only way for me to proceed.

That's probably some worthwhile information actually, I'm going to add that to the OP - Apologies if I wasted your time, I hadn't even occurred to me that speakers would be suggested hahahaha.

That being said, should I ever be in a situation where I can use them, I certainly will. Saved for possible later usage

 

[kanewolf]

Quality headphones and a good headphone amp can make most source sound good.

 

[Yeldur]

Quality headphones and a good headphone amp can make most source sound good.

In respect of amps, how does one go about setting those up? Is it like 3.5mm to the amp then the amp has another 3.5mm to the headphones?

Any particular recommendations in respect of headphones and an amp? I've used the Fidelio X2's for a long while now and they've served me very well, but if there's something out there that I can attach a modmic to and simultaneously have even higher audio quality, then I'm definitely down to upgrade.

 

[Deleted member 217926]

A computer sound card is the cheapest way to add both a headphone amp and DAC with a microphone port. You could do a separate amp/DAC but you'd still be plugging the mic into the motherboard. There are devices that are aimed at gamers but they aren't really cheap and the don't do anything a similarly priced soundcard will do. Like the ARC. I mean it's good, but so is a flagship soundcard.

Arc Mk2

mayflowerelectronics.com

The X2's are excellent especially if you got them after the price drop. Plenty of upgrades out there though. I've owned pretty much everything in the mid-fi area worth owning at this point including the X2 and I've settled on the AKG K712 Pro for daily drivers. The Hi-Fi Man Sundara also hits way above its price. It really depends on budget and intended use. What kind of music do you like?

 

[Yeldur]

A computer sound card is the cheapest way to add both a headphone amp and DAC with a microphone port. You could do a separate amp/DAC but you'd still be plugging the mic into the motherboard. There are devices that are aimed at gamers but they aren't really cheap and the don't do anything a similarly priced soundcard will do. Like the ARC. I mean it's good, but so is a flagship soundcard.

Arc Mk2

mayflowerelectronics.com

The X2's are excellent especially if you got them after the price drop. Plenty of upgrades out there though. I've owned pretty much everything in the mid-fi area worth owning at this point including the X2 and I've settled on the AKG K712 Pro for daily drivers. The Hi-Fi Man Sundara also hits way above its price. It really depends on budget and intended use. What kind of music do you like?

Unfortunately I'm going to be very cliché and say "everything" - Because I truly do listen to everything.

Some days it's classical, some days it's Chinese rap, other days it's an Icelandic group called Árstíðir - It goes on and on down different avenue's from there.

I suppose the TL;DR is that I'd be looking for a headphone that does everything well, because I honestly couldn't say what I listen to more

When I spoke to somebody for about soundcards I was told that the one in my current motherboard is actually fine and didn't need changing (ROG Strix Z370-H) - This was a little while back though, so it might not be so correct anymore.

That being said, with the new rig upgrade the card may not be the same.

I'm still undecided on motherboard, but I'm either going for:

Gigabyte X570 AORUS PRO
or
Asus ROG Strix X570-F

If a soundcard is going to do the same thing as a separate amp/DAC and at a lower cost, then I'd be foolish to go for anything else, any particular soundcard you would recommend that would boost up the audio?


(Going to take a look at those two headphones you mentioned as well, thanks! - Though, if there's one that's better for an "all-rounder" then please let me know hahaha.)

 

[hang-the-9]

Hi all,

I've recently began pondering a full system upgrade but, I figure, whilst I do that, why not improve my audio quality along with it. I'm into my music quite a lot and am looking to go "one step further" - The trouble is, I'm a bit lost of where to begin.

Currently, I'm sporting Philips Fidelio X2's which I was previously recommended by a user from this forum, and they have been (and still are) a fantastic investment, but besides that I've got nothing else, just the headphones with a connection into the computer.

I've noticed the following error comes up after I plug my headphones in, I'm not really sure what it means but at a guess, I'm going to say that whatever I'm connecting to isn't "powerful" enough?

Either way, can anybody offer me any tips on how to get into improving my audio quality experience?

For the record, price is not an issue within reason, I'm not looking to spend £5,000 or something on an audio upgrade.

Primary usage is going to be for gaming, however I listen to a lot of music alongside it so it's reasonable to say that this is the secondmost "important" thing - Thought I'd include that info in case it was relevant.


Edit: Due to my hours of work etc etc. I'm unable to go with a speaker system, I'm looking to improve my quality when using headphones

You need to put the fact that you just want something for headphones or different headphones in the first sentence LOL, I just wrote some things about speakers and other things that are not relevant to headphones.

What does hours of work have to do with speakers? Do you need to keep noise down for other people so limited to headphones?

Budget is what exactly? You said not 5,000 so is 1,000 for higher end stuff OK? 2,000? 300? You have just that one set of headphones, you can get an amp/dac for a bit better sound, buy other headphones to play with. Depends on your budget. With good headphones you are probably going to be for a "different" sound more than something "better". Without hearing dozens of combinations it's just blind luck that something you pick you will like better. But something you like that has a different sound than your set now is very easy to get.

You also said something about a mod mic so you have one that you are using with your headphones now?

 

[Yeldur]

You need to put the fact that you just want something for headphones or different headphones in the first sentence LOL, I just wrote some things about speakers and other things that are not relevant to headphones.

What does hours of work have to do with speakers? Do you need to keep noise down for other people so limited to headphones?

Budget is what exactly? You said not 5,000 so is 1,000 for higher end stuff OK? 2,000? 300? You have just that one set of headphones, you can get an amp/dac for a bit better sound, buy other headphones to play with. Depends on your budget. With good headphones you are probably going to be for a "different" sound more than something "better". Without hearing dozens of combinations it's just blind luck that something you pick you will like better. But something you like that has a different sound than your set now is very easy to get.

You also said something about a mod mic so you have one that you are using with your headphones now?

Oops, sorry! I've edited again and placed it above alongside increasing text size

I have to keep the noise down due to other people being present in the household, and my work hours would conflict with their times of sleep, so I have to pick headphones to avoid any issues with them hahaha

I don't have a specific number in mind when it comes to budget, but I'm open to suggestions that I can then consider, for the sake of ease we'll say below £1,250 to keep things in margin of easy/easier suggestion.

Interesting to read RE the different sounds, it may be the case that I'll just have to wait until COVID lockdowns are over and we can re-enter shops again, that way I suppose I can look for a place to test out headphones. (Or, alternatively, order from Amazon and return if not liked)

If I was to want something that does well in a specific genre of music whilst also keeping other genre's of music within a good range, does that make things easier in terms of suggestion?

I'm not really looking to change out headphones every time I want to listen to X, Y or Z to be truthful, so if I can get a single set that does what I "like" then I'm certainly happy to look. If it truly is a hit or miss type game, then I suppose doing it now before this set dies on me is the best idea.

 

[Deleted member 217926]

If you're looking to slap a modmic on some good headphones get a flagship soundcard like the EVGA NU and an AKG K712 Pro. You'll appreciate the upgrade from the X2. The K712 has better staging, separation and treble air. It's a more refined X2.

If you want to jump up to something more hi-fi while retaining the staging for gaming the HiFi Man Ananda would be my choice. You're also getting into Audeze LCD GX territory in that price range. I'd have a harder time recommending a sound card at this level although they'd perform better than one would expect.

No budget at all gaming? Sennheiser HD800S. Very, VERY amp picky for music. But the best sense of spaciousness and staging you can get with headphones.

 

[Deleted member 217926]

I just saw you're potentially upgrading motherboards? Asus does audio very well and has for years. The ROG Strix X570-F has an integrated headphone amp. No mention of the DAC so it's probably nothing impressive. But I'd probably try it with the K712 Pro. The Gigabyte doesn't mention any sort of amp.

 

[hang-the-9]

beyerdynamic DT 1990 are good at the higher tier price range without going into the take out a loan range. Quite a few nice headphones on Drop also, but availability depends on area for shipping and can be a bit of a wait to get things. Their Sennheiser HD 6XX are great and around 200, depending on sale or not.

I would get a nice DAC / APM but not go crazy with that, for the most part it's a lot harder to hear differences between those than headphones, maybe an Aune X1S which is right at the price point between lower and high end. Mayflower Arc is about same price and includes a mic input. Topping DX3 Pro is almost as good and includes a remote and bluetooth.

 

[Yeldur]

Thanks for all the suggestions guys, looks like I've got some research to do! I can't look more in depth currently as I'm at work but I'm excited to do some more research into all the suggestions!

 

[Yeldur]

I just saw you're potentially upgrading motherboards? Asus does audio very well and has for years. The ROG Strix X570-F has an integrated headphone amp. No mention of the DAC so it's probably nothing impressive. But I'd probably try it with the K712 Pro. The Gigabyte doesn't mention any sort of amp.

Overall price wise, the K712 Pro looks to be very reasonably priced, at £200 it sounds like a steal given that it's essentially a better X2 as you say.

Query:

If I was to get the X570-F, and then pair it with the K712 and then get a DAC, would that be the "ultimate combo" so to speak? (In the sense of that particular headphone) - Or would something like the EVGA-NU + MoBo + K712 + DAC be the combo to go for?

I'm relatively clueless about audio, would you mind explaining to me the difference between something like the K712 and the Hi-Fi Man Ananda? The price difference is definitely there, but audio wise are they even comparable?

beyerdynamic DT 1990 are good at the higher tier price range without going into the take out a loan range. Quite a few nice headphones on Drop also, but availability depends on area for shipping and can be a bit of a wait to get things. Their Sennheiser HD 6XX are great and around 200, depending on sale or not.

I would get a nice DAC / APM but not go crazy with that, for the most part it's a lot harder to hear differences between those than headphones, maybe an Aune X1S which is right at the price point between lower and high end. Mayflower Arc is about same price and includes a mic input. Topping DX3 Pro is almost as good and includes a remote and bluetooth.

Would you say that the DT 1990's would do fine for gaming as well as music? Same query with the Sennheiser set.

It doesn't look like the Mayflower is available in the UK unfortunately however the Topping DX3 Pro does appear to be, so looks like that would probably be the one to go for

When you say on Drop, is drop a website or is drop another term for on sale?

 

[Deleted member 217926]

The DAC is the chip that turns 1's and 0's into music. The soundcard option will have a good DAC paired with a headphone amp and various software modes like virtual surround for gaming. You'd use stereo mode with all enhancements off for music. It also has a microphone connect so it's basically an all in one solution for you. I did and would recommend starting there since gaming is a priority for you. My Asus Xonar STX was a flagship card when I bought it about 10 years ago. If you decide this headphone hobby is something you want to pursue deeper then you can always add external DACs and amps as you so choose. Amps affect sound more than DACs at least once you reach a certain level of transparency.

I'm relatively clueless about audio, would you mind explaining to me the difference between something like the K712 and the Hi-Fi Man Ananda?

Refinement. Everything the K712 Pro does well the Ananda does better. Treble air, layering, bass extension. Is it worth twice the price? That's going to depend on you.

Would you say that the DT 1990's would do fine for gaming as well as music? Same query with the Sennheiser set.

Yes the 1990 Pro is solid. It's even better than the K712 Pro at imaging but it has a smaller soundstage and isn't as comfortable. You can change the sound on the 1990 Pro. It comes with 2 sets of pads one sharp and analytical the other wide and bassy. There are also aftermarket pads which are pretty good. I do really like the 1990. That being said I own both and reach for the K712 Pro more often especially for the comfort factor.

No on the Sennheisers. The HD6XX is an HD650 with different paint. It's a warmish headphone with glorious mids. It's not a gaming headphone though. Imaging isn't even close to everything else mentioned here. The HD660S is the best of the Sennheiser 6 series and it's still not something I'd buy for that.

 

[Yeldur]

The DAC is the chip that turns 1's and 0's into music. The soundcard option will have a good DAC paired with a headphone amp and various software modes like virtual surround for gaming. You'd use stereo mode with all enhancements off for music. It also has a microphone connect so it's basically an all in one solution for you. I did and would recommend starting there since gaming is a priority for you. My Asus Xonar STX was a flagship card when I bought it about 10 years ago. If you decide this headphone hobby is something you want to pursue deeper then you can always add external DACs and amps as you so choose. Amps affect sound more than DACs at least once you reach a certain level of transparency.




Refinement. Everything the K712 Pro does well the Ananda does better. Treble air, layering, bass extension. Is it worth twice the price? That's going to depend on you.



Yes the 1990 Pro is solid. It's even better than the K712 Pro at imaging but it has a smaller soundstage and isn't as comfortable. You can change the sound on the 1990 Pro. It comes with 2 sets of pads one sharp and analytical the other wide and bassy. There are also aftermarket pads which are pretty good. I do really like the 1990. That being said I own both and reach for the K712 Pro more often especially for the comfort factor.

No on the Sennheisers. The HD6XX is an HD650 with different paint. It's a warmish headphone with glorious mids. It's not a gaming headphone though. Imaging isn't even close to everything else mentioned here. The HD660S is the best of the Sennheiser 6 series and it's still not something I'd buy for that.

Ahhh I see, apologies, so in short, Soundcard + Headphone = Best option for me

I'm a safe "investor" so to speak, so walking into the door slowly sounds like the best option. Out of curiosity, do you own a set of Ananda's? If so, what are they like comfort wise compared to the K712 Pro? I'm going to be wearing these headphones virtually all day every day, as I work from home during the day and game during the evenings, during which I will be using these headphones.

I'm leaning towards the K712 Pro just on the basis of comfort alone in that respect, that being said, I'm okay to trade a little bit of comfort for a lot of quality increase, which it sounds like the Ananda has.. But if it also has the comfort... I can feel the sway appearing hahahahaha.

Out of curosity, how does one install a Soundcard? Is it just a connection into the PCIe slot similarly to how a GPU would connect in?

Edit: In terms of the sound card, is this the one I'm looking for? https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07MSQJ3GY?tag=pcp0f-21&linkCode=ogi&th=1 - I noticed that there's one for 7.1 Surround Sound, is that something I should be looking at with either of these headphones or is it not necessary?

 

[Deleted member 217926]

Ahhh I see, apologies, so in short, Soundcard + Headphone = Best option for me

In my opinion yes. I started with the Xonar STX and a pair of Sennheiser HD598s and the intention of having a great gaming setup that would also work for music.

Out of curiosity, do you own a set of Ananda's?

Not yet. Probably next. I just got the Sundara about a week ago. It's an AMAZING value at $350 US. I actually just sold off my HD598, HD600, HD650 and X2HR and bought the HD660S and Sundara. I thought abut going straight to the Ananda but I had to give the Sundara a try to see if they were as good as everyone says.

I'm going to be wearing these headphones virtually all day every day, as I work from home during the day and game during the evenings, during which I will be using these headphones.

At this point I have owned or currently own a Sennheiser HD598, HD600, HD650, HD660S, Fidelio X2HR, Monoprice M1060, AKG K712 Pro, Beyerdynamic DT1990 Pro, Massdrop x Fostex TH-X00 Mahogany, TH-X00 Ebony, HIFi Man Sundara and a Focal Elear/Elex. The K712 Pro is the most comfortable one. I can wear it all day with no fatigue at all.

 

[Deleted member 217926]

Oh and that seems quite expensive for the soundcard. It's only $199 on the US EVGA site. I know not having trade deals is causing price hikes and availability issues in the UK right now on certain brands.

 

[Yeldur]

In my opinion yes. I started with the Xonar STX and a pair of Sennheiser HD598s and the intention of having a great gaming setup that would also work for music.



Not yet. Probably next. I just got the Sundara about a week ago. It's an AMAZING value at $350 US. I actually just sold off my HD598, HD600, HD650 and X2HR and bought the HD660S and Sundara. I thought abut going straight to the Ananda but I had to give the Sundara a try to see if they were as good as everyone says.



At this point I have owned or currently own a Sennheiser HD598, HD600, HD650, HD660S, Fidelio X2HR, Monoprice M1060, AKG K712 Pro, Beyerdynamic DT1990 Pro, Massdrop x Fostex TH-X00 Mahogany, TH-X00 Ebony, HIFi Man Sundara and a Focal Elear/Elex. The K712 Pro is the most comfortable one. I can wear it all day with no fatigue at all.

Hot damn, that's a lot of headphones! Definitely a person of much experience then hahahaha, I've been looking at some reviews from a YouTube channel that seems pretty good, annoyingly it hasn't made my choice between the HiFiman and the K712 Pro any easier, though he has stated that the HiFiMan is very comfortable, so it's given me a better idea of that end of things.. I guess the only thing to really do now is to figure out which I really want more. Maybe it'll turn into a hit/miss scenario where I just have to buy both and test em out before returning one (If possible) or alternatively I'll just have to make a choice and live with it!

Oh and that seems quite expensive for the soundcard. It's only $199 on the US EVGA site. I know not having trade deals is causing price hikes and availability issues in the UK right now on certain brands.

Gotta love Brexit, here's a kicker you might get a laugh out of:

It's cheaper for me to buy it from the US and have it shipped over here than it is to buy it from a UK retailer

Thank you for the heads up on that, I would have forked out a fortune without realising it!

 

[Yeldur]

Righty, I think I've gathered enough information to make a decent informed decision at some stage, thanks a bunch for all your help everyone! Gotta give the "trophy" as it were to anort overall though

I can't say that I've made a final decision yet RE headphones but it's between the K712 Pro and the HiFiman Ananda, I'm somewhat leaning towards the Ananda but I'm not completely set in stone yet.

Thanks very much once again

 

[Deleted member 217926]

My endgame in two or three years will be three headphones. An Ananda or something very much like it in the general use / gaming role my K712s now fill. And a Focal Clear complemented with a closed back ZMF Atticus for music. HiFi Man did a stealth pad revision in early 2020 on the Ananda and Sundara ( maybe the Arya as well ) so make sure any reviews you're watching aren't the old ones.

View: https://youtu.be/iiOyXRxc9IE

View: https://youtu.be/89RtTLeuCXk

 

[Deleted member 217926]

View: https://youtu.be/1VhfqTI6sQU

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNxONeSj-pI

 

[Yeldur]

Funnily enough the Wheezyman reviews were the two I watched for the AKG and Hifiman, sounds like I watched the right videos then hahaha, thanks once again