MSI Gaming vs Asus ROG

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I am going to do a build (only in like 6 months or so) but i have no clue on what motherboard to choose.
I do have a budget, but i am able to stretch it a little bit.(i cant tell excact budget in dollars as i am not an american).

So what features does msi have over asus and asus over msi? I am thinking z97 g45/65 vs maximus vii ranger

I will not be overclocking(i do need some Zxx features though)

I have heard many things about asus software, but mostly about overclocking and fan control - i might buy a fan controller too so their fan expert doesnt mean alot(except if it is really good the price of rog motherboard matches msi's gaming)
 
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The ASUS SupremeFX is a lot of marketing IMO but it indeed it one of the best built in sound options on a motherboard.
MSI uses the Realtek ALC1150 Codec and ASUS uses a modified version of it so I expect them to be close with the ASUS a bit better (they also include more software).

They both have the same amount of fan connectors. But it is ASUS that has the better fan control, it is easier to use also because of their very good BIOS. Also I would say the ROG features are better then the MSI gaming features. The ROG has more of a premium feel, but that is my personal opinion.

Both are great boards based on pure performance the Maximus VII Ranger
Based on price/performance here in Holland the MSI board costs €20 less then the Ranger...
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A lot of money? Gigabyte z87x-Gaming 7 is about the same price as Ranger (even cheaper). So why buy an inferior product when you can buy a better one with the same price? Sorry but what's the logic here?

They have same features overall. Moreover Gigabyte has better quality in its power regulation department and that's a very big plus.

 
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I did actually mention that the ranger was cheaper, still true ^^
I like your explanation og digital phases - but how much does it matter really? If we look at my plans, going for non-oc and just needing features like fan control, sound and that kinda stuff. If we say the cpu has 84w tdp, put it into the ranger, it uses 84watts and put it into the gigabyte one it uses how many watts? Just use an example, you of course cant know the excact number :)
 
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Well yeah, Gaming 7 is slightly cheaper where I live but on Amazon it's tad expensive I guess. Just a few bucks though.

Like I said, in real life usage the difference is not like day&night. But it still matters since we are talking about enthusiast boards here. And enthusiasts are after best quality for buck no? Gigabyte is using better vrm components overall, and more true phases. Having a better vrm would worth that few bucks of price difference imho. Unless there is like 30$ difference.

Power consumption, on the other hand, is mostly related to the features like additional controllers: And manufactureres can even make their boards more energy efficient with BIOS updates. Both boards of course will run a 84w tdp cpu @ 84w. But while running that cpu there will be less load on vrm if you have an efficient controller and more true phases. Which means better heat dissipation and less heat overall.

There is also a misunderstanding around. People think that Intel moved the power regulation inside the cpu so motherboard vrm is not important anymore. That's not true. Intel didn't move the vrm inside the cpu. They just added a secondary vrm into the cpu package that takes voltage ranging around 1.8 to 3v and reduces it to all the other voltages needed. But motherboard is still important here since it reduces the 12v from the psu to 1.8v to 3v . Yes this new design reduces the load on the motherboard vrm but increases the heat of the cpu. Yet motherboard vrm still important, just not like before. That's why we don't see some 16 phases overkill vrms anymore.
 
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CPU temperature won't change dramatically here, it's the Intel's new design with Haswells that increases the CPU temps, since they added a secondary vrm into cpu package. But if your case doesn't have good airflow, the temperature around vrm would effect the cpu temp a bit. But it won't be that dramatic if you have a decent cooler and decent airflow.

On the other hand with more phases (and especially with a higher-end digital controller) vrm runs a lot cooler since the load will be splitted between more components.

Even though those differences are not really huge. But it's the devil in the details. And that makes a motherboard good for enthusiasts.

What's the price difference between Giga Gaming 7 and Ranger?

Giga Gaming 5 is also a great board. Top notch quality but the only downside is memory vrm which is 1 phase (other boards in its price range has 2 phases). DIMMs really don't need much current though so 1 phase is enough. But if you plan to run 4 rams in the future and especially the factory overclocked ones there might have some slight stability issues.
 
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It's about 18-20 bucks I guess. So yes, in the end it's your money man. Weird that Gaming 7 is actually tad cheaper here in Turkey... You can check Gigabyte Gaming 5 too. MSI Gaming 7 is also tad better than Ranger. But still it's your decision in the end. I'm just underlining the pros and cons.
 
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Is there anything else other than the phases that is better than the ranger? I think i can live with 4phase design, and i really like what is done with asus rog motherboards, but if there is anything else that is basically deal breaking, i think i would be better off with that :)

So currently sounds like -
Better phases on other similar priced motherboards

And nothing else quite? Sorry if i did not catch the other points.
 
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Well, Gigabyte Gaming 7 also has 2 more sata ports via additional Marvel controller. MSI Gaming 7 also has 2 more sata ports.

Their sound quality are pretty much the same. Asus's SupremeFX is a bit gimmicky since it's actually a renamed Realtek 1150. Gigabyte and MSI uses the same codec with similar quality amplifiers and capacitors.

NiC quality also similar. Asus has an Intel controller while Gigabyte employs Qualcomm's Killer 2201. Both are quality stuff with Killer having a robust software suite to further customize the network traffic.
 
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I dont need more than 4 ports for storage so thats fine, sound i lean towards asus because of the software. Nic will not be used as i dont have the option of running the cable into my bedroom(without cables on the floor all over the house)
I think i will go for asus board
 
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The main differences between the boards are:

-I have read that the Hero has better sound, tho on with both being connected to Logitech 5500s, you can't tell which is which.

-The GD65 has a better NIC most reviewers would agree, tho there were driver issues at 1st release, but again, using both of them, not that I can see a perceived difference.

Most importantly, the MSI doesn't have this bug where the BIOS time clock freezes and you have to re-enter all ya settings:

http://rog.asus.com/forum/showthread.php?33895-Hero-Time-Clock-Problem

There's numerous threads on the topic for several of the Asus boards plus one main sticky. I will go for a few weeks w/o it rising its ugly head, yesterday hit me 3 times.

Possible Related issues:

Have since been advised not to save / load OC Profiles ... Sporadic success
And especially not to try to backup / restore them from a USB .... 100% Failure loading
Change a BIOS setting and when you go to save it says "you haven't changed anything" but it really did.... Really doesn't matter but annoying and makes me wonder what elee is wrong.

I'm anxious to hear if these bugaboos carry over into Z97 so if anyone experiences please advise.

 
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I am not getting the hero, but the ranger. Oc profiles no problem, no overclock. About nic i wont use it, as i can only have wifi currently. Sound means quite a bit though, i have always been used to some kind of built in audio with software that is great.
 
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Well if you are fancy with a good onboard audio, Gigabyte G.1 Sniper Z97 has by far has the best onboard solution in the market. It employs a quad core Creative sound core 3d audio processor. Others are not comparable with this one.

On the other hand Asus's SupremeFX is just a marketing gimmick. It's actually a renamed Realtek ALC1150. MSI and and most of the Gigabyte counterparts use that codec as well. Amplifier and capacitor quality is similar (actually MSI and Giga uses high-end nichicon caps that professional sound cards have so they are tad better in this department). So the snr values are very close, around 100-115db.

They are decent but G.1 Sniper is an exceptional board. If it's not much expensive than Ranger in Denmark, definitely get this board. 30-35$ difference is nothing here compared the audio solution you get.

In power department G.1 Sniper is close to Ranger. Intersil hybrid/analog controller with 4 phases and a doubler driver. So total of 8. Cap and mosfet quality is good. It's more like Ranger.
 
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Should i go for the rev 1.0 g1 sniper or the rog maximus vii ranger? It is 1209 vs 1061 dkk(gigabyte is the cheapest), I could also step down to z87 but i would prefer not to, but if i do i can save a tiny tiny bit more.
Also - i am 100% sure i will get a gpu from asus, and i have heard that rog boards have even more overclock options for graphics when it is asus card in rog board. True/false? Dealbreaker? Also - Does gigabyte g1 sniper have fan control software stuff?
 
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Well, getting the latest chipset it always better especially for future upgrades. Z97 will support upcoming Broadwell cpus for instance, and it's not yet clear that z87 will support or not. There is actually no reason not to (since the power designs and other stuff related to cpu are all similar) but it's Intel and they like promoting a new chipset, so probably z87 won't support Broadwells (still not certain though). On the other hand Z97 has the M.2 slot that offers 10 gigabit/s bandwidth for m.2 ssd storage devices which will enhance the SSD transfer speeds up to 1gb/s (currently they are around 550-600mb/s) So if you plan to buy a m.2 device in the future you won't be able to use it with a z87 board.

Other features are actually very similar between two chipsets.

Gigabyte z87 g.1 sniper boards have better VRM. All digital IR 8 phase design with top notch mosfets. But they must have found it a bit overkill for Haswells and stepped down a bit for the new chipset. But if you don't overclock the difference is really negligible.

For gpu overclock, other brands like MSI have the same feature as well. But the boost is really not a selling point here. Maybe around a 50-100mhz boost or less for a factory overclocked gpu. If you plan to manually overclock, however, there won't be a difference in overclocking potential.

For the fan controls, yes every brand has similar software suites. Moreover you can easily do these stuff in BIOS if you don't want to install a software (I have some friends that really don't like these kinda softwares and avoid installing unneccesary stuff 😛) However Gigabyte Sniper has 1x cpu fan header and 3x system fan header. Ranger has 2x cpu fan header (for push pull configurations) and 3x system fan header. That one less cpu fan header is not that important if you plan to use a big cpu cooler with 2 fans. But that can also serve as a normal system fan header.

All in all it's up to you.

But I care about sound quality as well and I'd get G.1 Sniper last year if I didn't have an external sound card. But that's just me.
 
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I think i will go for the ranger because i was planning on getting enthoo luxe or pro when released(probably released within 6 months), and the fan hub on the back needs a cpu port. I would like to seperate the cpu cooler and the case fans though, so this is pretty nice for me :)

I am going for the ranger then, Thanks for all the help you have given me(btw cant pick you as best solution because the thread already was "solved" earlier)
 
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The Pro has been available for a while
http://www.phanteksusa.com/products/phanteks-enthoo-pro

If ya need help with the Phanteks Fan Hub send me a PM .... I have 4 separate fan curves set up

CPU => Pump No.1
CPU_OPT => Pump No. 2

CHA_1 => Phanteks PCB No. 1 => (5) case fans (Enthoo Primo)
CHA_2 => Phanteks PCB No. 2 => (6) rad fans (XT45-420)
CHA_3 => Phanteks PCB No. 3 => (4) rad fans (UT60-280)

Each is controlled via separate curves in Asus FanXpert2

Note: You want 3 pin fans for these hubs, not PWM
 
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I thought i only could use the cpu fan header for the hub, and about the case, it is not released yet in Denmark(also i will build as said, in about 6 months or so).
Thanks for the quick tip for the 3pin, but couldnt i use 4 pin on a 3 pin connecter and it just wouldnt be pwm?
 
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No.

1. PWM needs 4 wires to work.
2. MoBo Chassis Headers are PWM (Pulse Width Modulation)
3. I haven't seen a MoBo with PWM on any other header in a very long time.
4. MoBo vendors, like Asus, have blurred the waters by saying in their manuals that the other headers are PWM, they are not.
5. CHA and OP headers, whether 3 or 4 pin are still VV (Variable Voltage)
6. The attraction of PWM is that it sometimes gives a wider range of adjustability. Fans can generally run at about 25% of full rpm but in order to get started from a standstill, they generally need about a higher voltage than is provided at 25% speed. PWM works by sending 12 volts ..... but in short bursts. Think of it this way:

Ya know those playground things you get on and spin around....disc shaped steel platform with rails .... on a center shaft ....

- Your 2 friends get on, you grab a rail and run around pushing on the rail.... to go faster you apply more force and speed up your running, to slow down you doi the reverse .... That's like VV.

- Your 2 friends get on, you stand still and grab a rail as it goes by and push as hard as you can..... with long pauses between pushes, the rpm is slow.... as you shorten the time between pushing on the rail more and more.... that's like PWM.
 
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Kinda makes sense how pwm works with your explanation :)

From your 4. answer, you said that the "other" headers are pwm. I guess the other headers is chassis headers. But i dont understand, it has 4 pins, and is not pwm? How is that(maybe i misunderstood)
 
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No, they are not PWM despite what the Manual says

As for the 4 pin thing..... just cause I have a 4 passenger car, does that necessarily mean that when I get ion the road it has 4 passengers in it ?

The physical part the white plastic thingie with the 4 pins is certainly capable of using PWM, but that does not mean the control circuitry the is connected to it is designed to send a pulsed 12v signal.

http://rog.asus.com/forum/showthread.php?33662-3pin-4pin-PWM-Voltage-Control
http://www.tomshardware.com/answers/id-1744859/case-fans-pin-motherboard-pin.html

My guess is that the industry wants to move to 4 pin PWM or at least give that option ..... so have moved to 4 pin headers ....

a) to allow the case / fan industry to "catch up" and start offering more 4 pin options.
b) work out the BIOS / software support for all those headers.
 
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It's pulsed ..... remember the playground analogy.

12v power on for T1 ..... 12v power off for T2. it alternates between 12v and 0 volts ...... VV works to control speed at say 5 volts fro a certain speed ..... make it v6 volts and it spins faster.

PWM works to modulate the speed by sending 12volts then turning it off then turning it on again..... shorten the off interval it goes faster.... lengthen the time interval and it goes slower.... hence the name "pulse width modulation"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulse-width_modulation aka pulse-duration modulation (PDM)
 
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