My experience with Radeon 5850 vs. GTX 285

[Mustang5521]

Recently, I purchased a Radeon 5850 which I ended up returning. After that I purchased a GTX 285, which I installed yesterday, and it's working great!

Here are the differences I experienced between the two video cards:

Radeon 5850 - Gave boot load error problems that couldn't be fixed even after updating bios and updating chipset drivers. Would constantly boot me out of WinXP until I ran Driver Sweeper and reinstalled ATI drivers again (control panel add/remove program wasn't enough to uninstall my previous Nvidia drivers). Power Management options did not work, and kept doing a complete reboot of system when coming out of standby mode. Overall just a problematic video card with problems that were basically impossible to fix even after numerous calls to several different technical support departments. Found out from Asus forums that Radeon 5000 series have known problems with Asus Nforce motherboards (even ones like mine without an onboard graphics card) and there is no solution. Fan can get loud, runs somewhat hot (without overclocking).

GTX 285 - No problems at all. Only needed to install proper drivers (which is normal for any video card install). Equivalent in-game performance to Radeon 5850. Fan is quiet, runs cooler than Radeon 5850 (without overclocking). Great video card!!

Now I know why the GTX 285 cost me $75 more than the Radeon 5850. In this case, I definitely got what I paid for.

 

[DarkMantle]

Wait a sec... you paid 75 bucks more for an older video card that has no DX11 support, is slower and you are happy with it?.

Next time do yourself a favor and spend those 75$ on a motherboard that has AMD chipset and not and NVIDIA chipset (probably the source of the problem) and spare us the propaganda.

 

[AMW1011]

Mustang, nVidia doesn't need your PR so just stop now while your ahead. I will now commence to explain why this scenario makes no sense:

1. It is common knowledge that when going from nVidia to ATI or vice versa, sometimes the old drivers just can't be removed without extreme measures. An easy way to test this would have been to install windows again on a new partition, download the drivers and see how it works. If this works then you will need to format your hard drive and reinstall windows. This happens a lot, and if someone was smart and asked for advice this would be the first step.

2. I assume since you tend to stay with conversations on these forums that you should have sufficient knowledge to see that the 5870 is a new generation on a new and troublesome process, 40nm to be exact. This means that there is a higher chance of getting a bad card that may need to be RMA'd. This will be equally, and most likely worse, with nVidia's G100 because it is still on a troublesome process with lower yields per wafer.

3. After a quick search on ASUS's forums it would seem that some people have zero issues with your exact board. There does seem to be something there, though I'm not sure if that is just coincidence. Regardless, you could have spent that $75 of a decent AMD motherboard and would have solved that problem, if it there was one, and would have made it easy for you to upgrade to a newer AM3 processor.

4. I'm guessing the card runs hot because of poor ventilation, its silent in an Antec 900 or similar from what I hear. This shouldn't be a large issue if you are well equipped, but you should have known that coming in.

5. How the hell can you say that you get "equivalent in-game performance to the 5850" when the 5850 is unstable and supposedly can't even get into windows. Sorry, but the 5850 is NOTICEABLY faster than the GTX 285, you are full of $h1t.

I've listed 5 good reasons why your supposed actions and conclusions are flawed. That said I am willing to bet you don't even have a 5850 considering how you have been arguing in the forums. If I am wrong, then I apologize in advanced, hopefully you can see where it is hard to believe that such actions were taken.

 

[EXT64]

I find my 5850 is quite quiet. It sounds like you had a combination of a software mess and perhaps a defective 5850 (it happens, just like it does with NVidia cards). Glad you like your setup now though.

 

[Mustang5521]

Wait a sec... you paid 75 bucks more for an older video card that has no DX11 support, is slower and you are happy with it?.

Next time do yourself a favor and spend those 75$ on a motherboard that has AMD chipset and not and NVIDIA chipset (probably the source of the problem) and spare us the propaganda.

Why on earth would I waste a perfectly good motherboard which is less than two years old, just so I can run some dumb finicky ATI video card that probably has compatibility issues anyways (ATI cards are not exactly know for their great hardware/software compatibility)? And even if I had purchased a new motherboard, what is the guarantee that the finicky Radeon 5850 would like it? It might give even more problems.

I don't care about DX11 because it will probably be a few years time before DX11 becomes the standard, and the 5850 will probably be considered a slow video card by then. The only reason I bought a Radeon 5850 in the first place was to save a few bucks, but I learned my lesson.

 

[jay2tall]

GREEN vs RED

FIGHT!

I am neutral. I have had cards from both nvidia and ATI and have had BAD experiences with both. There are hardware incompatibilities either way you go. Sounds like he had a bad card, and didn't want a repeat so went with a different card. I've done that before, once you have a bad taste in your mouth, it lingers for a while.

 

[Mustang5521]

Mustang, nVidia doesn't need your PR so just stop now while your ahead. I will now commence to explain why this scenario makes no sense:

1. It is common knowledge that when going from nVidia to ATI or vice versa, sometimes the old drivers just can't be removed without extreme measures. An easy way to test this would have been to install windows again on a new partition, download the drivers and see how it works. If this works then you will need to format your hard drive and reinstall windows. This happens a lot, and if someone was smart and asked for advice this would be the first step.

2. I assume since you tend to stay with conversations on these forums that you should have sufficient knowledge to see that the 5870 is a new generation on a new and troublesome process, 40nm to be exact. This means that there is a higher chance of getting a bad card that may need to be RMA'd. This will be equally, and most likely worse, with nVidia's G100 because it is still on a troublesome process with lower yields per wafer.

3. After a quick search on ASUS's forums it would seem that some people have zero issues with your exact board. There does seem to be something there, though I'm not sure if that is just coincidence. Regardless, you could have spent that $75 of a decent AMD motherboard and would have solved that problem, if it there was one, and would have made it easy for you to upgrade to a newer AM3 processor.

4. I'm guessing the card runs hot because of poor ventilation, its silent in an Antec 900 or similar from what I hear. This shouldn't be a large issue if you are well equipped, but you should have known that coming in.

5. How the hell can you say that you get "equivalent in-game performance to the 5850" when the 5850 is unstable and supposedly can't even get into windows. Sorry, but the 5850 is NOTICEABLY faster than the GTX 285, you are full of $h1t.

I've listed 5 good reasons why your supposed actions and conclusions are flawed. That said I am willing to bet you don't even have a 5850 considering how you have been arguing in the forums. If I am wrong, then I apologize in advanced, hopefully you can see where it is hard to believe that such actions were taken.

1. Eventually, all previous video card drivers were removed, only helped a little.

2. Yeah, I really want to spend all my time RMAing Radeon 5850 video cards just because they are buggy and have issues. If a card is that buggy, then it shouldn't be released in the first place. And apparently (according to the Asus forums) the 5850s have known issues with Nforce chipsets.

3. Well you must not be very good at searching forums then. And as far as replacing the motherboard, read the reply above I gave to "DarkMantle".

4. No, my system has good cooling. And Radeon 5850 doesn't run very hot, just hotter than the GTX 285. And it is louder than the GTX 285 also.

5. The in-game performance of the GTX 285 is absolutely equivalent to the Radeon 5850. Some games are a little faster with the GTX 285, and some are a little faster with the Radeon 5850, but in general I found them to be equivalent. I think most review websites show them being pretty close in performance also. But whatever, believe what you want.

 

[roofus]

Dont blame the card. It is pretty common to have issues with an ATI card on an nForce board. The problem was compatibility, not the ATI card itself.

 

[jay2tall]

2. An ATI video card having an issue with an Nvidia chipset? wow, that's really suprising 😀
3. I'd probably do the same thing honestly. I don't like replacing motherboards, it seems like a waste.
4. The gts285 has a MUCH larger cooler than the 5850 I would expect it to run cooler. It might be louder but they aren't that loud. It's perception I think.
5. That is a very accurate statement. And remember, you always have Batman. (hope you get that joke)

 

[AMW1011]

Why on earth would I waste a perfectly good motherboard which is less than two years old, just so I can run some dumb finicky ATI video card that probably has compatibility issues anyways (ATI cards are not exactly know for their great hardware/software compatibility)? And even if I had purchased a new motherboard, what is the guarantee that the finicky Radeon 5850 would like it? It might give even more problems.

I don't care about DX11 because it will probably be a few years time before DX11 becomes the standard, and the 5850 will probably be considered a slow video card by then. The only reason I bought a Radeon 5850 in the first place was to save a few bucks, but I learned my lesson.

Oh that makes complete sense! Buy an inferior GPU because you don't want to buy a new motherboard that will help you upgrade your processor in the future, which it needs dearly. Nope nothing stupid about that!

That was sarcasm in case you did not catch that.

1. Eventually, all previous video card drivers were removed, only helped a little.

2. Yeah, I really want to spend all my time RMAing Radeon 5850 video cards just because they are buggy and have issues. If a card is that buggy, then it shouldn't be released in the first place. And apparently (according to the Asus forums) the 5850s have known issues with Nforce chipsets.

3. Well you must not be very good at searching forums then. And as far as replacing the motherboard, read the reply above I gave to "DarkMantle".

4. No, my system has good cooling. And Radeon 5850 doesn't run very hot, just hotter than the GTX 285. And it is louder than the GTX 285 also.

5. The in-game performance of the GTX 285 is absolutely equivalent to the Radeon 5850. Some games are a little faster with the GTX 285, and some are a little faster with the Radeon 5850, but in general I found them to be equivalent. I think most review websites show them being pretty close in performance also. But whatever, believe what you want.

Yeah don't RMA your card, instead pay more for a lesser card because you are lazy, your absolutely right! If a card is that buggy is shouldn't be release?! Then NEVER buy a GPU is that is less than one year old, hell never buy one period because you can ALWAYS get a DOA. Oh and guess what, the GTX 285 had a good deal of DOAs when first released even though it was on a more mature new process, you shouldn't have bought it since it never should have been released!

Oh no! The 5850 is imperceptibly louder than the GTX 285. You damn well know that you wouldn't notice the difference after a week, assuming there is one.

No, the 5850 outpaces the GTX 285 pretty well, costs less, and gives you DX11 which you SHOULD care about unless you are upgrading in a years time. The only reason you may not see a difference is because of your slow CPU. I assume you bought to future proof since an Ahtlon X2 6400+ wont show a difference between a 5770 and a 5850, therefor I assume you are planing to get a new CPU. Well when you do you will have lost a decent amount of performance in most games and have lost the ability to use DX11, congratulations.

Look if you want to be lazy, waste your money, or you just have an undying love for nVidia then keep it to yourself. This whole thread was only to confuse and trick people into not buying the superior product, the 5850. There was no reason to start a thread when you had already taken steps, the wrong steps, and had made up your mind.

 

[EXT64]

There is no point in arguing. If mustang is happy with the end result, that is all that really matters. Because in the end, all these cards are a waste of money if all we mainly use them for is gaming. Now if he goes bashing ATI in every other thread he posts in I'd be angry, but after an experience like this we all need a way to vent a little frustration.

 

[AMW1011]

Sorry EXT64, he has done it a few times. Besides I could care less if he bought a Quadro FX 5200 for gaming, I just wanted to clear up things so people don't think what he did was reasonable and copy him.

 

[Mustang5521]

Sorry EXT64, he has done it a few times. Besides I could care less if he bought a Quadro FX 5200 for gaming, I just wanted to clear up things so people don't think what he did was reasonable and copy him.

Oh yeah, the "reasonable" thing to do it to pull apart my entire system, install a new motherboard, and then hope that the Radeon 5850 works well with it. Pffffttt......real smart there.

I think I'll just keep my more compatible (with hardware and software) and equally fast GTX 285 (with the additional PhysX feature), thank you very much.

Oh and another thing, with the Radeon 5850, suddenly my MagicTune Premium software (that came with my Samsung monitor) stopped working because the video card was "unsupported". Gotta love ATI and their fantastic compatibility.

 

[AMW1011]

Oh yeah, the "reasonable" thing to do it to pull apart my entire system, install a new motherboard, and then hope that the Radeon 5850 works well with it. Pffffttt......real smart there.

I think I'll just keep my more compatible (with hardware and software) and equally fast GTX 285 (with the additional PhysX feature), thank you very much.

Oh and another thing, with the Radeon 5850, suddenly my MagicTune Premium software (that came with my Samsung monitor) stopped working because the video card was "unsupported". Gotta love ATI and their fantastic compatibility.

It would only take 5 minutes to research compatibility, and besides your supposed case was a rarity. The GTX 285 is not equally fast, unless you mean in your system then so is the 5770 for $200+ cheaper... PhysX is dead, but love that feature all you want, I don't even use it since the slight performance hit isn't worth almost no additional visuals even in batman. Oh NOs!!!! A new card generation doesn't support EVERYTHING?! Besides you would do better with a third party app. Oh and there is nothing wrong with ATI compatibility. nVidia is just as bad. (Blasphemy I know! How dare I contradict the gospel!?)

Sorry, you can't defend your actions like this. If you said, "I decided it was worth it FOR ME to pay extra for less performance and get an older card instead of troubleshoot an issue", then that would be fine. This nVidia gospel isn't.

 

[jyjjy]

4. No, my system has good cooling. And Radeon 5850 doesn't run very hot, just hotter than the GTX 285. And it is louder than the GTX 285 also.

How hot the sensors for the processor are reading is mostly irrelevant as to how much heat your card is giving off. The HD5850 uses MUCH less power and generates much less heat. Power usage and the coolers ability to remove heat from the case are what matter in terms of practical effect on your system's overall temp.

 

[EXT64]

Point taken and agreed. This is unfortunately how bad reputation rumors start and somehow gain more traction than fact.

 

[Bluescreendeath]

How hot the sensors for the processor are reading is mostly irrelevant as to how much heat your card is giving off. The HD5850 uses MUCH less power and generates much less heat. Power usage and the coolers ability to remove heat from the case are what matter in terms of practical effect on your system's overall temp.

Exactly. The GTX285 gives off far more heat the the 5850. The GTX285 just has its fans spinning faster so the card itself reads lower temperatures, but the GTX285 still gives off way more heat into the case.

Oh yeah, the "reasonable" thing to do it to pull apart my entire system, install a new motherboard, and then hope that the Radeon 5850 works well with it. Pffffttt......real smart there.

I think I'll just keep my more compatible (with hardware and software) and equally fast GTX 285 (with the additional PhysX feature), thank you very much.

Oh and another thing, with the Radeon 5850, suddenly my MagicTune Premium software (that came with my Samsung monitor) stopped working because the video card was "unsupported". Gotta love ATI and their fantastic compatibility.

The 5850 came out like 2 months ago. The GTX285 came out years ago. Your comparison is way off. When the GTX285 first came out, it had loads of problems.

The 5850 has been shown to be faster than the GTX285 is the vast majority of situations. The 5850's support for DX11, eyefinity, lower cost, lower power consumption, and better performance far trump the GTX285's physX support.


Like virtually everyone here have said, giving up your 5850 and buying a more expensive GTX285 is a complete waste of money.

 

[Mustang5521]

For anyone who doubts that the Radeon 5850 (and probably the rest of the 5000 series) is problematic, the following thread is just one example: LINK

 

[Mustang5521]

The 5850's support for DX11, eyefinity, lower cost, lower power consumption, and better performance

Those things don't help the fact that it's a buggy P.O.S.

 

[mfarrukh]

Comeon people, He had a bad experience with a card doesnot means he don't know anything.

'mustang5521'

I would agree with you, bad things happens, and happens alot.

This is a new card, and new cards always have some kind of problems.

In my opinion, you should have waited some time before giving away $75.

AnyWays,
Good Luck for the future

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

A bad experience doesnt explain low fps, where the 5850 is clearly superior.
Its common to have install problems due to old driver "left overs" when switching from 1 company to the other.
Spending more money before seeking answers shows the OP was mad, and who here has always made the best decisions when mad?
Claiming the card is louder and hotter also goes against everything everyone knows about these 2 cards. The 5850 is cooler and quieter.

@OP, if youre happy, good, but next time, Id suggest you ask around Toms a bit more for answers, as youve gone backwards in features and perf, while spending more money to do so

PS Stay away from nVidias latest driver, it wont let you oc your card til the hotfix comes out, if you intend to oc

 

[Bluescreendeath]

For anyone who doubts that the Radeon 5850 (and probably the rest of the 5000 series) is problematic, the following thread is just one example: LINK

I can cherry pick links too:

http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies-archive.cfm/1132578.html

http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/265764-33-problem

http://www.vistax64.com/graphic-cards/214127-problem-gtx-285-a.html

Those things don't help the fact that it's a buggy P.O.S.

http://www.newegg.com/product/product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102857

The sapphire 5850 has an 89% 5/5 or 4/5 on Newegg. That means that basically 90% of the people who bothered to leave a review had a positive experience. And we all know that people who have had a bad experience tend to leave feedback more often than those with good experiences.

What does this mean? You either got a bad card, or you don't have the software installed correctly.

 

[Mustang5521]

Ok I get it. There are a lot of ATI video card owners on this message board who don't like it when someone insults ATI. Many people like rooting for the underdog, in this case being ATI. I would venture to guess that many ATI owners purchase their video card based on the fact that they don't like the bigger more popular company that is dominating the video card market (i.e. Nvidia). And they also purchase ATI brand because the video cards are lower priced and fit their budget better for price/performance. However, all of this doesn't change these facts:

* Nvidia is better supported by game developers - obviously game developers are going to work harder for Nvidia compatibility since Nvidia cards are in a far higher percentage of the PCs out there compared to ATI. Many game developers also optimize their games better for Nvidia cards.

* Nvidia has better compatibility - again most hardware manufacturers are going to focus more on compatibility with the dominant video card company (i.e. Nvidia).

* Nvidia usually has better drivers - don't exactly know why this is the case, but it is.

All of these factors play a big role in why Nvidia video cards cost significantly more that ATI video cards. Because Nvidia can demand a higher price for their video cards and get it. ATI can't demand as high a price, otherwise their sales would probably plummet (again because of the facts listed above).

Now ATI owners/fans on here can argue until they are blue in the face that ATI is equivalent or superior to Nvidia, but in reality this is simply not the case. Just like happy Kia owners can argue until they are blue in the face that Kia is equivalent or superior to Honda, but again this is simply not the case.

Again, argue as much as you like about this, but there are valid reasons why the general consensus out there is that Nvidia cards are generally less troublesome than ATI cards.

I think I am less biased when it comes to these things. For example, I know Intel CPUs are better than AMD CPUs, but I still have an AMD CPU because at the time I didn't want to spend extra for an Intel CPU. My AMD works great, but next time I am going to buy Intel brand. You might ask why? Because I know that Intel CPUs are simply better. There is nothing wrong with AMD though.

 

[Mousemonkey]

Point taken and agreed. This is unfortunately how bad reputation rumors start and somehow gain more traction than fact.

It seems enough people are making noises about Ati's drivers that someone has taken a bit of notice.
http://www.techeye.net/chips/amd-punter-has-problems-catalysing-things

PS Stay away from nVidias latest driver, it wont let you oc your card til the hotfix comes out, if you intend to oc

The MSI utility still works (at least I think it's that one) so they are not all broken.

 

[yannifb]

Ok mustang, frankly, I would trade my GTX 295 for a 5870 anyday. Why? Because the 5870 has dx 11, which already has 2 titles and many upcoming ones (best imo Alien vs Predator), can keep up with my GTX 295 with only 1 GPU, and is cooler and quieter. So a 5850 is an even better choice to you since it is much faster than a GTX 285, and has the same pluses as i listed above.

Oh yeah and at the time (if that was the Prescott time) AMD cpus were better. And here you are saying Intel cpus are better just b/c they are Intel. You are a smart one.

Good job wasting money!