Need help choosing the right motherboard

[Daveyo]

Hi Xthe

Alright now we are getting somewhere. What would be the watts that would be considered safe for the NEW graphics, and the quads, and motherboard, besides the hardware and the Hard drive. I need a ballpark minimum of which to begin because all this is new now, and also this LCD has to be hooked up to the computer as well so you can see the screen.

I have to find out what the total power all this will take and plus some extra to be on the safe side to cover all the bases. From there say you tell me 500 watts, OK then I will jump to 1,000 to cover everything power wise.

When did they start going into wattage here??? I remember back in 2000 all they needed was 110V 60 hertz, and this power unit breaks it down to 12 V system which powered the computer.

I am not concerned with the power over here because they have converters to take their 220 V down to 110v and it goes wattage. which has been running my computer here and the fridge since 2004. Never had a problem up to now. I have a 1000 watt power converter here now. This barely meets the needs for this old sytem. So I have been very lucky up to now.

I will have to pull out my papers here and add this all up again. Since you already did tell me those quads needs 2 volts to run just to be on safe side. I have to know how much the motherboard needs.

I will report back and let you know.

Daveyo

 

[xthekidx]

Well a system with a Q9550, a mainstream GPU (like Radeon HD 4850), 3 HDD's, and 2 Optical drives would need probably around 350w at the most during Peak power consumption. For a setup like that I would probably chose a 500w PSU. This is highly dependant on the GPU you chose though, as it is usually the most powerhungry component of the PC. Use this Calculator to get an idea of what you will need, I used it for what it sounds like you will build and it said to get a 450w PSU:
http://extreme.outervision.com/psucalculatorlite.jsp

Here is a review of a bunch of different GPU configurations and their Peak Power consumption of the system:
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3517&p=13
as you can see the Peak power consumption of their test system (which will be more demanding than yours because they used the most power hungry CPU on the market) with a 4850 used only 260w when it was fully loaded.

 

[Daveyo]

Hi Xthe

Your not going to believe this, but a basic computer system uses about 30 amps!!!! This covers everything inside that tower and not the monitor since it is a separate power source plugged to the wall. However here where I am at, I have to draw that as well and add to the amount.

I need minimum of 3,500 watts of power here. 3300 watts is equivalent to 30 amps on a 110 volt system. However read on because this power source unit is a step down from 110 volts to 12 volts OK

I only (1) 1,000 watts power converter here. Stepping down 220 to 110. OK This unit is way under the power because if you take 1,000 watts and use a 12 v system this comes out to only 83 volts!!!!!!

A better way of saying it as follows: 1000 watts divided by 30 amps equals to 33 volts. OK

I have a 30 amp system here. If 1 amp times 110 volts equals to 110 watts (the formula) then 30 amps times 110 volts will equal to 3300 watts. That is why I said before this watt converter I have here is barely able to take this load and I know it is hitting top no doubt.

The power sources they are selling now really can confuse people indeed.

Now the computer deals with only a 12 volt system, but it needs a 110 power source. So this is a step down converter if you want to call it that way.

Now you shoot 12 volts into this system still using 30 amps. OK you will need 360 watts of power. So they are selling 500 watts and selling 1000 watts. This will be OK for a 12 volt system but woefully lacking on a 110 volt system.

Man people have to do some arithmetic here to make sure of everything - whew.

So for the PSU yes a 1000 is a nice safe bet to cover everything but be careful again.

I noticed something else here.

A CD-RW uses 5 volts but uses 1.2 amps to run, a scanner uses 120V but needs 1.25 amps from the computer to run, and the deskjet uses 120 volts but need 0.7 amps etc. and so forth. As long as you can plug the main other utensils shall I say like the deskjet and the scanner to the main outlet your OK. What these units need is the amount of amps from the computer to run.

I may be wrong here, but never the less 30 amps pretty much covers it for my computer system using 12 volts. So it is now decided I will buy the PSU of 1000 watts to be safe.

So now the question is what do you think. Is it better to have the PSU outside of the tower or inside the tower.

My dell 8100 has it inside the tower. If I want to keep this system cool then it best to keep the PSU on the outside since that generates a lot of heat by itself.

What is your opinion

Daveyo

 

[xthekidx]

I'm not sure how circuitry and stuff works over there in thailand, but I think you must be mistaken. Look at the PSU inside of your Dell 8100, I'm willing to bet its no bigger than 400w. A 1000w PSU is MAJOR overkill for your requirements. A 500w PSU would be fine, if you really want to be careful then a 650w, otherwise you are just wasting your money.

Also, not everything in your system needs a 12v supply of power, some need 5v, others need 3.3v, so while something might require 6A, it won't need 72w of power, maybe just 30w or 20w. Your PSU is plugged into a 12v outlet, and from there it changes its voltage output to the rest of your components.

Keep the PSU inside of the system, its fine since PSU's have fans that blow the hot air from their heatsinks directly out the back of them, not into your case. The heat generated from your PSU inside the tower will be very minimal compared to the heat generated by your other components. Plus its so much more convenient to keep it inside the tower if you need to move it for some reason.

 

[Daveyo]

Hi Xthe

OK just reading from you and of what I figured mine out to be, then I will need minimum of 650 watts. Again, I know you guys like to over clock these computers with gusto, but I don't do that so this would be a nice safe amount.

Ok that is said and done, now to find the PSU. Which one is most reliable and is of good quality meaning lasting a good 10 years, like I have. Hmmm, I just thought of it now, can I use my current PSU???? I will have to shut down my system to find out what the watts here is. If it is 500 watts, I will leave this to be your decision, because you are slowly beginning to know what I need as we speak here and of what I do with a computer. But if it is more, heck why not. Something to think about here. I will let you decide the brand of the PSU OK. Your more on top of things and would know which one is the flaky one or the ones giving people problems.

Next is the case part, and making sure if one can put a PSU in it. I am very much leaning on that XCLIO Windtunnel Fully Black Finish 1.0 mm SECC Chassis ATX Full Tower Computer Case - Retail $ 100.00 and probably is settled on that one since it is quite a tower indeed. Now I must find out if I can install washable filters into this contraption and if I can then I am in real business.

Then we have the tower covered, we have the CPU Quad chosen, and we have the PSU covered which is 650 watts. Next is the right mobo and then we move on to the graphics and the LCD. Once that is figured out, then we got a computer ready to get set up and built from scratch.

OK now I will study up on the mobo again, sigh and see what Intel has to offer as I said before.

Thanks again for your incredible expertise and help.

Daveyo

Moving that tower, oh man, the one I picked weighs a ton all by itself and then add my gizmos to it. whewwwwwwwwww, no it will stay put until I move back to USA.


Daveyo

 

[xthekidx]

My choices for a 650w PSU would be to get an Antec Earthwatts EA650 650w or a Corsair TX650 650w, they offer great price/performance ratios. If you can't find one of those, then look at SeaSonic S12 Energy Plus SS-650HT 650W, SILVERSTONE OP650 650W. If you can't find any of those then let me know and I will find another high quality product.

PSU's degrade over time and 10 years for the the PSU you have right now is very good, I wouldn't recommend reusing your current one. Chances are when you hooked it up to your more powerful system, it would die due to the increased stress, and dying PSU's are VERY bad news. Best case scenario, you just have to go buy a new one, worst case it shorts out 1 or many more of the other components with it, or even burns your house down. DO NOT GO CHEAP ON THE PSU, tell me what you are getting before you get it so I can give it my approval.

That xclio windtunnel is a great case.

 

[xthekidx]

So I know you really want an intel motherboard, but Intel motherboards are not necessarily better than third party ones, many Intel boards have problems. Look at Asus and Gigabyte motherboards as well. Its 3Am here so I'm going to hit the sack, I'll see what you have come up with when I wake up.

 

[Daveyo]

Xthe

I know you said DDR 2 800. I see a lot of DDR 2 1200 and DDR 1066 or DDR 3 1800

Can you give me some guidance on this that would be a nice handshake with the Quad 9550.

I am lost in knowing the difference concerning the standard memory on these motherboards.

Also would you recommend a Video Chipset be on these motherboards as included or not. I noticed this too.

As of the PSU your the boss on that part because the graphics is coming and also that LCD as well, and also the boss on the motherboard.

As of the graphics, one of the people here said it is a waste to have 2 of them, but really having 2 graphic boards can play a big role. For example, OK I have the Quad 9550 processor, and when playing my game, sure I already have 1 graphics card here installed but once I move the sliders to the MAX to get the real enjoyment of the game, pow the hanging and studdering begins. Yea I know I only have a 512 mb memory which I know also is a big factor.

Anyway with 2 graphic cards the processing of the scenery complexities will be a lot better as things don't jam up so hard. Example say you have a truck and it drives fine on a lane and a half. Now comes a lane only it is like squeezing this truck sideways it so it fits. Same with the data that flys around the system. It is like taking 4 pipes and squeezing them into one small pipe. By splitting the load on to the graphic boards, it should get the data much faster and better and not jam up. This new processor should be able to handle the graphics data with ease since the memory will also come into play with plenty of room to spare speed wise.

In fact some of these memory rams cannot handle the speed loads of these processors as I am now finding out.

So sure OK now I have a fast processor, but once that single graphics card gets hit with the demand, well things begin to happen you know.

To be on the safe side, I am firm on getting 4 gig ram minimum. 6 and 8 gig is optional so I can do with some expansion here. In this case I will need 4 slots for the cards minimum.

This time I hope to not get caught like I am now when Dell forced me to have just a specific ram and they became obsolete in 4 years. I hope to have Rams available for me like 6-8 years and not be stuck or be under the control of the motherboard itself. The prices that Dell did back then was outrageous. RAMBUS ECC I don't know if you understand what I am saying but I am at least trying to pass this information out to you so that you know as we work along here.

This is what I still have here. Toshiba 128mb/8 ECC G 100, and Infineon 128/8 Ecc Rambus 700-45 It was a 184 pin deal. The dell part number is D370XMD. These are actually purely a PC 600 and it cannot accept any other RAMBUS. Somehow Dell had this motherboard programmed to accept only this and nothing else. Go figure.

I tried without the ECC, and it not work at all. The puter was dead. Hehehehehe. It needs Error correction for it to work. Don't that beat all.

The price for these Ram cards is unbelieveable. $175 for each and this is a 128mb.

For the 256 it went up to 250 bucks for each. That is why I not buy it, whereas I was seeing PC 600 without the ECC going out like butter at 50 bucks a set. So I was screwed by Dell on this part.

I also want to get to have a 256 bit instead of 128 bit or the 64 bit which I have now. Much better too. When the requirements for the games get better, the memory will be increasing as well as the bits for it to work.

Before, these games required 128mb memory minimum, and 64 bit. Now I am seeing a lot of it be 512mb memory and 128 and some 256 bit. So I also have to jump up a bit here as well. It won't be long before we see 768mb around the corner and it needing 256 bit for a game being minimum requirements.

Basically I want to be ahead of this as much as possible so I do not need to keep upgrading if you know what I mean.



Daveyo

 

[Daveyo]

Xthe

I am having a lot of problems with this Newegg on the searches. Here is what I did on a power search and put down all the things I was looking for and it comes up zilch. What gives here man.

Home. > Categories0_. > Motherboards1_. > Intel Motherboards2_. > [EVGA] , [PNY Technologies, Inc.] , [ASUS] , [GIGABYTE] , [Supermicro] , [Intel] , [MSI] > AGP Slots[1 x AGP 4X / 8X ],PCI Slots[3 ],Audio Channels[6 Channels ],Audio Channels[8 Channels ],USB[6 x USB 2.0 ],USB[8 x USB 2.0 ],CPU Socket Type[LGA 775 ],Maximum Memory Supported[8GB ],Maximum Memory Supported[12GB ],Memory Standard[DDR2 800 ],Number of Memory Slots[4×240pin ],Memory Standard[DDR2 1066 ],Memory Standard[DDR3 1333 ],CPU Type[Quad-core / Core 2 Duo / Pentium D / Celeron ],Memory Standard[DDR3 1600 ],Memory Standard[DDR3 1800 ],Memory Standard[DDR2 1200 ],Memory Standard[DDR3 1333 / DDR2 1066 ],Memory Standard[DDR3 1066 / DDR2 800 ],Memory Standard[DDR3 1600 / DDR2 800 ],Memory Standard[DDR3 1900 ],Memory Standard[DDR3 2000 ],Memory Standard[DDR2 1333 ],North Bridge[Intel P45 ],South Bridge[Intel ICH10R ],Memory Standard[DDR3 1600 / DDR2 1066 ], Product Type [OEM] [Retail]

I basically thru everything at it with options and still come up zilch.

sigh

Daveyo

 

[Daveyo]

Morning Xthe

Ok here is a list I extracted out of CDW which is a bit better but lousey but better.

http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/default.aspx?EDC=1502095 ####

http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/default.aspx?EDC=1303990 ****

http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/default.aspx?EDC=1581514 ####

http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/default.aspx?EDC=1570051####

http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/default.aspx?EDC=1522981 ####****

http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/default.aspx?EDC=1605015 Crossfire

http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/default.aspx?EDC=1525933 Crossfire

http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/default.aspx?EDC=1495711 Crossfire

http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/default.aspx?EDC=1596359

http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/default.aspx?EDC=1556455 Crossfire

http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/default.aspx?EDC=1596398 Crossfire ####

http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/default.aspx?EDC=1605056 No PCI???

It is very hard to find what I was really looking for, however some of the eyecandy was there, but missed out on the PCI slots which I really do need. So I don't know what to do or where to look any more as this is so fricking confusing.

If I was to get what I was looking for it would end up in the 400 dollar range on up.

That really sucks. CDW prices are higher than Newegg and I cannot figure it out since it is supposed to be a Discount warehouse. So why higher than Newegg???

Newegg is taking away the competition sort of I guess.


Daveyo

 

[xthekidx]

Yeah Newegg is generally the cheapest US online store, and it is where I would chose to buy from in the US. So since you are probably going to be using two video cards it sounds like (if not initially then eventually) I recommend going with this motherboard, it is probably the best motherboard for the price anywhere, it compete with those $250 motherboards in terms of quality and performance:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128358
However it uses DDR2 memory which is the kind of memory that has been out for a while, and in two or three years will probably not be the standard thing anymore. DDR3 is the newer faster version of ram (just like DDR2 replaced DDR, DDR3 is starting to replace DDR2). So if you want to be able to upgrade the ram more in the future, then you should get the DDR3 compatible motherboard version of that board, however you cannot use DDR2 with it.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128369

DDR2-800 is the standard speed for DDR2 ram, and if you get DDR2 memory I would go with DDR2-800. DDR2-1066 or 1200 are useful if you will be overclocking your processor and ram, but you won't, so its not necessary. If you get DDR3 ram, get 1333mhz ram, it is pretty much the standard speed for DDR3. Just get 4gb right now, benchmarks have shown that is all you really need for gaming, if you think you need more adding memory is easy as pie, and DDR3 will only continue to get cheaper as time goes on. The only thing that isn't good about DDR3 is that its usually twice as expensive as DDR2, and doesn't offer a huge performance increase over DDR2 right now, although it is possible that programs will start to realize the memory bandwidth potential of DDR3 in the near future and so the difference will become more apparent.
My DDR2 Preference: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231219&Tpk=g%20skill%20hk
My DDR3 Preference: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820146868

If you do a newegg search you have to be general about your requirements, otherwise it gets too specific and you never find what you want.

Ok for video cards, if you want this PC to be able to keep up with games for a while, then here is what you should do. Buy 1 4870 1GB video card now, its the best crossfire capable single GPU card. I think this will be plenty for your current needs and expectations. In two years or so, (or maybe just one year when prices drop to reasonable levels) buy another one and run the cards in crossfire on your motherboard. This should last you a while. The thing about video cards though is that the technology behind them advances so fast, that almost anything you buy now will be old and outdated in two years and need to be replaced if you want to keep up with the current games. If you get two of them and run them simultaneously, then it'll probably last you 3 years before you have to replace them. Most people who like to Game on their PC's upgrade the graphics card every 18 months or so. The best plan of action for upgradablility of the graphics is to get a good single GPU now, and then later add another one that you can use in tandem with the one you are using now, instead of buying two midrange GPU's now and using up all your PCIEx16 slots, then you have to toss both GPU's later when you want a graphics upgrade.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102801

My PSU suggestion was based on the assumption that you would use 1 GPU. Since you are looking at using two, then you should go for a 750w PSU, or since you like to be careful, then look at an 850w PSU. The Corsair 850tx is your best bet I think for Power Supply Units.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139009&Tpk=850tx

...So I think that is all for now...Keep the questions coming.

 

[Daveyo]

Morning Xthe

How did you know that I was leaning on the 45TUD3P??? You surprised me. I also was looking at the extreme really hard as those slots look tasty to me and the copper cooling.

The UD3P is the one they claim 50,000 hours no problem. Good for 6 years running the puter 24/7 non stop without shutting it down. Wow. Yea that one can give me a nice 10 baller for sure.

What is your opinion on the extreme though??

I was checking out the gig site here all afternoon and up to now, and my brain is fried trying to digest the smarts data here.

Yes I think I will crossfire, but definitely need those slots for versatility you know.

Big problem though Xthe, when I do get this mobo and Quad and PSU plus monitor, and that memory, and cooler and what else we jam into it, for a simple pc user like me just playing the sim, sigh, it is going to be the bios setting, and believe me, I am worried. Most of gig I see here one needs to set the bios etc to get everything correct. There is a advance setting too but it is kept a secret from gig so dummies like me not mess with it. However I SAW it on the forum so smack chalk one up for me, ehhh.

Gigabyte got 24 choices, but strike one of them out as it being a bad production board. That one is GA-EP45C-UD3R Best stay away from that one. Many have problems with that one board.

Now I am so tired here got to get some beauty rest and snuggle on my pillow for awhile.

So this much more you know. Will crossfire, and add extra graphics board, stay with 4g memory with 6 as an option for future if needed. So you pick the PSU once you know the mobo that gets picked and now the LCD that gets picked. Tower is already said and done. I am taking that one even though it weighs a ton.

If you can check the gigabyte site, pick just 4 for me to examine that sort of meets all my needs OK I like the site as it is pretty detailed pic wise. That extreme with all those slot really caught my eye as chocolate candy slups my mouth. Yummy. However what is the trade off here. No 3UDP ehh solid state deal. Hmmm.

The price for extreme is a whopper over 200 candles.

Sigh, why they do that to me, when I see a good item it just so happens to be expensive. Darn.

Did you see the CDW site>

Ok sound off. lights off and time for some shut eye, see ya in 8 hours.

Daveyo

 

[xthekidx]

I am assuming this is the extreme you were referring to: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128349 and I really only think the extreme is necessary if you will be doing extreme overclocking and running tons of peripherals. I think its overpriced for what it offers, it should be about $50 less in my opinion. A lot of people seem to have problems with that board too...and to be honest even if I didn't know the price of that board and just comparing it to the UD3P, I would pick the UD3P instead. The UD3P is the best built motherboard for LGA 775 that I know of, it has excellent cooling and it would be the one I would pick to last 10 years.

The monitor doesn't require much power, most only need 75w at the most, and that power comes from the wall, not the PSU in the tower so it really has no effect on the PSU you chose. I still say get the Corsair 850tx if you can find it, it is an excellent PSU and usually very reasonably priced.

I did see the CDW site, which is a canadian site...are you Canadian or American? As far as Canadian sites go, CDW is not that good of a site for good deals. If you want to shop around in Canada (I wouldn't though, prices usually aren't as good there due to taxes and outrageous shipping costs, besides the fact that CAD$ are weak against the US$) then look at memoryexpress.com and ncix.com. So I am still kinda confused about where and when you are planning on buying these components...are you going to build this thing in Thailand, or come back to the US first? You won't be able to use any of the parts you buy in Thailand unless you buy all the parts...otherwise they will just sit in your closet and collect dust, while the prices of the components you bought continue to fall. The best time to buy is when you are ready to build.

As far as setting up the bios goes, I think its fairly easy, you just need to read the manual. Especially since you won't be overclocking the CPU, you really just have to set everything on auto, and it will take care of itself. The only thing you might actually need to mess with is the memory timings and voltage, which is fairly easy to figure out. Read the manual, you should be fine. Google of course is always your friend.

 

[Daveyo]

Morning Xthe

Ok I have decided on the UD3P. Said and done. Wow. No the actual CDW headquarters is located in USA as a matter of fact in Vernon Hills, Illinois which was when I was living in Waukegan about 16 miles away. No I am American, and not Canadie. However in Canada, they have my keyboard which cannot be found in USA, and I am trying to get the buzzards to send it across the border, but still waiting for them to tell me the final price including the shipping. The keyboard is being sold for 6.99 each and I want to get two of them because soon they will be all gone. Been waiting for almost 2 weeks for the turd to answer me via e-mail.

I still cannot believe that you knew somehow that I selected the UD3P. You must have some telepathy to my brain. Actually now I am in Nakhon Sawan Thailand, and hope to get to Kentucky either late 2010 or early 2011. I got set back a year due to having to pay for my mothers debts of which the Credit companies caught up to me when I applied for the house loan. Sigh. I am the only son with no bros or sis like I told you so by law I have to settle out the debt.

Moving back to USA is going to be extremely very time consuming and I will be very busy. I will do the build here, and get it all going. When time to move I will then take the most important items with me to protect it, and the rest will be put in cardboard boxes, and then into a custom made wooden crate.

With my stuff here it will fill up a 40 foot container. When I left USA back 2004 I had only about 3 -4 feet of space left at the rear. It was practically full of all my home furnishings and everything. So this time going back it will be completely full, so I might have to get the High Cube which I suspect since there is some extra items I bought here that will fill that up.

It took me and two other people that I hired privately from Labor World nearly 4 days to load it up. When I got here I had 10 Thais to take it out plus a fork truck to do the job and they did it in 16 hours. Not to mention the cost I had to pay Customs just to bring in my personal property!!!!!! Going out now will not be that much and it will be allowed back into USA without any taxes or penalties. Thank God for being an American.

I have to pay for my airfare, plus the shipping of my Doxies here. Still need to make the arrangements with the Airline Cargo company to time everything just right. I will fly out of here straight to Narita, and from there straight to Chicago, and from there be in a VAN and drive down to Kentucky. Looking at some land now for 6 acres to build on. With that land plus a house there property taxes a cool 340 dollars a full year. Previously in Waukegan I was paying 6 grand a year. Whew.

Now on Disability, due to my back from an injury when a 747 engine crushed me against the wall and the only thing that saved me my life was two steel bars that was agains the wall and I was pinned right between them. Not want to talk about the pain I endured cause I did pass out when it was removed from me. Next thing I remember was in the hospital.

So I plan to do something with that land of mine once I get it and maybe sell two acres of it as lots so it help pay off the house. 5 lots per acre. I pretty much kinda know what price I will sell it at and for the buyers it will be a bonanza. With that lot and they build a home there, their property taxes will be around 100 dollars a year. It is better to build a home rather than buy an existing home. People tend to way over exaggerate home prices seeking huge profit deals and cost of home etc.

Sure they want to make money but with the materials needed to build the home the cost is very low. It is the labor that can bring it up and the cost of the land besides contractors seeking a profit return on materials and extra's involved.
Now many people are in default, and foreclosed etc, and buying one like that you are going to have a major headache. So I am staying away from that like it is poison. I will let the bank and the mortgage companies have it and they will be stuck with it. I don't plan to bail someone out because of their stupidity.

I have always told people to build a home they can financially afford and not be the redhead next door being Lucy Ball. People want to always live in Luxury and they ante up the house to near quarter million whereas they have a budget that can settle for just 120,000 and be happy with it. Know what I mean.

OK now lets see, we got the mobo finally down and this is the list so far

Mobo - Gig UD3P
PSU - Corsair 850 tx
CPU - Quad 9550
Tower - XCLIO Windtunnel
Ram - I forgot ???? I know 4 gigs, with 6 gig as option
LCD Monitor - still open 22 or 24 The price here is the thing to keep costs down and the resolution deal which I need more than 85 refresh rate.
HDD - still debating yet Sata or ATA but need the ATA 133 very soon here 320/350 each of gig, to make it 640 or 700 if possible.
Converter of SATA to IDEE, and from IDEE to SATA (very important here)
Graphics - (2) of them
Will crossfire indeed as that is a nice option
Need washable filters
CPU cooler - Is this still needed for what I do Xthe??????? That tower should take care of it cooling wise but then again you're the expert.

I might want to slight overclock it if needed so I need you to guide me here. Not much just a slight amount if needed.

I will not do encryption on this at all, as that is way too much for me of what I do.

I am trying to stay as simple as I can with this new get up as much as possible and still have plenty of room to expand as time goes on if I need to adjust accordingly.

I agree the costs will be coming down but gradually but I don't think not very much. There is a break point on that too, and availability can be gone as I have found out otherwise.

I did look at AMD, but forget it, it is way over my league.

OK lets work on the RAM now and that LCD Sound good

Daveyo

 

[Daveyo]

Hey Xthe

I would like a graphics card with Ti and DDR tech on it and definitely a fan on it too.

Oh also the sound card too. Almost forgot this part.

I am not so keen on getting software such as Norton etc, OEM stuff as you know I got a lot of boot leggies with me that work just fine as part of the packages, but will take the OEM as it is nice to have anyway. When they throw the software to the package that is when prices climb and many should know that part most of all.

Daveyo

 

[Daveyo]

Xthe

This encryption tech by gig to the motherboard is nice. So sure good for office environment no problem.

The question I have is as follows:

Does this encryption work while your on line so that no hacker or virus - trojans etc can get to it. When your off line, no one can touch you. But once on line yes they have a means to do so and when hacked you will not know it. Was wondering if this motherboard set up can alert you to this intrusion of someone trying to access your puter hacking at it????

If this protects and locks them out, then it is a good security set up with the other features such as keeping the virus of all kinds in check from removing or going into your system.

Actually Xthe, your hard drive is the part that holds all your data, programs and files etc. Not the motherboard. That is why I don't understand this from Gig itself.

However if say OK you have a dial up, hooked to your puter, then it goes to the motherboard first and then to the hard drive, then to the LCD screen I can see the motherboard coming into play here. I am not sure about this at all, but I suspect it being that route. True or false

Bios backup from a virus is nice but what to do when your on the backup bios system. How to fix something like that????? and get your bios back to original setup and eliminate the offender without crashing. Another question there too.

A while back there was a virus that hit in Thailand that burned out the keyboards, and your CD-RW drives and the mouse as well. I got hit and lost the keyboard but shut down fast enough to protect the rest. Restarted in safe mode and cleaned out the offender, but that beautiful keyboard I had got wiped out. The circuitry was fried to boot. Later on and I did not know it, but it did damage my hard drive too. This was back in 2006 during the summer.

So this virus came in on piggyback via the internet line connection. Someone did it. It was indeed a stealth type cause my anti-virus system did not pick it up until it activated and it is fast this virus once it begins.

They should make laws for hackers and virus makers to serve very long prison terms like 15 years or more. The objective is to keep them out of the mainstream of computers while the rest of us catch up and protect ourselves. Also there should be a worldwide list of these people and it be available to anyone who wants to know if they are back on the streets.

I am really serious as this is the biggest culprit now involved with computers today. Bootlegging is on the bottom of this list requiring the least attention.

So much for my thoughts here

Daveyo



Let me know OK

 

[xthekidx]

As far as ram goes- There shouldn't really be any difference between brands, but I suggest you find DDR3-1333 at timings 7-7-7-20, or at least 8-8-8-24. Something like this perhaps:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820146868
Since you are getting a Core 2, then you should either get 4gb or 8gb of ram since it is dual channel. The first setup we looked at ran triple channel, and as such you buy the ram in sets of 3. Don't worry about dual or triple channel, just buy a 4gb kit and it will run dual channel.

As for the monitor, Samsung and Dells are very nice, but a lot of it is personal preference. I suggest you go to a store and check them out in person to see what suits your needs. I'm afraid I won't be too much help choosing a monitor.

I would avise getting Sata drives if you will buy new ones (and I advise you do as it is likely that newer drives will be much faster than the current ones you own). I would look to Western Digital for these, or perhaps Samsung. WD is the industry leader here though. DO NOT BUY SEAGATE DRIVES. Their firmware causes them to fail constantly. The thing about SATA is that the cables are far less obstructive of airflow in the case and thus cooling efficiency is higher with SATA than IDE cables. Sata also looks much more clean when looking inside the PC, don't know how you feel about that.

These are the kinds of converters you need for IDE to SATA:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812206002

For Graphics cards, I would Suggest going with just one right now, a 4870 1GB. Saphire tends to have the best prices and very good customer service. This is the card I am referring to:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102801
Although if you can't get that one, any will do, but try to get one that has the plastic housing around the card and not just the heatsink and fan exposed. The ones with the housing (like that saphire card) blow the hot air from the card heatsink out the back of the PC, others just disipate the heat into the case, which must then be expelled by the other fans in your case.

I advise you to just get one right now that will suit your needs, then you can later add another one. If you were to get two lesser GPU's now, then later when you wanted to upgrade the Graphics you would have to toss them both out, as opposed to just adding one.

For a CPU cooler; there are many that are of great quality. Xigmatek HDT-S1283 is a great one at a very reasonable price, however make sure you buy the Crossbow backplate for it too, as it will increase the contact of your cooler and CPU IHS and cool better, as well as reduce the strain on your motherboard. This is what I am talking about:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835233003
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835233019
Other worthy mentions for cooler are the Scythe Mugen 2, Vigor Monsoon III LT, CoolerMaster v8, Noctua NH-U12P, Thermalright Ultra 120 Extreme (this is the best out there). However the S1283 is the best value of these coolers as it competes with the far more expensive and costs half the price.

I do suggest you get an aftermarket cooler, even if you don't end up overclocking, it will be much quieter than the stock HSF. If you did want to try out overclocking, then a cooler is absolutely necessary if you do not wish to damage your CPU.

 

[xthekidx]

Ok I'm not really sure what TI Tech is on a graphics card...I get the feeling its something that has phased which is why I am not familiar with it...as far as DDR goes, that is the type of ram that is on the GPU. The GPU I suggested uses GDDR5, which is far superior...DDR is old technology.

 

[xthekidx]

I do not actually have personal experience with the Gigabyte board you are looking at, so I cannot speak to how the data encryption works, although I did help a friend build a computer that used it.

But to remove a virus like a trojan you have to do scans of your computer and then delete the entries from your registry and such...its a pain in the ass. I had to do it once. A very small amount of information is stored on the motherboard, the rest on the HDD, and viruses infect both, which is how they can cause damage and stick around for so long. I am in total agreement on the sentences.

For a sound card, I highly suggest that you try out the onboard audio chipset on the board, as these days it is usually very good, and most people cannot hear the difference between it and a fancy $100 sound card, unless you have very fancy THX surround sound speakers. If it turns out that this is insufficient, then it is very easy to add a sound card later, it only takes a few seconds. If you try out the onboard sound first before you buy a separate card, it is likely you can end up saving yourself $100 or so.

 

[Daveyo]

Hi Xthe

Took a look at the graphics cards. Nice but too expensive. Need to come down a bit price wise to around inside the hundred range or lower. Not going to spend gold on graphic cards.

Whew, even though you chose good cards but I want to put my money where it counts the most.

So please give me more choices. Would appreciate it that can at least handle my FS 9 and FSX since it the scenery complex is high and I want to avoid the studdering and other and get those sliders out to the max setting on the game itself with room to spare to ensure a smooth flow and for the future Microsoft flight sim game coming up soon.

Daveyo

 

[Daveyo]

Xthe

Looking at the Nvidia 9800 GTX 512, 256 bit and etc, but was warned to make sure you have the proper PSU that can handle this card alone. Takes pure 24 amps alone. Person says get one that a 60 amp single rail or better.

Anyway the price is reasonable. This one should handle my FS9 and FSX without a problem and maybe the future Microsoft Game as well. Supposingly does almost 34 frames a second.

With that Quad, it should double

Only drawback it is huge taking up 2 pci slots.

What are your thoughts.



Daveyo

 

[Daveyo]

Hi Xthe

Did a bit more studying here on the Graphics data, and believe it or not that game from Microsoft is very scenery demanding, in compared with all the others around. I am refering to the bench marks as given. This card that I mentioned bests the 8800 GTS by a bit more margin fps wise, but loses out to the 8800 GTS by a mere 1-3 fps tops. Go figure.

Normally Xthe, our eyesight goes at 24 frames a second. What you see and the movie camera's around they go at 24 frames a second. Going at 30 frames a second is impossible for our human bodies but is possible movie wise and when that happens things basically speeds up a bit faster. In the movie itself, you will see a person talking faster, moving faster cars going by faster and etc. Below 24 frames a second we tend to go slo mo if you know what I mean.

So in the computer world yes the FPS does say a lot. Once it hits the full scenery complex itself and does it at 24 fps without a studder or hang or jitter, then you have the normal speed. Anything above that I think one would call it a frame reserve. Meaning it has extra frames to keep up with the demand being rendered to it.

So with this in mind I am getting about an extra 11 on average fps when when playing the FS 9 on that GTx plus board. This is more than adequate to cover additional hits from autogen or the newer photo sceneries now coming into the market, plus all the eye candy being put into an airport setting with lots of animation going on.

Secondly when the plane is moving in the scenery, it can catch up much faster as this plane goes from one scenery tile to the next scenery tile and process it fast enough as you would see in real life. When your behind 24 fps, what happens is the scenery will lag behind and not show up normally until it gets finished with that tile data stream and by that time you pretty much is passing it to the next tile data scenery stream.

That is why FS9 and FSX is very scenery complexed. Games such as Crysis is not even close or world in conflict. This is less scenery demanding compared to the Micro FS 9 and FSX and some other games of flight sim involved like Gen X, which is extremely very scenery demanding.

Seeing a human bounce around in those games is peanuts compared to a scenery that has LOD 9 or less. Just one square of tile encompasses 25 miles by 25 miles showing buildings, skyscrapers, lights, moving cars below, and this is big 25 X 25 and moving at plane speed of 250 knots or less at 3,500 feet going in for a landing or taking off. That scenery below and around including the 3D clouds hits the system so hard, my current processor and graphics card cannot digest it at full setting no how.

So I am really looking forward to seeing what this quad will do and that 9800 GTX card and even two of them will do, and that motherboard as well. Heck I am sure the jump on that alone will be awesome.

However I don't think I will be able to put two of those cards in because of their size.

Can you check and verify this for me. Those cards are very big Xthe. and if that mobo that we selected can handle it or not.

If each one of those cards take 24 amps that comes out to 48 pure just for the 2 cards itself. Then add another 30 amps for the rest of the system. This comes out to around 78 amps. I hope the PSU can handle all that amperage Xthe.

So double check the PSU on the amperage loads that it can hold max and have some extra to spare. I would have to have something say 85 as minimum amp wise and maybe tops 100 amps max wise.

The guy said you can have a 1000 watts but if it not put out the amp demand or have such in the PSU it is going to fry itself out.

Interesting and will await your reply

Daveyo

 

[Daveyo]

Hi Xthe

OK the cooler and that retention adapter is set in stone to cool the CPU. Said and done

Will that Graphics card I selected do OK

The other is on the PSU

Decided to need a 2 rail 12V power. One has to have at least 30/35 amp and the other has to have at least 30/35amp. Will need 3 of these.

Why, because each graphics card hits 24 amps, so I have to have minimum 30 amp for the card. This requires two of them.

The other is for the system to power my other items, such as my HDD, DVD, CD-RW, the floppy etc. All these will pull near 30 amps as I have figured out before.

I sort of think it is not smart to have just one 12V rail as this puts a load on it when you start playing with the amps.

Having 2 rail set up breaks this load up a bit and it is easier.

The other from what I see I don't even know if this is going to fit inside a tower due to its size all by itself. If it does it is going to be a miracle.

Can you find a PSU to meet my needs now and that is reliable but not so expensive???

The adapter to convert the ATA 133 drive to connect to a SATA will suffice. Will buy two of these or three since I have one other HDD still going. So I just hope all this fits correctly.

The other is I hope this new PSU has the power plugs for the HDD and the DVD and the CD-RW. What I have now is 4 pins to power the devices. So I will need to have total of 6 minimum. I can do with 6 for sure. The rest is for the Graphics, the telephony, the wireless and possibly the future sound card if needed.

The RAM that you told me about, OK that is done getting 4 gig and I will cross check it to make sure it works for that specific motherboard and has the same handshake for the Quad as well.

Please write. Have not heard from you at all.

Daveyo

 

[xthekidx]

Ok so here is the thing about the graphics card: the motherboard you are looking at supporst crossfirex technology which means it will allow you to use two ATI graphics cards together. Nvidia is the company that makes the 9800 GTX which you were looking at, and they decided not to support SLI on that motherboard, because they wanted to make their own chipsets for SLI to sell. Unfortunately, SLI chipsets are the most unreliable chipset out there, and I never recommend getting them. The only chipset which is reliable that supporst SLI is X58, which means you have to pay for an i7 if you want to use it. So if you want to use two graphics cards together, you have to use ATI cards. The ones I think you should look at are Radeon HD 4850, or Radeon HD 4830 if the 4850 is too expensive. The 4830 is about equal in performance to the 9800 GTX, the 4850 is better. Take a look at these:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102802
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102770
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127401
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121295

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102822

 

[xthekidx]

Sorry I didn't write back sooner, I was sleeping...other side of the world you know.

Now on the PSU...I really think that you should reconsider your requirements...the Corsair 850tx which I suggested to you or even the Corsair 750tx (which is now a good option since you won't be getting 2 4870's) would be excellent choices for PSU's, they are of some of the highest quality PSU's on the market and are very reasonably priced, and use a single rail. They have some of the best voltage regulation of any power supply out there and won't fry your other components. The Corsair 750/850tx would be my first choice for a PSU for you, as well as PC Power & Cooling Silencer 750w:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817703009
If you really want to have split rails (I actually prefer a single rail...) then look at these:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817256049
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817256050

Another thing...those GPU's you were looking at do not use 25A...at the most they use like 12 or 13. 25A is a conservative estimate of the amount of amps you should have on your 12v rail in order to support one of those cards, but if you had 20A then you would be fine too. The reason they estimate needs so high is so that they don't get a lawsuit later of someone saying they didn't provide a large enough margin. Other hardware runs off the 12v rail too such as the CPU, so you need to have a little extra for that as well. 25A would be enough for a much more power hungry card.