'Nehalem' 2.93 GHz Benches Revealed

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JPForums

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Craziness: In general I agree with your comments (and bumped you), but I must point out the QPI and IMC do have a real impact (if small) on single socket systems.

The IMC will reduce memory access latency showing an improvement nearly across the board. The problem is, Intel already got the memory access latency down so low with the X38/X48 that there isn't that much room for improvement.

The QPI separates the CPU frequency from the rest of the system. It also provides a full duplex path (as opposed to the half duplex FSB) to the rest of the system. Further, memory accesses will no longer be traversing the same path as the rest of the system data. For single socket (monolithic cpu) systems, this boils down to a relatively small improvement due to (again) latency. If Intel connects two quad cores on one package using QPI, it will be just as useful as it is in multi socket systems (in multithreaded apps of course).

So, when you bundle a few small improvements from IPC, QPI, HT, and other core optimizations, you get a somewhat meaningful clock for clock improvement. Keep in mind, AMD's Athlon64 chips were only about 25% faster clock for clock than the AthlonXPs. The improvements everyone is looking for will be more apparent when the clock frequency scales and Intel puts two of these in one package. Of course, software developers have to fully embrace multithreading to benefit from more cores, but that is where the industry is going, so they'll either do it or their products will stagnate as CPU frequencies don't seem to be going up much anymore. On that note, if the test sample is running 2.93GHz, where do you suppose these chips will scale to?
 

jabliese

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Why do we need a teaser? Why rush anything with release 6 months away? What is more important, that we read this 6 months before release, or you get a month to bang on it, present a worthwhile article, and we can read about it 5 months before release? Everybody take a deep breath, relax, then go hyperventilate about Diablo III coming out (in 18 months (maybe)).

There is a little piece of me that says Tom's is having a little laugh at all of us with this very much pre-release nonsense. But the rest of me thinks Tom's is slipping farther away from what it used to be.
 

hurbt

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Holy overclocking, Batman! I'm still ogling that core voltage. I'm a tad surprised that wasn't mentioned in the article... but again, it's not a full review.

I think most of the reactions on here are pretty silly... it's an expose, not a review. They did a decent job comparing it to a couple relevant processors toward the end of the article update... keep your pants on! It's 2 months+ away.
 

gwolfman

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Something no one has seen/mentioned: How much of that improvement can simply be attributed to HyperThreading!?! I mean, with the P4, hyperthreading only added ~20% improvement at most. Seeing that a dual core with hyperthreading can take on a native quad-core, that's interesting.
 

mustacheman8

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Ok look, the multiplier is 22! Who knows how high this thing could be overclocked. And the processor is bigger, allowing more heat dissipation and a larger heatsink...This could be an overclocker's dream! So the stock speeds aren't that impressive to some, but who knows what crazy clock speeds could be attained...
 

kidswithguns

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[citation][nom]SiliconDoc[/nom]AS far as the arguments on what does this test and article really mean, heck they had little time, just look up the scores you are interested in they're on this site. No I'm not doing it, I'm underwhelmed.I think the manufacturers design, research, and produce for the big boy servers markets, where all these cores can be used in meggawhomper multi cpu setups, then we get the steam and urine leftover off their silicon presses. LOLYa know it's true, noone wants to say it but that's the way things are.LOLYes, I'll take the prozac now or slug down a shot of whiskey. roflWhat crap.I still say some of us get together and make a laptop with the latest vidcore, and a harddrive sound and ram and USB ports only(anything attatches for cheap). Then CRUSH the googleheadsaleswonks with all their crap unvalue added junk on every laptop, selling em for 600 bucks each - 300 million sold in a quarter...Come on, where are the motherboards that do that too. How about some REAL VALUE for the enduser ? ( Don't say e-pc or whatever 12 inch tinbox they called it.)3 grand for a decent gaming laptop ? Oh really... the videocard setup costs 2 grand ?Same with this nehalem - it's just more buffoonery. Overclocked E7200 probably smokes it in gaming and everything but "folding" and "stealing dvd videos".[/citation]
People keep researching and researching, it might cost 1000 USD right now for new CPU, but after few years, it will become the main-line products for casual users. Technologies are about the future, normal users don't OC. Nehalem beated all the current CPUs clock per clock, even though, it's not even matured yet.
You're denying Nehalem, denying the future, but let's see, after 2-3 years, what kind of CPU you are gonna use. Are you going to buy an E8400 and OC it? Lol.
Because the E8400, that's why E7200 is there.
Because the Nehalem, there will be products to at different prices range to fit people needs.
 

itaydrum

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I don't understand
Intel say that the next generation of CPU 'Nehalem'
will be production in 32nm
and now we still talk about 45nm
 
[citation][nom]Woofermazing[/nom]Their setup must be screwy, the QX6800 is much better than that. Look at the old cpu reviews, it gets a 9458 with lesser components.[/citation]

Vista vs XP. Thats the difference and why the QX6800 gets a lower score now. Vista takes a chunk out of most scores.
 

ZootyGray

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I would have preferred a theoretical and OBJECTIVE discussion. Comparing the latest, highly pre-acclaimed wondertoy(?) to older existing LOclox is misleading and inflammatory.

So it's makes a big noise and the flame wars take over - and we have a trash article.

It simply is a bad article - the basic news part is ok but bemching and comparing with no in-depth factual details is just like - hmm, o yeh, ok, uh-huh, and (really) just one big "So What". We did not learn anything real here folks.

And more and more, I look to Anandtech for absolutely brutal, intense, indepth, thorough testing. But these forums are more fun - and that's where I am at. And, yes, I am an AMD fanboy and won't buy ntel anyway. But I have personal reasons for that. I insist on clear communication and thorough testing - and if it's just a trailer, then emphasize that rather than move into comparisons that beat down dual cores and whoever whatever with no unbiased platform. Fanboys are not just dummies - they have personal bias, and it's personal human interests at work. This article just violates everybody.
 
[citation][nom]ZootyGray[/nom]quote: onearmedscissorb 07/10/2008 2:22 AM"This site absolutely baffles me lately. Not that I'm ungrateful that they do tests and take the time to write about it, but on a very consistent basis, there have been glaringly obvious things wrong with the articles that totally defeat the purpose of bothering."Agree - and this is a crock of caca.Also funny - Anandtech site did a review on 9950 Black Edition(!!!!) 2 weeks ago - this is the first mention of it here on thg - BIASED MUCH??And yes they could have oclokd to make a comparison.Funny = no review - and suddenly 9950BE appears HERE in a comparison w a non-releaseD propaganda schmozzell. - BIASED MUCH??thg is really starting to suk bad - the forums are more informative than the whole site.This is really a waste of time and an insult. (spit)Also the 9800 PHENOM is going to be phased out in favour of the 9950 BLACK EDITIONNehalem is obviously crawp at that clock and for what lame price $1500??BANG FOR THE BUCK = AMD OWNS ntel = hahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!![/citation]

Ok I will say this. THG did not do a review on the C2 Q9450, 9550 or 9300. THG has been lacking in many ways when it comes to hardware reviews. Reason why they used the 9950BE in this review (was a 9850BE OCed to 2.6GHz) was because its the best CPU you can get from AMD.

Oh and best bang for your buck right now quad core is the Q6600 @ $199. Not always is AMD best bang for buck, its a mix. Stop being a fanboy.

[citation][nom]itaydrum[/nom]I don't understandIntel say that the next generation of CPU 'Nehalem' will be production in 32nmand now we still talk about 45nm[/citation]

Nehalem will debut at 45nm (tock) and Westmere will debut at 32nm (tick) as it is a Nehalem shrink to 32nm

[citation][nom]randomizer[/nom]The core voltage read by CPU-Z is wrong, the CPU needs at least 1V to operate.[/citation]

This is not always true. Some CPUs now can run on less than 1v, of course at much lower frequencies.

[citation][nom]wingless[/nom]Looks like you'll want to build an AMD Deneb system. Nehalems will be DDR3 only...[/citation]

Yea..... get a AM2 or AM2+ just for the memory. Then get a chip and hope the mobo maker decides that your mobo will support it and then when it does have it be limited in performance due to not having full support.

To the guy asking about the memory support, by the time it comes out, DDR3 should be cheaper and plus it will have better latencies and bandwidth.

[citation][nom]robspierre6[/nom]So,hes comparing a phenom quad core 2.5GHz to a nehalem 2.93GHz.The nehalem is clocked 17% higher than the phenom 9850 and the gap is roughly 25%.I think that the DENEB will definitely outperform the nehalem.Is this the best you can do INTEL!![/citation]

You really think that a die shrink to 45nm will do that? Wow. Seriously. Unless they are reworking the entire chip it will not give it that much of a performance increase.

Nehalem is different. It is a brand new chip.

Man its funny how people take this as the true performance. Seriously guys.
 

justjc

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response@craziness

Your point of bringing the K10 vs. K8 into the debate would be worth a lot more, if it did in fact not just confirm my statement that AMD didn't get away with a lower improvement.

There were no Quad FX scores in Toms Hardwares CPU chart, so I'll have to compare 2 cores to 4, like it's done in the beginning of the article.
A comparison of the improvement from the Athlon 64 X2 4600+ to the Phenom x4 9700(both@2.4Ghz), in PCMark05 - CPU results(found in Toms CPU charts) with this articles results of the Core 2 Extreme X6800 vs. Nehalem must be considered favoring Intel.(as it's tested in a faster system and have a 500Mhz clock advantage)
Still looking at the score improvement the AMD comparison(from 4940 to 7092) you will find it just lacks 14 points, in PCMark05, to match the improvement made by Intel in the above(AMD 2152 vs. Intel 2166) I haven't bothered to make percentages, but I think we can agree it's more than 29% improvement.
This is the same Phenom you pull out as a dissapointment...

I belive the above comparison confirms my belief that
I doubt AMD would be seen as making a huge step forward if they don't get more improvement, than 11%, when they present their next generation Phenom processors.

About not making a dual core K10 the question is if it's worth the ressources to make the new design. After all AMD is really good at making cheap AMD x2(K8) processors, that bring a performance that will suit most users needs, without requiering the costly design change.
If a Athlon 64 X2 6400+ isn't enough you most likely won't be looking at a x2 processor, considering how little more a better performing Phenom x4 costs.
The only reason AMD should have to make a K10 x2 processor is to take the performance crown, for dual core processors, and then the money would be wasted unless the resulting product runs faster than 3.5Ghz. However with the future belonging to multicore CPUs one could even say the money would wasted even if they succede.
 
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I would have been far more interested in some rough benches of what CSI is bringing to the party. People are still choosing AMD over Intel where they need high bandwidth, the FSB is the weakness that Nehalem is designed to overcome, yet we don't get any sort of rough image of what that might look like.
 

vider

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SiliconDoc:

You are so right! All this is a big pile of ____ (fill the blank on your own)! 3D Mark was never a true benchmark for me. I encode my DVD's
to My PSP / iPOD and the scores of 3dMark don't help me much :/.

I think that the best would of been using real world bench's, like let's say... encoding a 1080p BR to a 720p x264 DVD5 size file or 3DSmax/Maya bench's would of helped much more. Ohh and comparing the
Nehalem to an AMD FX-74 wasn't a good idea but comparing it to the Phenome CPU was a good idea (even tho some argue that it should of been done Clock to Clock, I arguee diffrent and say that both models are at their stock clocks, which makes more sense).
 

silversound

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Totally disappointed, only up to 20% performance boost?
My core 2 is better, hope AMD can pick it up and act like ATI in VGA department
 

omario

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and now for the kicker, sheeple :
Bend Over and Enjoy your new intel Big Brother processors designed in Israel by Mossad agents with back door to your system up the ying yang
HA ! and another HA !
 
[citation][nom]Woofermazing[/nom]They used Vista last timehttp://www.tomshardware.com/review [...] 18-14.htmlAnd here's the benchmarkhttp://www.tomshardware.com/review [...] 18-27.htmlAnandtech did the same thing, touting this huge performance gap created by Nehalem. Several of the benchmarks they did of other processors had gone way down from previous reviews.[/citation]

Just a response to you since you are obviously blind:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/extreme-fsb-2,1663-6.html
This is the first test done on Windows XP Pro SP2, just like how Anand did. The change to Vista was later.

Now here is a link to the scores
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/extreme-fsb-2,1663-9.html

You see how close they are to the same score? You do know that THG and other sites re use the same old scores unless they are doing something else like OCing right?

Seriously.
 
[citation][nom]omario[/nom]and now for the kicker, sheeple :Bend Over and Enjoy your new intel Big Brother processors designed in Israel by Mossad agents with back door to your system up the ying yangHA ! and another HA ![/citation]

And AMDs chips are diffused in Germany....so they also would have a back door. Difference is that Intel has their chips designed there but made here (Prescott AZ, Oregon and Colorado) and then assymbled in Malaysia.
 
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They cannot implemment Hyper threading on C2D's because the core pipeline is too short to accomodate two threads at the same time.

That 21-24x multiplier reminds me of my old P4 btw...
 

omario

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>And AMDs chips are diffused in Germany....so they also would have a back door. Difference is that Intel has their chips designed there but made here (Prescott AZ, Oregon and Colorado) and then assymbled in Malaysia.<

Last time I checked Germany and Malaysia weren't a part of a diabolical cabbal to take over the world thru Zionistic Racist Apartheid.
You can bet your modern (useless) dollar that Mossad thru it's brainchild Haifa's Technion nest has put every conceivable provision
to get into and compromise any intel chip they "helped" design at the blink of an eye or before. If they didn't they'd be morons -something they're NOT .All the useless attempts by disinfo agents or the timid to laugh it off mean nothing. The facts remain.
Now they've just made it sooooo much easier for themselves to get into your Intel chip...
it's completely irrelevant what cheap labor they use to stamp it into the retail tray

no theory just the FACTS
 

vider

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One more thing... Why would someone compare the Nehelem to a QX6800, when we have the INTEL QX9650 and QX9770 available for a couple of months now? o_O

Even if they would have tested it against the QX9650 (or QX9770) and Nehelem would lose to it, I would totally understand it. After all this is not a finished product.

THG needs to straight up! What happened to the good old days, when THG had good informative articles with good bench's? :(
 
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