New Harddrives May Force Windows XP Upgrades

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[citation][nom]Cryogenic[/nom]Last I checked Windows XP can read and write 4k block just fine (actually 4K block size is the default for NTFS for drives above 2GB) http://support.microsoft.com/kb/314878[/citation]

4k cluster size is on the software side of things. The 4k blocks they're talking about are the "physical block" on disk. Currently a lot of desktop hard drives still default to 512K on disk even if you have a 4k cluster size on Windows. The recent WD drive is one exception as it could read and write 4k blocks.
 
So there are three choices:
1. XP with low HDD speeds because it's out-of-date and only supports 512
2. 7 which supports both 512 and 4k
3. Linux which supports both 512 and 4k and pobably will support any future sizes

Also, Linux will probably run just fine with a lot of eye candy on your existing computer.

I'm starting to think Microsoft might be pulling some dirty tricks to get XP off the market for good...
 
[citation][nom]cscott_it[/nom]Well, when they can't play games on XP is when you'll see a nice chunk go to 7.I recall seeing the same trend when so many jumped the 98 ship.[/citation]

this is the exact reason why i switched from 98se to XP. i had to keep resetting my pc after playing Neverwinter Nights for like 10 or 15 minutes...

maybe after lots of games are exclusively using DX11, then lots of gamers will abandon XP. but then again, most of them are already using 7.
 
Using the jumper hack is a bad solution. Instead you run western digital's align utility to realign your drive.

FYI I already had compatibility issues with my favorite diagnostic/formatting utilities with 4k drives ... looks like I will have to wait for an upgrade or switch disk utilities soon.
 
This is call racist or ANTI-TRUST!!!!!!!! WRONG!!! WRONG!!! What the retard what companies are insulting and threat to Windows XP fans! Companies are PURE EVIL!!!!!!!!

Microsoft and Hard drive manufacturers will face 1+ Billions of dollars for damaged when drop support on Windows XP!


Dear Windows XP fans, Please SUE Microsoft and hard drive companies now!!!!!!!!

I will going set up in court on Spring 2012 then fill massive complaint there then Companies will have pay billions of dollars fines for damaged call know as ANTI-TRUST!!!

NEVER, NEVER, NEVER drop support on Windows XP PERIOD! I will use Windows XP for over 50 to 80 years!

Vista and 7 are SUCKS!!!
 
[citation][nom]cggkevin[/nom]This story is just BS. I can't believe Tom's even posted it.[/citation]

I agree with you!!!! Microsoft removed 16 bit of program/games support from Windows 7 is stupid!!!
 
The article is IRRELEVANT. These new drives use 4K physical sectors but still map data to them with LBA addressing (which uses 512 bytes virtual blocks). The only problem XP has on these, is that XP's fdisk version isn't block-aware: virtual and physical blocks would be misaligned (incurring extraneous operations) with them. For example, XP's fdisk creates the first partition at block 63. If it defaulted to block 64, there would be no problem: performance, data density etc. would be the same as ever before.

Provided you don't do fancy stuff such as formatting your drives with blocks smaller than 4K (which is the default setting for NTFS ever since Windows 2000, smaller values are not recommended), once your partitions are set, you will be good to go.

One solution: use a partitioning utility to create your partitions, install XP as usual. There are many available for free, including Linux based ones (Linux can create, read, write, move, resize, migrate, repair, clone etc. NTFS partitions up to and including Win7's alternate data streams, on any physical sector size). If migrating from an old to a new drive, the process is pretty much instantaneous.

Another solution: use partition utilities that can shift partitions so that they align correctly - these drive makers provide such utilities, for free too. It may be slower if you're applying the utility to partitions re-cloned to a new drive by a sector-unaware utility (old version of Ghost, say).

Or, solution 3, fork over $100 (at least) to get a bloated, incompatible 'upgrade' OS installed, which precludes migrating older partitions - since the upgrade won't fix the partitions, only new partition creation.
 
zelanni - you're completely wrong on Windows 7 requirements
2GB is plenty, even for 64-bit versions of 7.
I have a lower-clocked dualcore laptop with only 2GB (and, integrated video, no less) and Windows 7 64-bit runs great. I am frequently running either multiple virtual machines, or large graphics apps.

And, >3GB is the point where you need 64-bit, not >4GB, as address space is used for your hardware. Furthermore, 64-bit apps have more registers available, and FPU operations are slightly less retarted. These give performance benefits, too.

The usage scenario you give (security apps, couple browser windows, spreadsheets/word docs, streaming music while printing) is lightweight and 1GB is enough for even that.

To the above poster that mentioned a need to run 16-bit apps - They still (sort of) run in Vista/7, but only the 32-bit versions. 64-bit versions ditched WoW, as they use as similar method to runnint 32-bit apps. I'm not sure about DOS apps, but DOSbox is way better. It's possible to run win3.1 in that, too. XP mode is supported not only in Ultimate versions, but the Professional version, also.

And, for the rest of the artice -
32-bit versions of XP won't be able to access more than 2TB on a drive. Period. This is due to MBR disks using a 32-bit number for partition sizes. 32bits * 512 byte sectors = 2TB max.
For anything larger, GPT is needed. 32-bit XP cannot read GPT disks. 64-bit XP can access them, but cannot boot from them. Only XP for Itanium can boot from GPT. With Vista/7, you can boot from GPT if your bios supports it.

Also, once drives stop emulating 512byte sectors, and are natively 4K, XP will be broken.
 
I use XP. the list of software that I use that is incompatible with vista and 7 is enormous. and don't tell me about the xp mode crap. pure marketing, doesn't work whatsoever.
If I'll change on day it will be to Linux.
Click to expand...

Have you even tried using XP Mode with Windows Virtual PC once? It is not a marketing gimmerick, XP Mode really works. Be open minded and try it before making a negative comment on it. It's a full license version of Windows XP Professional with SP3 in a virtual environment. It's almost 100% identical to running Windows XP on a clean harddrive. The only difference is that it runs a little slower because it's running in a virtual environment and Windows Virtual PC uses generic drivers. I use it on a daily basis with a 16-bit software that didn't install or work under Windows 7. I don't know what software you are using that doesn't work under Windows 7, but the majority of software I use work perfectly in Windows 7. It sounds like you are using software dated back in the year 1995 when Windows 95 came out and even those outdated software would work perfectly under XP Mode.
 
I was a windows 7 beta tester so stfu before you assume that I don't known what I'm talking about. Yes I've tried hundreds of times using XP mode and that's why I'm making a negative comment on it. It's NOT a full license version of xp sp3. that's a complete bullshit. it's not even close to be 100% identical. generic drivers don't work with tons of hardware in my company. not to mention the applications that don't work whatsoever. and even if it worked properly it would have a crippled performance. and no I'm not using 1995 software I'm using software released and developed in 2007 that completely do the job without anykind of problem. windows 7 doesn't bring any benefits. I can give you tons of examples. we have 500notebooks with wifi and bluetooth modules that don't work in windows 7 or with the stupid generic drivers. we have industrial printers, laser etching and cnc machines, active scanners, ip cameras and tons of software that simply don't work in windows 7 or with the pseudo xp mode. it's not just the hardware, the software simply doesn't run. it has even more issues then other virtualization program. and yes we have deeply tested many solutions.
It sounds like you are another m$ fanboy.
Click to expand...

Read the "Ban" rules before you respond like this again. You don't need to flame me because you used a "Beta" version and it didn't work out for you. All I wanted to say that there could have been something wrong with your setup and you can try to use XP Mode. Also, since you said XP Mode is pure marketing. I assumed that you didn't try XP Mode. Windows 7 "Final" version is a whole lot different than the "Beta" version. You can ask anyone in this forum. Lots of compatibility conflicts are solved in the "Final" version and XP Mode is a pre-installed, full license copy (I am using it at this moment & you need to do more research). You don't need to flame people on this forum, just respond back in a professional way. Also, you don't sound like a mature person who works for a company with all those hardware at your disposal with the way you responded back to me (all those grammatical errors). All you had to say was, "My company has outdated hardware and the 2007 software we use doesn't work on XP Mode." Simple as that. I have nothing more to say to you.
 
Frankly I do not understand what the heat is about. I initially installed win 7 ultimate 32 bit and all my software (primarily non-gaming) worked 100% with no bugs or crashes. That remained at 100% even in win 7 ultimate 64 bit. No issues at all. Even with supposed incompatible/slower programs like firefox and itunes. That is not material and what I get with 64 bit is 5 gb of ram and 1 gb of gpu.
 
What an utter BS! You can mount and use 4K ioblock drives in XP 32 even now. Fact is that you can mount an up to 16TB block device and the only way to do the 2-16TB range is 4K ioblock. You just cannot convert them to dynamic disks. The problems comes with booting from them but you could always dig up a "standart" 500Gb drive to do that :)
 
I strongly recommend Windows 7 and also Windows XP installed separately. It is great if you do not have a high performance machine. You will have your old programs running like clockwork, no need for compatibility concerns, and you familiarize yourself with 7, which runs great! Just remember install XP first and 7 after.
 
No one has mentioned this yet. Hard drives have a format to them before the end user gets them. It has head alignment information/markers between the sectors which are currently 512 bytes. This is what is changing. The less space used by these alignment markers means more space for actual data. Yes windows has been able to read and write 4kb blocks for a long time but internally to the drive it was really reading 8 512 byte sectors. How this affects the OS is beyond me. It should be transparent to the OS as the circuitry in the HDD should be handling this.
It must be that Windows uses the drive geometry information to determine where certain information is on the drive and that is where Windows has a problem with the new design. (just speculating)
 
Why not just reformat the drive yourself with a different format? The article doesn't mention what the formats are called. I assume they are talking about FAT32 and NTFS. Microsoft already put a 128gb limit on FAT32 partitions with XP, now they reduced the FAT32 partition size to 32gb in Windows 7. That isn't hardware limit, it's an artificial limit that Microsoft imposed. You can still create a FAT32 partition larger than 32gb using a Mac or even a Windows 98 boot disk, for example. Maybe the article is talking about exFAT? That is still supported by XP if you have KB9557704 installed.

http://www.ntfs.com/ntfs_vs_fat.htm

Nope, this just sounds like a desperate act of Microsoft spreading anti-XP propaganda to scare naive users. I use Linux, so I always reformat my drives with ext3 or ext4 anyway. I say this article a bunch of Microsoft BS.
 
The issue remains one of compatibility.

But it is interesting to see just how many are still stuck on the OS issue, as they miss the the larger functionality issues!

There is still no compelling reason to leave XP if one has multiple $3-5000 applications that must be repurchased simply to get Win7 compatibility!

The OS issue is moot, I really don't care which version of kludgy Windows is used as long as the applications function properly!

The applications are the thing! NOT the OS!

 
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