News Nintendo Switch 2's SoC die shot reveals 8x A78C cores, 1,536 Ampere shaders, and Samsung's 8N process

[Admin]

Geekerwan managed to procure a non-functional Nintendo Switch 2 board, and utilized a FIB-SEM to dissect and analyze its internal details.

Nintendo Switch 2's SoC die shot reveals 8x A78C cores, 1,536 Ampere shaders, and Samsung's 8N process : Read more

 

[TheyStoppedit]

It's a T239. This has been known for like.... 2 years now. Switch 2 is essentially a nerfed 2050 mobile lol. People are shocked that all these big games like Star Wars Outlaws, and Cyberpunk are running on such terrible hardware. Its not that hard. All they do is just strip out all the eye candy, pretty visuals, nice effects, nice features, etc ... render it at 480p + DLSS up to 1080p. It looks like hot garbage but at least its....playable..... And I use that word "playable" very loosely.

These AAA games on Switch 2 are essentially demasters. If you put in the time and effort, you can get Indiana Jones & The Great Circle to run on an N64. All ya gotta do.... is drop the texture resolutions.... lower..... and lower..... and lower.... and reduce the color pallet..... lower.... and lower..... and lower.... And... reduce the round edges to be more and more jagged, like we all remember in the N64. Then reduce the codebase, shrink it lower.... and lower..... and lower..... and eventually you can get it small enough to fit on a cartridge, and play Indiana Jones on an N64.

How do you think a remaster is done? How do you think they got Turok 3 (N64 game) remastered? It's just the same thing but in the opposite direction. If they demastered the Turok 3 remaster to put it on N64, it would look like the Turok 3 N64 release we had in the 90s. That's all Switch ports are, they're just demasters. You can take the most demanding game in the world and get it to run on an original NES from 1985..... All ya gotta do is just demaster the visuals and the codebase lower..... And lower.... and lower, until it fits on an NES cartridge and can run on an NES. It won't look anything like we have today but at least it's "playable".

Go look at Hogwartz Legacy for Switch. Its halfway between a PS2 and a PS3 lol. How did they do it? Just reduce the visuals/codebase lower..... and lower..... and lower.... Until it can run. Sure it looks like hot garbage, but hey, some people don't care to play at 480p with the visuals stripped down to the bare metal. To each their own.

Truth is though: you don't buy a switch 2 for third party games lol. That's just dumb. The only reason for a Switch 2 is for Mario, Zelda, and other Nintendo IP. Everything else, get a gaming PC. Seriously

 

[usertests]

It's a T239. This has been known for like.... 2 years now. Switch 2 is essentially a nerfed 2050 mobile lol. People are shocked that all these big games like Star Wars Outlaws, and Cyberpunk are running on such terrible hardware. Its not that hard. All they do is just strip out all the eye candy, pretty visuals, nice effects, nice features, etc ... render it at 480p + DLSS up to 1080p. It looks like hot garbage but at least its....playable..... And I use that word "playable" very loosely.

It's a better situation than the weak first Switch. Except for paying full price or more for a bunch of old games, that part sucks.

One thing to confirm: if it can actually use all 8 CPU cores. The original Switch technically had 8 cores, 4x Cortex-A57 + 4x Cortex-A53, but the A53 cluster was disabled.

 

[warezme]

The Nintendo consoles are not necessarily for performance but for mobile entertainment you can stuff in a backpack or big pockets. Most Nintendo games are not graphically demanding or complex games in either textures or 3D models and were always about fun affordability. That went away with the Switch 2. $450 to $500 for the console and $80 dollars for NON AAA games using the same old models and texture from previous games just juiced a bit is freaking ridiculous. They can keep it. Nintendo has gone full on Sony/Apple and has lost sight of their fan base.

 

[bit_user]

Geekerwan emulated the performance of the Switch 2 using an underclocked RTX 2050 laptop GPU. While not a one-to-one recreation, in synthetics, the laptop (using leaked docked specifications) showed similar performance to a GTX 1050 Ti

I think that's an underestimate. I think probably more like a GTX 1650. I guess they just based that on similar DRAM bandwidth, but they're not accounting for the fact that GPUs get a big boost from however much on-die cache they can fit.

If memory bandwidth were so determinitive, then iGPUs wouldn't perform nearly as well as the faster ones do.

 

[Notton]

How does the T239 compare to say... a Snapdragon 8 Gen 3?

 

[HideOut]

So a 10+ year old GPU with CPU cores that are nearly as old and its going to cost $300? Who is this, nVidia?

 

[atomicWAR]

I think that's an underestimate. I think probably more like a GTX 1650. I guess they just based that on similar DRAM bandwidth, but they're not accounting for the fact that GPUs get a big boost from however much on-die cache they can fit.

If memory bandwidth were so determinitive, then iGPUs wouldn't perform nearly as well as the faster ones do.

Agreed. plus when you take into consideration to the fact this will be a closed box and devs will know exactly what they have to work with hardware wise, unlike a PC or tablet where they get near infinite combinations of gear...they'll be able to squeeze the most out of this kit. I for one am eager to get a Switch 2. It should make for a great thin and light hand held experience.

 

[magbarn]

Samsung 8N? The big N must've gotten a sweet discount to use an outdated process from half a decade ago. N4P would've given 2x the performance.

 

[bit_user]

So a 10+ year old GPU with CPU cores that are nearly as old and its going to cost $300? Who is this, nVidia?

Ampere launched in 2020. So, only 5 years old. The Cortex-A78 was announced in 2020, but flagship phones didn't actually have them until early 2021. So, those are only about 4 years old.

Yes, it's old stuff (same as the first Switch, I might add) and yet they're charging a lot for it. But, it kind of undermines your point, when you exaggerate like that.

 

[bit_user]

Samsung 8N? The big N must've gotten a sweet discount to use an outdated process from half a decade ago. N4P would've given 2x the performance.

It would've also cost more engineering time to port to TSMC, since Orin was already designed and shipping on that node. (source: https://www.techpowerup.com/gpu-specs/jetson-agx-orin-64-gb.c4085 ).

 

[Notton]

In the worst kept Nintendo secret, T239 was only 6 years old back in 2021 when it was taped out.
Nintendo was stockpiling the chip for at least 2 years before launching it this year.

Does no one remember the disappointment when Switch OLED launched in 2021, when everyone thought it was the Switch 2?

 

[Giroro]

"... but was likely postponed due to unknown reasons"
I'm pretty sure we know why Nintendo wouldn't launch a new console when everybody was still COVID panic-buying their old console.

But now Nintendo fixes their prices assuming everybody will panic-buy their new console with the same blind, apocalyptic fury as peak COVID?

Sure they will buddy. They'll buy it like Wii owners bought a Wii U.

 

[DS426]

The Nintendo consoles are not necessarily for performance but for mobile entertainment you can stuff in a backpack or big pockets. Most Nintendo games are not graphically demanding or complex games in either textures or 3D models and were always about fun affordability. That went away with the Switch 2. $450 to $500 for the console and $80 dollars for NON AAA games using the same old models and texture from previous games just juiced a bit is freaking ridiculous. They can keep it. Nintendo has gone full on Sony/Apple and has lost sight of their fan base.

Nintendo has gone full nVidia, and this is what you get at the "budget" performance level when that badge is used. I agree and it should be pretty well understood at this point that Nintendo isn't about being a graphical quality and performance leader, but at least provide some value. Most previous consoles were very affordably priced and decent for what they gave you, but not anymore. I'd rather spend a bit more and get a full-fledged handheld PC.

Too easy for them to blame it on U.S. import tariffs, but how much do the native models cost in Japan??

Samsung 8N... LOL! Hard to not bash them but Nintendo is one to spend more time on platform validation, QA/QC, optimizations, and so on to deliver the most polished product possible. Still, IMO, they need to get their products to market quicker as they are almost half-way obsolete by the time they reach sales channels. Console products last for almost a decade in terms of manufacturing runs and lifecycles, so front-loading more modern tech up front just seems like a more competitive business strategy IMO. But alas, I haven't had a console since the N64, and Nintendo does things differently (especially today relative to the Xbox and Play Station).

 

[bit_user]

Nintendo has gone full nVidia, and this is what you get at the "budget" performance level when that badge is used.

A discussion in another thread just reminded me that Nvidia planned a SoC after Orin, which they subsequently cancelled, called Atlan. Had that come to fruition, it's quite conceivable that Switch 2 could instead be based on it.

But, Nintendo is cheap and seems to like using pretty much off-the-shelf parts, these days. So, instead of following the path of Sony & Nintendo and ordering up a custom SoC, I guess they just went with what Nvidia had lying around and just had to make do with Orin.

Console products last for almost a decade in terms of manufacturing runs and lifecycles, so front-loading more modern tech up front just seems like a more competitive business strategy IMO.

This.

When the current XBox and PS5 launched, they both used AMD's latest, not-quite-released GPU tech (an early version of RDNA2) and very recent CPU cores (Zen 2, but Zen 3 had only launched at about the same time as those consoles).

Orin uses 4-5 year old tech and Switch is just now launching with it. That's even further behind than the original Switch was, and it was at least cheap! I think Nintendo is going to regret this move.

But alas, I haven't had a console since the N64, and Nintendo does things differently (especially today relative to the Xbox and Play Station).

I went PS1 -> PS3 -> PS5. The PS3 was supported for an amazingly long time! I was still using it for streaming Amazon Prime videos, until about this time last year, and they were still supporting it, last I checked!

 

[Amdlova]

Samsung 8nm Now i Know why it's so cheap... and some folks it's trying to say will have thr power of a ps4. ONLY in flames mode lol.

 

[JohnyFin]

The worst hardware released in decades. Not mention aggressive business politics of Nintendo according prices