Obama Calls on Congress to Fund Research on Effects of Violent Videogames

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lamorpa

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[citation][nom]10tacle[/nom]Nothing like watching the gunaphobic liberals here become obsessive and spend an entire waking day posting their gunaphobic drivel. It is NO SECRET that the president and the Democrat party (liberals specifically) DESPISE the Second Amendment. If they had their way, they'd be rid of it. In fact, much of the Constitution is in their way anyway (and especially in Obama's way...like Congress). There are always baby steps taken by these people to an ultimate goal. They will not tell you up front what their mission is. But it's not difficult to connect the dots. By the way: I have yet to hear from one anti-gun liberal gunphobe as to why the Obama government is buying up millions of rounds of ammunition.[/citation]
I assume you know paranoid conspiracy theorists are no taken seriously.
 
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They should fund a research on effects of their soldiers raping and killing people overseas too.
 

matt_b

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@lamorpa
I'll leave you alone in your isolated thought process by saying that when you have the epiphany that things happen because a person chooses to carry out such actions, and that it is solely the fault of that individual and no inanimate object because the choice to be made lies within themselves before they commit whatever atrocities they are about to do, then you'll understand. You still never answered the question on if someone stabs another to death, is it the attacker or the knife's fault? I understand why you cannot answer though, it would defeat what you're trying to preach about and the correct answer would contradict the same argument about any other tool that could be used for possible fatal action.
 

lamorpa

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[citation][nom]matt_b[/nom]@lamorpaI'll leave you alone in your isolated thought process by saying that when you have the epiphany that things happen because a person chooses to carry out such actions, and that it is solely the fault of that individual and no inanimate object because the choice to be made lies within themselves before they commit whatever atrocities they are about to do, then you'll understand. You still never answered the question on if someone stabs another to death, is it the attacker or the knife's fault? I understand why you cannot answer though, it would defeat what you're trying to preach about and the correct answer would contradict the same argument about any other tool that could be used for possible fatal action.[/citation]
The issue was, is, and still is, the lethality of the weapon. If you keep wondering if inanimate objects can somehow act on their own, you will be unable to see this simple fact. Mass murderers choose firearms over knives, clubs, etc., because they are much more lethal and have a much greater 'acting' range (at a distance). If you continue to believe that guns do not shoot bullets a greater distance than you can throw a knife or club, and do not impart an injury of a much greater magnitude, then you will again be stuck believing nonsense. You, of course, did not answer the question about choosing a knife over a gun in a fight against someone with a gun, because you do not want to answer (because you do not have an answer that would not make my point). Why do you think mass murders choose a firearm both for their attack and for their defense when someone tries to stop them? Do you deny this greater firepower and it's action at a distance does not embolden them? Blinding yourself to these things does maintain your point (but leaves you blind to the reality of the situation). What you are constructing for yourself is a dodge, a ruse you are playing on yourself to justify unlimited ownership of weapons of mass murder. You have not introduced a single idea other than to state, incorrectly, that lethality of a weapon is irrelevant. In that you are wrong. My 'isolation' is only from those who join you in this self-delusion for their own selfish purposes. At this point discussion is silly.
 

davewolfgang

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No it's not.

It's about the government wanting to take away guns from people who have broken ZERO laws - because something bad "might" happen.

It's about the FACT that you don't understand what "shall not be infringed" means.

The 2nd Amendment was put there so WE THE PEOPLE could PROTECT ourselves from an overbearing and tyrannical GOVERNMENT - not for Hunting, not for Target Shooting.

This "lethality" thing you keep bringing up is a STRAW MAN argument. It's that incremental-ism that you Libs keep doing to get to your final goal (that you will NEVER admit too, because it would get shot down and you'd lose) - so that The People have no way to defend themselves from Government - because THEN Government can do WHATEVER it wants.
 

unoriginal1

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@lampora

I agree that a gun is more lethal then a knife, bat, club. To answer your question I would choose a gun over a knife in that fight, however; removing/banning any type of gun or weapon is not the right answer (imo). There are simple to many available. As we've learned with drugs and basically anything else illegal (look at the prohibition on alcohol) Where there's money to be made. Someone will be supplying and selling. The psychos will only go from obtaining them legally, to obtaining them illegally. IMO and it's only an opinion. We need to focus on making sure Law Abiding Citizens are the only ones able to purchase these weapons legally. More extensive background checks, Psychiatrists actually informing police when their patient makes comments of wanting to kill people. Etc.

Look at the rapper T.I. for example. He had an arsenal of Fully automatic weapons, Silencers, etc. He had actual military grade weaponry (which your typical AR-15 is not) that's stuff that's already illegal without going through ridiculous hoops to obtain the proper licenses. If he can find them and purchase them. Most anyone can.
 

lamorpa

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[citation][nom]unoriginal1[/nom...There are simple to many available. As we've learned with drugs and basically anything else illegal (look at the prohibition on alcohol) Where there's money to be made. Someone will be supplying and selling...[/citation]
A valid point to be explored, and not a lesson our society want to learn the hard way (again). It just seems to me that some of the shooters are disorganized nuts who got their firearms from, for example, a parent who did not properly take case of them, or bought them on another person's behalf. Unfortunately, there is a fraction of gun owners who put ownership well before safe ownership. I'm for restrictions that could weed them out. Require certified training for anything more than a revolver or single shot rifle (maybe that's not practical?), require 'proof' of safe storage (again, probably not practical). Something. Anything.

Why in the world doesn't the NRA lead with this idea? There is a large segment of people who are generally afraid of guns. When they try to impose some pointless restrictions, why does the NRA maintain a strict stance of 'no restrictions of any kind'? Why not move the conversation to responsible ownership and penalties for failure to do it? It's just all Charleton Heston shaking a musket in the air about Columbine, as if acting like wingnut is the best way to deal with wingnuts.

As an old range instructor said to our class one time, "As a beginner, what should you be focusing on when target shooting? Answer: Gun safety. Once you start getting the hang of things and you want to start getting some better aim and consistency, what should you be focusing on? Answer: Gun safety! ..." It went on like this through many skill levels.
 

unoriginal1

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Now this ^ I agree with.

Unfortunately you are 100% correct. The majority of these horrific acts stem from to easy of access to weapons. Your instructor was correct. Every gun i own is locked in a gun safe and the ammo is stored separately.

As far as the NRA. Even thou I love my guns, Ive never been a member and a lot of them are very bias and naive in their opinions. It reminds me of a professor my brother has at school this semester. They are kind of on the opposite end of the spectrum. She is a brilliant person, a big city type. In class she was discussing the good and bad of a city "civilization" She then made the comment that here (where i live) is very agriculturally based and how she didn't think it was important and needed to be developed like New York was. Well my brother spoke up and asked. Do you want to eat in 2024? She said... Yes I will be eating. He replied well without agriculture you won't be.

Kind of a stupid story but true nonetheless. I think the environment we are in and/or raised in makes a large difference on your views. Myself.. I grew up on a ranch where you drove 60 miles to the nearest grocery store. Guns was an everyday part of life. From shooting Coyotes, lions, bear to keep them from killing the calves and various other ranch animals, to rabbit, deer hunting. To just sport of shooting some cans. I think that's why a lot of NRA spokesmen sound so stupid in their suggestions is they forget that not everyone is from a rural area, not all of the same issues/rules apply. Were a very diverse country. I know for certain it was an eye opener when I moved to large city. The way people behaved and carried themselves was different. Much different.

Anywho... Long rant basically to say I agree we need something in place to beef up security of whom can get a gun and how they are obtained. Still don't want any sort of bans but prolly won't be anything your avg citizen can do about it now.
 

matt_b

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[citation][nom]lamorpa[/nom]The issue was, is, and still is, the lethality of the weapon. If you keep wondering if inanimate objects can somehow act on their own, you will be unable to see this simple fact. Mass murderers choose firearms over knives, clubs, etc., because they are much more lethal and have a much greater 'acting' range (at a distance). If you continue to believe that guns do not shoot bullets a greater distance than you can throw a knife or club, and do not impart an injury of a much greater magnitude, then you will again be stuck believing nonsense. You, of course, did not answer the question about choosing a knife over a gun in a fight against someone with a gun, because you do not want to answer (because you do not have an answer that would not make my point). Why do you think mass murders choose a firearm both for their attack and for their defense when someone tries to stop them? Do you deny this greater firepower and it's action at a distance does not embolden them? Blinding yourself to these things does maintain your point (but leaves you blind to the reality of the situation). What you are constructing for yourself is a dodge, a ruse you are playing on yourself to justify unlimited ownership of weapons of mass murder. You have not introduced a single idea other than to state, incorrectly, that lethality of a weapon is irrelevant. In that you are wrong. My 'isolation' is only from those who join you in this self-delusion for their own selfish purposes. At this point discussion is silly.[/citation]
To wrap this thing up: I would choose a gun over many other methods because it's the one I'm most proficient with as well as easily accessible. Take away all the guns, then you've got the knives. Take away all the knives, then you've got things like the old bow and arrow. Take that away, then you've got blunt objects. Take away that, you you've still got other things like gas, fire, explosives, poisons, and so on. You cannot ban everything and anything that "may" pose a threat to ourselves as human beings. My point to this: where there's a will, there's a way as the saying goes. If an insane individual has made up in their mind that they've had it with ________, then they will look around and see what's available to perform what they had in mind. That individual will look around and ALWAYS find something to be able to kill someone else with. As with what unoriginal1 said as well, when you ban something, the enormous underground or black market has proven to be VERY resilient. So where does that leave those that abide by the same laws created to ban these very items from those people that have no regard for human life or laws that will no doubt still find some way to access that supply line?

I'm telling you that lethality of a weapon is irrelevant because just about everything around you can be used as a weapon. Is a gun more dangerous than a knife? Absolutely, but the box cutter example for the 9/11 airplanes is a VERY valid point. Without those knives being considered the catalyst, would the planes have been hijacked and later crashed to kill those thousands? That's debatable due to the fact of what I'm saying about banning everything "lethal". No guns, no knives (not that criminals abide by laws anyway), so they would have probably just utilized something else further down the list to get the job done. Then would we try to ban that next as well? However, it's not the airplane's fault, and it's not the box cutter's fault, it's the fault of a group of masterminds that came together with a devious plan to inflict as much harm and death as possible. Oklahoma City and the 93' WTC incidents are other lessons where guns aren't the only way to get the job done.

If you would like to see how well all this gun banning would work for the US, just read how Australia and the UK are doing as far as the level of overall violence (robbery, rape, assault, B&E incidents, trespassing, etc.) is concerned after their bans. After the guns start disappearing, then down the road, we can all work more on things like this to protect us from ourselves: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knife_legislation
Did you know the UK are now working to ban kitchen knives over six inches and the point must have a large enough radius because now assault with large pointed knives have become such a problem after their magical gun ban? How ridiculous must it travel before people flip-out over being so overly legislated down upon and turned in to an absolute nanny state?

There are those within this world that you cannot take the evil out of, are deemed clinically insane, enjoy the suffering or harm inflicted on others, power hungry, and some that just simply want to watch everything in front of them burn. You want to find a real solution? Figure out what to do with these individuals and how best to remove them from the rest of society, then you've fixed a large portion of the world's problem!
 

lamorpa

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[citation][nom]matt_b[/nom]To wrap this thing up: I would choose a gun over many other methods because it's the one I'm most proficient with as well as easily accessible. Take away all the guns, then you've got the knives. Take away all the knives, then you've got things like the old bow and arrow. Take that away, then you've got blunt objects. Take away that, you you've still got other things like gas, fire, explosives, poisons, and so on...[/citation]
Let's not be silly here. You'd choose the gun because it is much more lethal, has a much larger useful range than a knife, etc. (and the list goes on). It is not just because you're "most proficient" with it. What, do you think people would accept that as an answer without snickering? Which situations (outside of Steven Seagal fantasies) would someone choose a knife over a gun? I was reading about the change in death rates with the rise of cheap handguns in Scientific American back in the 80's.

It boils down to this: Some people want unrestricted indulgence in their hobby; Some people want to try in any way possible to minimize the chance of having holes blown in their children's heads. Do I wonder which one of these is more important?
 

matt_b

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I guess I'll just have to accept that if we take guns off the street, then that will make people wanting to kill each other a thing of the past and not a problem any longer (they had these things back in the Cain and Abel era of man, right?). For now though, whenever I hear or read about a strangling, beating to death, a stabbing, or something like that, I'll just think of the influence your Steven Seagal left behind. Regardless, violence IS human nature, and it cannot be removed for our DNA.......
 

Reepca

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anonymous@guest, the shooter, it is believed, originally planned to go for the high school. Any guesses why? I agree that it is a poor decision on behalf of the mother to (assuming she knew completely exactly his state, which is a far assumption) allow him access to guns. However, having recently finished my second year of high school and hardly being able to bear it, I cannot say I have not had similar thoughts to what went through his mind. Homeschooling should help. I don't have any mental diseases, but the public school system can be bad enough to bring on this kind of violence without any outside influences. This is not to say that I despise all teachers - like all people, some are good, some are bad.
You also have to consider that every parent is in some way blinded out of love for their child. Would you blame them for that? Would you honestly expect a parent who loves their child to be fully willing to decide right off the bat that they are a danger and a threat to all around them? Of course not. The blame falls on a lot of places, but I feel that it is quite injust for you to place it that heavily on the mother.
Although I suppose I do agree with you, the violent-video-game industry isn't where the blame goes. Hooray. Consensus.
 
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