Open Letter To Omid: Have You Lost Your Frakkin' Mind?

[chiadog]

Long time reader/lurker here.

I remember the glory days of Toms and the infamous AMD going up in smokes video mentioned earlier. The site lately has been yet another tech review site. Where are the enthusiast focused articles? I don't need to be spoonfed the prepackage reviews that recite from the press release, there are plenty of other sites for that. Bring back the guides that we can really get our hands dirty with. I got my soldering iron and dremel ready :lol: Perhaps the recent changes are more consumer and seudo-geek friendly, but it really has lost the core of the site: the true enthusiasts. Sure the computer and tech review industry have changed, but the fact is that Toms staled along with rest of the supposed enthusiasts' sites. It is quite sad for the industry that most sites' forum is more informative than the actual site's content.

My 2 worthless cents

 

[YO_KID37]

Can you at least do The Forums a favour and let us be the first ones to know the list or at least the potential buyer of THG?

 

[LAN_deRf_HA]

Nice how Omid completely skips over the big issue, quality. While a lot of the news and articles we've seen lately have been getting far enough out of bounds to have no relation to computers... this is infinitely more bearable than the lack of, lets say, proof reading! I mean really if this place is worth millions of dollars I think it can do better than "in not to be"

 

[TimBog]

Well, I do have to say that having the CEO himself post is a brave thing. There were a few statement that you made that make me a little nervous. Maybe you should proof read before posting something that makes no more sence than the articles that I've read here on THG lately.

Some of what you said could be taken in a way that just said to us as readers, "supporters", of THG that if we don't like it "then so what". Let's olny hope that what you last said would happen to mean that you actually read what we've been saying. And that it might have just struck a chord of change for THG to return to its roots.

Thank you for taking the time to post but please go back and re-read what has been said here that my help you in your endevor to make $ as well as be part of something that makes you as proud as we have been in being part of THG.

You may want to proof read your spelling mistakes before asking someone else to do the same for their posts.

I think your glass house has another hole in it.


Now ya no why this here hillbilly don't do articles for a livin. It sure is nice to no that it at least did git red tho. thanks for noticin.

 

[TimBog]

Sinking in quality? By what metric? By your own opinions - but of course!

Give me an example of a bad article and I'll give you an example of a good one. As for Anandtech/Xbit labs improving, it sure doesn't show in their traffic. Go ahead and fire up Alexa.com and do a comparison... I can wait.

Here I'll make it easy on you. Tomshardware.com receives much more traffic than either of the sites you mentioned. In fact, just the news site TGDaily.com gets more traffic than xbitlabs.com. Now, I go to both of those sites and love the content.. but your assertions are incorrect.

You are upset that Tomshardware doesn't write to your narrow set of interests. This is fine because there are many other sites that you can browse to. That's the whole nature of the Internet. If we don't have the content, someone else will - and vice-versa.

Traffic is $. And I think you missed the point. The changes in THG are being made solely to exploit the reader base that has been here for years and has continued to visit the site in hopes of gaining knowledge at the level of what was previously found here.
The point we are making is two-fold.
1. Readers have always visited THG to gain a deeper understanding of the computer hardware, its limits and its problems/solutions.
2. In visiting the site for that info THG has become valueable in $.

Now take away the content that was once here and sure enough the reader base will drop. There will be some that become new readers based on info of new pink iPods and the like but over time that will not have a positive impact on the sites traffic.
Sure ads draw traffic and people visit the site but do they stay? Do they return? Do they add it to their favorites?
Click thrus just don't count in real world cash flow of an internet site. The ones that count are the ones that visit time and time again because of the content found within the site.
The "Sinking in quality" he was refering to was the quality of the articles themselves. If your knowledge of computer hardware was simply average or below then maybe, just maybe the articles suit you just fine. But THG has always been here diving deep within the hardware past the level of average. That has pushed us past our own limits alot of times and in doing so we were able to learn more and more about these new products. It even helped us to make decisions as in what to purchase for ourselves and for some, what to purchase for their buisnesses.
Now almost every article you read states what a wonderful product this or that co. has on the market. Without real in depth testing or any real time spent with the product.
I've recieved more defective new parts in the last 8 months than I had in the lat 8 years. most of these parts were given "execllent" marks in reviews from this site and others. When I took the time to go back and re-read the "reviews" I finally began to notice that these guys are not really spending any real time with the products. I'd go so far as to say that the stock boy in Wal-Mat electronics dept. could have done just about as good in testing these producta at that level.
I'm not here solely to bash THG, I want to help. When my parents used to tell me that it was usually right after a buttt kickin for doing someting really stupid.
If THG was to become a news site, then fine, so be it, let it make $ that way. We're only saying that it did not become worth X million $ because of that.

P.S. if ya want this spell checked and edited for grammer then please let me know when the check has been mailed and I'll get right on it. lol

 

[tamalero]

We did a lot of research before making the changes to the site which you seem uncomfortable with. But our statistics prove that the website is as popular as ever and is receiving an increased number of hits each month.

Funny.. Omid usually posts under Saintbabs nom de plum. You do realize that if you are indeed not Omid Rahmat and you are only impersonating him, you are subject to loss of posting privileges.

@Everyone complaining about the other:
Grow up. Plain and simple. Read the stickies, and have a thick skin.

backseat moderating again dasickninja????

its bad for your health you know!

I read the posts, and frankly, if the debate was debatable, I would get involved.

I cannot do anything about nonsensical arguments:

ok... shoot

-THG has sold out. In case you missed reality, we live in a capitalist society where we all do business, pay taxes, and have to do commerce like, shopping for groceries. If it is so bad to be in a capitalist society trying living in one that is not, and send me a report from the Gulag.

so you mean the decline in quality of the reviews and news because we live in a capitalist society? in case you mean THG had made less money because less enthusiasts read this site, i believe it is due to the fact that the quality of this site had declined. No one would stop reading the site if the quality is still topnotch; No one would stop reading the site even if there are tons of Google Ads. Enthusiasts only care about the content, and frankly speaking, THG's content had declined over the years, and especially in these months.

-THG is not what it used to be. Thank goodness. I see the ol' hardware sites. and they ain't what they used to be, but in case you missed reality again, neither is the hardware world.

ok? So you're saying that THG is sinking in quality, because the hardware world has improved quality? While other sites such as Anandtech and Xbit labs improved, THG sinked.

THG reported on ethanol trucks when everyone else reported on Intel's new Penryn. THG reported on "MacBook Pro" when everyone else reported on Barcelona's architecture. THG reported on Craiglist when everyone else reported on nVidia's G80. THG reported on vehicle stability control when everyone else reported on ATi's RD790

THG has changed... so have other hardware sites.

-THG is not as good as <fill in the blank>. We are the punching bag because, we ain't pretending to be anything that we are not. There are no enthusiast sites, or operations left out there. There are no champions of the little man, or trusted companions. We are, at least, aware that we need to have professionalism and integrity, and if you say otherwise, you have no idea what you are talking about. Since Google AdSense came along, I have not seen a site that is not a sell out or has that escaped everyone's attention?

As I said before, if you withhold the content quality of your reviews, no one would complain about the Ads. Heck I've already seen those Ads back in 2005 when THG did a stress test between P-D and X2. I don't think anyone was complaining about the Ads, because the content of the article was just superb.

Professionalism and integrity... you mean publishing a review on "MacBook Pro"?

Change sucks for those who choose to avoid it. For everyone else, it is inevitable, and in most cases, desirable. If you want a nice customer service message then, yes, go to CNET. Here, don't whine. Give me something I can really get my teeth into.

Frankly speaking, I don't think the readers here are avoiding the changes. I feel that the publishing team is actually the ones avoiding changes. As you said before, hardware world does change. But while it changes, others learned to adapt to it, and still retain that enthusiasm for it. What did THG change to adapt to the hardware world?

With all due respect sir, I feel that you no longer have the enthusiasm to run the site. From where I'm seeing, you're just basically avoiding the real question: why didn't THG change to adapt, to hold that standard once displayed years ago? Maybe selling it off to someone with more enthusiasm is a good idea.

I actually looked at his response.. its like "to be better and go with the world change, we should do the google way.. sell all our asses, get millions time, and leave others with horrible services and information for years..
jesus, this is a penny arcade tale of sarcasm!!!
he's just pulling the google-buy-everything card to get millions :|
its no longer about enthusiasm and computer hardware, and information, its just about millions..
amid is no longer a computer savvy guy... is just another wanna-be google investor who wants $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ :|

 

[TechnologyCoordinator]

Here's another example of quality issues:

http://www.tgdaily.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=31518


THE FIRST WORD OF THE ARTICLE IS SPELLED WRONG.


FIRST WORD.


I am not joking. The word that represents the number 9 is spelled "nin" instead of "nine". It is the first word of the article.

Seriously! Barry Gerber asks "Who designed this crap?". Well I ask, "Who proofread this crap?". Hell, install Google Toolbar and use the spellcheck feature on your "articles". I put more time into proofreading my forumz posts than THG does for its articles.

First word! The word that comes before all others. Not even the second, the first!

Fibre Channel over Ethernet standard proposed
Networking
By Wolfgang Gruener
Friday, April 06, 2007 14:01
Recommend article:San Diego (CA) – Nin IT companies, including Cisco, IBM, Intel and Sun, have asked the T11 Committee of the American National Standards Institute (ANSI) to create a Fibre Channel over Ethernet (FCoE) standard.

The standard proposes to transport SAN traffic natively over Ethernet networks. If approved, FCoE would provide Ethernet users with a “more pervasive connectivity” in the data center, the submission claims. Promised user benefits would include lower longer term operation costs via consolidated connectivity and management, additional server connectivity options as well as improved reliability, latency and performance for storage and “broader” data center connectivity, according to a statement released on Friday.

The group proposing FCoE includes Brocade, Cisco, EMC, Emulex, IBM, Intel, Nuova, QLogic, and Sun Microsystems.

 

[TimBog]

And to think that is mostly "copy & past" ,,, lol

yep spelled paste wrong,, lol, oops but I'll put some niuce adds on here for ya,, lol

Great find! Sorry for the bad spelling on my part. Some is on purpose the rest is only due to the low pay I recieve from the CEO for producing these fine posts.

 

[ShadowdogKGB]

hehe. that's some funny shiz.

 

[Boliver]

Hmmmmm.... 8O

 

[turpit]

Well, If the path THG has been walking and Omids answer are any indication, it looks like THG may very well turn into the next advertainment site, where products are listed along with the manufacturer written product information, and nothing else.

Its funny, Omid speaks of capitalism, yet apparently he seems to have forgetten the single key component to capatalism is the consumer. Without the consumer, there are no hits, and there are no advertisment kickbacks. If people have come here for information, but that information is nothing more than the same as given at the maufacturers site, or the actual etailers, then there is no point in coming here.

 

[albundy2]

well if all we are is cash there is a way to fight back... i just dl maxthon browser, and i get no ads at all no adwords noflash nothing... just what i want to see, your posts. just thought i would contribute that for those here and in other forums fed up with ad whoring. :roll:

 

[jamiepotter]

we have one of two choices as supporters of toms,we can critique and make suggestions or we can flame and embarass ourselves.

The choice is simple we support it with our suggestions or we dont. I for one would rather see them reach their full potential than criticise and offer nothing.

Part of the solution or part or the problem we each make our decision. Make a wise decision; the staff became involved out of concern for readers and core supporters,Its better than stoic silence and a big screw you.

We should keep that in mind as we criticise and try to be constructive as a due payment for all the good toms has done for all of us.

If I ran a site like this you bet your blessed azz id get all the ad money i could to further broaden the sites appeal. Id do so many ads that i could afford to make the site 3d interactive and possibly even have a whimsical toms online video game for the chronically bored.

But then realizing there is no I in team is part of the reader cooperation.

By all means question authority, But if you do so without solutions youre just part of the problems.

We do have another option: mass migration. The _only_ good thing about this site at the moment is the fora. I've lost count of the amount of times any decent information has come from a new thread with a link attached, as opposed to THG's home page. Sometimes they might have it a couple of days later...

Now, I don't want to start using another forum, simply because I've found the noob to person-worth-listening-to ratio is rather high. I want to hear from people such as your good self, verndewd.

If the site doesn't improve in the next 3 months, say, why not everyone just pack up and move to Anandtech?

 

[georgelawton]

I say we boycott now before he sales, lets cost him millions.

DOWN WITH TOMS FUCKWARE! THE SHITIEST PLACE ON THE PLANET TO READ ABOUT PINK IPODS. FUCK YOU!

 

[ShadowdogKGB]

Well hmm. Not to kick a dead horse, but it's kinda like the frog in a pot of water when he doesn't know he's being boiled.

I'm so done with ringtone ads and the google words. I don't need links to Bathroom Hardware or Curtain Hardware or any of the other gazillion bs links.

No, it's over. I came. I saw. I'm moving the f**k on. See ya THG. You now officially suck.

 

[endyen]

I forget how many posts like this I've seen.
Slvr's was better.
Yes, THG is "flash"ier. Yes, there are articles that apeal to a larger audience. But it is hard to argue with the numbers. Hits are up about 500% over the last 18 months.
You do have to understand that enthusiasts are no longer the market. We have become rather, a part of the product.
All you have to do is look at the number of members compared to the number of visitors at any given time.
18 months ago, it was rare to have more than 20 people on the forumz @ one time. Maybe that's because the site is so much worse?
Here is the reality. If you have a suggestion that will make THG better, PM saintblabs. He will listen.
If you just want to pass wind about the good old days, be his guest, but dont expect to get banned for it.
Oh, and if you are looking for news, try the register they usually get it right, and they are entertaining

 

[TimBog]

One question for you guys. Why do you guys think there has been such an increase in hits to THG?
Answer, EXPLOITATION.

I've been around long enough to know when I'm simply being used. The higher powers of THG knew long ago of the potential sale that is now happening. In knowing that, the best way to show a potential buyer the "value" of THG was to show that potential buyer or buyers a nice shiny new print out of the increased traffic and the cash flow increases made over a set amount of time. How do you think they made that happen?

We were, and until a new buyer steps up to the plate, will be nothing more than a number set for them to ponder over.

I have to admit that if I were to consider selling anything I would do just about the same thing that has happened with THG lately.
Any good businessman always does what is needed to get the most $ out of his final product before moving on. So I guess that this thread should be something the current buyer should be reading, not the current owners.
Please notice that the requests to actually do some testing and writing, not copy & paste, of products is something that I and others feel is a valid point for THG to consider in helping it to maintain its reader base. In the future, once the new owner is ready to move on, how will he/she derive a value of THG to the next potential buyer? That will be done once again as it is being done now, exploitation of its reader base. Problem is, if the reader base drops off how can that happen again to the degree that there is a profitable return on investment in the future?
To look good on paper the things I see happening here are. 1. Reduction in payroll by using cheap help to do the copy and paste stuff without even an editor managing that with something as simple as a spell checker.
2. Increase in ads and content not even pertaining to computer hardware. That will make the hit #s look good to the potential buyer.
End result is a much more marketable product.
One thing I hate is the fact that THG will no longer be at the top of my list as an information site. For now it is nothing more than another Epinion site trying to gain points with manufacturers to increase cash flow.

I think I've said enough, and if what I've said doesn't help THG in the future to maintain its status as a well respected site then, goodbye THG it's been fun while it lasted!

 

[LAN_deRf_HA]

One question for you guys. Why do you guys think there has been such an increase in hits to THG?

Uh, more idiots know how to use google than ever before?

 

[TimBog]

One question for you guys. Why do you guys think there has been such an increase in hits to THG?

Uh, more idiots know how to use google than ever before?

Yep, but Google for what? Flex Fuel conversion kits from a computer hardware site?

I did mention this happening because of the added non-relevant content.

 

[LAN_deRf_HA]

Well frankly I didn't read any further, I don't feel inclined to after that Omid guy was like "I read a few posts and you're all stupid and this is pointless", basically. If hes going to assume what the content of our posts are and then blow them off, I think we all should do the same to anyone posting on behalf of the site, or each other in general. Just let everyone post without reading anything thats been said before... you know, seems fair enough. :roll:

and btw, if you google "flex fuel conversion kits", tg daily shows up on the third page.... so yes, just about any idiot who uses google

 

[TimBog]

I have to agree with you that going any further in adding to this thread personally is pointless. I'll stop here and go do some googleing myself for pink iPods. Thanks , CYA

 

[predaking]

another article you may want to look at:
http://www.tomshardware.com/2007/03/06/the_best_gaming_video_cards_for_the_money/

This card brings Nvidia's high-end DirectX 10 architecture down to the $300 price point, and costs more than $100 less than its 640-MB 8800 GTS cousin.

 

[saintbabs]

What I HAVE NOT said is that anyone who posts here is stupid, or that I do not care.

What I HAVE said is that you are entitled to your opinions, but I am under no obligation to adhere to them. Nor are you to mine.

If this is a forum then, I assume I can post as easily and as honestly as you guys do, or am I merely supposed to be the whipping boy, and to come to you in a prostate position?

I don't agree with everything that is said about the site, particularly the general level of negativity about its content or commerce. I have always found the arguments about selling out to be jejune, and pointless. They are just mud slinging. Not factual. Highly emotive, and great fodder for forums.

What I have said is that yes, we make money, and yes, we are successful. We don't force anyone to come here, or force them to read the articles, or force anything.

We put the content up, and do our best. You may not like our best, but we DO OUR BEST.

Read it, and enjoy it. Don't enjoy it. Criticize. Whatever. No one is stopping you.

I listened to comments about the needs of enthusiasts and as a result, two of your own, Crashman and Cleeve, were recruited to write for us based on their enthusiasm and familiarity with the forum' members needs. I opened up the invitation to anyone else in the forums to contribute, and asked for enthusiasts and experts. Only those two stepped up, and they have done a great job. Anyone ever mention that, or talk about that? Anyone talk about how only those two stepped up to the plate, and no one else?

Hmmmm.

 

[LAN_deRf_HA]

We put the content up, and do our best. You may not like our best, but we DO OUR BEST.

I would be more appreciative if I could believe this is really the best THG can do. It's one thing if the writer of an article doesn't seem to be fully educated on the subject they're writing about, i'm use to that, but if they can't even be bothered to run a spell check... how is that putting forth their best effort?

 

[YO_KID37]

I wasnt aware youd asked for interested writers. 8O personally i think working for toms would be awesome.Unlike so many here that just slam and run ;it would be a chance to add to the pool.

Then take this as a call for New Recruits and send in your resumes and make space on your Daily Planner to write up interesting articles collaborative with other writers who have jumped on Tom's Waggon and are writing almost nothing lately. 😀 Hope you get payed though, or at least start writing about something us Forum users would totally read