Out of memory errors with a ridiculous page-file usage...

[amnesiaaisenma]

I have been using Windows 7 for quite some while (2 or more weeks) on this new PC. Now...problem is, Task Manager shows a massive page-file usage. 1.40 GB used as soon as my PC starts (without loading any programs). I have 4 GB RAM, out of which, 3305 MB is usable (Microsoft licensing issues keep messing around with 32-bit Windows), and the page-file usage slowly gets to around 3 GB. I have 4 partitions on my 1 TB HDD, and I had 2-4 GB page-file on each. I disabled the page-files on all the partitions, but TM still shows a massive usage of 2.5 GB as I am writing this article. I mean, there's 4 GB RAM, and even without running any programs, it's still around 1.40 GB page-file usage.

I disabled Superfetch and the page-file on all the drives, now Windows is giving me out-of-memory errors. The only things open are Google Chrome, Windows Live Messenger, mIRC, Windows Media Player, Task Manager, Yahoo Messenger and Bit-Torrent, and none eat memory. TM is showing 710 MB RAM available out of 3304 MB, and 70 MB free. IDK what is using the RAM and causing this big a page-file usage. My PC is gone very slow, and it sucks. Any way to reduce this much disk-activity, and actually use the RAM? Nothing in the TM shows active (CPU is always at 0-5 %), so nothing is eating memory. What's causing this much RAM and page-file usage?

 

[egilbe]

Let windows manage the ram and quit screwing around with paging files. The paging file is created to free up ram. The more crap you have running, the bigger that file is going to get.

 

[amnesiaaisenma]

There goes the process list. Yea, it's large, and I know there's lots of Chrome windows open, but more than 60 used to be open back then. This is just a list of 30-40.

http://tinypic.com/r/140azwk/6

http://tinypic.com/r/4pvxpt/6

http://tinypic.com/r/zwi81t/6

http://tinypic.com/r/af8nmb/6

 

[egilbe]

You really have 149 processes running? 91% ram used? Think messing around with the paging file has something to do with that? What was the last Windows OS you used? Windows 98? Windows 7 is very good at managing memory. The problem is the owner of the PC

 

[azathoth]

We can't see the amount of memory each program is using, In the view section of task manager click on Select Columns then make sure just Image Name, Memory - Private Working Set, and User Name are checked for screenshot purposes.
Again sorry but you need to retake those pictures.

It's probably a process or two that has a massive memory leak.

 

[amnesiaaisenma]

And didn't I mention so many times, that the older PC performed with the same load and was so much faster than this one is? That had the exact same amount of load, exact same amount of RAM, exact same HDD and exact same OS...so I don't think why would 8 GB of RAM be a NECESSITY in the first place?

Dude, egilbe...really, you need to read twice before posting. The last OS I ran before this one was Windows 7. The problem is me? Please, do enlighten me..since I did set up Windows EXACTLY THE SAME WAY on the previous installation on the old PC...

As for the screenshot, I'm posting only the first screen, sorted as you can see in the picture.

http://tinypic.com/r/1zp4i2g/6

 

[egilbe]

There's no way chrome should be using that many resources.

 

[azathoth]

The problem is the simple amount of processes you have running. Even though they're all between 20-50megs, There is SO many of them that they eat up all your RAM. With a pagefile windows allocates extra resources into the pagefile for faster loading regardless of the hard-drive speed, sometimes this may slow things down as in your case.

Only solution that i'm seeing is to start using a 64-bit OS and upgrade the RAM. You said there was compatibility problems however, but with which applications?
Personally I have never come across a program that would not run in 64-bit Windows.

 

[amnesiaaisenma]

I know, that so many tabs open eat memory...but when I start up the PC, with no processes running, the PF usage is 1.40 GB, and RAM usage is 1800 MB. NO programs running, and yet the usage.That's what bothers me, that if there's no programs running, then why is the RAM and the PF being used in the first place? I have no problem with a program using it if I am using the program...but starting the system...a brand-new reboot eating up RAM and the PF? That's ridiculous.

And the main use I have is playing games, so games like GTA SA and others won't run in 64-bit...newer games might, but older games won't. Also, RAM is very expensive, so I can't buy any, so ultimately, no use upgrading to x64. But I don't think the need should be. I know, I sound like a broken record by saying that the old PC used to run faster, but I need to...if the basic PC can run Windows 7 a lightning speed, this faster, latest and brand-new PC should run it even more smoothly.

 

[azathoth]

I only have 47 processes running on a fresh restart, using 2GB of RAM off the start. Sorry to say but it is what it is. No errors of any sort, just 4GB of RAM just can't cut it for your usage.

 

[jtenorj]

Hi there. Read through the thread and noticed a thing or two.

So, you ran windows 7 32 bit in the old pc and all was well, but now your new pc (also with windows 7 32 bit) has a
ton of missing memory? what gpu was in your old system? integrated? discrete? how much memory was on the
discrete or allocated to the integrated? Since 32 bit windows has a hard limit of 4GB that can be allocated to any
memory in the system(system ram, video memory, bios, etc) I am thinking maybe your new 3GB HD7950 has
3GB of your max 4GB allocated to it, leaving less than 1GB left over between system ram etc. I don't know
what special software or hardware is requiring 32 bit compatibility, but get over it and install windows 64 bit. Home
Premium limits you to 16GB of system ram(I think it is 128GB for enterprise/business, pro, ultimate, or whatever
costs more than basic and home) and maybe a virtually unlimited amount of vram on top of that. Your 4GB of
ram may end up feeling much snappier(since you will finally be able to use all of it) and if you upgrade to
8GB of ram(depending on your more intense workloads), you may not need a page file at all. Windows will use
left over physical memory to cache frequently used programs you aren't currently using and not need to use
the hard drive to for extra virtual memory/page file at all.

 

[egilbe]

Hi there. Read through the thread and noticed a thing or two.

So, you ran windows 7 32 bit in the old pc and all was well, but now your new pc (also with windows 7 32 bit) has a
ton of missing memory? what gpu was in your old system? integrated? discrete? how much memory was on the
discrete or allocated to the integrated? Since 32 bit windows has a hard limit of 4GB that can be allocated to any
memory in the system(system ram, video memory, bios, etc) I am thinking maybe your new 3GB HD7950 has
3GB of your max 4GB allocated to it, leaving less than 1GB left over between system ram etc. I don't know
what special software or hardware is requiring 32 bit compatibility, but get over it and install windows 64 bit. Home
Premium limits you to 16GB of system ram(I think it is 128GB for enterprise/business, pro, ultimate, or whatever
costs more than basic and home) and maybe a virtually unlimited amount of vram on top of that. Your 4GB of
ram may end up feeling much snappier(since you will finally be able to use all of it) and if you upgrade to
8GB of ram(depending on your more intense workloads), you may not need a page file at all. Windows will use
left over physical memory to cache frequently used programs you aren't currently using and not need to use
the hard drive to for extra virtual memory/page file at all.

If that card wasn't in the old system, then yeah, probably that's it.

 

[egilbe]

32 bit OS's can only address 2^32 bit addresses. That includes all the memory in your pc, HDD caches, DVD-rom cache, video card ram, BIOS and CPU cache. The main benefit of a 64bit OS is that when you put 4 gigs of ram in your pc, you have 4 gigs available for programs and OS. 64 bit OS has 2^64 bit addresses that's available (theoretically) any limitations below that are written into the OS itself.

 

[Smeg45]

Pointless for you...but when Windows crashes, all the data is gonna' be lost. The 320 GB Hitachi HDD is a back-up HDD, and the 1 TB is the main HDD. I have made 4 partitions with some point for me...maybe pointless for you, but not for me. As far as using 32-bit goes, well, I use 32-bit for compatibility issues. And if a PC SHOULD need 8 GB of RAM, then I'd say it's a waste. Why do I need 4 GB of RAM? You know how expensive it is here? And didn't I mention so many times, that the older PC performed with the same load and was so much faster than this one is? That had the exact same amount of load, exact same amount of RAM, exact same HDD and exact same OS...so I don't think why would 8 GB of RAM be a NECESSITY in the first place? Maybe YOUR PC can't run without 8 GB, but mine used to run, and even now, it should run.

Old PC vs the new PC:
ASUS P5KPL AM/PS vs ASUS Sabertooth X79
Intel Core2Duo E5200 @ 2.5 GHz vs Intel Core i7 3960X @ 3.3 GHz
ATI Radeon HD 7950
Generic 4 GB DDR2 RAM @ 1333 MHz vs Kingston 4GB DDR-3 RAM @ 1600 MHz

And the old PC was lightning fast. But it's fried now, so I can't use that one. It had the same loads, so why is the newer and better PC running worse?

Expensive? Over here in rip off Australia a 8GB kit is an earth shattering $40. Which is nothing. As for compatibility issues, upgrade. Or get a 64-bit version of 7 (who even runs 32-bit 7? I've never even see 32-bit store bought PC's for sale!) and run a VM. 8GB is the sweet spot. You've got too much crap running on your system.

 

[fb39ca4]

32 bit OS's can only address 2^32 bit addresses. That includes all the memory in your pc, HDD caches, DVD-rom cache, video card ram, BIOS and CPU cache. The main benefit of a 64bit OS is that when you put 4 gigs of ram in your pc, you have 4 gigs available for programs and OS. 64 bit OS has 2^64 bit addresses that's available (theoretically) any limitations below that are written into the OS itself.

32 bit Windows can access page files above the 4GB limit, and CPU cache and VRAM do not apply. In fact, with a modern processor you can have say 8GB of RAM and create a 4GB ramdisk on the portion Windows cannot access, effectively giving you 8GB of RAM (though it will work somewhat slower than having 8GB natively, it is still a lot faster than even a page file on an SSD.)

 

[amnesiaaisenma]

Man...first of all...stop constantly telling me about 64-bit...I know 64-bit has capability, but I use 32-bit. Can't be changed, and that's it. If it could be changed, I would. Smeg, for you, $40 is nothing, but come here and tell me what you think after you see the prices. My home income is not enough to buy so much, and even this PC was bought after I saved up for a long time, so don't tell me that it's nothing. You don't know my financial condition, you don't know why I use what I use, so why not find the reason instead of constantly belittling me for using 32-bit Windows? Tell that to Microsoft and other nut-jobs who put money and licensing crap before consumer wishes. This isn't Australia, or America, or Europe...this is INDIA, so please, for the forum's sake, stop telling me the same things over and over again. The hardware is what it is and can't be changed. And for the record...more users use 32-bit than 64-bit, if not there, at least here they use. People here run systems as far back as Windows 95, so don't talk before knowing what's what and what's not.

And yes, the graphic card WAS in the old PC. Radeon series are high-end cards, and an HD 7950 is obviously a card with it's own set of memory. 3 GB DDR5 is not the same as 4 GB DDR3. Jtnorj, as I said, the old PC had the same HDD, same graphic card, same amount of memory and same OS. I moved the Radeon to the new system, of course. Only the MB, Processor, Power Supply, Type of RAM (DDR2 to DDR3) and the Chassis has changed. The HDD, GC, OS and RAM amount is the same. As I said...I don't have a problem with a program using RAM if I am using it. If I'm using the browser, I do expect it to use RAM, or even the PF. But a brand-new reboot and the RAM is still full, and the PF is half used up already, so that's what I want to know...what's this invisible usage which is not being detected by either TM or Resource Monitor? Of course, that usage stays, so, the browser just adds to the usage, creating a full RAM. I close the browser, the RAM usage will go back to 800 MB for Hardware, 1300-1800 MB in use, around 1-1.40 GB PF use and the rest of the RAM free...I don't know why is so much RAM being used by the invisible thing.

And yes, I did a ForceEnable for PAE, but the usable RAM is still 3.23 GB. It was 3.23 before that, and still 3.23 after. On the old PC, it showed 3.50 GB, here, it's 3.23 GB usable.

 

[mouse24]

Windows uses whatever amount of ram you give it, it uses as much as it can where available to get things done faster. Its simply how it works. If you take out one stick you would see windows would be using less. Its nothing to worry about man.

Heres my usage with 4gb of ram and around 18 tabs open in chrome and 3 youtube videos open. It frees up the ram from the system when it needs to.

 

[amnesiaaisenma]

I know it frees the RAM when it needs to...the only problem is that it has a heavy usage even with no programs running.

 

[mouse24]

Sooo... Whats the problem? If you aren't using the ram why can't windows use it to make things faster?

 

[amnesiaaisenma]

The problem is...even with NO programs running, the RAM and PF usage is high...so, IDK what's the thing which makes Windows go crazy with RAM and PF usage...

 

[egilbe]

32 bit Windows can access page files above the 4GB limit, and CPU cache and VRAM do not apply. In fact, with a modern processor you can have say 8GB of RAM and create a 4GB ramdisk on the portion Windows cannot access, effectively giving you 8GB of RAM (though it will work somewhat slower than having 8GB natively, it is still a lot faster than even a page file on an SSD.)

false, a 32 bit OS can't address more than 4gb of ram. It's not possible. Anything the OS has to address counts towards the limit, including cache and Vram. There are more addresses available than the OS can use.

 

[ex_bubblehead]

OP has absolutely no idea how Windows memory management works. I'll give you just a little clue. Windows pre allocates page space (pre allocate != in actual use), the Task Manager shows both in use and pre allocated as a single value. As to memory useage. Memory lying around unused is memory wasted.

I have experience with Windows, so I know what's best and what's not.

To both, no, you do not.

 

[ELMO_2006]

I have been using Windows 7 for quite some while (2 or more weeks) on this new PC.

So thus far everything is peachy-keen.

Now...problem is, Task Manager shows a massive page-file usage. 1.40 GB used as soon as my PC starts (without loading any programs).

Has something changed here? What was done or shall I ask what made you look here and was there anything that was installed when you noticed something was a foot?!

I have 4 GB RAM, out of which, 3305 MB is usable (Microsoft licensing issues keep messing around with 32-bit Windows), and the page-file usage slowly gets to around 3 GB.

Can you please explain when you said "the Microsoft licensing issues keep messing around with 32-bit Windows"?

I have 4 partitions on my 1 TB HDD, and I had 2-4 GB page-file on each. I disabled the page-files on all the partitions, but TM still shows a massive usage of 2.5 GB as I am writing this article. I mean, there's 4 GB RAM, and even without running any programs, it's still around 1.40 GB page-file usage.

What you should actually do is move your pagefile to a completely different physical drive to split up the workload.

I disabled Superfetch and the page-file on all the drives, now Windows is giving me out-of-memory errors.

SuperFetch caches the most frequently accessed application files in RAM so your applications will open more quickly. It's one of the many reasons why Windows 7 feels so much more "snappy" and disabling the pagefile takes away RAM that Windows could be using for caching.
The big problem with disabling your pagefile is that once you've exhausted the available RAM, your apps are going to start crashing, since there's no virtual memory for Windows to allocate—and worst case, your actual system will crash or become very unstable.

TM is showing 710 MB RAM available out of 3304 MB, and 70 MB free. IDK what is using the RAM and causing this big a page-file usage. My PC is gone very slow, and it sucks. Any way to reduce this much disk-activity, and actually use the RAM? Nothing in the TM shows active (CPU is always at 0-5 %), so nothing is eating memory. What's causing this much RAM and page-file usage?

If your system has 4GB of RAM and your peak memory usage was 5GB (including virtual memory), you should set your pagefile to at least 1GB and the maximum as 2GB to give you a buffer to keep you safe in case a RAM-hungry application needs it.
Try the following link to download Process Explorer which may provide further detail. - http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb896653.aspx

With 4GB installed but only 710MB available this is indeed a little concerning, does the system upon bootup register 4096 of memory on the post screen?
Have you performed a memtest of the RAM modules (sorry if this has been requested already)?
Do you have anything set in the BIOS that should be disabled i.e. memory remapping?
What about the video card, you should be able to view the memory usage within the driver/software?

Hope this helps...

 

[amnesiaaisenma]

OK, I formatted my system and installed Windows anew. Of course, I had used Windows 7 for a moth, it's just 2 weeks or more on the new PC, and it's similar to XP, so I can easily find my way around here. I have only installed what I need: Google Chrome, Yahoo and MSN Messenger, FlashGet, BitTorrent, TeraCopy, mIRC and of course, the drivers...only that much. and even now, after I formatted the system, it's big usage of RAM (2380 MB in use) and 2.36 GB PF use. Still, the system isn't slow, but this much usage is a nuisance. The Display Properties shows 358 MB as Total available graphics memory, 3072 MB as Dedicated Video Memory and 1382 MB as SHared System Memory. My graphic card is an ATI Radeon Sapphire HD 7950. Is that eating so much memory? I don't think it should, since it has 3 GB of onboard RAM, but the Shared Memory is 1382 MB, so IDK.

By Microsoft Licensing issues, I mean that Microsoft won't allow 32-Bit Windows to natively support more than 4 GB or RAM due to licensing issues (Check Wikipedia for more information). So, their licensing, patenting, copyright and other crap messes with the progress of something, that's what I meant there.

The other physical drive already has data, which is a sort of a back up for my main HDD, so can't use that for PF.

And I mentioned before, I had disabled Superfetch and PF only to test what was using it up and to reduce the dependence of Windows on the PF, but that didn't help, so I enabled them.

I know about Process Explorer, but IDK how to know the peak usage. Any help there?

Right now, the memory usage (this is, OFC, the new installation) is as follows: Hardware Reserved = 820 MB, In Use = 2300 MB, Modified = 30 MB, Standby = 850 MB and Free = 85 MB. PF usage is 2.30 GB.

I did perform MemTest, and RAM modules are clean. Also, the BIOS registers 4096, but of course, even with PAE, available memory is still 3.20 GB. I have nothing in the BIOS like Memory Remapping.

IDK how to see the memory usage of the Radeon with the Catalyst Control Center.

 

[Smeg45]

Clean install 64-bit 7. Microsoft has nothing to do with licencing 32-bit, 32-bit is physically limited to less than 4GB. And why are you running 32? Everyone should run 64 in 2012.

 

[13thmonkey]

shared system memory? is that an ati thing? still not sure what your problem is, not a nuisance but a problem, with symptoms that you see in use, not when you look for them.