Question PCIe USB 3.0/UCB-c expansion card

[Julian Lineton]

Hi,

I am looking to add some UCB 3 ports to my PC (A Dell 5040 optiplex) and am looking at expansion cards to take the unused PCIe slot. I see from amazon that there appear to be approx 3 types.
1. Those that slot into a PCIe slot on their own
2. Those similiar to above but have either a 4 or 15 pin power connector
3. Those with also a USB-c connector.

A/ I am curious to know if there is a substantive difference between these that cannot be overcome with a cable, i.e. in the case of 1/2 and 3 with a USB-A to USB-c cable.
B/ Is there a substantive difference between 1 and 2, i.e. are those of type 2 able to supply more power than those of type 1 or is it simply a matter of the components on the board?
C/ can those in class 2 operate without power via the 4/15 pin connector? If so will they do so but be able to supply less power than with a power connection via the 4/15 pin connector?

Some examples are :

type 1 : https://www.amazon.com/FebSmart-Self-Powered-Technology-No-Additional-FS-U2-Pro/dp/B071P5C6CS/ref=sr_1_18?dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.Tzx6euXR5rdxWXAmauPlPmN66WGTsl4SHxM-4ISvNi05UsfasA3Fn-h9E1xYT1uL-dXLE9DYbQwU74mJ-N4AhR3MWPcS8mGo_si4XR8PiGcspZW_T3JTMT8g7UArvCeQYAwk3oaTKNQq18S94EyA9bipJmSRdqi1XnyyGwOQqTEr2iGjBtr2vGZBeK9nrNbmXiddP9ZY6oxcXGaN_7I6yl3ar9DRHVDH8KqRWqseQIw._eYJoYAPfTvRKGfeUZ0Yh5SPxbY5TdiUeOWu64WiQuQ&dib_tag=se&keywords=PCIe%2Busb%2Bcard&qid=1719327830&sr=8-18&th=1

type 2: https://www.amazon.com/StarTech-com...23-spons&sp_csd=d2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9tdGY&psc=1

Type 3 https://www.amazon.com/MingChuan-PCI-Express-Charger-Expansion-Adapter/dp/B07KFY81CT/ref=sr_1_13?crid=SVBVXSQ8Z0SQ&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.m8JHG8TlVatSewjSa8otB8FleAtafQeeG1TVnrm9seuc1W3WYhPt5fe94pPQZO6kQhH8HOIASBhEQJbqKPX8SNprlPySX6LfvYMplFaUNKLBHJRLHT4HM-cCQcY4bDJZH504ODof8z2lvobVLLdhnvABb7GQN17AbZNqrygrqfVVFC1SeODMlxIxcWJyFyFlCdC6QVxd-1bUwdtWWgQD6wzTYu2L7dpHpn1rUbT4xgo.qO0hL4h5bxYthEKurgB_NJUPqZbFPyUSqjy-siH3CEk&dib_tag=se&keywords=PCIe+usb+card+usb-c&qid=1719327992&sprefix=pcie+usb+card+usb-c,aps,168&sr=8-13

Those chosen to illustrate are just that, I am not necessarily considering those exact cards, just wanting to understand the differences if any.

Edit: I am aware that the example of tyoe 3 above includes fast charging which is off topic, a better type 3 example is https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09MM4MX3...&s=pc&sp_csd=d2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9kZXRhaWw&th=1

Thanks for you help.

Regards

JRL

 

[Lutfij]

Welcome to the forums, newcomer!

If you look at type 3, the ports may be lacking on the rear of the expansion slot but there's an internal front panel header, so if you do the math, you're actually getting about 4 ports in total. The 3rd party controller on them would mean that their speeds aren't exactly worth writing home about but yes you will need the supplemental power input on the card to help deliver power to your USB devices.

Since your OptiPlex has a proprietary PSU, I'd advise on looking at a card that doesn't need an external power source, like this;

Amazon.com

 

[SkyNetRising]

A/ I am curious to know if there is a substantive difference between these that cannot be overcome with a cable, i.e. in the case of 1/2 and 3 with a USB-A to USB-c cable.
B/ Is there a substantive difference between 1 and 2, i.e. are those of type 2 able to supply more power than those of type 1 or is it simply a matter of the components on the board?
C/ can those in class 2 operate without power via the 4/15 pin connector? If so will they do so but be able to supply less power than with a power connection via the 4/15 pin connector?

There is no fundamental difference between them.
For PCIE card with power connector on it - power connector is meant to provide additional power to USB port.
Connected devices can be charged faster.

 

[Paperdoc]

YES, these differences are important.

A. All USB3 system now are named this way: All are versions of USB 3.2, each with a Genn suffix. Gen 1 has a max data transfer rate of 5 Gb/s. Gen2 can do up to 10 Gb/s and many devices cannot actually go that fast, but more are coming on the market. Gen2x2 can do up to 20 Gb/s with even fewer devices that fast currently available. Regarding CONNECTORS, you CAN use the USB3 versions of the older Type A sockets / connectors with any of these, BUT that is guaranteed to deliver ONLY the LOWEST speed of Gen1. A Type A connector system MAY deliver speed up to Gen2 specs, but may not, and it is recommended you use the new Type C connector system for Gen2. You MUST use Type C for Gen2x2. Now, for the cards you show, most are built with controller chips providing only Gen 1 output ports, so they offer only Type A sockets, and that is reasonable. But for some that HAVE one or more Type C sockets, that is because they offer Gen2 performance on those ports. So IF you have (or expect to get) any Gen2 speed USB 3.2 devices, you WILL need Type C sockets fed by Gen2 port chips. Note that you can get adapters to convert a Type A to a Type C socket, and the other way around, but these may have an impact on the actual data speed you achieve. Too many Type C sockets can be solved easily with an adapter to Type A if you need that.

B. The PCIe bus was not designed to provide significant power to a device connected to its cards. So it is NORMAL for a PCIe USB card to require a connection to a power supply from the PSU to get the power needed by USB devices.Now, USB 3.2 specs include providing MORE power to each port than the older USB2 system did, so it IS important for a USB 3.2 card in a PCIe slot to HAVE extra power supplied direct from the PSU. Of course, IF the card has charging ports this is absolutely essetntial, but you are not really concerned with that, I think. By the way, most of the cards you show have a standard SATA power supply connector on them (some MAY have a 4-pin Molex instead), and I expect YOUR computer's PSU output wiring does have one or both of those, hopefully at least one that is NOT in use currently.

C. Your last qestion depends on the card design, which is NOT generally described in their promo info. IF the card is designed so that power from the PCIe slot IS connected to the USB 3.2 ports AS WELL AS power from the extra power input direct for the PSU, then yes, the card could be operated without that power connection to the PSU. HOWEVER, as noted above, that MAY mean that the card can NOT provide sufficent power to an external connected device. A good example of where this can be a problem are the "Laptop Hard Drives" sold now for use with USB3 systems. Common hard drives can NOT operate on the power available from a USB3 port. The ones now sold for use with USB3 and with NO added power source are particularly designed to work that way, but they use virtually all of the power up to the limit of the port. To do this they make some adjustments in design, including slower performance to minimize power consumtion. So ONE such Laptop Hard Drive will use ALL the power available to it from its host port. If the USB3 card in the PCIe slot CAN actually supply that much, it is VERY unlikely that any more power will be available to any second port on that card.