- Status
Am I retarded? Is it wrong for me to want a website where I can see a side-by-side comparison of ALL possible complete systems?
It seems like Tom's Hardware is always featuring comparisons of apples to oranges and any other sort of 2 system comparison that I don't care about.
There are graphics card rankings but what I really want is total system rankings showing most every system configuration possible. For example how do ALL of the socket 775 quad-core systems compare to ALL of the Core-I7 quad-core systems. You don't need to include every mobo out there but including a few different graphics cards in the benchmarks would be nice. Also, I would drop a few of the benchmarks and go with just one gaming, one video encoding and one audio encoding.
I think most people come here in hopes of figuring out what they should build next. Whether to upgrade what they have or build new. I just always seem to go away without finding what I'm looking for. I'm sure it's a lot of work to build every possible system based on every cpu and graphics combination available and then run all the benchmarks and collect and compile all the data but that's what everyone is jonesing for.
It seems like Tom's Hardware is always featuring comparisons of apples to oranges and any other sort of 2 system comparison that I don't care about.
There are graphics card rankings but what I really want is total system rankings showing most every system configuration possible. For example how do ALL of the socket 775 quad-core systems compare to ALL of the Core-I7 quad-core systems. You don't need to include every mobo out there but including a few different graphics cards in the benchmarks would be nice. Also, I would drop a few of the benchmarks and go with just one gaming, one video encoding and one audio encoding.
I think most people come here in hopes of figuring out what they should build next. Whether to upgrade what they have or build new. I just always seem to go away without finding what I'm looking for. I'm sure it's a lot of work to build every possible system based on every cpu and graphics combination available and then run all the benchmarks and collect and compile all the data but that's what everyone is jonesing for.
Twoboxer
Splendid
- Jan 21, 2008
- 4,208
- 0
- 23,460
I don't think you three guys understand the impact of your tone. Whether you're right or wrong you're *not* convincing anyone. Those who agree with you now already did, so you accomplish nothing.
You might benefit from a re-read of the thread that led to this article.
When the name-calling, whining about conspiracy theories, accusations of bribes et al stopped, and folks stuck to discussing facts reasonably rather than trying to stick them up . . . anyhow, it was then that you actually made progress.
Your call. As for me, its my last attempt at a pig flight lesson.
You might benefit from a re-read of the thread that led to this article.
When the name-calling, whining about conspiracy theories, accusations of bribes et al stopped, and folks stuck to discussing facts reasonably rather than trying to stick them up . . . anyhow, it was then that you actually made progress.
Your call. As for me, its my last attempt at a pig flight lesson.
balancedthinking
Distinguished
- Apr 28, 2009
- 16
- 0
- 18,510
The i7 is great for cf or sli, no doubt about that.
But lower the price point of the systems by 200$ and go for single gpu cards:
That will give you i7 with 4870 vs Phenom II 955 with 4890 OC 1ghz.
i7 is gonna loose that one big time, I tell ya!
You also do not need a 790FX and can go for a much cheaper 790GX with single gpu configurations, without compromising performance, saving you even more money.
It all boils down to the amount of money you want to spend for your gaming rig and if you like cf/sli with micro stuttering an a huge power draw.
You like cf/sli and do not care about power consumption AND have a lot of money to spend: the i7 is the clear winner.
You do not like cf/sli and want to use a single gpu set up, do not like huge power bills and are on a budget: go for AMD
But lower the price point of the systems by 200$ and go for single gpu cards:
That will give you i7 with 4870 vs Phenom II 955 with 4890 OC 1ghz.
i7 is gonna loose that one big time, I tell ya!
You also do not need a 790FX and can go for a much cheaper 790GX with single gpu configurations, without compromising performance, saving you even more money.
It all boils down to the amount of money you want to spend for your gaming rig and if you like cf/sli with micro stuttering an a huge power draw.
You like cf/sli and do not care about power consumption AND have a lot of money to spend: the i7 is the clear winner.
You do not like cf/sli and want to use a single gpu set up, do not like huge power bills and are on a budget: go for AMD
i dont give a s..... on amd or intel but please can we see a real benchmark without color blue or green?
just facts
no personal conclusion or other .....
i buy like this gflops/$
every body has to eat not just one....you are not glad about chrome os?
get my point?
just facts
no personal conclusion or other .....
i buy like this gflops/$
every body has to eat not just one....you are not glad about chrome os?
get my point?
- Dec 31, 2007
- 48,582
- 92
- 66,190
[citation][nom]sighQ2[/nom]Now I am convinced that you really are hiding the truth behind this idiot obsession with trying to match the gross overprice of spintel junk.Yes. You can do it easily - use a triple core. And I am not the only one yelling at you for not knowing - or ignoring - how to properly oclox a Phenom.You are the tester - and you call the tune - and you deny the bribe - and you don't know how to pull it off; but your readers are way ahead of you.and typos and petty insults reduce you to the level of the other idiot fanboys.I was really impressed with how you began the article - but you sabotaged. OWN IT.I challenge you to run the same test w a lil dually 550. That will give you all the money to equal the cost of the super jjunkkk.Play your OWN GAME.OWN IT - or find somebody else to insult.Your placative conclusions - disgusting - but it's typical of most spintel paid sites. You mention in the midst of your conclusions, that you would get an i7 anyway because you run unknown "apps". At that point, you abandoned the testing, the results, the conclusions and revealed yourself as incompetent to people who really just keep on whining incessantly for fair and unbiased testing and reviewing.Sorry to poo on your parade. Nice start. Bad ending. As playerone and a few others have said, learn about Phenom and how to oclox it.It can bust i7 - but you may not be allowed to report that.It's not about nice - it's about antitrust. what's nice about that? you support it? read the EU results. shocking stuff.I appreciate what you claim to be doing here; and I am serious about that. I just wish I could believe it. You have the potential to pull of some clean tests; but there may be some dark forces misinforming you - perhaps by omission. This angle of matching price is a scam.[/citation]
Wow, Take everything you said, flip it over, and see that you're either a complete zealot or a marketing shill for Intel trying to make AMD fans look bad. I've been told not to insult people, but this is a compliment for you.
So let me get this straight: You think Core i7 should be compared to a 3-core Phenom so that even more money can be spent on beefing up the Phenom system? If that's the case, why not put a Core 2 Duo in the Intel system? Or a Pentium Dual-Core E5200 perhaps. Then OC the E5200 to 4.2GHz while supplying it with superior parts on the graphics side. I'm sure you'd have loved to see that kind of deck-stacking against the AMD.
And then you complain about the AMD overclock without even considering the low Intel overclock. AMD was cheated from a more significant victory with its 0.2 GHz below-max overclock, which favored Intel's 0.4 GHz below-max overclock?
It looks to me that Don skewed this article as much as possible towards AMD and still you say the same old crap about Intel money and bribes.
Everything you say isn't just a simple lie, it's the direct opposite of the truth. To say I gave money to charity when I didn't would be a lie. To say you gave money to a charity when you actually robbed its drop box would be the opposite of the truth.
Insults? There aren't really any insults good enough for people like you. Go climb in a hole, or better yet, just go to a redneck bar and tell the kind folks there what you really think of their women.
And when you get back here, please post pictures from your adventure!
Wow, Take everything you said, flip it over, and see that you're either a complete zealot or a marketing shill for Intel trying to make AMD fans look bad. I've been told not to insult people, but this is a compliment for you.
So let me get this straight: You think Core i7 should be compared to a 3-core Phenom so that even more money can be spent on beefing up the Phenom system? If that's the case, why not put a Core 2 Duo in the Intel system? Or a Pentium Dual-Core E5200 perhaps. Then OC the E5200 to 4.2GHz while supplying it with superior parts on the graphics side. I'm sure you'd have loved to see that kind of deck-stacking against the AMD.
And then you complain about the AMD overclock without even considering the low Intel overclock. AMD was cheated from a more significant victory with its 0.2 GHz below-max overclock, which favored Intel's 0.4 GHz below-max overclock?
It looks to me that Don skewed this article as much as possible towards AMD and still you say the same old crap about Intel money and bribes.
Everything you say isn't just a simple lie, it's the direct opposite of the truth. To say I gave money to charity when I didn't would be a lie. To say you gave money to a charity when you actually robbed its drop box would be the opposite of the truth.
Insults? There aren't really any insults good enough for people like you. Go climb in a hole, or better yet, just go to a redneck bar and tell the kind folks there what you really think of their women.
And when you get back here, please post pictures from your adventure!
jennyh
Splendid
- Mar 3, 2009
- 4,292
- 0
- 22,860
Pretty good review. Everybody knows the i7 is a better cpu, at least when both are overclocked.
Can't really argue with any of it and as plenty of others have mentioned, most AMD users would stick with ddr2, lose about 3% performance and save a good deal more $$$, making the AMD system the winner on price/performance.
Can't really argue with any of it and as plenty of others have mentioned, most AMD users would stick with ddr2, lose about 3% performance and save a good deal more $$$, making the AMD system the winner on price/performance.
Core i7 is indeed superb for both gaming and applications and does offer crossfire and sli, but does not sport backward or forward compatibility, which should also be taken into account when choosing between amd / intel.
I own a gigabyte am3 board and it feels great to know that I'll be able to just pop in any next gen cpu that will come out.
I own a gigabyte am3 board and it feels great to know that I'll be able to just pop in any next gen cpu that will come out.
- Mar 7, 2003
- 12,012
- 0
- 40,790
[citation][nom]zipzoomflyhigh[/nom]I saw the X4 955 at ZZF just 2 days ago for $185. Now how do they say the cost is the same?[/citation]
True enough, but realistically we can't be expected to re-edit the article on a daily basis as prices fluctuate. The best we can do is take a snapshot of what's available when we test and go from there.
The onus is of course on the buyer to look into things at the time of purchase. If they find a better deal on parts, then the benchmark information is still useful, but the conclusions must be adjusted accordingly.
That's the only reasonable way to do it.
True enough, but realistically we can't be expected to re-edit the article on a daily basis as prices fluctuate. The best we can do is take a snapshot of what's available when we test and go from there.
The onus is of course on the buyer to look into things at the time of purchase. If they find a better deal on parts, then the benchmark information is still useful, but the conclusions must be adjusted accordingly.
That's the only reasonable way to do it.
hey, the intel system can use better memory:
OCZ OCZ3G1600LV6GK DDR3 PC3-12800 1600 MHz Gold XTC 6GB Triple Channel Kits
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B001IT4BWA/ref=ord_cart_shr?%5Fencoding=UTF8&m=AM8G38W0RM7BF&v=glance
I know that most benchmarcks will not measure any difference (except winRar, winzip, and 7-zip), but is the same price for faster memory (I did not checked the overclocability of the article g.Skill modules, but I also did not searched hard for a good bargain in Amazon)
OCZ OCZ3G1600LV6GK DDR3 PC3-12800 1600 MHz Gold XTC 6GB Triple Channel Kits
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B001IT4BWA/ref=ord_cart_shr?%5Fencoding=UTF8&m=AM8G38W0RM7BF&v=glance
I know that most benchmarcks will not measure any difference (except winRar, winzip, and 7-zip), but is the same price for faster memory (I did not checked the overclocability of the article g.Skill modules, but I also did not searched hard for a good bargain in Amazon)
dragonsprayer
Splendid
- Jan 3, 2007
- 3,809
- 0
- 22,780
Good job THG! yes, my posts are crypic on purpose, you find your answers in them.
Frist, the i7 is the first chip in many years that greatly benfits from water cooling, while others have in the past not as much as the i7.
Next, air cooling is not simple as ordering from newegg and pushing the blk - cyperpower has no clue that is why they had to lower, considerably, the claimed i7 speeds from the first reviews by t-town.
Like i always say just copy the photos, what you see?
finally, you used the 2 coolers i wrote about over a year ago on THG - neither works for i7! I mentioned this since i have plenty of x=pweince with them all. days and days of staring at prime 95 with 3dmark loops.
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/250728-28-xigmateck-thermalright-120mm-plastic-forgot
Look at the photos i post all the time for the real cooler! Second, what you see here:
this runs 4.15ghz for weeks of prime - but certain settings
http://s329.photobucket.com/albums/l373/warpedsystems/?action=view¤t=WSZ-WCcm-T63-1.jpg
this runs 4.25ghz with 8 cores at any settings:
http://s329.photobucket.com/albums/l373/warpedsystems/?action=view¤t=WSZi7X4-44WC-6.jpg
anyone from THG can email me for help to build your own!
nice job THG good info - build off it people!
THG rocks! photos are posted for info, for my friends not advertising - my foes!
Frist, the i7 is the first chip in many years that greatly benfits from water cooling, while others have in the past not as much as the i7.
Next, air cooling is not simple as ordering from newegg and pushing the blk - cyperpower has no clue that is why they had to lower, considerably, the claimed i7 speeds from the first reviews by t-town.
Like i always say just copy the photos, what you see?
finally, you used the 2 coolers i wrote about over a year ago on THG - neither works for i7! I mentioned this since i have plenty of x=pweince with them all. days and days of staring at prime 95 with 3dmark loops.
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/250728-28-xigmateck-thermalright-120mm-plastic-forgot
Look at the photos i post all the time for the real cooler! Second, what you see here:
this runs 4.15ghz for weeks of prime - but certain settings
http://s329.photobucket.com/albums/l373/warpedsystems/?action=view¤t=WSZ-WCcm-T63-1.jpg
this runs 4.25ghz with 8 cores at any settings:
http://s329.photobucket.com/albums/l373/warpedsystems/?action=view¤t=WSZi7X4-44WC-6.jpg
anyone from THG can email me for help to build your own!
nice job THG good info - build off it people!
THG rocks! photos are posted for info, for my friends not advertising - my foes!
dragonsprayer
Splendid
- Jan 3, 2007
- 3,809
- 0
- 22,780
ps: i forgot the crptic stuff -
photo of air cooled is in the THG post ......... its the second best cooler not the best. You can find that with google or x@$t!
nm here: http://s329.photobucket.com/albums/l373/warpedsystems/?action=view¤t=wszi7htpc-G-11.jpg
GL!
remember all these poser builders are using cheapy water coolers by asetek or coolit (uncool it) - since the i7 benfits so much. The problem is your more limited with ambient air temps. Air cooling at high ambient air temps is better somtimes, since there is effiecency loss with water.
custom or good water cooling have no match with i7 - its a true, ok close to, a 150w plateform not the 125w of old.
2 fans on the air coolers! and seal the holes!
photo of air cooled is in the THG post ......... its the second best cooler not the best. You can find that with google or x@$t!
nm here: http://s329.photobucket.com/albums/l373/warpedsystems/?action=view¤t=wszi7htpc-G-11.jpg
GL!
remember all these poser builders are using cheapy water coolers by asetek or coolit (uncool it) - since the i7 benfits so much. The problem is your more limited with ambient air temps. Air cooling at high ambient air temps is better somtimes, since there is effiecency loss with water.
custom or good water cooling have no match with i7 - its a true, ok close to, a 150w plateform not the 125w of old.
2 fans on the air coolers! and seal the holes!
IMPORTANT!!!!
I researched long and hard for my new system that I paid $1075 roughly for. I was sold on the x4 940 for the longest time. I love AMD, my XP 3200+ with my 7600GS is still running at home (until I get home from work today becuase my case will be delivered today
) and has been nothing but great to me. I looked at the i7 920 and just thought it was too expensive at the time. All in all I have read these articles on Tomshardware and Maximumpc and looked up benchmarks, I have even made two spread sheets that lists all the componets and had a colunm for price and have updated them for the last 5 months. One thing that I noticed nobody mentions...is the upgrade path. I did it with my 3200+ it was the best CPU for that chipset, I had no ugrade path except for my vid card. lol yes i was one of those guys that bought another AGP well into the PCIe times. Anyway, my conclusion was I don't want to buy a 940 or a 955 and be stuck with no upgrade path. So i went with a i7 920 and 1 ATI 4890 xtreme. Now I feel good that I can buy a 975 or whatever intel puts out for the 1366 type when they get cheaper later down the road. Like Don Woligrosky mentions too is that I will be doing other stuff with my pc and as of right now intel is ahead in most areas. I hope that helps some people. Now for my bedroom media center pc this will be a different story as it will be all AMD!!!
Anyway...think about your upgrade path too when building a PC.
I researched long and hard for my new system that I paid $1075 roughly for. I was sold on the x4 940 for the longest time. I love AMD, my XP 3200+ with my 7600GS is still running at home (until I get home from work today becuase my case will be delivered today
) and has been nothing but great to me. I looked at the i7 920 and just thought it was too expensive at the time. All in all I have read these articles on Tomshardware and Maximumpc and looked up benchmarks, I have even made two spread sheets that lists all the componets and had a colunm for price and have updated them for the last 5 months. One thing that I noticed nobody mentions...is the upgrade path. I did it with my 3200+ it was the best CPU for that chipset, I had no ugrade path except for my vid card. lol yes i was one of those guys that bought another AGP well into the PCIe times. Anyway, my conclusion was I don't want to buy a 940 or a 955 and be stuck with no upgrade path. So i went with a i7 920 and 1 ATI 4890 xtreme. Now I feel good that I can buy a 975 or whatever intel puts out for the 1366 type when they get cheaper later down the road. Like Don Woligrosky mentions too is that I will be doing other stuff with my pc and as of right now intel is ahead in most areas. I hope that helps some people. Now for my bedroom media center pc this will be a different story as it will be all AMD!!!Anyway...think about your upgrade path too when building a PC.
dragonsprayer
Splendid
- Jan 3, 2007
- 3,809
- 0
- 22,780
AMD makes great chips the new phenon II is a fairly priced product.
i build intel, anyone who knows me from years ago, i was intel fan boy #1. i joined to site to dispute the raine of amd - i say it was from may of o5 until core 2 july of 06 not in o4.
pentium was a better mutli tasking plateform and there are no good tests from 04-05 - lets put that aside.
phenon II is a good product!
good move on amd if you tight on funds. we do not build systems below $2000 and the last system above sold for $4000 to $7000.
amd vs intel debate is probably closer then fx-60 vs X6800 in july of 06
got 2 lov THG!
i build intel, anyone who knows me from years ago, i was intel fan boy #1. i joined to site to dispute the raine of amd - i say it was from may of o5 until core 2 july of 06 not in o4.
pentium was a better mutli tasking plateform and there are no good tests from 04-05 - lets put that aside.
phenon II is a good product!
good move on amd if you tight on funds. we do not build systems below $2000 and the last system above sold for $4000 to $7000.
amd vs intel debate is probably closer then fx-60 vs X6800 in july of 06
got 2 lov THG!
[citation][nom]Crashman[/nom]Wow, Take everything you said, flip it over, and see that you're either a complete zealot or a marketing shill for Intel trying to make AMD fans look bad. I've been told not to insult people, but this is a compliment for you.So let me get this straight: You think Core i7 should be compared to a 3-core Phenom so that even more money can be spent on beefing up the Phenom system? If that's the case, why not put a Core 2 Duo in the Intel system? Or a Pentium Dual-Core E5200 perhaps. Then OC the E5200 to 4.2GHz while supplying it with superior parts on the graphics side. I'm sure you'd have loved to see that kind of deck-stacking against the AMD.And then you complain about the AMD overclock without even considering the low Intel overclock. AMD was cheated from a more significant victory with its 0.2 GHz below-max overclock, which favored Intel's 0.4 GHz below-max overclock?It looks to me that Don skewed this article as much as possible towards AMD and still you say the same old crap about Intel money and bribes.Everything you say isn't just a simple lie, it's the direct opposite of the truth. To say I gave money to charity when I didn't would be a lie. To say you gave money to a charity when you actually robbed its drop box would be the opposite of the truth.Insults? There aren't really any insults good enough for people like you. Go climb in a hole, or better yet, just go to a redneck bar and tell the kind folks there what you really think of their women.And when you get back here, please post pictures from your adventure![/citation]
Are you going to be ok?
I am saying pit a tiny lil Dual Core Phenom II 550BE vs i7 - use 1 4870. Run at stock clox. Run at 3.5 Oclox. Run at max oclox. Use best possible ram for tests. Test same set of games. And blow your lil mind.
The cost will be roughly half price. Don't spend the extra cash. I7 will win something - but the lil dually 550BE will win a lot more than you know.
Is that hard to understand? Is that offensive?
Apart from all of that - I am a blatantly obvious AMD enthusiast. I know already that most gamers will blow their lil minds on this test. I also know that a paid fanboy site will never reveal this truth - I will apologize for that remark if they do. Let the truth be revealed - it doesn't matter who wins - it's the relative performance - and the cost - that will disturb people. I plan on building such an AMD system for myself - so I will be putting my money where my big mouth is. And I think I will cheapen the vidcard card with a 4830 or a 4850, undecided.
As for rednecks - that's very funny - thank you for the giggles.
I apologize if you are threatened by this idea. I apologize to the i7 people who already invested in that costly thing when it was not necessary. It's not a good gamer.
Oh yeh - make sure the gaming tests are in 1920 resolutions.
Thanks for your help.
sigh
.
Are you going to be ok?
I am saying pit a tiny lil Dual Core Phenom II 550BE vs i7 - use 1 4870. Run at stock clox. Run at 3.5 Oclox. Run at max oclox. Use best possible ram for tests. Test same set of games. And blow your lil mind.
The cost will be roughly half price. Don't spend the extra cash. I7 will win something - but the lil dually 550BE will win a lot more than you know.
Is that hard to understand? Is that offensive?
Apart from all of that - I am a blatantly obvious AMD enthusiast. I know already that most gamers will blow their lil minds on this test. I also know that a paid fanboy site will never reveal this truth - I will apologize for that remark if they do. Let the truth be revealed - it doesn't matter who wins - it's the relative performance - and the cost - that will disturb people. I plan on building such an AMD system for myself - so I will be putting my money where my big mouth is. And I think I will cheapen the vidcard card with a 4830 or a 4850, undecided.
As for rednecks - that's very funny - thank you for the giggles.
I apologize if you are threatened by this idea. I apologize to the i7 people who already invested in that costly thing when it was not necessary. It's not a good gamer.
Oh yeh - make sure the gaming tests are in 1920 resolutions.
Thanks for your help.
sigh
.
dragonsprayer
Splendid
- Jan 3, 2007
- 3,809
- 0
- 22,780
we have a set of these water cooled 4890's from power down color - great product great price. all 4890's oc really well - water cooling is very inexpensive.
Im sorry, but this comparison is a joke. The Intel I7 overclocked correctly, and giving the intel i7 the matching video cards instead of downgrading the video to give AMD a bump in performance is a joke. People buy the Intel I7 because they want the best performance and they buy the AMD when they are broke and need good performance at lower cost.
WE ALL KNOW, that the i7 overclocked with matching video cards will destroy AMD in almost any test.
WE ALL KNOW, that the i7 overclocked with matching video cards will destroy AMD in almost any test.
- Mar 7, 2003
- 12,012
- 0
- 40,790
[citation][nom]sighQ2[/nom]I am saying pit a tiny lil Dual Core Phenom II 550BE vs i7 - use 1 4870. Run at stock clox. Run at 3.5 Oclox. Run at max oclox. Use best possible ram for tests. Test same set of games. And blow your lil mind.The cost will be roughly half price.[/citation]
That's what i alluded to at the end of this review, dude. I spent a couple paragraphs on that in the conclusion, you should read it.
The Phenom II 550 BE or Phenom II X3 720 are excellent buys for the dollar. Will they beat an i7 when overclocked? Probably not, but they probably won't be embarrassed, either. And they'll do it for hundreds less.
We covered that.
That's what i alluded to at the end of this review, dude. I spent a couple paragraphs on that in the conclusion, you should read it.
The Phenom II 550 BE or Phenom II X3 720 are excellent buys for the dollar. Will they beat an i7 when overclocked? Probably not, but they probably won't be embarrassed, either. And they'll do it for hundreds less.
We covered that.
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Question upgraded to 32gb ddr4 and now it wont boot above 2133mhz - help appreciated- Started by SophieTheMeh
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