PM2 jumper setting

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teholdsedare

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Nov 15, 2011
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I have a 30 GB IDE 7200 RPM drive, I had it in my back storage bin for 8 years, I used it last in 2001, and I had not been able to get it working for the last 9 or so years. I pulled out everything I had HD wise, slapped it in... no dice as usual. I was about to toss it in the garbage, and then I decided to play around.

BTW my test was as follows - Sec IDE Master, primary slave (with master and without master) PRI Master, with slave and without, yanked everything including floppy, put on all 4 settings again... nothing at all ever. 9 years straight.

So as I was throwing it away, I saw this PM2 setting. I jumpered that, and it booted. I was shocked. It showed up! So I went through all of my old drives that were supposedly dead, and I now have 3 ressurected HDs.

WHY IS THIS WORKING? This was supposed to be for Power Management compatible boards, but I am using an ancient Matsonic board with Athlon 1.2 CPU. Crappy 16Meg video card... basicly nothing special, but seriously.... Why did these Hard Drives start working out of no where? and not just a fluke... but 4 of them!?!?!?

Other notes:
They are all installed with WINXP Pro, One has a confirmed bad boot sector, still shows up as a SECONDARY PM2 UNDER THE OTHER PRIMARY PM2 DRIVE. I can not install 2 drives on the same cable with PM2 selected, but that I figured would make sense.

Just looking for insight, not really a problem I guess.

Help me o' Hard Drive gods :)
 
Solution
F
Thanks, now it's starting to make a lot of sense.

In fact I had suggested on several occasions that users try the PM2 jumper for troubleshooting purposes, but have never received any feedback until now. The reason that the drive shows up in BIOS when PUIS is enabled is that it uses the information in the onboard serial flash memory chip to identify itself. This proves that the PCB is mostly OK.

If PUIS is disabled, then the drive spins up and attempts to load the bulk of its firmware from a reserved System Area (SA) on the platters. It then identifies itself using these data, rather than the data in flash. If there is an internal fault, then the SA may be inaccesible, or its firmware modules (eg program code, SMART data, defect lists...
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The PM2 jumper controls Power Up In Standby (PUIS). It is used in large arrays to avoid the problem of all drives spinning up at once.

If PUIS is enabled, then the drive won't spin up until it receives a read or write command, or a special ATA Set Features subcommand.

See the following documents:

Working Draft AT Attachment 8 - ATA/ATAPI Command Set (ATA8-ACS):
http://www.t13.org/documents/UploadedDocuments/docs2008/D1699r6a-ATA8-ACS.pdf

Jumper Settings for WD SATA and EIDE Hard Drives:
http://www.wdc.com/wdproducts/library/other/2579-001037.pdf
 
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And it powers just fine.
Did you read the entire original post? I explained very thoroughly what is confusing me.
Not WHAT PM2 IS... but why it is enabling use on previously dead HDs when used under Master/Slave aka... normal IDE conditions.
More or less baffled... and I dont like finding a trick with my hardware and then have no idea why it worked. 😛

Thats all :)
 
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I meant to put a 2nd part on that first sentence.

It powers up just fine, but windows does not detect it unless its PM2.
Bios shows the drive, but it stalls when loading windows, or BSOD on one of them, or simply just loops while loading windows on another.

Why does windows XP care that the jumper is PM2 as different from slave/master?
 
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Some of my questions may appear ignorant, but please indulge me.

IIUC, none of your 4 drives are detected by BIOS (even with blank model number fields?) if the PM2 jumper is absent. Furthermore, none of the drives spin up unless the PM2 jumper is installed. Have I understood you correctly?

What are the model numbers of your drives? I can't find anywhere in the documentation that talks about PM2 jumpers in IDE models, only SATA. Moreover, the SATA PM2 jumper has the reverse effect. That is, PUIS is enabled if the jumper is installed, meaning that the jumper has to be removed in order for the drive to spin up on power-on.

I don't understand what you mean by "SECONDARY PM2 under the other PRIMARY PM2 drive". Are you saying that the two drives are listed in your BIOS configuration as stated, or do they show up in Device Manager under Windows XP as stated? Does "PRIMARY PM2" refer to a drive on the primary IDE port that is configured for PM2, and does "SECONDARY PM2" refer to a similarly configured drive on the secondary IDE port? AIUI, some BIOSes identify drives as PM, PS, SM, SS (Primary/Secondary Master/Slave).

When you say that "it booted", are you saying that the system booted from one of your resurrected drives?
 
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I had long reply last night, and then my wireless disconected when I submitted, and it erased it. I hate PHP sometimes.


1. Model numbers WD 200, WD 300, WD 400, WD 800. All IDE drives.
When I dont use PM2, The drives spin up and do NOT show up in the bios. The post shows NONE on all IDE's. When I use PM2, it defaults to Master. I can not use a slave drive when PM2 is selected. So when I tested another WD200 that had died, (one without a working boot sector) it loaded on the secondary IDE. Thats why i said Secondary PM2. Since PM vs PS dont really mean anything since PM2 is used, I guess I should say PP and SP.

It booted - I was able to load the old OS from 2003 on the 30GB drive, and I found lots of my old music :) was not able to do this before.

I tested this on Asus A7N266-vm, Matsonic MS8137C, PC chips M863G. Matsonic was shorting out, and last night the AGP died, no onboard video, so I cant test it on that anymore. Asus was put in a customer computer monday, sold and gone. I can still test on the PC chips board and I have an old ASUS board I can test this with still.

One of the drives (WD800) is detected by the bios without PM2, but for somereason the file system table does not save, so all the data clears when I remove it from the computer. So basicly this is an 80GB drive I used for a swap file. However PM2 at least made this drive bootable. Before it would stall after post. Now at least it gives me the error of... no OS restart computer... what ever it says... I cant recite that one. Its the one in all caps... lol

Never even got that far without PM2.

Off to work. Ill check this later.
 
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Thanks, now it's starting to make a lot of sense.

In fact I had suggested on several occasions that users try the PM2 jumper for troubleshooting purposes, but have never received any feedback until now. The reason that the drive shows up in BIOS when PUIS is enabled is that it uses the information in the onboard serial flash memory chip to identify itself. This proves that the PCB is mostly OK.

If PUIS is disabled, then the drive spins up and attempts to load the bulk of its firmware from a reserved System Area (SA) on the platters. It then identifies itself using these data, rather than the data in flash. If there is an internal fault, then the SA may be inaccesible, or its firmware modules (eg program code, SMART data, defect lists, LBA-to-CHS translator) may be corrupt. If this happens, then the drive may remain BUSY, or it may power up in some kind of safe mode, thus rendering it invisible to BIOS.

Here is a free online diagnostic service (AFF Repair Station) that can diagnose bad firmware modules:
http://hdd-tools.com/products/rrs/

BTW, my Internet machine still runs a 13 year old PCChips M571 motherboard. I was going to upgrade to an Asus P4 motherboard, but I have to repair it first (faulty 2.5V regulator).
 
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Solution
I am sad. My PCchips board finally died an hour ago. It had an issue that I have not been able to detect in the video processor onboard, and I installed a DVD burner, and boom no post. Swapped 3 processors, still no error beeps with no ram on board. I guess its finally time to retire it. :) If I can find an AM3 processor for this extra MSI board I have, I will have a decent troubleshooting machine. Got a used one? lol

It was a free board anyways. lol

As far as the PM2 jumper, that fits everything perfectly. I did not know those drives had a flash memory, so seeing that it caused it to work after the firmware failed means there is a use for it other then Power Management.

Thanks for the input Fz. :)
 
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