RAM upgrade no issues????

[Guest]

Can I literally just open this up and add say 2x8gb ram sticks and put the case back on and job done or will I have to do other things. If so can you recommend ram. I know PSU and CPU are outdated.
http://www.pcworld.co.uk/gbuk/desktop-pc-monitors/desktop-pcs/gaming-pcs/cyberpower-empire-elite-gaming-pc-21831981-pdt.html?

 

[Guest]

I mean change existing ram obviously not add more ram. So change 2x4gb ram for 2*8gb

 

[InvalidError]

If everything went well, that's all there should be to it. When I upgraded my PC to 32GB RAM, I put a second 2x8GB kit in, done.

 

[Guest]

So I open the case get to the RAM. Remove the RAM and switch it out. And boot up like normal and that's all? Could you recommend some really high end ram I could exchange it for and will this RAM greatly improve gaming performance?. Thanks.

 

[InvalidError]

Between low-end 1066MT/s memory and high-end 2400MT/s memory, the performance improvements are only in the neighborhood of 10%. High performance memory is one of the least cost-effective upgrades possible. The most important thing about memory is having enough of it to avoid relying on the swapfile during normal use.

As far as RAM recommendations go, I would say look for the current prices for 1600-9-9-9 and do not bother paying more than maybe 10% more for anything faster than that. Most of the major manufacturers have similar warranties, so picking a recommendation is almost down to splitting hairs.

 

[LaoziSailor]

I no longer have my (RIP) 16GB RAM, i7-4700HQ ASUS G750JW-SB71-CB, the BIOS got fried.

So I bought a (refurb), ASUS X750JN, to keep me working..., uuugh! what a downer; it only carries 8GB and ASUS insists I can't put 2 16GB stick I have because the machine will be hurt. It's still in the 3 month warranty window so I'll wait.

What really got me upset was that they would not explain WHY..., so I set out to research it myself.
In short, this is a mixture of limitations. One is in how many "address lines" the CPU itself supports (different from the 64/32-bit address space/register size), 32 lines would allow 4GB of RAM, having a 33rd line connected would allow 8GB of ram and so on.
The other problem is in how many of those address lines the manufacturer actually bothers to wire up to the memory controller.
In the end, it was my mistake to just trust ASUS and not do my homework in depth. In order to simplify the design the manufacturers tend to decide on a current realistic amount of memory and wire up as many address lines as are needed to support that amount of memory.

Soo, I found a machine I was able to salvage, an ASUS G60JX and according to specs it can only go to 8GB.
This one has 4 slots and I have four (4) 8GB sticks but I'll be faced with the same problem if I ask ASUS and i have no idea how to check for address lines on the MoBo, so I'm left with anecdotal evidence provided by others that have tried it.

That's where I'm at..., any takers?

Thanks!

 

[InvalidError]

That's not how DRAM chips work. They have 16 address lines (A0-A15) and since these are used during the DRAM configuration process to program the DRAM chips' Memory Setup Register, all address lines must be present. Some of the address bits have alternate purposes during row and column addressing, which reduces the usable address space but that part is beyond motherboard manufacturers' reach.

What motherboard manufactures do have control over is memory ranks: the number of independent memory banks supported per DIMM. A normal DIMM usually has two ranks of memory: one per side.

Mainstream memory controller only support four rank select line per memory channel, which is only enough to support two dual-rank DIMMs (two slots) per channel and because of that, you will hardly ever see four ranks mainstream DIMMs. Four ranks is more a server thing.

 

[MDXX]

That's not how DRAM chips work. They have 16 address lines (A0-A15) and since these are used during the DRAM configuration process to program the DRAM chips' Memory Setup Register, all address lines must be present. Some of the address bits have alternate purposes during row and column addressing, which reduces the usable address space but that part is beyond motherboard manufacturers' reach.

What motherboard manufactures do have control over is memory ranks: the number of independent memory banks supported per DIMM. A normal DIMM usually has two ranks of memory: one per side.

Mainstream memory controller only support four rank select line per memory channel, which is only enough to support two dual-rank DIMMs (two slots) per channel and because of that, you will hardly ever see four ranks mainstream DIMMs. Four ranks is more a server thing.

you sound like you know your stuff with it comes to RAM, but is this english lol? *mind blown*

 

[InvalidError]

you sound like you know your stuff with it comes to RAM, but is this english lol? *mind blown*

The rank stuff is a somewhat obscure part of DRAM specs. I know about this detail mainly because I ran into that issue back in the P3 days where memory controllers had three slots sharing four rank select signals, which meant you could use 3x single-rank, 1x dual-rank + 2x single-rank or 2x dual-rank. In any case, that meant 512MB maximum RAM with the DRAM chips available at the time.

 

[LaoziSailor]

My knowledge of RAM stops at Magnetic-core memory. We had the X, Y, Z and S wires going through the donuts.
If you looked at it with an oscilloscope you would have wondered "what's on and off?", the amount of noise was incredible and only the clock made the 0 and 1's actually visible.

I read the Wikipedia entries on DIMM's, and the other terms involved here and I am no wiser *chuckles and groans*.

The X750JN has two (2) slots = DIMM's ?? with 4GB chips and I woul invest in 2 x 16GB chips if I knew they would work.

The G60JX has four (4) slots and three (3) are populated with 2GB chips. I have 4x 8GB chips which would be ideal.

Does the AIDA64 report for both machines help to determine the feasability of what I would like to do?

Thanks



====================

--------[ AIDA64 Extreme ]----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Version AIDA64 v5.60.3700
Benchmark Module 4.1.643-x64
Homepage http://www.aida64.com/
Report Type Quick Report
Computer LaoziX750JN
Generator LaoziSailor
Operating System Microsoft Windows 8.1 6.3.9600.18090 (Win8.1 RTM)
Date 2015-12-15
Time 23:02


--------[ SPD ]---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[ DIMM1: SK Hynix HMT451S6AFR8A-PB ]

Memory Module Properties:
Module Name SK Hynix HMT451S6AFR8A-PB
Serial Number 48642AAEh (2922013768)
Manufacture Date Week 27 / 2014
Module Size 4 GB (1 rank, 8 banks)
Module Type SO-DIMM
Memory Type DDR3 SDRAM
Memory Speed DDR3-1600 (800 MHz)
Module Width 64 bit
Module Voltage 1.35 V / 1.5 V
Error Detection Method None
Refresh Rate Normal (7.8 us)
DRAM Manufacturer SK Hynix

Memory Module Features:
Auto Self Refresh (ASR) Not Supported
DLL-Off Mode Supported
Extended Temperature Range Supported
Extended Temperature 1X Refresh Rate Not Supported
On-Die Thermal Sensor Readout (ODTS) Not Supported
Partial Array Self Refresh (PASR) Not Supported
RZQ/6 Supported
RZQ/7 Supported

[ DIMM3: SK Hynix HMT451S6AFR8A-PB ]

Memory Module Properties:
Module Name SK Hynix HMT451S6AFR8A-PB
Serial Number 48742AAEh (2922017864)
Manufacture Date Week 27 / 2014
Module Size 4 GB (1 rank, 8 banks)
Module Type SO-DIMM
Memory Type DDR3 SDRAM
Memory Speed DDR3-1600 (800 MHz)
Module Width 64 bit
Module Voltage 1.35 V / 1.5 V
Error Detection Method None
Refresh Rate Normal (7.8 us)
DRAM Manufacturer SK Hynix

Memory Module Features:
Auto Self Refresh (ASR) Not Supported
DLL-Off Mode Supported
Extended Temperature Range Supported
Extended Temperature 1X Refresh Rate Not Supported
On-Die Thermal Sensor Readout (ODTS) Not Supported
Partial Array Self Refresh (PASR) Not Supported
RZQ/6 Supported
RZQ/7 Supported


====================

--------[ AIDA64 Extreme ]----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Version AIDA64 v5.60.3700
Benchmark Module 4.1.643-x64
Homepage http://www.aida64.com/
Report Type Quick Report
Computer LaoziG60JX
Generator LaoziSailor
Operating System Microsoft Windows 7 Ultimate 6.1.7601.18113 (Win7 RTM)
Date 2015-12-15
Time 23:11


--------[ SPD ]---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[ DIMM1: Kingston ASU1333D3S9DR8/2G ]

Memory Module Properties:
Module Name Kingston ASU1333D3S9DR8/2G
Serial Number B002637Ah (2053309104)
Manufacture Date Week 9 / 2010
Module Size 2 GB (2 ranks, 8 banks)
Module Type SO-DIMM
Memory Type DDR3 SDRAM
Memory Speed DDR3-1333 (667 MHz)
Module Width 64 bit
Module Voltage 1.5 V
Error Detection Method None
Refresh Rate Normal (7.8 us)
DRAM Manufacturer Kingston

Memory Module Features:
Auto Self Refresh (ASR) Not Supported
DLL-Off Mode Supported
Extended Temperature Range Not Supported
Extended Temperature 1X Refresh Rate Not Supported
On-Die Thermal Sensor Readout (ODTS) Not Supported
Partial Array Self Refresh (PASR) Not Supported
RZQ/6 Supported
RZQ/7 Supported

Memory Module Manufacturer:
Company Name Kingston Technology Corporation
Product Information http://www.kingston.com/en/memory

[ DIMM3: Kingston ASU1333D3S9DR8/2G ]

Memory Module Properties:
Module Name Kingston ASU1333D3S9DR8/2G
Serial Number B202487Ah (2051539634)
Manufacture Date Week 9 / 2010
Module Size 2 GB (2 ranks, 8 banks)
Module Type SO-DIMM
Memory Type DDR3 SDRAM
Memory Speed DDR3-1333 (667 MHz)
Module Width 64 bit
Module Voltage 1.5 V
Error Detection Method None
Refresh Rate Normal (7.8 us)
DRAM Manufacturer Kingston

Memory Module Features:
Auto Self Refresh (ASR) Not Supported
DLL-Off Mode Supported
Extended Temperature Range Not Supported
Extended Temperature 1X Refresh Rate Not Supported
On-Die Thermal Sensor Readout (ODTS) Not Supported
Partial Array Self Refresh (PASR) Not Supported
RZQ/6 Supported
RZQ/7 Supported

Memory Module Manufacturer:
Company Name Kingston Technology Corporation
Product Information http://www.kingston.com/en/memory

[ DIMM4: Kingston ASU1333D3S9DR8/2G ]

Memory Module Properties:
Module Name Kingston ASU1333D3S9DR8/2G
Serial Number B002617Ah (2053178032)
Manufacture Date Week 9 / 2010
Module Size 2 GB (2 ranks, 8 banks)
Module Type SO-DIMM
Memory Type DDR3 SDRAM
Memory Speed DDR3-1333 (667 MHz)
Module Width 64 bit
Module Voltage 1.5 V
Error Detection Method None
Refresh Rate Normal (7.8 us)
DRAM Manufacturer Kingston

Memory Module Features:
Auto Self Refresh (ASR) Not Supported
DLL-Off Mode Supported
Extended Temperature Range Not Supported
Extended Temperature 1X Refresh Rate Not Supported
On-Die Thermal Sensor Readout (ODTS) Not Supported
Partial Array Self Refresh (PASR) Not Supported
RZQ/6 Supported
RZQ/7 Supported

Memory Module Manufacturer:
Company Name Kingston Technology Corporation
Product Information http://www.kingston.com/en/memory

 

[InvalidError]

The only way to know what DIMMs the motherboard supports is to look at motherboard specifications. If the manual says 8GB max per DIMM with no additional information, it may or may not support larger DIMMs through higher density chips or quad ranks. If the board supported quad ranks (32 chips per DIMM, 36 chips for ECC), the maximum should have been 16GB per DIMM, limited to one slot per channel.

 

[LaoziSailor]

Surprise, surprise

I decided to take the plunge and do the empirical, one slot empty on the G60JX just begging for a 4GB chip I had.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/144cbysbq4nk6lk/ASUS%20G60JX%20max%20RAM%20exceeded%2012-16-2015%205-41-17%20PM.png?dl=0

The temperature was quite acceptable.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ptt8j6fmume2n5i/ASUS%20G60JX%20max%20RAM%20exceeded%20Temperature%2012-16-2015%206-13-49%20PM.png?dl=0

Tomorrow I'll see if I break the 16GB barrier.

PS. Used the G51J instructions to open the laptop https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zb3orK-SCRg

 

[LaoziSailor]

Extra...,extra...!
16GB barrier broken

Piriform Speccy Summary

Operating System
Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit SP1

CPU
Intel Core i7 720QM @ 1.60GHz 55 °C
Clarksfield 45nm Technology

RAM
22.0GB Dual-Channel DDR3 @ 666MHz (9-9-9-24)

Motherboard
PEGATRON CORPORATION G60JX (Socket 989) 54 °C

Graphics
Generic PnP Monitor (1366x768@60Hz)
1024MB NVIDIA GeForce GTS 360M (ASUStek Computer Inc) 55 °C

Storage
465GB Seagate ST9500420AS ATA Device (SATA) 36 °C
1863GB Seagate ST2000DL001-9VT156 ATA Device (SATA) 35 °C
465GB Western Digital WD 5000BEV External USB Device (USB (SATA)) 31 °C

Audio
High Definition Audio Device

 

[InvalidError]

Extra...,extra...!
16GB barrier broken

Heh

One more example of how the manufacturer's official specifications do not necessarily match actual limits, especially when new DRAM densities become available after the last time the manufacturer bothered to update the specs, which is already rare for desktop boards and next to never for laptops.