News Russia Aims to Mass Produce 28nm Chips by 2027, 14nm by 2030

[George³]

And I hope that with "2" nanometer class processes, the descent will end. It becomes pointless to invest an insane amount of money with the diminishing returns of the resulting product obtained only thanks to the lithographic node number. It makes much more sense to develop better and more efficient microarchitectures and better software.

 

[TerryLaze]

It makes much more sense to develop better and more efficient microarchitectures and better software.

Why?! do you really think that those DO NOT need insane amounts of money while having diminishing returns? You can only put that many things into an architecture and software only needs the instructions that it needs you can't make it more efficient just because you want to.

 

[George³]

Why?! do you really think that those DO NOT need insane amounts of money while having diminishing returns? You can only put that many things into an architecture and software only needs the instructions that it needs you can't make it more efficient just because you want to.

I did not write that software and microarchitecture development is free. But it doesn't need new factory builds, new lithographic scanners, and yes, I think it's still cheaper and more meaningful and significantly more environmentally friendly.

 

[NihonKuma]

most things don't need more advanced nodes than 28nm. especially automotive and consumer electronics. advanced nodes are only for cpus and gpus. on those items yes, 28nm will never cut it. but cpu and gpu manufacturing is so niche especially if you want to compete at the top that you need cutting edge to even take part. i want them to push for more advanced nodes so that 2nm becomes commonplace and sub nm is cutting edge at tsmc. the US should push far harder for node advancement and outinnovate. i want semiconductor fabs on every continent especially africa and south america. 28nm node manufacturing needs to drop immensely in price where all countries can buy machines to make chips. chip design and fabrication tech should become commonplace at 28nm.

Fair enough, but what you're describing is increased availability/a more distributed supply chain rather than a technical advancement.

Fabs are concentrated in East Asia for a reason, they're extremely expensive and require specialized personnel to operate (High barriers to entry + high operating costs + tough competition + government cooperation). This is the result of a somewhat free/global market environment, where companies like TSMC can pull from a global talent-pool and face stiff competition from other companies.

Now compare this to the news story above, Russia is trying to ramp up its semiconductor production because its access to the global market is restricted. This means that the global market has shrunk due to Russia's exit/sanctioning. It's the global semiconductor firms that are actually making technological advancements. Naturally, given that companies in a somewhat free market have to compete with each other, while companies in restricted markets don't have to compete with foreign firms.

 

[purpleduggy]

Fair enough, but what you're describing is increased availability/a more distributed supply chain rather than a technical advancement.

Fabs are concentrated in East Asia for a reason, they're extremely expensive and require specialized personnel to operate (High barriers to entry + high operating costs + tough competition + government cooperation). This is the result of a somewhat free/global market environment, where companies like TSMC can pull from a global talent-pool and face stiff competition from other companies.

Now compare this to the news story above, Russia is trying to ramp up its semiconductor production because its access to the global market is restricted. This means that the global market has shrunk due to Russia's exit/sanctioning. It's the global semiconductor firms that are actually making technological advancements. Naturally, given that companies in a somewhat free market have to compete with each other, while companies in restricted markets don't have to compete with foreign firms.

except for ultra cutting edge stuff like the best cpus and gpus, i think most older nodes need to be manufactured locally. and they should be continually manufactured until they stop being useful, not abandoned the moment a new thing is created. there are plenty older chip designs like old cpus and gpus and mobile socs that still can be made new locally in poorer regions. this will save the environment and more importantly lower costs locally making tech widespread. older chip designs will then enjoy further profits whereas now they would be abandoned. manufacturers see nothing of the profit of used products that enter poorer countries. if you can make a 3 or 4 generation old iphone or samsung in poorer areas, they can further gain profit from their short lived R&D and tooling but at far lower cost. there is no point in importing 10 year old tech. just make it locally. tsmc can build fabs locally in countries to do this especially older nodes so they do not need imports on older nodes. shipping is far more expensive than local manufacturing.