Samsung Accused of Trying to Silence Report of GS4 Fire

[InvalidError]

If the phone did actually malfunction it typically results from using unsupported batters or chargers or some of the other issues jimmysmitty mentioned.

With devices that use USB for charging, there technically is no such thing as an "unsupported charger" since all the USB power source does is provide 5V up to whatever its current limit is regardless of what the device does with it.

But as with anything else, you can have a defective or poorly designed USB power adapter that will ruin your day.

 

[Wisecracker]

The guy ain't too bright.

Edit: And, his 5 minutes are up.

 

[InvalidError]

Every settlement agreement I've seen is written the same way. He is not being forced to sign it. He neglects to state if he even tried to just RMA the phone.

How often do you get asked to sign a settlement that absolves the vendor for all future potential damages for a normal RMA? I have never had to sign any for any of the hardware I have gotten replaced in the past... at least nothing that goes beyond agreeing that my defective product may be replaced by an equivalent product of similar or superior specifications.

The reason for the settlement papers is because Samsung wants to get off the hook in case the guy decides to start a civil lawsuit for further damages beyond the warranty replacement (ex.: damaged furniture) or join a hypothetical future class-action lawsuit if the problem is relatively common. If the problem is somewhat common, public safety agencies may order Samsung to issue a recall due to fire hazard so it isn't surprising that Samsung might want to settle those quietly if they can.

 

[oczdude8]

this smells SUPER fishy. Not sure how a power connection can catch fire. as someone else mentioned, he probably dropped it in water and he's trying to pull a fast one on Samsung/Rogers.

I don't see how a simple connection between 2 wires (the charging port) can catch fire. Samsung knew this and just wanted to get rid of the evidence before people jump to incorrect conclusions about the S4. and judging by the comments in the YouTube video, they were right to do so. Unfortunately, people will believe the first thing they see on the internet without doing any further research.

 

[m32]

Mez wantz yourz moneyz.....

 

[rwinches]

I just viewed the Youtube vid.
FWIW
So we see a melted area around the micro USB port the battery is fine. Th USB cable end is burned/melted, but we only see a quick glimpse.

They are in the garage hmm. They say Samsung needed video proof so instead of getting a shot of the phone placed where this happened where with the way the burn looks there must have been collateral damage, we are in the garage.

There is nothing in the phone or in the cable that would produce that much heat. The supply which looks fine is a switching unit just like the one I have (Samsung) it regulates voltage and current.

We are in the garage though where we can do stuff like use a heavy duty soldering iron.

Sorry the way all this is done it is just like those UFO vids you know no steady shots poor lighting and focus. Yeah and stories about apartment buildings burning to the ground, and exploding batteries (this one is fine though).

Broken wire or loose USB connector causing arcing? Hmmm, but what about the switching supply's protection limits? Most of the damage is on the cord end, in fact it appears that that is where the heat came from that melted the case around the phone's USB connector. That would mean it was the cable that was defective not the S4.

Oh and the fact that he owned all the failed devices and how wonderful those companies were replacing them without question.

 

[ElMoIsEviL]

So a power surge... so it wasn't the phone that cooked itself it was a power surge at the source. Duh... look at the damage.

 

[Cash091]

I have had my s4 since it came out and I have had no issues with this at all! There have been a few 2 hour road trips which involved me using GPS, a bluetooth Moga controller, and an SNES emulator all while having the phone connected to a Philips adapter that converts the cigarette lighter to a USB port for charging! In fact I regularly use that charger while using my phone. Using the split window feature I browse reddit while running GPS fairly often. Other drivers need not worry, my wife usually drives!

 

[alextheblue]

Everyone is overlooking the fact that this guy posted a video on YouTube about the alleged "melting" before informing Samsung. This screams foul play. Samsung was ready to defend itself from someone obviously looking for attention or money. Had he gone through the proper channels, it is unlikely that legal paperwork would have even existed. Samsung would be idiotic to hand someone a free phone when the chances are he might try to sue after he got it.

Anything breaks on your phone, the first thing you do is notify the company. That's basic common sense. You don't publicly attack the company then get mad when you don't get something "free no strings attached' afterword.

Well... that's not what the article says.

"Wygand said that his provider, Rogers, told him to take the phone back to Samsung. Before it would replace the phone, Samsung apparently asked for proof in the form of a video. Unfortunately, it seems Samsung would rather not share that proof with the rest of the world. Wygand posted his video proof to YouTube and sent a link to Samsung."

He went to the phone company. They sent him to Samsung, who asked for a video before they would do anything. Bam, here's your video! Right here on Youtube... for easy access. If you were in his shoes and your phone started smoking and you woke up to that mess, how would you feel if Samsung or whatever company said "We don't believe you send us video proof first"? Personally I'd be pretty irritated.

Anyway, I'm not saying whether or not he's legit, or what caused the problem. He could be a total fraud. But it looks like he DID try to contact first Rogers and then Samsung prior to the video, and their answer did not please him. Then you've got the demands to remove the video and sign an NDA, never again discussing the incident. Whoa.

 

[JD88]

Everyone is overlooking the fact that this guy posted a video on YouTube about the alleged "melting" before informing Samsung. This screams foul play. Samsung was ready to defend itself from someone obviously looking for attention or money. Had he gone through the proper channels, it is unlikely that legal paperwork would have even existed. Samsung would be idiotic to hand someone a free phone when the chances are he might try to sue after he got it.

Anything breaks on your phone, the first thing you do is notify the company. That's basic common sense. You don't publicly attack the company then get mad when you don't get something "free no strings attached' afterword.

Well... that's not what the article says.

"Wygand said that his provider, Rogers, told him to take the phone back to Samsung. Before it would replace the phone, Samsung apparently asked for proof in the form of a video. Unfortunately, it seems Samsung would rather not share that proof with the rest of the world. Wygand posted his video proof to YouTube and sent a link to Samsung."

He went to the phone company. They sent him to Samsung, who asked for a video before they would do anything. Bam, here's your video! Right here on Youtube... for easy access. If you were in his shoes and your phone started smoking and you woke up to that mess, how would you feel if Samsung or whatever company said "We don't believe you send us video proof first"? Personally I'd be pretty irritated.

Anyway, I'm not saying whether or not he's legit, or what caused the problem. He could be a total fraud. But it looks like he DID try to contact first Rogers and then Samsung prior to the video, and their answer did not please him. Then you've got the demands to remove the video and sign an NDA, never again discussing the incident. Whoa.

The only evidence of any of that is his word. I find it highly unlikely that Samsung asked him to send a video of anything. In all likelihood, they would just RMA the phone. If they did indeed ask for a video, it was only after he refused to send them the phone for inspection. Likely because it would reveal the entire thing to be a fraud.

 

[elmo2006]

Samsung is synonymous for atrocious support for their products. I have an Samsung SSD Pro 256GB and though it works like a charm without issue, however there is a growing concern for warranty repair for their SSD's within Canada. Their Canadian website has no link for warranty work.
http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/storage/60608-samsung-ssd-support-canada.html
Until Samsung can get their crap together I will no longer purchase their products.

 

[techngro]

Maybe it was a special version to promote the Hunger Games movie. You know...catching fire..

 

[makaveli316]

What a fanboy is the people commenting here. It's not about the guy who exagerated or not, it's about Samsung's response to this incident. I'm also a GS3 user, but this is crazy. I guess all companies are douches, not oy Apple.

 

[TheRealArtlover]

Quote: "The issue here is not a problem about the defectiveness of these electronic devices, it's about the way that samsung wants to mute its angry customers."

Exactly. It's quite disturbing how many people are jumping on this guy and/or going all off topic about failure rates and junk. That is not the issue.

The issue is, his phone broke through no fault of his own, and Samsung won't do anything about it unless he gives up all his rights and hide's everything about the failure. He owned their product, their product failed, they need to replace it. Only thing Samsung has any right to demand is proof that it wasn't his fault. He did that already. End of story. Last time I checked, there are laws about this kind of thing. Samsung can't refuse to honor or apply a whole bunch of new conditions to their warranty after the fact just because it's embarrassing to them, yet that is exactly what they are doing. This is lawsuit material right here. Holding warranty service hostage to extort his silence.

 

[cbrunnem]

it sounds like there was a connection problem between the phone and the cable and it started arcing. just like a welder works. whats hard to grasp is that it takes significant current to melt metal like that.... like more then what goes through a phone charger.

 

[eddieroolz]

Astroturfing is strong in the comments. The problem here is the hide the problem mentality of one of the largest phone makers in the world.

 

[virtualban]

The more they try to silence it, the more it grows.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straisand_Effect

 

[pmstroex]

Several people here mention that it is all about Samsung acting like a complete ogre.

I would like to point out a simple question that I think is being ignored and should be asked first : Is that GS4 owner himself at fault for the defect (telling the truth) ?

More questions : Is he aware of warranty conditions ? Did he even read the manual, specifically the warnings on what to do and what not do with delicate electronic equipment ?

In my experience there are shedloads of people who feel entitled to free replacements even when the failure of these devices is totally their own fault. ESPECIALLY with mobile phones ! Oh the stories i can tell about people flipping their lid when, for example, they don't get a new phone even though ' it only was in the toilet for a moment', or 'no it never was in contact with water (liquid)' and then we open it up and the detergent vapours come flying out - not to mention the white residue on the pcb.

This chap here could simply have been taking a shower, water vapour condenses on the contacts and next thing you know he's putting >1A of current through there. Gee.. I wonder what that would do ?
No, don't give me arguments on how these devices should be able to withstand any and all things you do to them. There are technological limits and compromises that are being made when designing hardware like this. RTFM, for fsm's sake.

Now let's examine Samsung's request for video proof. I have never heard of Samsung asking for such a thing. May be different across the pond, still, never heard of it where I work fixing these devices. Why would Samsung even ask for proof like that AFTER the event happened ? Doesn't make sense imho.
Picture proof, yes, that would make sense, and yes Samsung does require that sort of evidence as standard practice on a number of warranty issues. In this case a picture of that volcanic fallout would be very telling. Nothing of the sort is seen in the video though. If there had been actual fire damage around the charging area, wouldn't he be more than willing to show that ?

This 'expert' also mentions swollen batteries. Note : swollen. Not volcanic. Not swollen before the fact apparently, but I suppose the first google result mentioned that, so hey, let's bash. Swollen (lithium) batteries are just that. Swollen. They smell, that's it (well and they don't work properly, goes without saying really). I have never seen an exploded one save one case back when i was on the iphone repair team. A newbie was poking around in the jackplug to clear a blockage and pierced the battery. Yep, that I would describe as volcanic. Really spewed and singed the surrounding area. Please not that this involved piercing the battery with a metal object. Worst swollen one I've seen leaked a bit of the goo that's inside of it, again, no fire. I've seen phones that have been run over by cars, dipped into deep fryers and just plain cut in two. No fire damage on any of those.

Next in the video he compares his service request to Apple with the current one (and later Microsoft as well). Apples (npi) and oranges. Different manufacturers maintain different service rules. He even states it was a different issue, so there's nothing there he can base a comparison on. Talk about entitlement, really..

As for the legal bit of it all, I think Samsung is just trying to protect itself from a slanderer. Can't say I disagree with that even though it does seem a bit over the top with all the extra stipulations. Was there ever a point where there was talk about just settling the warranty request like adults ? Because it seems to me that a letter like that would be at the end of a longer chain of events. This seems like an escalation event, which means this customer is telling only part of the story.

 

[InvalidError]

This chap here could simply have been taking a shower, water vapour condenses on the contacts and next thing you know he's putting >1A of current through there. Gee.. I wonder what that would do ?

It should do nothing.

Water condensation is practically distilled water so unless you put your phone/tablet in the freezer and put some salt or other contaminants in there, there shouldn't be enough condensation nor enough contaminants to draw significant current... and many devices these days come with 1.2-2A chargers so 1A should be well within the connector's tolerances.

Managing to cause that much of a burn with only ~10W of total available power would require a well-contained electrical fault. Manufacturing or material defects could certainly cause that. To see if this is legit or fraud, you need to dismantle the USB connector and try to see if you can tell where the burn started from to guess how it may have started.

 

[pmstroex]

Yeah sure, usb connectors are at operating-room levels of cleanliness. Just look at yours and anyone's phone near you, preferably with a magnifying glass. Tons of stuff in there to make a viable conductor when coupled with water.
Oh and just ignore what a short in the connector does to the electronics directly behind it, the device should be able to handle that as well. And ignore what the charger does when confronted with a short, shouldn't send those amps anywhere but on the 2 pins that are designed for it eh ?
But hey, prove me wrong, put a drop in there and hook it up overnight. Only 10 watts, couldn't even light a cigarette with that surely ? Sleep well..

 

[InvalidError]

Oh and just ignore what a short in the connector does to the electronics directly behind it, the device should be able to handle that as well. And ignore what the charger does when confronted with a short, shouldn't send those amps anywhere but on the 2 pins that are designed for it eh ?
But hey, prove me wrong, put a drop in there and hook it up overnight. Only 10 watts, couldn't even light a cigarette with that surely ? Sleep well..

Most devices' USB connector is mounted on a ribbon that goes a few inches further into the device before connecting to the main PCB so there usually aren't any electronics directly behind the USB port... that space is usually occupied by the speaker box.

A properly designed USB port has current limiting circuitry that will shut down current flow after a fault is detected so a short in the port itself would not cause abnormal current flow - at least not long enough to cause damage. A properly designed USB power adapter would also have similar protection.

The data pins do not carry any power and would be AC-coupled to the SoC for termination so even if they shorted to either power pin, current through them would be zero.

The amount of water that might get in the connector from condensation would be extremely small and you would need to plug the cable in before it has a chance to evaporate. Even if you decided to charge your device while still in your steamy bathroom, whatever moisture might have been trapped in the connection would evaporate pretty quickly once current starts passing through it and warm the connector up.

So, if you want to burn a USB port with only 10W input power, you need an electrical fault that is capable of holding just the right characteristics to build up heat without tripping protections. A normal/natural amount of condensation would dry off long before causing any significant damage.

 

[ElMoIsEviL]

What a fanboy is the people commenting here. It's not about the guy who exagerated or not, it's about Samsung's response to this incident. I'm also a GS3 user, but this is crazy. I guess all companies are douches, not oy Apple.

No shit... State Capitalism creates an environmental incentive whereas competition is relegated to nothing more than an urban legend we tell our children. Truth is, the established firms maintain their Oligopoly through the enforcement of Intellectual Property Rights, Patents and Licensing/Fees the State levies on all companies wishing to compete with the established firms (creating barriers to entry into the marketplace and thus making it near impossible for small enterprises to compete with the established firms).

The difference is that Apple is shaped in an identical fashion as Mussolini/Hitler's Fascism. Whereas your vision of how you wish to lead your life is irrelevant and not permissible. Instead, you are compelled to share in the Great Leaders vision. So Creativity and customization are shunned. In their place we see "Order" and "Consistency". Apple is shaped like Fascism in nearly every single way.

Samsung is simply a good ol' neo-liberal enterprise. They're more about mass production than quality. Though I must say a lot of their devices are of a great quality as of late.

Anyway... peace.