Samsung Densifies M.2 SSDs With PoP Controller, Forges Ahead With New Spec

[Guest]

Samsung unveiled its new package on package (PoP) design for its Polaris SSD controllers. PoP designs, which combine the memory and the logic into one discrete (but still separate) package, allow the company to squeeze more NAND onto the M.2 form factor.

Samsung Densifies M.2 SSDs With PoP Controller, Forges Ahead With New Spec : Read more

 

[pocketdrummer]

Too bad they don't curate the ads they put on their website. Whenever they use services like that, it just results in clutter and scams.

 

[Game256]

Is there any info about more concrete 960 release date (like beginning of October or late October)? NewEgg is already accepting pre-orders.

 

[CRamseyer]

We honestly have no idea when they will ship. I heard the samples came back to the US the same day we returned but we do not have samples, a spec sheet or release date information yet.

 

[Patrick_Bateman]

I don't get why SSDs are so expensive? They are physically smaller and have no moving parts, which hard drives do. Is it because NAND purity has to be very high? Or is it because the vendors just set a price that most consumers would be ok with? Still waiting for a 100$ 1 TB 3D NAND SSD.

 

[CRamseyer]

The fabs to make the flash cost 5 billion Dollars and take several years to build. The technology changes roughly every 18 months and each change requires new tools, new processes and so on. Imagine what a car would cost if each year and a half a new design had to come out.

 

[falchard]

Will these work well with Polaris GPUs?

 

[Bruce427]

Chris,

Would your expectation be that the new Samsung 400GB EVO 960 will be superior to the 256GB Pro 950 in pretty much every performance parameter?

I had planned on replacing several 256GB Pro 950s with Pro 960s, but Samsung didn't choose to offer a 256GB pro version.

 

[Bruce427]

Sorry, I meant 500GB EVO 960.

 

[rpg1966]

"SSD manufacturers tend to shy away from using 16-die stacks because of manufacturing complexity" ...and "We know that Samsung is already using small F-chips in some 48-layer NAND packages".

Here, is the number of dies in the "stacks", the same as the number of "layers"?

So whilst 16-die stacks are avoided by some, Samsung (and others) are doing 48- or 64-layers?

 

[PaulAlcorn]

"SSD manufacturers tend to shy away from using 16-die stacks because of manufacturing complexity" ...and "We know that Samsung is already using small F-chips in some 48-layer NAND packages".

Here, is the number of dies in the "stacks", the same as the number of "layers"?

So whilst 16-die stacks are avoided by some, Samsung (and others) are doing 48- or 64-layers?

Each die has 48 layers of cells.

The individual die are stacked, 16 of them.

So, in effect, that would be 768 layers of data cells.

 

[2Be_or_Not2Be]

In the enterprise, they already have the U.2 spec to support 2.5" PCIe SSDs. You can fit way more memory in a 2.5" size versus the M.2 2280 size. This new "Small and Dense" form factor will interesting to see how it develops.

 

[Brian_R170]

"In contrast to popular belief, the SSD controller is really only a very small part of the BOM (Build Of Materials) cost, with prices projected between $5 to $15 apiece."

I sure hope that means we will soon see NVMe SSD priced the same as SATA SSDs of the same capacity.

 

[bit_user]

I don't get why SSDs are so expensive?

The storage medium on hard drives and tapes is just a blank, (relatively) unstructured surface. By comparison, SSDs must have dedicated circuitry fabricated for each cell. That's probably the simplest explanation of why it's been so hard for solid state storage to catch up.

The fabs to make the flash cost 5 billion Dollars and take several years to build.

Fab construction and equipment cost is only one factor. It would be interesting to know how much this adds to the cost of each wafer, because it might not even be the largest term.

The other part of wafer cost is the material, energy, and labor needed to fab each mm^2 of die area. Then, multiply that by the number of dies needed for your SSD, scale by the yield, add overhead for testing and packaging, and then you need to get those chips on a board. And don't forget to add in some profit margin for the fab.

Of course, the SSD vendor has hardware & firmware design costs, as well as support, warranty, and advertising. But the structure of those costs is similar to what a mechanical hard disk vendor would face.

Anyway, just take a step back and consider that a typical consumer can buy over 2 trillion little circuits for a bit over $100. Pretty mind-blowing stuff, IMO. (Newegg has 480 GB SSDs for $112. 480 GB * 8 bits per byte / 1.5 bits per cell = 2.56 trillion cell, not counting over provisioning)

 

[heliomphalodon]

BOM = Bill of Materials, not "Build Of Materials" - nitpick.
Thanks for the update, good story here.