[SOLVED] Secondhand Palit RTX 3090 has high temps ?

[baileyboy125]

I built my PC about 4 years ago with the following components:

• Motherboard: Gigabyte X399 DESIGNARE EX
• CPU: AMD Ryzen Threadripper 1920X
• CPU Cooler: Corsair Hydro Series H150i PRO RGB 360mm (mounted to front intake)
• GPU: GTX 1070
• PSU: Corsair RM1000x
• Case: NZXT H700i RGB
• Cooling has 3x 120mm fans intake through the AIO radiator, 2x 120mm exhaust fans on the top and 1x 140mm exhaust fan at the back

This has worked fine for me for most applications and still does. I recently upgraded to a Palit RTX 3090 GamingPro OC as it was on a good offer secondhand. The problem is when playing a game the card shoots up to over 86-88C with memory junction temps upwards of 76C and hotspot temps of around 105C even up to 108C. The fans are maxed out and it's extremely loud. I've been doing some research on this and I know the 30 series cards run fairly hot, but I don't think the hotspot or main temps are supposed to be that high. Ambient room temps of around 22-24C.

I've tried undervolting the card but it makes no difference to the temps.
Do I not have enough case airflow? I make sure it's free of dust so there are no obstructions anywhere.
Could it be the card itself? I know people repaste and repad them but the Palit supposedly has nonstandard 0.75mm thickness pads that are very hard to source or make. The card still has those screw sticker covers so I don't think the previous owner has opened it up, but I could be wrong and they could have replaced them.

 

[XxDarkMario20xX]

Thats the problem with buying used cards and normaly good deals are to good to be true. Have you tried lowing the performance memory clock and core speed via MSI afterburner?

 

[Phaaze88]

I built my PC about 4 years ago with the following components:

• Motherboard: Gigabyte X399 DESIGNARE EX
• CPU: AMD Ryzen Threadripper 1920X
• CPU Cooler: Corsair Hydro Series H150i PRO RGB 360mm (mounted to front intake)
• GPU: GTX 1070
• PSU: Corsair RM1000x
• Case: NZXT H700i RGB
• Cooling has 3x 120mm fans intake through the AIO radiator, 2x 120mm exhaust fans on the top and 1x 140mm exhaust fan at the back

This has worked fine for me for most applications and still does. I recently upgraded to a Palit RTX 3090 GamingPro OC as it was on a good offer secondhand. The problem is when playing a game the card shoots up to over 86-88C with memory junction temps upwards of 76C and hotspot temps of around 105C even up to 108C. The fans are maxed out and it's extremely loud. I've been doing some research on this and I know the 30 series cards run fairly hot, but I don't think the hotspot or main temps are supposed to be that high. Ambient room temps of around 22-24C.

I've tried undervolting the card but it makes no difference to the temps.
Do I not have enough case airflow? I make sure it's free of dust so there are no obstructions anywhere.
Could it be the card itself? I know people repaste and repad them but the Palit supposedly has nonstandard 0.75mm thickness pads that are very hard to source or make. The card still has those screw sticker covers so I don't think the previous owner has opened it up, but I could be wrong and they could have replaced them.

What's the temperature of the air just below the gpu cooler - not before, but during these sessions?

The reported memory junction is fine.
Airflow may be suspect, after having looked through this: https://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/palit_geforce_rtx_3090_gamingpro_oc_review,1.html
76C core temperature was recorded in the thermal tests, but that was on an open bench in ~20C room temperature. If the air inside the case is much warmer, then it makes sense, as the main source of air directly correlates to operating thermals.

 

[baileyboy125]

Thats the problem with buying used cards and normaly good deals are to good to be true. Have you tried lowing the performance memory clock and core speed via MSI afterburner?

I've just tried it. Lowering it doesn't seem to make much of a difference. Even lowering it to the max (-502) makes no difference to temps or performance.

 

[baileyboy125]

What's the temperature of the air just below the gpu cooler - not before, but during these sessions?

The reported memory junction is fine.
Airflow may be suspect, after having looked through this: https://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/palit_geforce_rtx_3090_gamingpro_oc_review,1.html
76C core temperature was recorded in the thermal tests, but that was on an open bench in ~20C room temperature. If the air inside the case is much warmer, then it makes sense, as the main source of air directly correlates to operating thermals.

Air temp just below the card is about 35C while in game.

 

[Maebius]

I think you might need to take it apart and reapply thermal paste.

Also, I don't know about your h700i case but I found that small-mid ones where the radiator is placed as in front (as an intake) are sometimes problematic.
Imagine that your CPU is as cool as it can get, but the hot-ish air that comes off the CPU is blown towards the the GPU.

Again, for your case, your placement might work just fine but, have you tried putting the radiator on top? If it fits, orientation should be : [fans blowing up]-[radiator]-[top]

By putting it on top you will surely get slightly worse CPU temps but it should be better -overall- for the rest of the insides.

That's a general suggestion as compared to my 3090 (zotac OC, nothing fancy), I doubt it's just an airflow issue.

 

[Phaaze88]

Air temp just below the card is about 35C while in game.

Yep. Sounds like airflow. IF the air going into the gpu cooler was 10C cooler, you'd be seeing close to what Guru3d got in their tests.
Are the H150i's fans in push, or pull? If push, switch to pull - or heck, move the cooler to top exhaust instead. The two 120mm should be front intake, of course.

 

[baileyboy125]

Yep. Sounds like airflow. IF the air going into the gpu cooler was 10C cooler, you'd be seeing close to what Guru3d got in their tests.
Are the H150i's fans in push, or pull? If push, switch to pull - or heck, move the cooler to top exhaust instead. The two 120mm should be front intake, of course.

Sound promising, thank you. As per the suggestions from you and @Maebius I'll try changing the rad to the top and see if that helps at all.

 

[baileyboy125]

@Maebius @Phaaze88 Ok so I've changed the config around. 3x 120mm intake fans directly into the case, AIO is at the top as an exhaust with the 3x 120mm fans and the 140mm at the back has remained unchanged. My average temps are way lower now.
In Cyberpunk 2077 on full ultra settings, I'm getting seeing temps about 10-15C lower than last time, but a few times it did jump up to 86C core, 74C memory and 106C hotspot for a while.

This is only with the undervolt enabled, without it the card goes right back to the really high temps. Previously, undervolting didn't decrease the temps at all so this is a promising start. Thank you again.

 

[KyaraM]

@Maebius @Phaaze88 Ok so I've changed the config around. 3x 120mm intake fans directly into the case, AIO is at the top as an exhaust with the 3x 120mm fans and the 140mm at the back has remained unchanged. My average temps are way lower now.
In Cyberpunk 2077 on full ultra settings, I'm getting seeing temps about 10-15C lower than last time, but a few times it did jump up to 86C core, 74C memory and 106C hotspot for a while.

This is only with the undervolt enabled, without it the card goes right back to the really high temps. Previously, undervolting didn't decrease the temps at all so this is a promising start. Thank you again.

What is your fan curve? Did you adjust that? If not yet, try to make it a bit more aggressive. If nothing helps, as stated above, open the card and reapply thermal paste and pads. That is all you can really do outside putting a water block on it or returning the card.

 

[Phaaze88]

@Maebius @Phaaze88 Ok so I've changed the config around. 3x 120mm intake fans directly into the case, AIO is at the top as an exhaust with the 3x 120mm fans and the 140mm at the back has remained unchanged. My average temps are way lower now.
In Cyberpunk 2077 on full ultra settings, I'm getting seeing temps about 10-15C lower than last time, but a few times it did jump up to 86C core, 74C memory and 106C hotspot for a while.

This is only with the undervolt enabled, without it the card goes right back to the really high temps. Previously, undervolting didn't decrease the temps at all so this is a promising start. Thank you again.

Repaste, and ONLY repaste, except if you accidentally tear some memory pads. Doing both at the same time regardless of pad condition can bite you, which some here and there have learned the hard way.
Warm the card up before you do the operation.



EDIT: What kind of fans are being used in the case?

 

[baileyboy125]

Repaste, and ONLY repaste, except if you accidentally tear some memory pads. Doing both at the same time regardless of pad condition can bite you, which some here and there have learned the hard way.
Warm the card up before you do the operation.



EDIT: What kind of fans are being used in the case?

The radiator has the corsair PWM ML120 that came with the AIO unit. The front 3 fans are just the ones that came with the NZXT case. They are AER F120 (case version) 3pin fans, which are airflow fans. The rear fan is also the one that came with the case, AER F140 (case version).
I was thinking of changing out the front fans for some decent PWM static pressure ones due to the case design.

If I do a repaste I wouldn't want to change the pads anyway since Palit have different revisions of the same card that have different pad thicknesses and even non-standard thickness pads.

 

[Phaaze88]

If I do a repaste I wouldn't want to change the pads anyway since Palit have different revisions of the same card that have different pad thicknesses and even non-standard thickness pads.

Gotcha.


There's also pad hardness, an unknown factor that tends to screw folks opting to replace pads. So even if one matches the thickness of the original pads, they can still screw up because the hardness couldn't be identified.
I've read that manufacturers use pads on the softer side, but I don't know the validity of that.
The hint to how hard commercial pads are is in the w/mK rating: the higher the rating, the harder they are.

 

[baileyboy125]

Gotcha.


There's also pad hardness, an unknown factor that tends to screw folks opting to replace pads. So even if one matches the thickness of the original pads, they can still screw up because the hardness couldn't be identified.
I've read that manufacturers use pads on the softer side, but I don't know the validity of that.
The hint to how hard commercial pads are is in the w/mK rating: the higher the rating, the harder they are.

Supposedly Palit uses a Shore hardness of 40 according to their datasheets. People have used 1mm pads and squished them down to 0.75mm (some of Palits pads need this exact thickness) but I assume that affects their hardness.

 

[Phaaze88]

People have used 1mm pads and squished them down to 0.75mm (some of Palits pads need this exact thickness) but I assume that affects their hardness.

More like, the hardness affects how far one can squish them down.
Not enough give, and you can end up with PCB warping, no contact spots over the gpu die, or worse, a cracked PCB(RIP).
Too much give, and the memory doesn't make firm contact with the heatsink through the pads.

 

[baileyboy125]

Installed some better PWM fans into the case, readjusted the curve of both the case fans and the GPU fans, then played a couple of hours of Cyberpunk on full ultra settings:

GPU benchmarking still brings the temps up to 85C+ but thats not my use case so it doesn't matter.
I've not repasted my GPU but honestly, I don't think I need to. It really was mostly all down to case air flow.

 

[KyaraM]

Installed some better PWM fans into the case, readjusted the curve of both the case fans and the GPU fans, then played a couple of hours of Cyberpunk on full ultra settings:

GPU benchmarking still brings the temps up to 85C+ but thats not my use case so it doesn't matter.
I've not repasted my GPU but honestly, I don't think I need to. It really was mostly all down to case air flow.

Those numbers look really, really good! I think you are fine now.

 

[baileyboy125]

Those numbers look really, really good! I think you are fine now.

Yeah turns out the fans that came with the case were absolutely terrible. Previously not too bad for a GTX 1070 but for a 30 series card they were not up to the task.

 

[Maebius]

Yeah turns out the fans that came with the case were absolutely terrible. Previously not too bad for a GTX 1070 but for a 30 series card they were not up to the task.

Must have been really terrible! I first thought you might have more than airflow issues as those temps seemed way way up!
Glad you're sorted.

 

[XxDarkMario20xX]

Yeah turns out the fans that came with the case were absolutely terrible. Previously not too bad for a GTX 1070 but for a 30 series card they were not up to the task.

this is why like buying Msi card’s because never had problem with the fans. Glad it’s sorted enjoy your gaming

 

[KyaraM]

this is why like buying Msi card’s because never had problem with the fans. Glad it’s sorted enjoy your gaming

It got absolutely nothing to do with the card... Palit makes pretty good cooling systems. And if case airflow sucks, then case airflow sucks, end of story. Your MSI cards wouldn't have faired any better if there is no airflow.

 

[baileyboy125]

Must have been really terrible! I first thought you might have more than airflow issues as those temps seemed way way up!
Glad you're sorted.

The airflow from the front of the H700i is really restricted, it just has little holes along the edges for the air to flow through and a completely solid front. The fans that came with the case were just standard airflow fans, but I swapped them for Silent Wings Pro 4 PWM static pressure fans, which really get the air moving. On full speed, a piece of paper gets sucked onto the holes with quite a lot of force. Previously when the stock fans were on full power that same piece of paper would be drawn towards the holes but the suction was never enough for it to actually stick.

Another important thing to mention is that for some reason the NZXT software wasn't actually updating the fan curves properly, and no matter what I chose the fans were stuck on "silent" mode, so the speed never went above 50%, which obviously made things even worse. A reinstall seems to have fixed that too.

 

[Phaaze88]

The airflow from the front of the H700i is really restricted, it just has little holes along the edges for the air to flow through and a completely solid front.

Both the front and top are restricted. The H700 series is NZXT's solution to the H500's weakness: "We'll brute force air through our minimalist design by throwing moar fans at it."
It works, to an extent.
Neither H500 nor H700 are ideal for utilizing AIO/CLCs - not saying one can't/shouldn't use them, mind you - as the radiator is another source of air resistance, and so, the user is stacking 'walls' and reducing the cooling efficiency of the cooler.

They finally gave in and released their Flow series.