Have standard network with 8 clients having problems with internet speed was getting max 2.8mbs dropping to .5mbs in afternoon so added mobile connection with Viva 4g lte router giving speeds upto 20mbs so trying to setup load balancing but cannot work out ip settings have purchased peplink 380 also Linksys rv042 but cannot get them connected have tried all variations of ip settings. Also have a Tenda 3g611n but canot get the Viva to work with that is shows connected but will not access internet. I need to do this as although the Viva is working fine it seems to be corrupting our opxml ordering I have to unplug whilst I order through adsl line. hope you can make sense of our problem and help out
Setting up Dual WAN on LAN
- Thread starter riscatto
- Start date
You are one of the first people to ask this question here that has a actual load balancers. I have never used the peplink but it appear their load balance choices are similar to F5 from Bigip.
Still your problem is fundamentally the same. You have multiple IP addresses and which you appear to the outside world as depends on which ISP you choose. You as the person configuring the boxes must have a strong understanding of the issues.
You can not load balance by packet because your ip address would change within a single tcp session. This means you can not combine the links to increase for example a single file transfer. This is generally what most people think a load balancer can do which it can not...unless you control both ends of both links.
You can try to load balance by session but certain session have dependencies that the load balancer may not understand. The example most people understand on this forum is a game company. You many times have 1 server IP you log into for authentication and then a second that you play the game on. If the ip address would be different for the connection you make to the authentication server and the game server the company will kick you off thinking hacking is occurring.
You can load balance based on the client IP. This tends to always work but does not balance well. It is equivalent to plugging the users into different ISP router physically but still allowing the lan to share between them.
If you know your applications well you can force certain end applications to always use certain connections.
There are of course many combinations of these but all require you to have pretty good understanding of these problems.
I suspect your problem is the application you are having problems with has some kind of session limitation that is not obvious to the load balancer. You are going to have to find a way to get the load balancer to do the equivalent of your unplugging trick electronically.
Even with a really smart box like you have it is still a lot of work. You still must tell the box what to do as if you were standing there like a traffic cop directing traffic. With the linksys you would have manually do even more.
Their actually is one solution if money is not a problem. You can place device like steelhead from riverbed in a hosting center. You would then form vpn connections over each of your connections to the hosting center. The reason you need these fancy wan accelerator boxes is if you were to just use VPN you solve the multiple IP problem but you get a new one that is even worse with packets out of order. These device correct the packet out of order problem. There is no free lunch though this does increase the delay but the accelerators work to solve that to a point also. The huge downside is the costs both of the hosting center costs as well as these wan accelerator boxes. It does though actually combine the bandwidth from the end user perspective.
Still your problem is fundamentally the same. You have multiple IP addresses and which you appear to the outside world as depends on which ISP you choose. You as the person configuring the boxes must have a strong understanding of the issues.
You can not load balance by packet because your ip address would change within a single tcp session. This means you can not combine the links to increase for example a single file transfer. This is generally what most people think a load balancer can do which it can not...unless you control both ends of both links.
You can try to load balance by session but certain session have dependencies that the load balancer may not understand. The example most people understand on this forum is a game company. You many times have 1 server IP you log into for authentication and then a second that you play the game on. If the ip address would be different for the connection you make to the authentication server and the game server the company will kick you off thinking hacking is occurring.
You can load balance based on the client IP. This tends to always work but does not balance well. It is equivalent to plugging the users into different ISP router physically but still allowing the lan to share between them.
If you know your applications well you can force certain end applications to always use certain connections.
There are of course many combinations of these but all require you to have pretty good understanding of these problems.
I suspect your problem is the application you are having problems with has some kind of session limitation that is not obvious to the load balancer. You are going to have to find a way to get the load balancer to do the equivalent of your unplugging trick electronically.
Even with a really smart box like you have it is still a lot of work. You still must tell the box what to do as if you were standing there like a traffic cop directing traffic. With the linksys you would have manually do even more.
Their actually is one solution if money is not a problem. You can place device like steelhead from riverbed in a hosting center. You would then form vpn connections over each of your connections to the hosting center. The reason you need these fancy wan accelerator boxes is if you were to just use VPN you solve the multiple IP problem but you get a new one that is even worse with packets out of order. These device correct the packet out of order problem. There is no free lunch though this does increase the delay but the accelerators work to solve that to a point also. The huge downside is the costs both of the hosting center costs as well as these wan accelerator boxes. It does though actually combine the bandwidth from the end user perspective.
Hello Bill001g,
Many thanks for your reply, quite detailed at that. I have been searching the forum for clues without success and I think your reply confirms that I am probably the first on here with this problem, whilst waiting for help I searched for Dual Wan routers and found this
Asus-4G-AC55U I then looked on Ebay and found one for sale this router will accept 3G/4G sim and also allow ADSL with load sharing I hope that this will solve my problem, the seller had a similar problem 0.5 speed from BT.
I think what may have solved my problem is if I could have setup the VIVA 4G LTE router to pass through a Tenda 3g611N router through its WAN connection but for some reason I couldn't get it working, the Teda showed CONNECTED in WAN but I could not access internet on the LAN output.
So I am hoping that ASUS have all the software in place if not the river is looking very inviting
Thanks again for reply
Many thanks for your reply, quite detailed at that. I have been searching the forum for clues without success and I think your reply confirms that I am probably the first on here with this problem, whilst waiting for help I searched for Dual Wan routers and found this
Asus-4G-AC55U I then looked on Ebay and found one for sale this router will accept 3G/4G sim and also allow ADSL with load sharing I hope that this will solve my problem, the seller had a similar problem 0.5 speed from BT.
I think what may have solved my problem is if I could have setup the VIVA 4G LTE router to pass through a Tenda 3g611N router through its WAN connection but for some reason I couldn't get it working, the Teda showed CONNECTED in WAN but I could not access internet on the LAN output.
So I am hoping that ASUS have all the software in place if not the river is looking very inviting
Thanks again for reply
Not sure if you are using one of those viva hotspot things and trying to connect to it via wireless that is quite a challenge. It should not really be any different than your ADSL router if you have viva little router.. You just hook the lan ports of each respective device behind the load balancer. Any mobile broadband connection though is going to add even another layer of NAT but that likely doesn't matter to you unless you have ps4 game consoles you intend to use.
Almost all asus routers support the use of mobile broadband usb modems. They have a list of supported ones. Most asus router also support loading asuswrt-merlin or dd-wrt. Both those support even more 4g modems. They also have the load sharing.
Problem is they are the stupid kind of load sharing that have no ability to know the relationships between open sessions. Pretty much you are back to the hard code certain client ip to use a particular device or hard code certain remote sites to always use one particular ISP.
Almost all asus routers support the use of mobile broadband usb modems. They have a list of supported ones. Most asus router also support loading asuswrt-merlin or dd-wrt. Both those support even more 4g modems. They also have the load sharing.
Problem is they are the stupid kind of load sharing that have no ability to know the relationships between open sessions. Pretty much you are back to the hard code certain client ip to use a particular device or hard code certain remote sites to always use one particular ISP.
Well as for the ASUS you may well be right it may be very simple load sharing but all I can do is try, what I have been doing is on client PC NIC is going into advanced settings putting both routers as gateways ie: BT HUB & Viva LTE and in the Metric taking off auto and setting both at 15 then setting the Automatic Interface Metric the same at 15 this seemed to work in a fashion but i need to get the Viva mobile integrated properly on the network or somehow hide it behind another router ie: Tenda so it doesn't cause a conflict. Do you think you could advise on connecting to the Tenda?
The VIVA has Wan IP address of : 10.3.165.XXX no subnet
LAN address of: 192.168.1.2 subnet 255.255.255.0
The Tenda is asking for:
Connection Mode: 3g
Ip Address: this is what i entered (10.3.165.xxxx) static ip seemed to connect
Subnet Mask:
Gateway
It stated connected but I could not connect I think it was either subnet mask or Gateway???
The VIVA has Wan IP address of : 10.3.165.XXX no subnet
LAN address of: 192.168.1.2 subnet 255.255.255.0
The Tenda is asking for:
Connection Mode: 3g
Ip Address: this is what i entered (10.3.165.xxxx) static ip seemed to connect
Subnet Mask:
Gateway
It stated connected but I could not connect I think it was either subnet mask or Gateway???
Not sure the trenda would have to somehow take the viva from it wan connection. It is not 3g it will either be wifi or ethernet. Unless you can somehow take the sim out of the viva device and put it in the tenda you can not use the broadband feature of the tenda.
The asus router would have the same problem. You can not hook the viva up as a modem to the router via usb. It does not have support...and I am not sure the viva will run as a tethered device anyway.
The asus router would have the same problem. You can not hook the viva up as a modem to the router via usb. It does not have support...and I am not sure the viva will run as a tethered device anyway.
I thought the Tend would be able to take the Viva through the Wan connection if it wouldn't then that is probably whats been stumping me, Asus can take the sim card and also has an ADSL connection I'm hoping that will do the job, so I'll have to wait for it to arrive, thanks for taking so much trouble to try and help out
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