[SOLVED] Several question for troubleshooting my unstable RAM

[Hynex]

Hi, I have a question. I have a Ryzen 3600 on a Gigabyte X570 Aorus elite motherboard. Two days ago I bought new RAM. upgraded from 16GB to 32GB and decided not to save and buy a high-quality 3600MHz cl16 memory (Gskill trident Z). This should be optimal for Ryzen 3000. The first day went fine, ran all the benchmarks with nice improvement and without a crash, but the second day, after filling up the RAM, I experienced game crashes and when I realized what was happening, I got a bluescreen while shutting down the computer. (System service exception so something got corrupted in memory... probably...) Unlucky me. After restarting it showed me a message that the system is damaged beyond repair but it booted fine after my BIOS got reset. I want to ask if it was the memory being too fast for my processor or if it could have been caused by the fact that I had set the overclock with a really low voltage and thus less voltage went to the infinity fabric... could that be the reason? That overclock was stable, not a single crash in 5 months, until after adding new memory. I'm currently running on stock both processor and memory and it's terrible. Should I try to re-set the XMP on the stock processor, or would I rather just overclock and give both memory and processor higher voltages? Or should I put some lower frequencies on the memories? I ask because I don't have two days to tune my system right now and because I've more or less forgotten what I knew about clocking Ryzen.


I mean, I don't want to run at 2133MHz even a minute longer, but I don't want to experience another annoying BSOD and I don't quite have the time to test it, so I'm asking if anyone has any experience. I want to go for the first good one, so to speak.

 

[Koekieezz]

Hi, I have a question. I have a Ryzen 3600 on a Gigabyte X570 Aorus elite motherboard. Two days ago I bought new RAM. upgraded from 16GB to 32GB and decided not to save and buy a high-quality 3600MHz cl16 memory (Gskill trident Z). This should be optimal for Ryzen 3000. The first day went fine, ran all the benchmarks with nice improvement and without a crash, but the second day, after filling up the RAM, I experienced game crashes and when I realized what was happening, I got a bluescreen while shutting down the computer. (System service exception so something got corrupted in memory... probably...) Unlucky me. After restarting it showed me a message that the system is damaged beyond repair but it booted fine after my BIOS got reset. I want to ask if it was the memory being too fast for my processor or if it could have been caused by the fact that I had set the overclock with a really low voltage and thus less voltage went to the infinity fabric... could that be the reason? That overclock was stable, not a single crash in 5 months, until after adding new memory. I'm currently running on stock both processor and memory and it's terrible. Should I try to re-set the XMP on the stock processor, or would I rather just overclock and give both memory and processor higher voltages? Or should I put some lower frequencies on the memories? I ask because I don't have two days to tune my system right now and because I've more or less forgotten what I knew about clocking Ryzen.


I mean, I don't want to run at 2133MHz even a minute longer, but I don't want to experience another annoying BSOD and I don't quite have the time to test it, so I'm asking if anyone has any experience. I want to go for the first good one, so to speak.

You could try to run stock speed at first, boot to windows, uninstall amd chipset driver in control panel, download the latest bios for your motherboard, then reboot to bios, update the bios, and go to bios again after update, load optimized, go to overclocking/advanced settings, enable xmp, then find SOC Voltage or DVID SOC, if it is SoC Voltage, increase it to 1.15V, if it's DVID, use the arrow keys to increase it to +0.150V, then save and exit. then install the latest amd chipset driver from amd website and reboot. Sometimes the soc needs to be increased to 1.15v in order gain stability, espescially for 3600mhz at cl16 (incase it's 16-16-16 at primary timings).

 

[Darkbreeze]

What you SHOULD do, as a starting point, is remove the overclock and run the CPU at it's stock configuration, and set the XMP profile for the memory, and then see how it does. If it is stable, THEN you can begin to worry about configuring any overclocked settings for the CPU and performing stability tests to ensure there is no instability.

And yes, low voltage on an overclocked, or even a stock CPU configuration (Or GPU, or memory, or.....anything), can absolutely cause these kinds of problems. Unless you have some magical 1% golden sample CPU, it's pretty rare that you can overclock AND run with a reduced voltage or even simply a low voltage for the overclock without having instability. And keep in mind, if you haven't done the extensive stability testing recommended by most experienced overclocking enthusiasts then the simply fact that your system wasn't hard crashing or having BSODs doesn't mean it was stable. It might even be WORSE than if it was doing those things because it's a lost more common for borderline unstable systems to introduce micro errors into your files and data than it is to simply have hard crashes and major instability if you've mostly followed standard procedures.

What is the exact model of your memory kit?

 

[Hynex]

Wow, thanks for the quick responses. Admittedly, my BIOS is pretty outdated, I'll try updating it and then I'll try enabling XMP again on stock CPU settings.
Otherwise the overclocking, or as I called it: optimization was really stable, I did all sorts of benchmarks back then, starting from a simple cinabench R20 to a few hours Aida stress test. Temperatures were around 60 degrees Celsius and not a single crash, so 99% of the blame is on those memories

So I'll update the BIOS and chipset and put the CPU on stock and the five on XMP and that will be it for now. When I ever have more time, I'll try to get the CPU back up to 4.1 again, sacrificing a bit of silence to get rid of the heat that is an inevitable part of the increased voltage.
But that won't be anytime soon anyway. Maybe I'll relocate the computer in the meantime. The position above the heater doesn't do much good thing.
(It's meant as a joke even with a bit of truth on it. PC does not suck pre-heated air.)

 

[Koekieezz]

So I'll update the BIOS and chipset and put the CPU on stock and the five on XMP and that will be it for now.

dont forget to increase the soc voltage ^^

it seems like the bios latest agesa is getting better for ram optimization, as per my friends B450M Steel Legend cant do 3200MT/s with 2600, and after he updated to the latest version he could do it, and after upgrading the cpu to 5600G and update to the very latest bios (4.20), I could manually tune his ram (8GB Klevv 3200MT/sz with XMP 3200MT/s@CL16 + 8GB Avexir Core 2666MT/s with XMP 2600MT/s @CL17) to 3600MT/s @CL16, he's lucky that both of his ram ICs are Hynix CJR, and i dont even believe that as simple as that bios update, i manually tune him with little to none expectations, passed the TM5 stress test with alta777 config for 3 hrs stable no error, and he gain alot of performance with 2 random sticks XD.

Here is his timings and aida64 results:

 

[Hynex]

What you SHOULD do, as a starting point, is remove the overclock and run the CPU at it's stock configuration, and set the XMP profile for the memory, and then see how it does. If it is stable, THEN you can begin to worry about configuring any overclocked settings for the CPU and performing stability tests to ensure there is no instability.

And yes, low voltage on an overclocked, or even a stock CPU configuration (Or GPU, or memory, or.....anything), can absolutely cause these kinds of problems. Unless you have some magical 1% golden sample CPU, it's pretty rare that you can overclock AND run with a reduced voltage or even simply a low voltage for the overclock without having instability. And keep in mind, if you haven't done the extensive stability testing recommended by most experienced overclocking enthusiasts then the simply fact that your system wasn't hard crashing or having BSODs doesn't mean it was stable. It might even be WORSE than if it was doing those things because it's a lost more common for borderline unstable systems to introduce micro errors into your files and data than it is to simply have hard crashes and major instability if you've mostly followed standard procedures.

What is the exact model of your memory kit?

Sorry, I'm only able to find the results from local e-shops, but they are: the TridentZ RGB 32GB (2x16GB) DDR4 3600 CL16
I believe the secondary timings are also 16

They should cost between 200-250 euro

 

[Hynex]

dont forget to increase the soc voltage ^^

it seems like the bios latest agesa is getting better for ram optimization, as per my friends B450M Steel Legend cant do 3200MT/sz with 2600, and after he updated to the latest version he could do it, and after upgrading the cpu to 5600G and update to the very latest bios (4.20), I could manually tune his ram (8GB Klevv 3200MT/sz with XMP 3200MT/s@CL16 + 8GB Avexir Core 2666MT/s with XMP 2600MT/s @CL17) to 3600MT/s @CL16, he's lucky that both of his ram ICs are Hynix CJR, and i dont even believe that as simple as that bios update, i manually tune him with little to none expectations, passed the TM5 stress test with alta777 config for 3 hrs stable no error, and he gain alot of performance with 2 random sticks XD.

Here is his timings and aida64 results:

Wow, that's pretty decent. And that's despite the fact that Ryzen 5000s have slightly better memory stability. I'm already looking for my BIOS update flash drive.
One more question. i have lags in the BIOS (UEFI). Whether I move the mouse or the arrow keys, I get like 0.5fps sometimes I wait more than two seconds before something happens. It's pretty scary. I've read that one of the causes may be plugging another device into the USB 2 port on the motherboard, which I do indeed have (sound card) I haven't tried running the BIOS without it, but I still want to ask if your have any idea of other reasons for this weird BIOS running
Again my motherboard is a Gigabyte X570 Aorus Elite and according to the internet this is a pretty common problem... Unfortunately

 

[Koekieezz]

Sorry, I'm only able to find the results from local e-shops, but they are: the TridentZ RGB 32GB (2x16GB) DDR4 3600 CL16
I believe the secondary timings are also 16

They should cost between 200-250 euro

You could try to identify those by the xmp profile list, or read and identify/match your ram sticks S/N with the one listed here.

If it's a 16-16-16-36, then it should use a samsung B-Die which is very great. If it's 16-19-19-39, then it should be something else.

 

[Koekieezz]

Wow, that's pretty decent. And that's despite the fact that Ryzen 5000s have slightly better memory stability. I'm already looking for my BIOS update flash drive.
One more question. i have lags in the BIOS (UEFI). Whether I move the mouse or the arrow keys, I get like 0.5fps sometimes I wait more than two seconds before something happens. It's pretty scary. I've read that one of the causes may be plugging another device into the USB 2 port on the motherboard, which I do indeed have (sound card) I haven't tried running the BIOS without it, but I still want to ask if your have any idea of other reasons for this weird BIOS running
Again my motherboard is a Gigabyte X570 Aorus Elite and according to the internet this is a pretty common problem... Unfortunately

If unplugging the Soundcard helps, then do it without the soundcard until all procedure are complete. sometimes bios is just wacky if anything else besides mouse and/or keyboard (some experience in the past..). Hope the best after you update the bios ^^

 

[Hynex]

You could try to identify those by the xmp profile list, or read and identify/match your ram sticks S/N with the one listed here.

If it's a 16-16-16-36, then it should use a samsung B-Die which is very great. If it's 16-19-19-39, then it should be something else.

Oh, right I still have a box here. It is indeed 16-16-16-36.
Well it better be B-die for that cost XD

 

[Koekieezz]

Oh, right I still have a box here. It is indeed 16-16-16-36.
Well it better be B-die for that cost XD

i hope the results later

 

[Darkbreeze]

Sorry, I'm only able to find the results from local e-shops, but they are: the TridentZ RGB 32GB (2x16GB) DDR4 3600 CL16
I believe the secondary timings are also 16

They should cost between 200-250 euro

You can find your memory model as follows, or you can use something like Thaiphoon burner to find it.

Open an elevated (Admin) command prompt (You can google how to open an elevated command prompt if you are unsure) and use the following command without the quote marks then hit enter.

wmic memorychip get devicelocator, partnumber


Other methods shown here:

How to Check RAM Manufacturer Brand, Model and Other Specs in Windows 10

Wondering why you would need to know the PC RAM brand, model or other specs in Windows 10? Well, there are many reasons we can tell you.Whether you want to chec

thegeekpage.com

 

[Hynex]

Well, hello again. I'm sorry it took me a month. I spent almost two weeks looking for a new flash drive after I found out I lost my 2GB and I didn't want to clean my 64GB, because I heard that there are sometimes problems on storage this big, that the board can't read the BIOS and stuff. Anyway, when I finally got a new USB stick 16GB one, I was overwhelmed with duties and then forgot about it.
However, now I have some free time again and another small problem. I wanted to update the BIOS, but the board said it couldn't find or read the file. After a quick search, I discovered this thread here on the forum, but I'm reluctant to use the same "enforcement" method because it just doesn't seem like a good idea.

Encountering "Cannot Read File" when attempting to use QFlash

Good afternoon! I am using a Gigabyte - GA-Z270X-Gaming K5 ATX LGA1151 Motherboard and it is known to have some voltage issue's and it comes stock with the F2 Bios. The most current BIOS is F6 or F7. I have been trying to update the BIOS with a USB stick that is formatted correctly but I am...

forums.tomshardware.com

So I want to ask isn't there something else I need to do to update the BIOS correctly? The USB stick is correctly formatted and the BIOS on it is correct. (Latest from the board's website)
I have already written the model of the board, but I will write it again: Gigabyte X570 Aorus Elite

 

[Koekieezz]

Well, hello again. I'm sorry it took me a month. I spent almost two weeks looking for a new flash drive after I found out I lost my 2GB and I didn't want to clean my 64GB, because I heard that there are sometimes problems on storage this big, that the board can't read the BIOS and stuff. Anyway, when I finally got a new USB stick 16GB one, I was overwhelmed with duties and then forgot about it.
However, now I have some free time again and another small problem. I wanted to update the BIOS, but the board said it couldn't find or read the file. After a quick search, I discovered this thread here on the forum, but I'm reluctant to use the same "enforcement" method because it just doesn't seem like a good idea.

Encountering "Cannot Read File" when attempting to use QFlash

Good afternoon! I am using a Gigabyte - GA-Z270X-Gaming K5 ATX LGA1151 Motherboard and it is known to have some voltage issue's and it comes stock with the F2 Bios. The most current BIOS is F6 or F7. I have been trying to update the BIOS with a USB stick that is formatted correctly but I am...

forums.tomshardware.com

So I want to ask isn't there something else I need to do to update the BIOS correctly? The USB stick is correctly formatted and the BIOS on it is correct. (Latest from the board's website)
I have already written the model of the board, but I will write it again: Gigabyte X570 Aorus Elite

which bios version you are now on? are your flashdrive formatted to fat or fat32 yet?

 

[Hynex]

I am on F10 and updating to F35. Yes, my flash drive is formatted to fat32.

 

[Koekieezz]

I am on F10 and updating to F35. Yes, my flash drive is formatted to fat32.

that's pretty old, you should try to do F20 or F30 first.

 

[Hynex]

Alright, I try F20. Thanks.

 

[Karadjgne]

but the second day, after filling up the RAM,

Huh? I'd be interested to know what game can fill up 32Gb of ram.

3000 series cpus only ran stable easily upto 3200MHz (2x8Gb is generally Single Rank, 2x16Gb is Dual Rank dram) , above that was pot luck until later Agesa adjustments with more current bios. When updating the bios, FIRST read ALL the bios notations, some bios need to be updated in stages as older bios files contain fixes and additions instructions and data that are not included in newer bios. For example, original bios might contain code XYZ. F10 bios contains instructions and data to change XYZ to ABC. F20 bios contains instructions and data to change ABC to 123, but may not contain data and instructions to change XYZ to 123. Bios can only use a certain amount of data and the added instructions make the file too big for bios to hold and manipulate.

So reading all the notations, you'll see bios files that say 'must have X bios before upgrade' etc and may not return to prior bios as there's no instructions to undo the changes. So be careful not to jump bios too many updates ahead.

 

[Koekieezz]

Huh? I'd be interested to know what game can fill up 32Gb of ram.

3000 series cpus only ran stable easily upto 3200MHz (2x8Gb is generally Single Rank, 2x16Gb is Dual Rank dram) , above that was pot luck until later Agesa adjustments with more current bios.

3000 series cpu could do 3600 most of the times, either it be 2x8 or 2x16GB (Single rank 16Gbit chips, or Dual rank 8gbit chips). It's also in the matter of agesa so you are right, since my friend couldn't do 3200mhz in his r5 2600, thinking its a bad bin on imc, while i suggested him to go to the latest agesa, 3200 is achieved real easy no sweat, even tightening it.

 

[Hynex]

Huh? I'd be interested to know what game can fill up 32Gb of ram.

3000 series cpus only ran stable easily upto 3200MHz (2x8Gb is generally Single Rank, 2x16Gb is Dual Rank dram) , above that was pot luck until later Agesa adjustments with more current bios. When updating the bios, FIRST read ALL the bios notations, some bios need to be updated in stages as older bios files contain fixes and additions instructions and data that are not included in newer bios. For example, original bios might contain code XYZ. F10 bios contains instructions and data to change XYZ to ABC. F20 bios contains instructions and data to change ABC to 123, but may not contain data and instructions to change XYZ to 123. Bios can only use a certain amount of data and the added instructions make the file too big for bios to hold and manipulate.

So reading all the notations, you'll see bios files that say 'must have X bios before upgrade' etc and may not return to prior bios as there's no instructions to undo the changes. So be careful not to jump bios too many updates ahead.

True, in my case it's more about convenience. Occasionally hosting a modded Minecraft for a few friends and playing Ashes of the Singularity is definitely not an excuse to buy 32GB of RAM, but it's nice to have a little more space for all the silly things I can think of. But anyway, the main reason was that I wanted faster memory, so I bought 32GB outright for the future.I'll still switch to Ryzen 5000 or 7000 at some point if it still supports DDR4, those intergenerational jumps are huge.
Anyway, thanks for the explanation about the letters, I'll look at the BIOS then, which has X
Edit: I meant a BIOS that depends on my current BIOS