- Jan 21, 2021
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I liked a lot about the Intel 11600K versus AMD 5600X head-to-head review put out by Tom's Hardware, and I especially appreciated its awareness of the current price-gouging on the AMD chip and how market price must and should impact a fair recommendation. It's all about value for money!
The discussion of value, however, seem to me to have one major missing feature:
"If chip B (in this case the Intel 11600K/KF) requires more electricity to run, and runs hotter than chip B (here, the AMD 5600X), then what's that mean for us customers in actual money? How much more should we value chip B? Give me a number, even a soft one, not just some arm-waving!"
You're a power worker or heavy gamer, and you don't like reading long posts? The discussion below argues for adding a hundred dollars (and for some of us a hundred and fifty) to the effective price of that Intel 11600KF you've got your eye on.
Introduction
A failure to price out the difference in power consumption and heat generation isn't just a problem with TH's review, it's a problem with the major video reviewer's discussions as well. They all mention power consumption, but no review I've read yet helps us understand what to DO with that information. This is offering mere noise, not signal, and I cannot abide that from a professional.
This issue combines with another problem the professional reviewers suffer from: They all have super-great computer cases, coolers, power supplies, and motherboards, so they throw them at whatever CPU (or GPU) they're reviewing ... without any regard for what savings on cases, coolers, power supplies, and motherboard more efficient CPUs (and GPUs) make possible ... and therefore what savings the savvy build-your-own people and the major OEMs pocket every day.
Therefore, the purpose of this thread is to help you estimate how much to add to the effective price of the less efficient CPU, understanding that such a number will be approximate and must be specific to your use case.
1. The Power Supply
If you're building a new computer around your new CPU, you'll need a power supply. The more juice the CPU requires, the beefier and more expensive that power supply will have to be, for a given quality and reliability.
Those of us who build our own computers tend to overestimate the power our rig will use, and therefore pay too much for the power supply. I'm running the AMD 5600X, PBO, +200 MHz all-core OC, alongside a 100W GPU. The total power draw of my full system, under a Prime95 all-component torture test, is 270 watts. Under ordinary use, usage ranges between 110 and 170 watts. A 300-watt power supply from a reputable brand will cover my current rig in any use case, and 450 will cover any probable GPU upgrade. I have a 600-Watt power supply. I therefore paid for capacity I'll likely never use.
If I swap in the Intel 11600K/KF, and drop both chips down to stock, I will need to provide power for about another 70 watts. If I overclock, the difference is, very roughly, 120-150 watts. That's the difference between a $55 and at least a $70 power supply.
CAD professionals and AAA gamers, of course, want beefier power supplies, but the same points apply, just with different (bigger) numbers for required power and cost. In either case, if you choose the Intel 11600K over the AMD 5600X, you should bump up your desired power supply to the next higher capacity. 550W rather than 450W, or 750W instead of 650W. Consider even bumping it up another level if you plan to do serious all-core overclocking on the 11600K with a beefy water cooler and high-performance motherboard.
2. The Electricity Bill
One method of putting a number on the additional electricity cost of a power-hungry chip is to:
1. Estimate the average hours a day your computer will be used, assuming moderate load (you're doing something that definitely uses your CPU, but doesn't ask it to go full-tilt). For an ordinary work and gaming computer, this might be 3 hours (most office and communications work doesn't hit the CPU particularly hard, and such a computer may not be used every day).
2. Estimate your electricity cost per kiloWatt-hour (kWh). The cost of electricity in the US varies from about 9 to >20 cents/kWh, with an average of about 14.
3. Plug in the additional wattage of chip A (the Intel 11600K) under sustained but non-stressed load over chip B (the AMD 5600X). This is about 70 Watts (~).(I assume no overclocking, and minimal use of full-current boost here)
Example: 3 hours-equivalent of medium-heavy usage-equivalent per day, for 365 days, using an additional 70 watts and paying 14 cents/kWh.
(3 hours/day * 365 day/year) * (70 Watts / 1000 Watts/kiloWatt * 0.14 $/kiloWatt-hour) = $10.73/year
When pricing in electricity usage, I tend to be willing to pay for three years of cash savings in advance. So, in this case, I would add $32 to the effective price of the Intel 11600K/KF, if comparing it to the AMD 5600X.
3. The CPU Cooler (this part is where the biggest cost difference is)
The hotter the CPU runs, the more you need to spend on a cooler in order to a) make the CPU operate at spec, b) keep running at spec for the time required without thermally throttling, c) boost as desired, again without throttling early, and possibly d) overclock and therefore do a, b, and c more effectively, in both single and multi-threaded loads.
The AMD 5600X is extraordinarily efficient. I have mine overclocked (PBO, +200 MHz all-core OC). I use an Arctic Freezer 7X, a 25-dollar cooler (that comes with its own thermal paste, for a few extra $ of savings). For this setup, under real-world loads, thermal throttling is effectively a non-issue.
The Intel 11600K/KF is a rather different animal. In order to make the following statements, I've had to read between the lines of a number of reviews, which bear no responsibility for any errors I make. So, these points are made under correction - don't take them at face value unless validated!
The word from the testers and reviewers appears to be something like:
a) If you just want baseline stock performance, and you're also using an low-end motherboard that only supplies Intel's recommended base-line current to the CPU, then maybe a mid-range air cooler might avoid thermal throttling if full boost isn't active? Maybe spend 40-50$?
b) If you want full stock performance, including allowing the CPU full boost capability on demand - the situation pretty much all 11600K reviews cover - then you will benefit from something like a high-quality air cooler, or a low-end water cooler. Spend about $60?
c) If you want to overclock this CPU and get the equivalent boost that the AMD 5600X gets from PBO, +200 MHz all-core OC, then you want a very good air cooler or a solid water cooler. Nothing less will "tame this beast", to quote the testers. Spend $80-120?
Corrections to the above statements are welcome!
4. Heat Generation - your Living or Office Space
If chip A uses more energy, it also generates more heat. What's that extra heat in your space actually costing you? I did some back-of-the-envelope calculations and came up with the following rules of thumb. Again, these are offered under correction:
"If you're mostly heating the space (you live in a cold climate), and are using an only moderately cost-efficient form of heat (natural gas, say) then subtract one-fifth from the effective electricity bill."
"If you're mostly cooling the space (you live in a warm climate, or the room gets hot), and your air conditioning is modern and reasonably efficient, add one-third to the effective electricity bill."
Conclusions
So! Given what should be an ordinary level of usage, and understanding the rigs the reviewers actually put both the Intel 11600K and AMD 5600X into in order to figure out how these chips compare in stock and overclocked conditions, we wrap up this post with a rather bold statement.
"If your intended use case is fairly ordinary, and you do not plan to overclock, then: The effective price of the Intel 11600K/KF, primarily taking the cost of electricity and CPU cooler into account, is roughly 80-120 dollars above list price, if compared to the AMD 5600X."
So, if the Intel 11600KF is selling for $235, and those ****
[Moderator edit to remove profanity. Remember, per rules, this is a family friendly forum.]
are price-gouging the AMD 5600X for $350, what you'll actually pay, after budgeting for equally effective coolers for both chips under stock loads, and after three years of electricity usage for stock usage, is not $115 difference, but something closer to $15. If you want to overclock whichever chip you buy, the hidden "gotcha" cost of the Intel 11600KF is quite a bit higher.
The discussion of value, however, seem to me to have one major missing feature:
"If chip B (in this case the Intel 11600K/KF) requires more electricity to run, and runs hotter than chip B (here, the AMD 5600X), then what's that mean for us customers in actual money? How much more should we value chip B? Give me a number, even a soft one, not just some arm-waving!"
You're a power worker or heavy gamer, and you don't like reading long posts? The discussion below argues for adding a hundred dollars (and for some of us a hundred and fifty) to the effective price of that Intel 11600KF you've got your eye on.
Introduction
A failure to price out the difference in power consumption and heat generation isn't just a problem with TH's review, it's a problem with the major video reviewer's discussions as well. They all mention power consumption, but no review I've read yet helps us understand what to DO with that information. This is offering mere noise, not signal, and I cannot abide that from a professional.
This issue combines with another problem the professional reviewers suffer from: They all have super-great computer cases, coolers, power supplies, and motherboards, so they throw them at whatever CPU (or GPU) they're reviewing ... without any regard for what savings on cases, coolers, power supplies, and motherboard more efficient CPUs (and GPUs) make possible ... and therefore what savings the savvy build-your-own people and the major OEMs pocket every day.
Therefore, the purpose of this thread is to help you estimate how much to add to the effective price of the less efficient CPU, understanding that such a number will be approximate and must be specific to your use case.
1. The Power Supply
If you're building a new computer around your new CPU, you'll need a power supply. The more juice the CPU requires, the beefier and more expensive that power supply will have to be, for a given quality and reliability.
Those of us who build our own computers tend to overestimate the power our rig will use, and therefore pay too much for the power supply. I'm running the AMD 5600X, PBO, +200 MHz all-core OC, alongside a 100W GPU. The total power draw of my full system, under a Prime95 all-component torture test, is 270 watts. Under ordinary use, usage ranges between 110 and 170 watts. A 300-watt power supply from a reputable brand will cover my current rig in any use case, and 450 will cover any probable GPU upgrade. I have a 600-Watt power supply. I therefore paid for capacity I'll likely never use.
If I swap in the Intel 11600K/KF, and drop both chips down to stock, I will need to provide power for about another 70 watts. If I overclock, the difference is, very roughly, 120-150 watts. That's the difference between a $55 and at least a $70 power supply.
CAD professionals and AAA gamers, of course, want beefier power supplies, but the same points apply, just with different (bigger) numbers for required power and cost. In either case, if you choose the Intel 11600K over the AMD 5600X, you should bump up your desired power supply to the next higher capacity. 550W rather than 450W, or 750W instead of 650W. Consider even bumping it up another level if you plan to do serious all-core overclocking on the 11600K with a beefy water cooler and high-performance motherboard.
2. The Electricity Bill
One method of putting a number on the additional electricity cost of a power-hungry chip is to:
1. Estimate the average hours a day your computer will be used, assuming moderate load (you're doing something that definitely uses your CPU, but doesn't ask it to go full-tilt). For an ordinary work and gaming computer, this might be 3 hours (most office and communications work doesn't hit the CPU particularly hard, and such a computer may not be used every day).
2. Estimate your electricity cost per kiloWatt-hour (kWh). The cost of electricity in the US varies from about 9 to >20 cents/kWh, with an average of about 14.
3. Plug in the additional wattage of chip A (the Intel 11600K) under sustained but non-stressed load over chip B (the AMD 5600X). This is about 70 Watts (~).(I assume no overclocking, and minimal use of full-current boost here)
Example: 3 hours-equivalent of medium-heavy usage-equivalent per day, for 365 days, using an additional 70 watts and paying 14 cents/kWh.
(3 hours/day * 365 day/year) * (70 Watts / 1000 Watts/kiloWatt * 0.14 $/kiloWatt-hour) = $10.73/year
When pricing in electricity usage, I tend to be willing to pay for three years of cash savings in advance. So, in this case, I would add $32 to the effective price of the Intel 11600K/KF, if comparing it to the AMD 5600X.
3. The CPU Cooler (this part is where the biggest cost difference is)
The hotter the CPU runs, the more you need to spend on a cooler in order to a) make the CPU operate at spec, b) keep running at spec for the time required without thermally throttling, c) boost as desired, again without throttling early, and possibly d) overclock and therefore do a, b, and c more effectively, in both single and multi-threaded loads.
The AMD 5600X is extraordinarily efficient. I have mine overclocked (PBO, +200 MHz all-core OC). I use an Arctic Freezer 7X, a 25-dollar cooler (that comes with its own thermal paste, for a few extra $ of savings). For this setup, under real-world loads, thermal throttling is effectively a non-issue.
The Intel 11600K/KF is a rather different animal. In order to make the following statements, I've had to read between the lines of a number of reviews, which bear no responsibility for any errors I make. So, these points are made under correction - don't take them at face value unless validated!
The word from the testers and reviewers appears to be something like:
a) If you just want baseline stock performance, and you're also using an low-end motherboard that only supplies Intel's recommended base-line current to the CPU, then maybe a mid-range air cooler might avoid thermal throttling if full boost isn't active? Maybe spend 40-50$?
b) If you want full stock performance, including allowing the CPU full boost capability on demand - the situation pretty much all 11600K reviews cover - then you will benefit from something like a high-quality air cooler, or a low-end water cooler. Spend about $60?
c) If you want to overclock this CPU and get the equivalent boost that the AMD 5600X gets from PBO, +200 MHz all-core OC, then you want a very good air cooler or a solid water cooler. Nothing less will "tame this beast", to quote the testers. Spend $80-120?
Corrections to the above statements are welcome!
4. Heat Generation - your Living or Office Space
If chip A uses more energy, it also generates more heat. What's that extra heat in your space actually costing you? I did some back-of-the-envelope calculations and came up with the following rules of thumb. Again, these are offered under correction:
"If you're mostly heating the space (you live in a cold climate), and are using an only moderately cost-efficient form of heat (natural gas, say) then subtract one-fifth from the effective electricity bill."
"If you're mostly cooling the space (you live in a warm climate, or the room gets hot), and your air conditioning is modern and reasonably efficient, add one-third to the effective electricity bill."
Conclusions
So! Given what should be an ordinary level of usage, and understanding the rigs the reviewers actually put both the Intel 11600K and AMD 5600X into in order to figure out how these chips compare in stock and overclocked conditions, we wrap up this post with a rather bold statement.
"If your intended use case is fairly ordinary, and you do not plan to overclock, then: The effective price of the Intel 11600K/KF, primarily taking the cost of electricity and CPU cooler into account, is roughly 80-120 dollars above list price, if compared to the AMD 5600X."
So, if the Intel 11600KF is selling for $235, and those ****
[Moderator edit to remove profanity. Remember, per rules, this is a family friendly forum.]
are price-gouging the AMD 5600X for $350, what you'll actually pay, after budgeting for equally effective coolers for both chips under stock loads, and after three years of electricity usage for stock usage, is not $115 difference, but something closer to $15. If you want to overclock whichever chip you buy, the hidden "gotcha" cost of the Intel 11600KF is quite a bit higher.
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