System Builder Marathon, Sept. 2010: $2000 Performance PC

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geok1ng

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[citation][nom]Crashman[/nom]Actually targeted 2200-2300 MHz there, but ended up using the lower multiplier to keep CPU temperatures down. Will keep that in mind and perhaps choose a lower lower core clock and higher CPU-NB multiplier next time that temperatures are a concern.[/citation]
thanks for the fast feedback.
i am still not convinced that a lower core clock will solve all the barriers on the Thuban OC, but at least for gaming a higher NB multiplier may give better numbers, such as 3.8Ghz core clock 2.8 NB clock is better for gaming than 4.0Ghz core clock 2.0Ghz NB clock.
anyway, TH is once again working hard to shows us new insights into system builds alternatives, which is way more relevant than OC settings.
 

Crashman

Polypheme
Former Staff
[citation][nom]geok1ng[/nom]thanks for the fast feedback. i am still not convinced that a lower core clock will solve all the barriers on the Thuban OC, but at least for gaming a higher NB multiplier may give better numbers, such as 3.8Ghz core clock 2.8 NB clock is better for gaming than 4.0Ghz core clock 2.0Ghz NB clock.anyway, TH is once again working hard to shows us new insights into system builds alternatives, which is way more relevant than OC settings.[/citation]I actually was aiming for 4.00 GHz and pushed HT clock until it was unstable, then dropped CPU-NB multiplier to get it stable, then repeated until I hit 4.00 GHz.

People are saying that giving up 100-200 MHz at the core might be worthwhile in order to achieve a much higher (stable) NB-CPU clock, and that's something I wouldn't have thought of myself.
 

JustAim

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I second the i5/i7 commnents. AMD needs to pull its stuff together. They used to kick the tar out of intel
I just bought an Alienware with 5870 crossfire an i7 920 6gb ddr3-1333 and one sweet ass case for 1500.
 

siman

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SILVERSTONE TJ08-B MicroATX Mid Tower Computer Case
Thermaltake A1280 120mm Case Fan (two of them)
Thermaltake CL-W0075 Liquid Cooling System
MSI 890GXM-G65 AM3 AMD 890GX Micro ATX AMD Motherboard
HIS H587FN1GD Radeon HD 5870 1GB Video Card (in crossfire aka two of them)
Tuniq Ripper PSU-RIP1000W-BK 1000W Power Supply
AMD Phenom II X6 1090T Black Edition Thuban 3.2GHz Processor
Seagate Barracuda ST31000528AS 1TB 7200 RPM Hard Drive
G.SKILL Trident+ Turbulence II 8GB DDR3 2000 Memory
LG GH22NS40 22X DVD Burner

try that out and call me in the morning
 

23mike

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it's obviously a value/performance CPU. Not sure why you wouldn't have chosen the 1090 for 2k system if you wanted to test AMD in this range.
 

ibn gozzy

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Seems like a nice setup, but what happened??? As some others have commented, AMD CPU + Nvidia SLI = PWNED! I would like to see this chip with the 890 AMD chip and crossfire = the way it was meant to be played. I'm not and AMD fan boy, as a matted of fact I have had both (most recent is i7 setup with 2 5870s xfired) and it gets about the same 3D vantage score as the rig reviewed here, but ouch! Perhaps compromises are made to make SLI work with AMD cpus, but stil would be nice to see a similar setup as have mentioned.

PS: If I win this, could I have last months rig instead?
 

eddieroolz

Splendid
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Toms,

I appreciate the frankness in writing this article. As much of an AMD enthusiast that I am, I have to admit; a mainstream processor does not belong in a high-end build, after all. Its a shame the 1055T couldn't overcome its CPU limitation.
 

rantoc

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[citation][nom]Judguh[/nom]I would actually like to see a small article on RAM usage on a PC during various uses and scenarios and to show where more RAM or faster RAM would be more beneficial.[/citation]

Agreed, would be intressting reading. More ram than 4-6 GB in my opinion equals more cache pretty much and with todays SSD's ramping up the old HDD bottlenecks thats less and less useful but i would like to se real data about the topic.
 

kilthas_th

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[citation][nom]coldmast[/nom]What would switching the Proc to the 1090T and maybe running 3x 460s in SLI x16/x8/x8 have done.[/citation]

Unless I'm mistaken, I don't believe the 460s can run more than dual SLI by design.
 

blink180heights

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MSI 890FXA-GD70 AM3 AMD 890FX SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX AMD Motherboard

AMD Phenom II X6 1090T Black Edition Thuban 3.2GHz Socket AM3 125W Six-Core Desktop Processor HDT90ZFBGRBOX

ARCTIC COOLING Freezer 7 Pro Rev.2 92mm Fluid Dynamic CPU Cooler

Arctic Silver 5 Thermal Compound - OEM

G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model F3-12800CL9D-4GBRL

x2 Palit NE5X460SF1142 GeForce GTX 460 (Fermi) Sonic 2GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video Card

XFX PVT95GZAFG GeForce 9500 GT 1GB 128-bit GDDR2 PCI Express 2.0 x16 Video Card - (For PhysX

KINGWIN Lazer LZ-750 750W Modular 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC W/ 3-Way LED Switch and Universal Modular Connector Power ...

Western Digital Caviar Black WD1002FAEX 1TB 7200 RPM SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive

Logitech G510 Black USB Wired Game Keyboard

Logitech G500 10 Buttons Dual-mode Scroll Wheel USB Wired Laser Gaming Mouse

ASUS VH242H Black 23.6" 5ms HDMI Full 1080P Widescreen LCD Monitor

ASUS DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS Black SATA 24X DVD Burner - Bulk - OEM

XCLIO 777 Black/Titanium Finish Chassis: 1.0 mm SECC; ABS Plastic ATX Full Tower Extreme Cooling PC Case

x2 IPCQUEEN IPC-12025 120mm Case Fan (for 2 Optional rear exhaust fans) (making it 10 fans in total)

Rosewill RCT4B-100 Black 4" Cable Tie

20 Item(s)
($1,999.30) (Gaming PC)
 

Marcus52

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Nvidia recommends that your PSU be able to supply 42 amps to each video card from the rail(s) for the GTX 480. Explain to me how a PSU with a single rail that has an 80A 12V rated max is suitable for a computer with 2 480s in it (84A), since the peak possible draw, according to Nvidia, could exceed the rating of the rail. (That doesn't even consider the rest of the 12V load on the rail, never mind the load on the whole system).

I can understand the mistake, since Nvidia also rates the card at a 250W max. These numbers are in direct contradiction - is the max wattage 250 or 504 (12Vx42A)? If they are saying you should use a PSU that can supply 42A per GTX 480, then they are saying each card can draw up to 504W, at least for a very brief period.

I have read about one person who fried his PSU by plugging his 480 (both connections) in to a rail rated @ 40A with nothing else on the rail, which he considered close enough. It was an older model, and though name brand, may not been up to par or had the headroom some of today's manufacturer's actually build in to their units.

Reading just a little teaches me it's a very bad idea to build any kind of electrical system where the supply barely meets the requirements in any case. A little napkin math tells me your system has very little headroom, even assuming 250W for the video cards.


My question would be, especially since the entire draw is on one rail, could the PSU actually be falling short in powering the OC'd CPU, which will draw far more power than a non-OC'd one, and hinder it's performance? I think it is unlikely, but entirely possible - strange problems crop up from flaky or poorly managed and underpowered systems.

I'd like to see this system re-worked with a PSU that supplies plenty of power based on Nvidia's recommendations and see if it makes a difference.

;)
 

hangfirew8

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What fantasy world are you living in that you found a Scythe Mugen 2 for $35? I'll take 3! Don't say the first two hits on Google Shopping, as they are both willing to take your money and then sit on the order forever as they never get any in stock, despite what their web pages say about being "in stock". Been there, done that.

Bizarrely newegg can't find a Scythe Mugen 2, but they are happy to sell you a Scythe SCMG-2100 Sleeve CPU Cooler for $39.99 plus shipping. I think they resort to this obfuscation just to keep the darn thing in stock for more than 5 seconds.

Excellent cooler, my SM2 keeps my AMD 550BE a few degrees above ambient, and lol, I had to turn the M/B fan alarm off as the single PWM CPU fan throttles down to Zero RPM half the time. Yes I have lots of other air (2x120mm in, 120mm+140mm out) but it still takes a heck of a cooler to get away with that level of cooling with its fan off. For those few who complain about it, find later they failed to mount it square, a real possibility with the bolt-thru mounting but I'll take it over Intel's push-pin FAIL-MOUNT.

Appreciate the rest of the effort but for 2 large, X-58 is the only way to go.
Keep the AMD for the budget or office builds.
 

hangfirew8

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[citation][nom]Marcus52[/nom]Nvidia recommends that your PSU be able to supply 42 amps to each video card from the rail(s) for the GTX 480. Explain to me how a PSU with a single rail that has an 80A 12V rated max is suitable for a computer with 2 480s in it (84A), since the peak possible draw, according to Nvidia, could exceed the rating of the rail. [/citation]

NVidia is making whole-system amperage recommendations, and refuses to tell us exactly how much each card pulls down in Amps. The result is CONFUSION.

[citation][nom]Marcus52[/nom]I have read about one person who fried his PSU by plugging his 480 (both connections) in to a rail rated @ 40A with nothing else on the rail, which he considered close enough.[/citation]

It may have been a name brand, but a QUALITY PSU would invoke OCP (Over Current Protection) at that rail or OPP (Over Power Protection) for the whole PSU and then reset to try again. If it fried, it is probably one of the many, many PSU's that advertise these features but do not actually include them.

 

ancientgammoner

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I just built a system on Newegg on the $2000 budget:

Motherboard: ASUS Sabertooth X58 LGA 1366 Intel X58 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 - $189.99
Processor: Intel Core i7-950 Bloomfield 3.06GHz - $299.99
Memory: G.SKILL 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 - $134.99
Graphics: 2 x MSI GeForce GTX 480 1536MB - $899.98 (2 x $449.99)
Hard Drive: 2 x G.SKILL Phoenix Pro 60GB SSD (RAID 0) - $279.98 (2 x $139.99)
Optical: LITE-ON CD/DVD Burner - $19.99
Case: Antec Three Hundred Black Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case - $59.95
Power: XION Power Real 1100W SLI Ready ATX Power Supply - $99.99
CPU Cooler: Standard Intel - $0
Shipping: $12.65
Total: $1997.51

So...
i7 = much better CPU
MB with SATA III and USB 3.0
2 sandforce SSD's in raid 0 = 500mb/s+ read/write w/120GB for games
All in all, a much, MUCH better build. Why didn't you guys build THAT?
 

radiumburn

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Great Article
I am the sad/happy owner of a 1055t

It does what I need it to do fast and it holds its own for gaming but I guess I'm CPU bound instead of graphics bound :) (kind of guessed that before I read this)

I know SLI has better results then Crossfire but I would like to see if a crossfire setup would be as cpu bound for the same processor.

(I think they should incorporate a multimonitor setup with fullscreen gaming/benchmark on one screen and movie playing from second screen and see how the cpu's hold up in this situation(thats how I roll, want to see if 6 core was a horrible choice in that department))
 
G

Guest

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Let me guess the problem - 480 SLI on an AMD board. I think it would be much better with a XFire 5870. You cloud also use the 120$ to get a 1090T or an SSD.
 

Crashman

Polypheme
Former Staff
[citation][nom]AnnoySumo[/nom]Let me guess the problem - 480 SLI on an AMD board. I think it would be much better with a XFire 5870. You cloud also use the 120$ to get a 1090T or an SSD.[/citation]Actually, if the choice came down to those two things, I'd save the money and use the lower cost to boost the system's value score.
 
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