System Builder Marathon: Sub-$4000 PC

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[citation][nom][object HTMLSpanElement][/nom]Unknown[/citation]

Forgot to login, before posting the last comment
 


Actually, the Ultra Chilltec was tried 13 months back in another system builder marathon and was totally inadequate, which is why marathons have used liquid cooling ever since.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/system-builder-marathon,1598-3.html

It's about overclocking. The Chilltech TEC is only good for 50W. Beyond that, you're just relying on the sink. When you overclock a quad core to extremes, it's going to run around 150W or more. The Chilltech simply can't cope because its sink isn't big enough.
 


Great choice in July, but where would you get one now? And where would you have gotten one when the system was assembled in May?
 
To Crashman & Cleeve

I'm sure they have got lots of money or spare licences but the worrying thing is that these guys & gals that build these superbeasts forgot the most important peice of equipment.

Makes you wonder how much attention to detail these guys think about when doing some thing like this, kinda like buy a Ferrari F430 and not putting any fuel in it.

Thats my point made and if you wanna make something of it, then i'll get my kamakazi ninja hamsters to attack your ankles until you start begging for mercy.... MUHAHAHAHAHAHA !!!!....... erm or something like that....

Ta

BTG
 
Good review Tom's. Personally I'm wondering why they opted for the Extreme CPU when they planned on overclocking the sytem anyway. Why not save $500 on the CPU and have money left over for a Blu ray drive? It just seems to be a waste $1000 to buy intel's top processor when you can get the same performance out of a cheaper model.

Otherwise, good review especially since I am trying to figure out which GPU to purchase to replace my aging 7900GS sli's. It looks like the older 880GTX's are a better bang for the buck considering you can find them for under $300.

I too am waiting anxiously for the ~$2000 rig.
 


The object with the most expensive system is to start with top parts and see how much further you can go. The less expensive systems make compromises for better value, which is why they always win the value comparison.
 
Pardon the noob question. I realize they're doing the build based on current prices and availability, but for those actually looking for a new system, wouldn't it be worth it to wait? Nehalem is only a few months away and sounds like a significant improvement. Reports of three Nehalem speeds suggests to me that the 2.66ghz will be priced reasonably enough.
 
can you guys build us a $1000~1500 machine which would put a $4000 dollars worth of crap to shame?

please that would be very very very interesting to see, and prove my statement below.

(*no video cards is really worth more than $250 period!)
 


The guys already built the machines but haven't put up the articles yet. The 4850 graphics card debut came first. Everyone else will see the articles over the next few publishing days, just like this article said they would.

But I don't want you to read those articles because:
1.) You'll think it was your idea, which it wasn't
2.) Your attitude sux.

So like I said, everyone else will enjoy them.
 
[citation][nom]btg[/nom]kinda like buy a Ferrari F430 and not putting any fuel in it.[/citation]

Aha, but that's the point, isn't it? We're reviewing the car, not the gasoline.

We're pricing the hardware; not the OS, not monitors, keyboards, or anything else. Just the box. The user can choose what they want to put in it, XP, Vista home, Ultimate, whatever - it's not our objective to dictate what you have to use.

You can disagree with us on whether you would have liked us to do it differently, but we chose to do it this way - it's no oversight.
 
btg :

kinda like buy a Ferrari F430 and not putting any fuel in it.





Aha, but that's the point, isn't it? We're reviewing the car, not the gasoline.

We're pricing the hardware; not the OS, not monitors, keyboards, or anything else. Just the box. The user can choose what they want to put in it, XP, Vista home, Ultimate, whatever - it's not our objective to dictate what you have to use.

You can disagree with us on whether you would have liked us to do it differently, but we chose to do it this way - it's no oversight.
Click to expand...

ok, i see your point, it's all theory then?

my argument is what happens then when you switch it on.......?
how can you test its performance?
how can you go into great detail of overclocking?
how do you optimise the system?

As i said before, you cannot do any of the above without and OS and i'm sure people here will agree that different OS's will make a difference to its benchmark scores

Do you see my point.....or do i have get get my Kamakazi Ninja Hamsters out with thier buddies, the Crazy Mofo Machette Wielding Ferrets !!!
 
$4K budget??? thats like a $500,000 sports car budget..., hmm, should I get the Murcielago or Porsche Carrera GT..., what a challenge
Click to expand...
Carrerra GT? You're going into Alienware territory.
That's more like 12 grand.

Honestly, nowadays if you spend anymore than 2000$ you're going to get screwed by how fast your system will be obsolete.
Look at the 8800Ultra 6 months ago.
700$+ card now getting spanked by a 200$ card.
Even the new 800$ card (GTX280) is having a hard time with the 300$ 4870.

The only overpriced card from the green machine that was ever remotely worth buying was the Geforce3. It could run doom3.

People are fools anyway, I would never again buy from Nvidia simply because of the Geforce4 MX series which this review reminds me of. Next gen does not really mean better for Nvidia. They may as well take Geforce 2 pcb's, put a g92 chip on it and sell it as a TNT 8000 GTXF ULTRA + DRR EXTRA for 300$
 
[citation][nom]btg[/nom]you see my point.....or do i have get get my Kamakazi Ninja Hamsters out with thier buddies, the Crazy Mofo Machette Wielding Ferrets !!![/citation]

Yes I see your point, keep the Ninja Hamsters and their cronies at bay!

I do see where you're coming from, I just think we both have the right to equally valid differing opinions is all. We could do it the way we've been doing it, or we can do it the way you propose, neither is necessarily wrong or right.
 
It seems to me that TG always puts themselves in a bind on the high end build. You say the object is to put in the best parts and see how far you can go with them. But then you chose the QX9650 instead of the QX9750 because it was better value (overclocked further and cost less, according to your article). It always comes down to sacrificing something (in this case CPU) to choose something else (in this case video cards)?

My point is take the silly price cap off the high end system. Anyone who flinches at a $4000 price tag can't afford a top of the line system anyway. Build the fastest gamer you can, and then just list the components and price.

Or... create another category. I think you'd find that the $4000 build scores less on bang for buck than the unlimited build for both performance and all around capability.

The high end system shouldn't necessarily be the most expensive parts. The high end system should be the parts that give the best performance, regardless of price. So (for example) if a QX9450 will overclock higher than the QX9650, doesn't that make it a better choice for both performance and value? Showing less performance from a more expensive system while justifying the choices is something we'd expect from the manufacturers, not a review. 😉

A couple days ago a potential customer called wanting a dual CPU (QX9850's, no less), SLI (9800GTX's), DDR-3, water cooled system built to be used for graphics editing and Cad Cam work. I'd have to look up if such a motherboard even exists, but the point is that $4000 is a long ways from a true "high end" system. I wouldn't expect TG to do dual CPU systems in their high end "gaming" builds, but I'm really tired of seeing how some components have to be left out to make it under budget for the high end system. I expect that in the mid and low end builds, but not the high end. :)
 


I agree with much of what you said, but

1.) Tom's can't get all the parts for an unlimitted system. Some of the "best" parts are nearly impossible even for Tom's Hardware to get free.
2.) Looking ahead to overclocking, they chose the best-overclocking processor.

Now, come to think of it $4000 seems kind of cheap for an "uber-system", perhaps it should be increased to $4500, or $5000?
 
Well you'd have to about double $4000 for a good Skulltrail system (with good memory, quad crossfire or SLI, etc.), but that's probably overkill for most any gamer unless they were into serious crunching as well. I spent just over $5000 on my system a couple years ago and have upgraded several components since, so I sure don't think $5000 is unreasonable. :)

I'll wait for the overclocking results to comment on the best overclocking CPU. I've seen quite a few QX9775's doing 4.4GHz on air, but then we're back to Skulltrail again. :)
 
Too bad P45/X48 doesn't support SLI. 🙁 ; would have reduced the cost ($450 for the Striker II; a good P45/X48 can be had for $200) and offer better performance. Other than that one of the more "good" SBMs written. I still disagree on going with a Cooler Master PSU when you could get a Corsair 1kW ($270 on newegg), providing you get a cheaper case, and/or get a little cheaper motherboard.
 


Yeh, the Corsair 1000w is a great power supply, it's too bad that the PCI-Express connectors won't fit the 8-pin sockets on the graphics cards. NVIDIA didn't make the latch holes wide enough to support 6+2 pin connectors, only "proper" 8-pin connectors will fit.
 
cleve,
You guys seem like DR Frankensteins...
I'd like you to test the Mercury CAB (maybe two)running a 2.8ghz cell processor with a gig of xdr memory and 4gig of ddr2. Its a pci express plug in and linux 64 or win64 is the OS. I'd think it would give anyone a run for the money. Just dont know the $$$.
Whats the story on the octo-cores from intel with HT turned on? Mmmm AMD will to be making video cards for intel and third world laptops by 2010:{
 
I have a question about leaving the Northbridge water block empty because it might restrict the flow of the water cooling system. Would it be a good idea to connect tubing from the Northbridge water block fittings directly to a small reservoir like the Swiftech MCRES-MICRO?
 
[citation][nom]jimwalk[/nom]I have a question about leaving the Northbridge water block empty because it might restrict the flow of the water cooling system. Would it be a good idea to connect tubing from the Northbridge water block fittings directly to a small reservoir like the Swiftech MCRES-MICRO? [/citation]

The easy path to good cooling performance is to leave the Northbridge block out of the loop and use a fan to cool the Chipset, Voltage Regulators, and RAM. The Antec Spotcool is a decent fan and when aimed correctly can do that job very nicely.
 
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