News The Commodore 64 Ultimate computer is the company's first hardware release in over 30 years — pre-orders start at $299

[TerryLaze]

I dont remember commodore being much of a sentimental outfit. whether it was typewriters, phones, file cabinets or computers, they were in the business of flogging stuff for reasonable prices. they could absolutely be selling steak knives or such today. they would have abandoned computers and sold literally anything they had to, to stay afloat.

They started out as commodore business machines (CBM) typewriters, phones, file cabinets, and anything a business can use to make business was their business.
They only got into computers because businesses started to use them.
(Although I agree, they would probably sell anything they could to survive)

https://commodorez.com/commodore.html

 

[shortaru]

If they don't get enough preorders they will just refund everybody and not make them.
It's like 10.000 for each of the 3 models, so if they make them they will be somewhat rare but not that rare.
https://www.commodore.net/product-page/commodore-64-ultimate-collectible-founders-edition-batch1

And just how many of those sold units do you really think noncollectors will just leave sealed in the box?

THAT is what gives collectibles their value.

Decades from now, nobody is going to remember any of this... except the few who snatched up units and put them in storage.

 

[MS67]

And just how many of those sold units do you really think noncollectors will just leave sealed in the box?

THAT is what gives collectibles their value.

Decades from now, nobody is going to remember any of this... except the few who snatched up units and put them in storage.

I wouldn't be super confident on that. there are lots and lots of things people buy and store unused thinking they might be collectible in future. its highly speculative. if these guys turn these trademarks into a multi million dollar business that is relevant in 20 years, yea, then they will be worth some money. but if they turn out to be just the latest group to try and fail to resurrect the brand, they'll likely be a novelty item worth $30 loose or maybe $100 in the package.

 

[Dane_Archer]

I dont remember commodore being much of a sentimental outfit. whether it was typewriters, phones, file cabinets or computers, they were in the business of flogging stuff for reasonable prices. they could absolutely be selling steak knives or such today. they would have abandoned computers and sold literally anything they had to, to stay afloat.

All due respect, what company in trouble wouldn't do that (Apple Pippin, or the "Apple Collection" clothing line.) And with all the companies that aren't in trouble "resorting" to tracking our browsing data, our interests, soft drink choices and who knows what else... I think a Commodore branded can opener isn't so horrible.

 

[MS67]

All due respect, what company in trouble wouldn't do that (Apple Pippin, or the "Apple Collection" clothing line.) And with all the companies that aren't in trouble "resorting" to tracking our browsing data, our interests, soft drink choices and who knows what else... I think a Commodore branded can opener isn't so horrible.

That's what I'm saying. this peri fractic guy did a video (a long, sticky sweet heavy on nostalgia fluff video) making it sound like a paper shredder with commodore branding was a sin when ironically its on point. and probably something general purpose like that has a better chance of making the brand relevant again vs a niche retro computer that has already been made 6 ways to sunday in the last 30 years.

 

[Joe_Cassara]

It's simple, you geeks:

If you, as I am, are enthused by the effort, dig in!
If you, as some do, have reservations, that's valid.
If you're vehemently against it for 'reasons', that's fine.

Rise above the schoolyard tomfoolery.

 

[JeffreyP55]

https://imgur.com/a/ckhudVd

View: https://imgur.com/a/ckhudVd

Resized screen. Full screen is much improved from previous versions.
Also have the C64 Forever emulator. Bundled with Amiga forever. Tons of games. Joystick works, if you still have one.

 

[Messier83 BarredSpiral]

It looks like it has a version of the Ultimate 64 circuit board with Commodore branding.

The circuit board works with actual C64 cartridges and peripherals, which is something that an emulator would never do.

$299 is a pretty good price I think.
For comparison, the TheC64 Maxi from RetroGames Ltd which does emulation on an ARM chip,, a rubber-dome keyboard, and no support for original peripherals (without the use of external adaptor) used to cost $120 when it was released, but is often listed for over $250 now.

The Commodore 64 Ultimate will be the first new hardware released under the auspices of the new management, and pricing starts at $299.

The Commodore 64 Ultimate computer is the company's first hardware release in over 30 years — pre-orders start at $299 : Read more

For 299 or 499 bucks this are asking a lot..i do wish this thing had modern hardware like an AMD Ryzen 5 (6 or 7 gen) or entry level Intel i5 alder lake..
Even the budget phones these days can run Retro Emulation nicely with the right emulator app.
I wish there's more than this device like a full fledge linux device like steamdeck that doesn't only retro emulate but can still be able to play some modern titles...this thing would only gain attraction to few older generation of people
Imagine a keyboard with a capable modern processor even with only integrated GPU a 512gb ssd and 16gb ddr5 ram then I'll justify the 499$ price tag..that would be nice than a ddr2 and not even a 1ghz cpu..this would be only as good as collectable device

 

[Messier83 BarredSpiral]

I doubt that very much, if commodore kept existing there would be no need for this product, they would bring out a c64 mini just like nintendo did (and just like whoever made the thec64)

Commodore would sell their old games on a digital store front of their current console/computer, again just like nintendo.

And also just like nintendo they would just take a generic or maybe slightly custom arm cpu and make cheap consoles that people can afford.

(All this assuming that they would not have become a PC only brand, since the home computer of the 80-90 became the PC later on, but in that case they would not have lasted)

If commodore would be able to make modern games or even modern 3D versions of their old games like Nintendo are doing for decade....

 

[alceryes]

I'm disappointed.
These have maybe $50 of tech in them. $299 is ridiculous. Looks like the company went the greed route, unfortunately. I'll pass.

 

[TerryLaze]

For 299 or 499 bucks this are asking a lot..i do wish this thing had modern hardware like an AMD Ryzen 5 (6 or 7 gen) or entry level Intel i5 alder lake..
Even the budget phones these days can run Retro Emulation nicely with the right emulator app.
I wish there's more than this device like a full fledge linux device like steamdeck that doesn't only retro emulate but can still be able to play some modern titles...this thing would only gain attraction to few older generation of people
Imagine a keyboard with a capable modern processor even with only integrated GPU a 512gb ssd and 16gb ddr5 ram then I'll justify the 499$ price tag..that would be nice than a ddr2 and not even a 1ghz cpu..this would be only as good as collectable device

https://www.commodore.net/product-page/commodore-64x-pc

Commodore C64X PC with a choice of different Mini-ITX motherboards and 2 different case styles, from Intel N100 up to a Ryzen 9 with Radeon graphics.

 

[Dane_Archer]

I'm disappointed.
These have maybe $50 of tech in them. $299 is ridiculous. Looks like the company went the greed route, unfortunately. I'll pass.

Cool. I've got $50 for you now. Go ahead and build me one. If I like it I'll buy two more.

 

[Dane_Archer]

That's what I'm saying. this peri fractic guy did a video (a long, sticky sweet heavy on nostalgia fluff video) making it sound like a paper shredder with commodore branding was a sin when ironically its on point. and probably something general purpose like that has a better chance of making the brand relevant again vs a niche retro computer that has already been made 6 ways to sunday in the last 30 years.

I think I get what you're saying now. And that's been one of my complaints about Commodore hardware -- every two years someone builds a new exciting same old Commodore 64 derivative, either in hardware or software, Or another Amiga 500. And really, I get it. It's amazing what people are doing, I don't have a chance of pulling off anything like that. But it does get tired after a while ("a while" being a unit of time significantly less than 30 years.) I'd prefer a Commodore 128 Ultimate, myself, so I'm likely S.O.L. but in the same boat here

And to further agree, Commodore was around *way* before Apple and Microsoft. They sold office equipment for years. So a paper shredder is, as you put, 'on point.' It's not nostalgia, sure, but it's practical and it's revenue that shouldn't necessarily be ignored. If I need a file cabinet or paper shredder I'd absolutely look at Commodore branded items if they were competitive. I didn't hear a lot of folks complaining about Radio Shack, and that was their gamebook for decades.

 

[palladin9479]

I'm still trying to figure out why I would want this. I still have a Commodore 64 in my closet that's been gathering dust for about 30 years.

The Retro community is quite large nowadays and most are constantly scouring ebay and old electronics markets looking for old hardware to build retro rigs. Finding original C64 compatible hardware is practically impossible so someone took the opportunity to create authentic hardware.

I mean someone actually made these ...

https://picog.us

A real ISA sound card that does Gravis Ultra Sound, Sound Blaster Pro 2, Adlib (OPL2) along with a few others.

 

[shortaru]

I wouldn't be super confident on that. there are lots and lots of things people buy and store unused thinking they might be collectible in future. its highly speculative. if these guys turn these trademarks into a multi million dollar business that is relevant in 20 years, yea, then they will be worth some money. but if they turn out to be just the latest group to try and fail to resurrect the brand, they'll likely be a novelty item worth $30 loose or maybe $100 in the package.

I would, because I know the difference between porcelain figurines and Elvis doodads and products with actual value, popularity, and function.

The best things to collect are items that are not typically viewed as collectible, because, duh, EVERYBODY IS COLLECTING THEM. No scarcity = no value.

Tech products with a cult following, however, don't fall into that trap. Even though everybody knows the name and what it is, few will value it and thus few will save it. Those who do value it will want it pristine.

It's us nostalgic old heads that pay a premium for items like this, not Johnny Stamp Collector that spent his month's allowance on a piece of sticky paper.

 

[LabRat 891]

What exactly in that link gave you that idea?!
Are all FPGA no matter how weak "materials that is subject to export control" ? If it would say that I would agree but they are not saying that.

To my limited knowledge, most-all FPGAs
(not explicitly engineered to *not* fall under those controls)
*may* be subject to those regulations and restrictions, yes.

[RE: https://adaptivesupport.amd.com/s/q...tatuslevel-of-the-artix7-200t-?language=en_US]
Someone else wanted to know whether the FPGA (or similar, and in same lineup) used in the new C64 product was subject to those restrictions, or not.
They asked in a public forum but, another member implied that AMD considers this 'sensitive' information, requiring a contractual relationship with AMD to even find out.

[RE: https://adaptivesupport.amd.com/s/article/40157?language=en_US]
Another member of the public forum inquiry, linked to this page. Seemingly, in explanation as to why such details are confidential and/or how to get those details 'through proper channels'.

Title: "40157 - AMD Adaptive SoC and FPGA Technical Support – Export Controlled Information (include ITAR) Policy"

Description Reads: "What are ECI and ITAR, and what is AMD Technical Support's policy on receiving export-controlled files?"

So, at the very least the answer to "Is the Artix 7 ITAR restricted?" is a solid
"Yes, maybe, it might be; it's complicated, but possibly, depending on what you're doing with it and who it's sold to, maybe no"

 

[TerryLaze]

A real ISA sound card that does Graphics Ultra Sound, Sound Blaster Pro 2, Adlib (OPL2) along with a few others.

Gravis, not graphics.
And that card was super expensive back in the day so nobody had it and you can't easily find it used to buy it today, so it makes a lot of sense to recreate that.

I would, because I know the difference between porcelain figurines and Elvis doodads and products with actual value, popularity, and function.

The best things to collect are items that are not typically viewed as collectible, because, duh, EVERYBODY IS COLLECTING THEM. No scarcity = no value.

Tech products with a cult following, however, don't fall into that trap. Even though everybody knows the name and what it is, few will value it and thus few will save it. Those who do value it will want it pristine.

It's us nostalgic old heads that pay a premium for items like this, not Johnny Stamp Collector that spent his month's allowance on a piece of sticky paper.

Oh I bet there will be a lot of people that will order two of these, to use one and to keep one, or will get only one to put it on the shelf.
There will be many pristine unopened one of these in the future.

So, at the very least the answer to "Is the Artix 7 ITAR restricted?" is a solid
"Yes, maybe, it might be; it's complicated, but possibly, depending on what you're doing with it and who it's sold to, maybe no"

Well that sucks...hope they won't have any issues.

 

[ottonis]

this is just the latest group trying to make a few bucks with what's left of the IP. and they haven't actually sealed the deal yet.

I respectfully disagree. This seem to be enthusiasts of the 8 Bit era, who cherish the Commodore 64 platform, for which they want it to continue to strive and preserve its legacy.

 

[ottonis]

As someone who grew up with many of my friends having a C64, and vividly remembering playing ",Pit Stop" one-on-one on a split screen, I do appreciate this nostalgic project and wish the makers best of success.
To all the skeptics out there: Of course,the look and feel of this old tech is in an entirely different league compared to today's standards.
And yet, these old things benefit from the technological constraints of their time as they had to leave a lot to the imagination of the players, which in and of itself is an excercize often missed in modern games.

 

[TerryLaze]

I respectfully disagree. This seem to be enthusiasts of the 8 Bit era, who cherish the Commodore 64 platform, for which they want it to continue to strive and preserve its legacy.

Sure, but in the end it doesn't make much of a difference, they need to make money to keep existing and they have almost no means of making money, licensing is about the only thing they can do without having to spend their own money.

If this c64 campaign isn't successful they will have an extremely difficult time doing anything.
These things are partly that expensive because the earnings also go toward the deal to get the name.

 

[palladin9479]

Gravis, not graphics.

Autocorrect

 

[Roland Of Gilead]

small correction. this is *not* the first new "Commodore" hardware in 30 years. there have been several units released under the 'official' brand since Commodore caved. this is just the latest group trying to make a few bucks with what's left of the IP. and they haven't actually sealed the deal yet.

Commodore Gaming PC's circa 2007.

New Commodore gaming PCs looking sharp

Pictures and additional information have surfaced about Commodore's new gaming …

arstechnica.com

I had the G model with a Q6600, and it was also my first real foray into overclocking.

 

[GideonZ]

If it's not an actual 6510 CPU then doesn't it have to use software emulation? How does it execute 6510 machine language?

Well, that's the beauty of FPGAs. They allow you to create your own digital logic circuits. So for people that have a bit of skill in this area (e.g. me ;-), a 6510 can be part of this digital design. In fact, I placed three of them in this implementation; one for the C64 part, and two for the floppy drives, as the original 1541, 1571 and 1581 had their own CPUs. It differs from a software emulation in that it is not 'executed' by another CPU, but it truly behaves like a 6510 due to the logic gates.

 

[usertests]

What is the use case of having 2,000 times more RAM than the original? I imagine some interesting things could be done with that, if you allow applications to use more than original limits, or have "save states" for the operating system where you can swap another program in quickly wherever it was running.

I'm disappointed.
These have maybe $50 of tech in them. $299 is ridiculous. Looks like the company went the greed route, unfortunately. I'll pass.

The FPGA could be more expensive than you'd think, as is manufacturing any low volume product in the post-tariff environment.

 

[GideonZ]

I'm disappointed.
These have maybe $50 of tech in them. $299 is ridiculous. Looks like the company went the greed route, unfortunately. I'll pass.

Unfortunately, this is not true. This *would* be true if it were a software emulator, but it isn't. Compare this to an audio system. Some people are totally fine with a lousy BT speaker; others prefer a high-end multi-speaker setup with the best DSP processing you can get. They don't come at the same price.

I actually think that $299 is a bargain, considering that the individual parts when bought separately add up to more than that. It is especially this collaboration between the people that have designed the best they can do that makes this project so interesting! Whether it appeals to people on a personal level is a completely different question. Retro-nostalgia is not for everyone.

For your reference, there are other alternatives, such as the EVO-64, which focuses on the absolute best sound you can ever get from a 1982, 8-bit sound chip, by using electron tube amplifiers. These boards alone are more expensive than this integrated solution. Will these produce studio quality synth sound like a modern KORG? No! But that's not the point.