Thuban conclusions over a variety of websites - AMD fans enjoy!

[ksampanna]

Ya ok, I'l mention HT, turbo boost, turbo core. so what?

 

[jennyh]

The more core debate is just a joke basically. Intel cores are bigger, more transistors, have hyperthreading etc.

AMD's methods are the best way forward, it's just poor coding that is holding them back right now.

 

[Chad Boga]

Well all I have to say is this, 3 years later the Q6600 will dominate any dualcore in GTA 4, BFBC2, and almost any intensive app. Yet at launch the Q6600 got its ass handed to it pretty regularly by the equal priced 3.0 GHz E6850. And unlike the Q6600, there are a few apps and games that fully use the extra cores that are provided at launch.

You are still overrating the ease in which various applications can be made endlessly multithreaded.

It wasn't so hard going from 1 thread to 2, or even from 2 to 4, but once you start going beyond that, the number of apps that benefit significantly start to shrivel up.

But hey, don't take my word for it, go ask Linus Torvalds on the Real World Tech forums, he will happily explain it better than I can(and he likes to use profanities to explain the difficulties of parallel programming :lol: ).

 

[AMW1011]

You are still overrating the ease in which various applications can be made endlessly multithreaded.

It wasn't so hard going from 1 thread to 2, or even from 2 to 4, but once you start going beyond that, the number of apps that benefit significantly start to shrivel up.

But hey, don't take my word for it, go ask Linus Torvalds on the Real World Tech forums, he will happily explain it better than I can(and he likes to use profanities to explain the difficulties of parallel programming :lol: ).

Understandable, but we have some applications benefiting NOW, even games. I realize that the benefits of hexacores will never be across the board, but in very intensive situations it will be, including physics or AI heavy gaming like BFBC2.

 

[Look]

Ya ok, I'l mention HT, turbo boost, turbo core. so what?

Being able to process data in a parallel format (IE HT making the 860/920/930 more than a "4-core" processor), is deceptive. If Thuban didn't match up to, say, an i5 750 (a true-quad core), then there would be something wrong the the hexcore.

 

[ksampanna]

No...

Where you aware when the C2Qs came out? They were useless compared to duals. Give the hexacores time, likely less than 3 years this time, and they will show their true colors. They might not be 50% faster, but they will be faster.




No, the i7 860 is slightly ahead overall, but that will change in time and is NOT in anyway worth $80 more. We are talking a 5% difference here from my guesses.

Really? So you would throw $80 at theoretical, insignificant, and unnoticeable performance? Perhaps it is not I that needs to step back for a moment.

No, the X6s aren't as good as Jenny makes them out to be, but did you expect anything less? They are good enough to make buying an i5 or i7 a very difficult decision.

LOL

Okay, so within the next three years, the 1090T will show its true colours. By then, Intel will have come up with a dual core which would blow it away.

 

[FALC0N]

OK forget pricing, forget everything.
Lets say someone puts a 6 core 1090T & a 4 core 860/920/930 in front of you, & tells you they are similarly priced, & have overall similar performance. Would you not wonder that why the 6 core chip is not outpacing the others by a significant margin? You know that the 4 core chips are proving more than a handful for the 6 core. Would you not say then, that the 6 core chip must be inferior?

Once again back to a academic argument. No end user really cares about how "core efficient" it is. It doesn't affect anybody in any appreciable way.

A simple academic counter argument would be that instead of giving you 6 REAL cores, intel chose gimmicks like more cache and hyperthreading to make 4 core act like 6. It too is a non starter for the same reason yours is.

 

[ksampanna]

Being able to process data in a parallel format (IE HT making the 860/920/930 more than a "4-core" processor), is deceptive. If Thuban didn't match up to, say, an i5 750 (a true-quad core), then there would be something wrong the the hexcore.

Ya ok, but the 750 is $100 cheaper than the 1090T. I'm comparing 1090T with the chips across its price spectrum, & it's 1090T's bad luck that they happen to possess HT & aggressive turbo modes.

 

[booseek]

From what I have seen, most of today's gaming benchmarks that use Radeon 5800 GPUs show that the i5 and i7 beat both Thubans in gaming, sometimes significantly. But I would love it if it were not the case.

 

[FALC0N]

LOL

Okay, so within the next three years, the 1090T will show its true colours. By then, Intel will have come up with a dual core which would blow it away.

This was not well thought out. It is unlikely that dual cores will even exist in 3 years. They are in danger of going the way of the Dodo core.

 

[milki654]

Ya ok, but the 750 is $100 cheaper than the 1090T. I'm comparing 1090T with the chips across its price spectrum, & it's 1090T's bad luck that they happen to possess HT & aggressive turbo modes.

You forgot about 1055t.

Then it 930's bad luck because Thuban has 6 cores...

 

[Look]

Ya ok, but the 750 is $100 cheaper than the 1090T. I'm comparing 1090T with the chips across its price spectrum, & it's 1090T's bad luck that they happen to possess HT & aggressive turbo modes.

I wasn't trying to compare it with a chip outside of it's price point, but all of the i7's have HT. The only reason I brought it up is that trying to market it as 6-core vs. 4-core is a bit deceptive, since the i7s have a different instruction set with HT. Both do have turbo, however.

 

[ksampanna]

Once again back to a academic argument. No end user really cares about how "core efficient" it is. It doesn't affect anybody in any appreciable way.

A simple academic counter argument would be that instead of giving you 6 REAL cores, intel chose gimmicks like more cache and hyperthreading to make 4 core act like 6. It too is a non starter for the same reason yours is.

I have to differ. Cache & HT is not a gimmick. It's serious firepower which gives the 920/930/860 an edge even when they lose out on core count.
Else, by your logic, the extra 2 cores of 1090T is also a gimmick. AMD just squeezd them to try & match i7 performance.

 

[milki654]

From what I have seen, most of today's gaming benchmarks that use Radeon 5800 GPUs show that the i5 and i7 beat both Thubans in gaming, sometimes significantly. But I would love it if it were not the case.

Please look again, a lot of review sites reduced the resolution to 800x600 so they would show the CPU power, but that is unrealistic because most people use much higher resolution.

 

[ksampanna]

This was not well thought out. It is unlikely that dual cores will even exist in 3 years. They are in danger of going the way of the Dodo core.

:lol:
You don't get sarcasm, do you?

 

[FALC0N]

I have to differ. Cache & HT is not a gimmick. It's serious firepower which gives the 920/930/860 an edge even when they lose out on core count.
Else, by your logic, the extra 2 cores of 1090T is also a gimmick. AMD just squeezd them to try & match i7 performance.

2 additonal cores ISN'T serious firepower in your mind.

And you missed the point. I ended by saying that BOTH arguments were non-starters in my mind. They are both fine cpu's that achieve their results in different ways. How really doesn't matter to the end user.

 

[FALC0N]

:lol:
You don't get sarcasm, do you?

Point taken.

But their are a couple of odd balls on this board that would say that and mean it!

 

[notty22]

You forgot about 1055t.

Then it 930's bad luck because Thuban has 6 cores...

How can we forget about it ? Its price point is all we keep hearing about,paired with the flagships performance (300 dollars) !
It used to be all about gaming, for AMD cpu's, the best gaming cpu, the best bang for your buck. Now they got themselves a 300 dollar cpu, and whole slew of new 200 dollar motherboards. But all the AMD fanboys will hold up the cheaper m/b's prices, the cheaper cpu' prices, the slower ram in one argument then cry foul when those under perform in a Intel shootout.

 

[jennyh]

The whole core thing is a smokescreen, it's total nonsense.

It shows how effective the intel mind machine works though - they would actually have us think that 6 cores is somehow a bad thing compared to 4 cores.

We'll see exactly how much cores matter when bulldozer arrives, when AMD has HKMG, CMT and Turbo all on the same package.

 

[ksampanna]

The whole core thing is a smokescreen, it's total nonsense.

It shows how effective the intel mind machine works though - they would actually have us think that 6 cores is somehow a bad thing compared to 4 cores.

We'll see exactly how much cores matter when bulldozer arrives, when AMD has HKMG, CMT and Turbo all on the same package.

Roger That. Have your coffins ready.

 

[AMW1011]

How can we forget about it ? Its price point is all we keep hearing about,paired with the flagships performance (300 dollars) !
It used to be all about gaming, for AMD cpu's, the best gaming cpu, the best bang for your buck. Now they got themselves a 300 dollar cpu, and whole slew of new 200 dollar motherboards. But all the AMD fanboys will hold up the cheaper m/b's prices, the cheaper cpu' prices, the slower ram in one argument then cry foul when those under perform in a Intel shootout.

A $200 hexacore that performs damn close to $200-$900 quadcores is something you shouldn't forget. It isn't a price v performance winner, that's the Phenom II 955 at $150. It doesn't dominate games any better than any decent quadcore. It does add a very good alternative to i7s for less money.

 

[jennyh]

have fun ksampanna 😉

 

[ksampanna]

OK, anyway....i've to sleep now, it's 4 am 😴 lol

The Intel vs AMD debate will never really be over. It's bastards like us who will keep it alive 😀

Ultimately, each one to his/her own. No hard feelings ...

Peace Out

 

[Chad Boga]

No, the i7 860 is slightly ahead overall, but that will change in time and is NOT in anyway worth $80 more. We are talking a 5% difference here from my guesses.

Your guesses are very, very poor

Really? So you would throw $80 at theoretical, insignificant, and unnoticeable performance? Perhaps it is not I that needs to step back for a moment.

Wake up and read the below.

It was all there in the Anandtech review, how the hell did YOU not pick this up.



................................1055T.......860........%Faster

Adobe Photoshop..........20.1......16.4.........1.225609756
DivX............................43.7.......35.9.........1.217270195
x264....1st Pass............79.........76............0.962025316
...........2nd Pass...........25.1.......26.8.........1.067729084
3dsmax 9.....................12.7........15..........1.181102362
Cinebench...Multi.........16268......16598......1.020285223
Pov Ray.......................3296.......3517.......1.067050971
WinRar.........................95..........79.6........1.193467337
7-Zip 32mb.................15339....18008.6....1.174039.....* i7-870 used in review and adjusted for here
..........300mb..............3084.......3885........1.259727626
FO3............................80.4........90.2.........1.121890547
L4D...........................111.5.......131..........1.174887892
Crysis.........................72.4........83.3.........1.150552486
Batman.......................180........180.43......1.0002387.....* i7-870 used in review and adjusted for here
Dragon Age.................102.........149.11.....1.461863....* i7-870 used in review and adjusted for here
Dawn of War 2.............52.8.......69.3..........1.3125.....* i7-870 used in review and adjusted for here

Average speed advantage for the i7-860 over the 1055T = 16.2%



Please note the following, where the Anandtech review had an i7-870 and no i7-860 in the review, I adjusted the i7-870's score downwards by 4.75% which is the full clock speed difference between and i7-870 and i7-860, and thus very generous to the Thuban.

In the above benchmarks I wasn't able to take into account SYSMark as Anandtech didn't bench the 1055T.

Also excluded from the above benchmarks is the Cinebench Single Thread result in which the i7-860 dominated over the 1055T.

 

[ksampanna]

have fun ksampanna 😉

thanks