Toshiba Satellite A200 Random Shutdown

[vadavada]

Ok, so continuing - and running Windows 7 x86.

In the bios, I switched to only using one core, and 'always low'. Even when connected to AC, it has not yet rebooted on these settings (mind you, that's only about 4-5 hrs of testing) but the computer is appallingly slow to use.

When I set the bios to one core, 'Dynamic' the machine spontaneously reset within about 30s (during boot-up actually, which seems to be a particularly sensitive period for restarting).

Having now set the bios to two cores, 'always low', the machine is running of AC power and hasn't yet spontaneously rebooted (currently running performance testing software PerformanceTest 7.0 on it). CPU seems to be sticking around 53 degrees.
Performance seems to be (unsurprisingly enough) about double what was measured when set in bios to use only a single core, and 'always low'.

This is all rather frustrating though; it doesn't appear that the reboots are CPU-temperature dependent, or even necessarily load-dependent as reboots were not occurring during burn-in tests even with both cores on dynamic (they were occurring randomly, but certainly not as a result of high CPU, 3d, or drive load, or even during ram testing). Mind you, I can't actually remember if I did the burn-in tests on AC or battery. I *think* it was AC. I may run them again both with and without AC and see if reboot frequency is different.

 

[vadavada]

Ok, continuing.
Reinstalled the machine with Windows 7 x64
Set the machine to 1 processor, dynamic - still got reboots on AC power
Switched back to 2 processor, dynamic; booted into safe mode, opened Control Panel, Device Manager, expanded 'Processors', right-clicked on each processor and selected 'disable'.
Rebooted into normal windows mode, and the machine has not yet reset (after about 2-3 hrs so far).

I have run PerformanceTest 7.0 again on the system, and its performance seems to be as equivalent to when I was running Windows 7 x86 2 processor, dynamic on AC. Thus, I suspect the processor is running at normal full-speed.
I also expect this same approach would work in Windows 7 x86 - but I'm not presently excited by the prospect of reinstalling the machine so I'm not going to test it at this stage.

So it seems that booting into safe mode and disabling both processors in device manager *may* resolve the problem. I haven't really been testing long enough yet to definitively state that it *does* fix it. I don't know what the long-term effects of doing this may be, but if the alternative is having the machine randomly reboot when running on AC a short useful life is better than a longer useless life.

If the machine continues to randomly reboot, I'll post another update.

 

[vadavada]

So having reformatted the machine back to Win7 x86 just for the hell of it, I used CPU-Z to examine the consequences of disabling the processors in safe mode.
In Win7, x86, CPU-Z reports (and performance tests confirm) that the result of disabling the CPU entries through safe mode is that the CPUs run at minimum speed (~750Mhz in this case).

Based on performance tests on the x64 installation, this doesn't appear to have been the case then (because the performance was high - equal to when running of batteries or AC with both proc running at full speed when it was lucky enough not to reboot on AC).

Anyway, the point is that right now running with the processors disabled on Win7 x86 is a waste of time. Much like running with 2 processors on 'always low' the performance is garbage, and the computer is essentially not worth using.

I'll reinstall back to x64 and see if I can get that doing what is was earlier (running fast, not bombing out, with processors disabled under Device Manager and in bios running both processors on dynamic, on AC).

 

[vadavada]

Further continuing; in Win7 x86, if I re-enable the processors in safe mode, but explicitly set my power options to limit the processor max and min to 50%, CPU-Z again informs me that the core speed is 798 MHz. Again, the computer does not reboot when running of AC at 798 Mhz. If I increase the min and max to 80%, then the machine does start rebooting when on AC. Even if I set the min and max to 100% for when the machine is running of batteries, the machine does not crash when running on batteries.

I reinstalled Win7 x64, booted into safe mode, and disabled both processors in device manager (as I did previously). CPU-Z reports that in this case (when I boot back to normal mode) the CPU is running at ~1995 MHz. This explains the difference in performance identified using the performance testing tool between Win7 x86 and Win7 x64 when the processors are disabled in device manager in each case. There is a substantial difference (for one reason or another) between the processor speed.

Anyway, I'm now going to let the machine run for as long as I can (several days) on AC power, running Win7 x64 with the processors disabled in Device Manager (and so presumably with the CPU remaining stable at 1995 MHz). With some luck, it will not crash *and* it will be fast enough to be useful.

This doesn't really clear up what the problem is. I had earlier thought that the reboots occurred when CPU speeds switched (sometimes, often it switched with no problems at all). That would explain why reboots never occured when the bios was switched from 'dynamic' speed to 'always low', as well as when the processor was disabled through device manager. There would be no speed switching. However, I would have expected that explicitly setting (in power options) both minimum and maximum CPU speed to the same value (80% for example) would have prevented switching, and thus stopped the reboots (which it didn't). It is possible that setting both values to the same thing does not actually prevent switching, but I haven't checked that directly.
In any case, my suspicion is/was that switching the speed of the processor switches the voltage required by the processor and that a problem in the AC power system was causing insufficient voltage to be delivered to the processor, causing the reboot. Without spending a while testing every component on the motherboard using equipment I don't have, I can't really check this.


I also don't have an explanation for why the speed the processor runs at when the processor is 'disabled' through device manager differs between Win7 x86 and Win7 x64. However, as long as the machine is not rebooting under Win7 x64 and the processor remains fixed at 1995 MHz that'll do me for the time being.
What would really be ideal, though, apart from the problem not appearing in the first place, would be to be able to set the processor speed to 'always high' in the bios in the way you can set it to 'always low'. I suspect this would overcome the problem.

Best of luck to all, and if the machine reboots in Win7 x64 despite having the processors disabled in device manager, or I come up with anything new, I'll post again.

 

[vadavada]

Adding yet again to this seemingly endless saga:
The clock speed does *not* remained fixed at 1995 MHz in Win7 x64 when the processors are disabled through device manager. On next reboot, the CPU speed was back to ~750 MHz (which is clearly useless).

Since I still think it is CPU speed switching that is causing crashes, I'm now trying setting the CPU min and max speeds to 100% in power management, having re-enabled the processors through device manager, and hoping that switching between multipliers of 10x and 11x will not create enough of a change in CPU voltage (if that is the problem) to cause resets.

If I could find a way to lock the processor to a particular multiplier (e.g. 10x) then I'd be able to test it more directly, but the only program which appears to do that (RMClock) requires use of unsigned drivers and at one point gave me a bluescreen so unless some way comes out of the woodwork to lock the multiplier at a particular value (for the love of god, Toshiba/Intel, give me some way of explicitly controlling the multiplier in the bios) that doesn't seem to be an option.

 

[vadavada]

Finally, I found a tool to explicitly control the CPU multiplier & voltage, called ThrottleStop.
With my processors disabled (through Safe Mode), and ThrottleStop installed I'm now running the laptop with a multiplier of 10x and a Voltage ID of 1.175

Apart from needing to run from battery during the booting process (during which ThrottleStop has not yet started), the machine now *never* seems to reset. I am actually now using it like a normal computer again.

Finally, my config is Win7 Ultimate x64. In bios both processors are running as 'dynamic' (although if they are switched to Always Low *and* ThrottleStop can override that it may overcome resets during booting).

My only concern now is that because the CPU speed is locked, it may not cool down even if it needs to (as it probably will not slow itself down). Still, the computer was useless before, and is now useful so it is better than it was right up until the moment the machine bakes.

Good luck, all.

 

[Metroid_III]

I have a Toshiba Satellite A205-S5831 with similar problems. Random shuts down, sometimes in seconds, sometimes after hours, with dynamic cpu and dual core enabled, when plugged into the charger. On battery the problem is less persistent but is there and the battery life sucks (40 mins with MAX power saving) so that's not a good option. On always low it seems to perform much better, but random shutdowns still occur, sometimes before getting to windows. Until yesterday, I had found a solution to keep the computer running, for hours on end:

1)change cpu to always low (can leave dual core enabled)
2) place computer on lap so that both the side and bottom fan have absolutely ZERO obstruction (what i do is place the laptop so that it's supported in the middle by my right leg). This makes it work all the time, even when moving it around, just keep your hand off the bottom fan....at least until yesterday when i developed another problem.

Now, usually after watching 1-2 episodes anime on vlc, the computer will freeze and random multi-color blocks appear on screen. The computer just completely freeze and needs to be shut down using the power button. Afterwards, I can't turn on the computer for an hour or so. Could be overheating but i doubt it, even when i've gotten to work on dynamic for awhile CPU never goes above 53 degrees Celsius MAX. Intel GFX are right below the keyboard which only feel warm to me, not hot.

Sorry for the wall of text, just putting out my situation, hope my temporary solution will help some others.

 

[itayguy]

same problem for me with this rubbish A200 - I switched to low cpu (not dynamic) and now it doesn't shuts down , but it feels like it is working slow.

My guess for this problem is that when the cpu tries to go to full process power, and the vents starts to spin at high speed, there is a problem with the vent , and it uses too much amp's , and this makes the computer shout off.

I think we should all make a protest to Toshiba , and add this link as a proof that this is a major problem.

my guess is that Toshiba put a time bomb it this laptops, to increase it sale


Last Toshiba I am getting ever !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Guest]

hi, I have the same problem with my toshiba A305-S6898, in windows and with the charger plugged in freezes and in safe mode with the same scenario is ok. I found a temporary fix for that:

With the computer plugged in first set the bios to default. after that boot in safe mode, and go to device manager, look for the "procesors". choose any core and right click on in to disable it (no uninstall). After that restart the computer and boot windows in normal mode. Then in windows go to device manager and enable the core that you disabled in "safe mode". Now it should work with no freezes and restart, unless you install Windows update and restart again to complete the installation. for that scenario you have to do the whole process again. and if you want to turn it off, just put it to sleep or hibernate. hope its fix your problem!! WK

 

[Notsosure]

In another forum/thread I had seen the solution of disabling the processor cores in the device manager and hence tried it, which sounds weird but actually works. I have kept them permanently disabled and am not sure of the consequences. All windows updates have gone through smoothly so far though I have not tried any major updates such as SP1/SP2. My A200 J01 random restart problem became more severe with the battery draining out further and further. It appears to me that the processor tries to do some balancing act between the battery and AC power and causes random restarts when the battery is too weak. The solution lies in disabling the processor cores in safe mode (tried successfully) or perhaps using a new battery (not tried). Safe mode or running the notebook only on battery works probably because the processor is not required to do any juggling but strangely, only AC power does not seem to work. It is really surprising that Toshiba did not recall this product, which clearly has design flaws including high heat and random restarts.

 

[feva55]

I have an A200-1YO, 1.66ghz, upgraded to Windows 7 RC and 4Gb 667mhz PC 5300 RAM.
My problem started about a month ago when i was still running Vista Home Premium and 3Gb of Ram.
The machine just started switching itself off randomly. No warning, no error codes, no shutting down or logging off screen...just instant OFF.
At first i thought it was a virus so i scanned the hell out of the whole laptop with my Kaspersky Internet Security 2010 and found nothing. Sometimes it would be on for days then suddenly switch off. sometimes when i plug in my external hard drive or my IR remote receiver it will switch off and sometimes it won't. The most annoying one is when it switches off about 2-3 mins after switching it on and i have done absolutely nothing to it.
I have blanked the hd using DBan and installed Windows 7 and it worked fine for a week or so until it started happening again.
There seems to be no repeat action that causes it to switch off. I have read about the overheating ideas and although i have had the laptop for about 16 months the airflow out of the vent on the side seems to be the same as it always has been..I keep the laptop raised at the back to improve the air flow and it doesn't seem to be overheating.
I have run a program called RealTemp and everything seems to be running within acceptable parameters at between 74-79 centigrade and the max showing at 86 degrees.
The ram i have upgraded to and installed is the correct type for the machine as i used Kingston's ram check function as well as checking the Toshiba website, plus it has been a long time since i installed the first 2gb of ram upgrade and nothing happened then.
The laptop is out of warranty so it would cost me an arm and a leg to get it fixed or at least looked at by Toshiba.
Has anybody got any ideas or suggestions as to what the cause may be??
If more information is needed please state what details required.
Many thanks in advance.

Have exactly the same problem with my Dell vostro 1000. tried everything..once it worked well after registry cleanup(Regcure)and virus cleanup(McAfee) but now scanning for malware sometimes causes it to shut down then other things aswell like everything you mentioned..:-🙂-(...

 

[sunnyzags]

6 hours later, and the a200 has NOT missed a beat. AC power attached, battery in, all the startup programs running, including the vdeo card drivers and utility, the CPU set to single core, and the Dynamic CPU Frequency Mode set to Always low, and the computer has NOT frozen or crashed once. Used it for 1 hour, then went to work for 5 hours. Never in the past week have I come back to find the PC not frozen. Maybe I have solved the problem from this computer, hope it works for you too......

Hii
@cors
thr is just a option of uninstalling the processors in contrl panl device mangr
does it harm if i uninstall one processr??

plzz help

 

[sunnyzags]

Hello,
Just joint this forum and to say thanks for your help guys as I am having problems with a200 toshiba,by the way toshiba used to be good but nowadays are all rubbish,anyway thanks,I just unistall processor and also display adapter,both are double under device manager,and put low instead dynamic CPU and seems to be working for the first time with ac charger. I tried previously almost everything,update CPU,new xp,silver compound,definitely toshiba fault,like all other models,eg,toshiba tecra 9100 yamaha sound problem with sp2,still not solved a problem,downloaded at least 50 drivers,using this one for diagnostics/com port,also qosmio g30,gpu repair program,toshiba fault again-at least theta admitted,asked for repair over 200 pounds,sold it.
Once again thanks and let you know if I have problems again.
I read so many replies regarding this but ussualy people say it's problem with gpu or dirt,it is nothing to do with that as laptop switching off sometimes in cole of seconds with ac charger,and finally I also tried to run benchmark and speed fun but could not Finnish it as it swithes off.
Regards
Donbato

Dobanto

plzzz let me know that u uninstalled one of the processrs by what steps ??/

I encounter the same problm

 

[sunnyzags]

It seems to me that toshiba ows us big time with their faulty laptops. We shouldnt be the bearer of these troubles ans costs. I'm seriously planning on contacting them and force them to acknowledge the problem and help us/ repay us, for the trouble we went trough. This is no different than all those asian cars being recalled from the US. If nessecary we can blow this out in the open. Very very bad marketing for toshiba.... They might be willing to listen, but we do need to act as a group then. By that i mean a groupcomplaint of all of us at the same time. Also from te people who already have it fixed by now. Im quite willing to take a lead in this (live in the netherlands), but i do need back up to make my point and to be taken seriously. Anyone interested?? Please let me know asap. With kind regards, J. Kievits

Hii Kie

I joined this forum lately
but u r rite nd if u havnt initiated the step
i m with u

 

[vectra500]

I've been having what appears to be a related problem. This is on a Toshiba A200 PSAF6A-07G01N, about 2.5 years old. A few months ago, the machine began spontaneously rebooting (presently at least a couple of times a week; it has been progressively more frequent, I think). The machine simply powers off briefly (1-5s or thereabouts), and then restarts. The power-off is instantaneous, with no blue-screen or other apparent software problem. It also occurs in Windows Vista x86, Windows 7 x86, and Ubuntu Linux x86 10.10.
I have tried running the system without a hard drive (from boot CD) - same problem
Fresh install of Windows - same problem
System restore - same problem

I have been monitoring the core temperatures while running burn-in tests. The cores reach 72ish degrees celcius (which they are on while I write this) and seem to operate fine at this peak temperature. Actually, it seems to be more frequent that the machine reboots when I am not actively using in rather than when I am. Mind you, that may simply be because it spends more time running without me actively working on it than with me working on it.

Anyway, after 1.5 continuous hours of burn-in testing the machine still hasn't rebooted during this process. Of course, that may be just pot luck.

Notable, the machine has *never* spontaneously rebooted while running on the battery. It does reboot with the AC power connected, with or without the battery inserted.

As I find more trends or patterns, I'll report them.
Also, the machine is running the most recent firmware (2.5?).

 

[vectra500]

Came accross a post in another forum where this surface mount capacitor is cited as being the culprit. NEC TOKIN OE128

http://www.zimbio.com/Laptop+Reviews/articles/cUMLNqDc_WN/NEC+TOKIN+0E128+OE128+Proadlizer+Capacitors

 

[BryanSellick]

Hi all, I might be having the same problem but want to verify the symptoms.

Seemingly random 'freezes' - power light stays on and, bizarrely, the DVD drive light turns on and stays on, but screen goes blank (display + backlight), no HD activity, utterly unresponsive. Thought maybe the DVD drive had some fault (eg throwing a bad interrupt) but I tried removing the drive and the problem still occurred. Independent of OS, has happened during startup as well as once Vista is booted up. Has occurred on battery power, mains power with the battery in, and mains power with the battery removed. The only thing to do at that point is hold down the power button until the hard power-off kicks in and reboot. Seems largely random but possibly linked to minor vibration/shock..? Not entirely sure.

Regards
Jim

Did you find a fix?

 

[vectra500]

Jim most of are having the problem of the laptop shutting down and starting back up with out any warning, this has generally been when running on power supply.

When mine runs on battery is rarely has the problem, but still exists.

I Have replaced power supply with no change, problem still exists which led me to the IC or Capacitor problem.

Try this link it may help your problem does not sound the same.



http://tim.id.au/laptops/toshiba/satellite%20a200.pdf

Regards Bill

 

[xettera]

A client gave me an A200 to fix.
It had 320gb as main drive and 200gb as secondary drive.
I tried to retrieve data from the 320gb drive, but it was seriously messed up.
I bought a replacement 320gb drive and tried reinstalling vista.
Machine kept rebooting at almost random points during install.

Long story short:
XP Live cd worked fine ONLY with no HDDs installed.
Only way to get vista to survive the install process was to only have the 200gb drive installed.

I read the service manual and some other stuff. Looks like there may be a hdd capacity limit of either 200gb or 250gb each drive.

Can anyone else confirm if this has made a difference for them?

 

[black1035]

thx to corsa59, now my a200 problem settle..

 

[salvoghana]

hi there br_15. just thought i'd let you know that i got it fixed and it wasn't the motherboard but it was an internal fault. the guy in the shop wouldn't tell me exactly what it was though (like it was a government secret!).
he had used a prog called speedfan and upgraded the bios (not sure where from as i had already checked on the toshiba site and had the latest version).
just before i put it in the shop it had only been working on the battery and whenever i plugged in the power cable it would switch off instantly.
i'm guessing that the fan speed had something to do with it obviously, but i don't care anymore! it's working now and i just wanted to say thanks for your help.
Cheers, Dude! (or is it Dudette?)

Hi, I am working for the Salvation Army in West Africa and have had the same problem with my toshiba. IT support is telling me similar things as everyone else. Where did you get yours fixed and can you post the contact information so I can call them.

Thanks

 

[tatooedsn]

You probably don't monitor this thread anymore Corsa, but your method is allowing me to reinstall windows as I type!

I tried replacing the hard drive, inverter, cpu fan, and video card to no avail. I was trying to avoid the mobo since it costs so much. Nowadays the mobo is cheaper than the 100 smackers I paid for the video card a year ago.

I'm still wondering if its a mobo or cpu issue in case I want to resolve this later. Normally I wouldn't care, but this laptop has a french keyboard that my portuguese wife enjoys using here in the states. Thanks again! I think I may get some brownie points with the wife!

Here is a solution that I found, and it has worked for me, so far.......

My guess is your laptops are exhibiting the same problem I faced, random crashes and freezes, with no warning.

I replaced the hard drive, reinstalled windows vista, same result.
Replaced ram, no better.
Replaced power supply, no good.
Run in safe mode, works fine, but very limited use.
Removed all the startup programs, still crashed.
Pulled my hair out, that worked for 10 minutes......
Replaced CPU, new thermal paste, reseated everything, and reassembled, and it worked perfectly, for about 3 hours, and then started crashing and freezing again.
Replaced vista with 7, and it wouldn't start at all........

Then I found a forum article that suggested that it only occurred when BOTH the battery and AC power supply where plugged in, disconnected the AC, started on battery only, and the problem seems to have completely dissappeared.

Not a solution, but certainly a step in the right direction. Now it appears then that something causes the computer to freeze on the motherboard at the AC point, or in the connection between the AC and the battery.

Forum suggested changing a bios setting.

Change the following setting in the bios setup, under the 'Advanced' tab
Dynamic CPU Frequency Mode = Always Low (NOT DYNAMIC)
Save and Restart

Now, this laptop has been running on battery only power without a problem for 2hours without a hitch, I was lucky if I could get 20 minutes out of it before, and most times it would not even start.

I am about to connect the AC power (whilst running) to see what happens, so I will report back on the result in the morning after it has been running for 5 or 6 hours.

Hope this helps. Will report back with further results

 

[Notsosure]

To my knowledge the only permanent solution is changing the NEC/TOKIN 0E128 Proadlizer Capacitor. All other solutions are temporary as they are just like providing life support systems while the capacitor is dying. Irrespective of what you do the capacitor ultimately dies. If one has time and patience then it is not very difficult to change that. Removing the old one is the most difficult part. Still the job can be done in 1-2 hours. I used a plier to crush it, which essentially removes the black plastic part. Then I used a a small and sharp flat head screw driver to chisel it delicately. One can use a small hammer or the plier itself to gently hit the sharp screw driver to chisel out the remaiining capaitor. Intermittently I used a small USB vacuum cleaner to suck out remaining tiny pieces. It is now very cleanly removed and I am waiting for my replacement capacitor to arrive. One can either use the exact same part as replacement or use several of smaller capacitance low-esr tantalum capacitors. The former apparently has limited life and hence people are going for the latter. I have ordered both but will probably use the former. I may upload some pictures later but for the timebeing the following links might help others make up their mind:

http://www.irisvista.com/tech/laptops/toshiba-satellite-a205/laptop-disassembly-1.htm

http://wiisingonline.com/NEC-TOKIN-0E128-OE128-Proadlizer-Capacitors-solve-Toshiba-Laptop-Problem-p-4088-272.html

http://australia.rs-online.com/web/c/?sra=oss&searchTerm=Tantalum%20Capacitors&cm_mmc=AU-PPC-0411-_-google-_-1_EEM_Capacitor_UK-_-tantalum%20capacitors_Phrase

 

[tatooedsn]

Wow, that's great info! Let me know how you make out with the capacitor change. I was able to install windows, but it goes back to a black screen after install is completed. I may try this myself if you have success. Pics of your project would awesome!

 

[kuzman67]

I've just ordered the capacitor too. My problem will be to find someone who will do the job correctly now. I don't think that heating the crap out of it is the correct way?