Toshiba Satellite A200 Random Shutdown

[Notsosure]

Some people have used heat gun to soften/melt the solder of OE128 to facilitate its removal. However, I just used physical means to avoid any possible damage due to heat. Other usual precautions such as disconnecting AC power, removing the battery, wearing antistatic wristband, etc will have to be followed in such disassembly procedures, of course.

In the first link of my previous post STEPS 17-21 show the OE128 Capacitor in A205 (apparently). In A200 the capacitor will be visible only after the fan has been removed. My replacement capacitor is yet to arrive but I have included some photos in the link below to show what I have done so far. I may have to just melt the existing solder on the terminals (and perhaps add a bit more solder) and stick the new capacitor there. I will update again once it is done.

http://gs138.photobucket.com/groups/q251/S1BXDWUERU/

 

[leinad0931]

Some people have used heat gun to soften/melt the solder of OE128 to facilitate its removal. However, I just used physical means to avoid any possible damage due to heat. Other usual precautions such as disconnecting AC power, removing the battery, wearing antistatic wristband, etc will have to be followed in such disassembly procedures, of course.

In the first link of my previous post STEPS 17-21 show the OE128 Capacitor in A205 (apparently). In A200 the capacitor will be visible only after the fan has been removed. My replacement capacitor is yet to arrive but I have included some photos in the link below to show what I have done so far. I may have to just melt the existing solder on the terminals (and perhaps add a bit more solder) and stick the new capacitor there. I will update again once it is done.

http://gs138.photobucket.com/groups/q251/S1BXDWUERU/

Thank you very much for this post... Very informative and helpful... still waiting for the update Sir... 99% hoping that this post/solution is the one i need for reviving my A205.... Thank you!!!

 

[Notsosure]

Yes, its done! Solved!! Perfect!!!

I have soldered the new OE128 cap and my A200 is working perfectly again after nearly two years of gradual and painful death. I just added the solder on the new OE128 cap at eight locations corresponding to the tips of the four pads/terminals. Then after placing the cap on the pads I simply inserted the hot soldering iron tip to touch and melt off the solder already added there. Although I first added the solder onto the new cap the same results could be achieved by adding the solder onto the tips of the pads, placing the new cap over them and then melting off the added solder by touching with the tip of a hot soldering iron. The photos given in the following link might help those who want to try the same:

http://gs138.photobucket.com/groups/q251/S1BXDWUERU/

Of course, one could also do soldering in a more conventional fashion by feeding the solder wire onto the hot iron tip placed at appropriate locations.

Now do not have any more doubts. This is a 100% sure and perfect solution (until the cap dies again, of course) not only for A200 but many other models of Toshiba that use OE128 or OE907 cap and exhibit random restarts, freezing when AC is connected, etc, etc.

 

[Notsosure]

Those who want to replace their NEC/TOKIN capacitor with apparently more durable tantalum capacitors may see this:
http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=8991&page=8

When soldered, tantalum caps look like this: http://www.google.com.au/imgres?q=a305+toshiba+tantalum&hl=en&safe=active&sa=X&rlz=1W1ADRA_enAU347&biw=1280&bih=799&tbm=isch&prmd=imvns&tbnid=SHHrTeWmdgExmM:&imgrefurl=http://www.forumnow.com.br/vip/mensagens.asp%3Fforum%3D32226%26topico%3D3029069&docid=xQgzmrRdRowFQM&imgurl=http://img823.imageshack.us/img823/5528/trabalhopronto.jpg&w=640&h=480&ei=uHcTT7bVCMPJmQWf8tn-CQ&zoom=1
However, the specs of tantalum cap must be chosen carefully, especially its ESR ( http://wiki.xtronics.com/index.php/Capacitors_and_ESR ). The rated ESR of OE128 is 2 mOhm and hence the ESR of each of the four 330uF tantalum caps soldered in parallel should not ideally exceed 8 mOhm (In practice, somewhat higher ESR might still be OK). The following cap seems to match most of the specs:
http://australia.rs-online.com/web/p/tantalum-solid/0147639/

 

[Guest]

Yes, its done! Solved!! Perfect!!!

I have soldered the new OE128 cap and my A200 is working perfectly again after nearly two years of gradual and painful death. I just added the solder on the new OE128 cap at eight locations corresponding to the tips of the four pads/terminals. Then after placing the cap on the pads I simply inserted the hot soldering iron tip to touch and melt off the solder already added there. Although I first added the solder onto the new cap the same results could be achieved by adding the solder onto the tips of the pads, placing the new cap over them and then melting off the added solder by touching with the tip of a hot soldering iron. The photos given in the following link might help those who want to try the same:

http://gs138.photobucket.com/groups/q251/S1BXDWUERU/

Of course, one could also do soldering in a more conventional fashion by feeding the solder wire onto the hot iron tip placed at appropriate locations.

Now do not have any more doubts. This is a 100% sure and perfect solution (until the cap dies again, of course) not only for A200 but many other models of Toshiba that use OE128 or OE907 cap and exhibit random restarts, freezing when AC is connected, etc, etc.

I opened my A200 today only to find out that my motherboard looks a bit different than yours. The most disturbing was the fact that there's no need to remove the fan in order to access the capacitor. What is more, there's not 1 but 10 small capacitors.
I'm pretty angry right know as I've been waiting two weeks now for OE128 coming from Hong Kong.
I'll post the pic of motherboard later today.
Can somebody advise me what to do here?
I'm really desperate and seriously considering new laptop tomorrow afternoon.

 

[Guest]

 

[Notsosure]

Laptop repairs call for a lot of patience. Even i7, USB3 laptops have become so cheap nowadays ( http://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/59445 ) that the efforts involved in the laptop self-repairs are more for providing a sense of achievement and waste reduction rather than real monetary benefits. I had paid nearly $2.5k for my A200 but now it may not even be worth $200.

You have not provided any details of the problem you are facing or your A200. The solution provided here is especially for Toshiba Satellite laptops that use NEC/TOKIN Proadlizer Capacitor and show symptoms of "working fine on battery but randomly freezing/restarting when AC is plugged in". Is your laptop Toshiba Satellite A200? If it is Toshiba Satellite Pro A200, Toshiba Protege A200, etc then it is a different cup of tea. If the problem is the same as mentioned here then the first thing a person must do is to look at the photograph of their specific motherboard by googling before taking any further action. One can also click "Find another model" in the link I have provided above to reach here http://www.irisvista.com/tech/ and see if it is helpful in locating any Proadlizer cap in your model.

The best you can do now (apart from buying another laptop, which is not an unwise decision anyway) is to start another thread providing all the relevant details of your laptop model and the problem because your motherboard does not show any Proadlizer (OE128, OE907, etc) and hence is not relevant to this thread. You should also consider posting your problem on badcaps (a link provided in my earlier post) as you may find more relevant experts there.

 

[Notsosure]

mariang,

I just typed "toshiba satellite pro a200 motherboard" in Google and then clicked on "Images" to find a photo of it in less than a minute, which matches with what you have posted:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Toshiba-Satellite-Pro-A200-Motherboard-Spares-Repairs-Faulty-/250908033674?_trksid=p4340.m185&_trkparms=algo%3DDLSL%252BSIC.NPJS%26its%3DI%26itu%3DUCI%252BUA%26otn%3D10%26pmod%3D300556140268%252B300556140268%26po%3D%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D4949252509126057171

So your laptop is Toshiba Satellite Pro A200 and not Toshiba Satellite A200. If you had done a bit of research yourself earlier you could have easily avoided ordering Proadlizer OE128. If you are really serious about DIY repair then it is best to start another thread on various forums, including this, Toshiba Forums and badcaps (if the problem is capacitor related) hoping someone might provide a solution.

 

[mariang]

mariang,

I just typed "toshiba satellite pro a200 motherboard" in Google and then clicked on "Images" to find a photo of it in less than a minute, which matches with what you have posted:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Toshiba-Satellite-Pro-A200-Motherboard-Spares-Repairs-Faulty-/250908033674?_trksid=p4340.m185&_trkparms=algo%3DDLSL%252BSIC.NPJS%26its%3DI%26itu%3DUCI%252BUA%26otn%3D10%26pmod%3D300556140268%252B300556140268%26po%3D%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D4949252509126057171

So your laptop is Toshiba Satellite Pro A200 and not Toshiba Satellite A200. If you had done a bit of research yourself earlier you could have easily avoided ordering Proadlizer OE128. If you are really serious about DIY repair then it is best to start another thread on various forums, including this, Toshiba Forums and badcaps (if the problem is capacitor related) hoping someone might provide a solution.

Hi Notsosure,

I'm afraid there's something wrong.
This is my laptop:
http://uk.computers.toshiba-europe.com/innovation/jsp/SUPPORTSECTION/discontinuedProductPage.do?service=UK&com.broadvision.session.new=Yes&PRODUCT_ID=138469

As we can see, it is not a Satellite Pro. I searched their website for any Pro A200-1VP, but no results.
I got no pressure anymore, because I bought a new laptop yesterday.
It was definietly my mistake, as I failed to conduct a proper research before ordering the parts. I think I was a bit naive here.
But why do I have motherboard from Pro model here?

BTW, thank you for your time and help with this one.

 

[Notsosure]

But why do I have motherboard from Pro model here?

mariang,

Yes, you are right. The motherboard of Sat A200-1VP and Sat Pro A200 have striking similarities, assuming yours was never replaced. Your model is probably not so popular as to provide an easy access to a photograph of its motherboard on the Internet. Therefore, there was obviously no way of knowing beforehand if there is a Proadlizer on your motherboard or not without opening it and I understand what you did.

I do not know answer to your specific question and hence I can only assume that Toshiba uses different motherboards on different models of the same family as well. This is all the more reason why people should first try to see if they can find a photograph of their motherboard on the Internet and locate the Proaodlizer, if any, before opening their laptops for its replacement. If a photo is not available then, of course, there may be no alternative to opening and having a look.

If you do have symptoms very similar to those mentioned in this thread then your small caps may as well be faulty, though apparently they do not fail as often and as consistently as Proadlizer does. A Proadlizer, as per its manufacturer, ( http://www.nec.co.jp/techrep/en/journal/g09/n01/090116.html ), is essentially meant to stabilize power lines through superior noise absorption across a wide range of frequencies. When it starts failing, it is not able to keep pace with the instantaneous power-fluctuating demands of the CPU while maintaining a reasonably constant core voltage. This is the reason why by reducing the load on CPU (for example, running in safe mode, disabling one core, etc) we are able to make the laptop work. While it is failing it takes longer and longer to get charged. Therefore, a laptop might get off a few times before the Proadlizer develops sufficient charge to keep it on. Those who want to extract the last penny from their Proadlizer (as I did) have to simply enter BIOS, while switching on after a long rest (i.e., when the cap is significantly discharged), and remain there until the cap is sufficiently charged again before proceeding further to load windows and increase the load on CPU.

Now that you have acquired a new toy, you may not be keen on taking care of the old fella but those who want to repair theirs might find the above info useful.

 

[kuzman67]

Those who want to replace their NEC/TOKIN capacitor with apparently more durable tantalum capacitors may see this:
http://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=8991&page=8

When soldered, tantalum caps look like this: http://www.google.com.au/imgres?q=a305+toshiba+tantalum&hl=en&safe=active&sa=X&rlz=1W1ADRA_enAU347&biw=1280&bih=799&tbm=isch&prmd=imvns&tbnid=SHHrTeWmdgExmM:&imgrefurl=http://www.forumnow.com.br/vip/mensagens.asp%3Fforum%3D32226%26topico%3D3029069&docid=xQgzmrRdRowFQM&imgurl=http://img823.imageshack.us/img823/5528/trabalhopronto.jpg&w=640&h=480&ei=uHcTT7bVCMPJmQWf8tn-CQ&zoom=1
However, the specs of tantalum cap must be chosen carefully, especially its ESR ( http://wiki.xtronics.com/index.php/Capacitors_and_ESR ). The rated ESR of OE128 is 2 mOhm and hence the ESR of each of the four 330uF tantalum caps soldered in parallel should not ideally exceed 8 mOhm (In practice, somewhat higher ESR might still be OK). The following cap seems to match most of the specs:
http://australia.rs-online.com/web/p/tantalum-solid/0147639/

Hi Notsosure,
My NEC/TOKIN caps arrived and I asked Pacific HiFi at Liverpool NSW to install them but after looking at it for 5 weeks they were not able too...? So my brother in law installed the replacement cap and it worked perfectly for about 6 weeks and now its the same old problem again. So much for Pacific HiFi...!!!
So I'm going to give the Tantalum ones a go. I know nothing about caps so I'm just going to go with your recommendation on badcaps . net
I'll let you know how that pans out in the long run. If that doesn't work I'm just going to scrap the laptop and tell all my customers never to buy Toshiba again.

Thanks

 

[Notsosure]

So I'm going to give the Tantalum ones a go.

Yes, that is a good idea because you have already confirmed that capacitor is the problem in your laptop. I have myself not used any tantalum caps so far hence my suggestion is a reasonable guess based on the specs but I do believe it will most likely work. My replacement OE128 has surprisingly not blinked so far though my laptop usage has gone up to at least 8 hours per day in recent weeks.

 

[carbonblack]

Hi Notsosure,
Did your laptop die completely and was not restarting on battery even? I have a toshiba with these symptoms of restarting but now its completely dead. No more starting on battery.

Kindly let me know if the replacement of capacitor will be enough.

Thanks,
Sidds

 

[Notsosure]

Kindly let me know if the replacement of capacitor will be enough.

If your symptoms are the same as mentioned above then capacitor replacement will most likely work. Mine did ultimately die completely and was not starting even on battery but it was a gradual death over a period of more than a year, which is consistent with gradual loss of capacitance. If it is sudden death then the problem could be something else.

 

[bim27142]

my toshiba portege m900 shuts down the moment windows starts loading AND this only happens during the first boot up for the day (cold boot).

details:

in the morning, i turn it on, first time it was turned on for the day, then the moment windows starts loading (vista - loading bar / windows 7 - when the windows logo shines) then it will shutdown completely.

when i turn it again, it will now proceed to loading windows (of course i get the error that windows was not shutdown properly, blah blah...... so i just select "start normally" then ok), then i can use my laptop normally.

i doubt it's a software issue since the same thing happened when on windows 7 and when on the default OS vista (i ran factory recovery to see if it helps but same problem happened).

i also ran memtest and ran diagnostics on the HDD using seatools, but found no errors...

i think it's with a certain hardware device somewhere/somehow and when windows loads the driver for that particular device, it crashes the whole system...

by the way, it won't shut down when i boot in to safe mode only even if it's first start up for the day...

 

[carbonblack]

Thanks Notsosure,

This is exactly the situation I am facing. Thanks for the info. I'll try with the replacement of the cap and hopefully the laptop will work.

Thanks again.

 

[Notsosure]

my toshiba portege m900 shuts down the moment windows starts loading AND this only happens during the first boot up for the day (cold boot).

This does seem like a capacitor problem. Any CPU-intensive task will require Proadlizer to have enough capacitance and work efficiently. A deteriorating capacitor will require more time to develop sufficient charge to cope with the rapidly fluctuating (high frequency) demands of the CPU. The load on CPU (hence Proadlizer) is reduced when the cores are disabled or windows is working in safe mode. Therefore even a deteriorated Proadlizer may be able to cope with the less-demanding CPU in such a situation.

When the computer is shutdown the capacitor keeps discharging. Therefore, at cold boot it takes longer to develop sufficient charge. If windows starts loading before that then it will activate computer shutdown. A workaround in that case will be to enter BIOS, wait there for few minutes till the cap develops sufficient charge and then proceed further to load windows and increase load on the CPU. In my case the waiting time kept increasing until finally nothing worked and I had to replace the Proadlizer.

First check if Protege M900 has a Proadlizer because you cannot replace something that you don't have. If you have small caps then I am not sure how to replace them or replacing them will help at all.

 

[bim27142]

In my case the waiting time kept increasing until finally nothing worked and I had to replace the Proadlizer.

First check if Protege M900 has a Proadlizer because you cannot replace something that you don't have. If you have small caps then I am not sure how to replace them or replacing them will help at all.

Ok... So basically I will have to expect roughly the same case that this will also die eventually correct?

 

[bruno504]

Hi,
I had same problem with my Sattelite L300. Motherboard has a defect in one Proadlizer film capacitor exactly on the back of CPU, the original ref. is nec-tokin 0E907 (900uF/2.5V) or similar code. I've replaced it by 4 tantalum capacitores of 470uF/2.5V each and 2 capacitores of 220uF/2.5V, all in paralell mode in same old place of nec-tokin component.
Vote for me...

 

[gomerpile]

Possible problem, read this

http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/forum2.php?config=tomshardwareus.inc&cat=35&post=76424&page=1&p=3&sondage=0&owntopic=1&trash=0&trash_post=0&print=0&numreponse=0&quote_only=0&new=0&nojs=0

 

[lusakor]

Static discharge through the metal speaker covers causes machine to lock up or become non-responsive.
SOLUTION: Ground speaker grills and mouse pad. I did this simply with some plumbers foil tape used for household metal ducting which can be found in home improvement or hardware stores. Cut the tape and adhere it to the underside of the top case to create new bridges from each of the metal speaker grills and double mouse button frame. When you examine your underside of the case top you'll see that speaker grills are only grounded on one of each of the metal tabs holding the speaker grills in place. I created a new grounding point to one of the other tabs leaving Toshiba's grounding in place and the same goes for the mouse frame. Before you adhere the foil tape make sure you scrape the metal areas you'll be grounding to so you remove any paints or coatings and you have bare metal to foil contact for best results. You can see some ideas and fixes not to mention what I'm talking about here: http://www.laptoprepair101.com/laptop/2006/04/06/satellite-m35...s-reboots/
RESULT: Since my fix I haven't had the machine lock up or freeze due to static discharge. 100% fixed.
College Girls

 

[Notsosure]

Various solutions being proposed here might provide people an alternative just in case one does not work.

I've replaced it by 4 tantalum capacitores of 470uF/2.5V each and 2 capacitores of 220uF/2.5V, all in paralell mode in same old place of nec-tokin component.

I am curious to know why you felt the need to replace 900uF with a total of 2320uF because I have rarely seen people going beyond 1.5 times the original uF but yours is almost 2.6 times. Technically only two 470uF/2.5V should have worked if they had the right ESR and other specs.

http://www.niccomp.com/help/capsubguide.asp

 

[bruno504]

Various solutions being proposed here might provide people an alternative just in case one does not work.



I am curious to know why you felt the need to replace 900uF with a total of 2320uF because I have rarely seen people going beyond 1.5 times the original uF but yours is almost 2.6 times. Technically only two 470uF/2.5V should have worked if they had the right ESR and other specs.

http://www.niccomp.com/help/capsubguide.asp

hi there,
yes the total capacity it's beyond 1.5x, one reason was to lower ESR, other reason was that more capacity has this filter, lower will be the ripple noise.
Also I've must say that I've taken used capacitors from one powerfull graphic card.
I don't recomend the nec-tokin decoupling capacitor because is not a good component, for many reasons...

 

[kuzman67]

After my (newly replaced) NEC/TOKIN cap FAILED again, I've now replaced it with 4 of the Tantalum ones. After putting everything back together, I powered up the system on battery power only and the laptop worked fine. I waited for 5 minutes and plugged in the power cable and within 20 seconds it rebooted. It now doesn't even make it into windows before rebooting itself.
I was sure this was going to work but it's a major FAIL for me. At least the NEC/TOKIN lasted a few weeks.

It was worth a try and thanks again to notsosure, who did all the research.

I might introduce the laptop to a 9mm like that guy did on youtube a few weeks ago.....!!!

 

[Notsosure]

It now doesn't even make it into windows before rebooting itself.

Which tantalum caps did you buy and are you sure that they were soldered properly (including polarity). I am wondering if the specs are right, especially ESR. If you have completely given up then my suggestion is don't discard your laptop as I might pick it up from you in a couple of months and try it myself. If still there is no luck then you can discard it, if you wish.

Fortunately my new cap is still going great guns despite very heavy usage in recent weeks (including over 24 hours continuous at times).