Question Upgrading 2070 Super

[anon7mous]

My build:
GPU: nVidia RTX 2700 Super
CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 3700X
Mobo: Asus TUF GAMING X570-PLUS
RAM: Crucial Ballistix Sport LT 16 GB
PSU: Corsair RMx (2018) 650 W 80+
Use: Gaming on 1440p, 144Hz

My Budget is around 700-800€ but I'm flexible.
Country where I'm buying is Germany.

A friend of mine is looking for a new graphics card and he would gladly take the 2070 super off my hands.

My question is, should I wait for the next gen nVidia to come out in late fall or just get something now while the prices are ok. What should I get, I was eyeing either 3070 TI or 6800xt.
Is it worth getting a new CPU as well?

 

[Lutfij]

Is the PSU in your build 4 years old or less(assuming the PSU was purchased later)? If you do get any of the latter mentioned GPU's in the thread, might want to also look into a higher wattage reliably built(akin to what your have, brand/quality wise) alongside the GPU purchase. If you're looking for a CPU upgrade, you're only going to go as far as a Ryzen 9 5900x/5950x seeing how the AM4 platform is coming to an end. I'd leave the CPU off the table for now, then see if your platform needs more oomph.

Also, you didn't mention the frequency for your ram kit. Subpar frequency and timings kits cripple Ryzen platforms.

 

[anon7mous]

Is the PSU in your build 4 years old or less(assuming the PSU was purchased later)? If you do get any of the latter mentioned GPU's in the thread, might want to also look into a higher wattage reliably built(akin to what your have, brand/quality wise) alongside the GPU purchase. If you're looking for a CPU upgrade, you're only going to go as far as a Ryzen 9 5900x/5950x seeing how the AM4 platform is coming to an end. I'd leave the CPU off the table for now, then see if your platform needs more oomph.

Also, you didn't mention the frequency for your ram kit. Subpar frequency and timings kits cripple Ryzen platforms.

Thanks for replying quickly.
The PSU is 2,5 years old and I bought it new but the model is older I guess.
RAM frequency is 1200 MHz, FSB : RAM is 1:12

EDIT: Typo

 

[alexbirdie]

RAM frequency is 1200 MHz

If that really true? It means, 2400 Mhz speed.

If yes, Ram with 3200 or better with 3600 will give you great boost for fps, much more than with any new GPU.

 

[hotaru.hino]

I'd say wait. I don't think it's worth spending that much to get maybe 40% more performance. Assuming performance trends continue, you could expect the RTX 4070 to perform at least as good as the RTX 3080, which the RTX 3080 is already at least ~60% better performing. And while there are fears that prices will go up, I don't think it'll go to cryptobro levels like people want to throw around should prices go up.

Either way, waiting for the next generation will be a better value.

 

[Karadjgne]

Monitor resolution? For 1080p, anything higher than the 2070Super is basically wasted, the 2070Super, 3060ti are mid level 1440p cards. If you are 1440p or 4k, then a 3080 or higher is better suited.

A 2070Super should land somewhere between a 4050 and 4060, so a 2 tier upgrade you'd be looking at a 4070/4070ti, or for this gen that's a 3080/3080ti class card. Anything less and the performance is close enough to not be worth the price.

Your buddy might be happy with your card, but if you don't get value for the upgrade, he ends up with the better end of the deal.

 

[spentshells]

maybe try to activate an xmp profile in your bios
if 2400 is the actual speed
I'd definitely suggest you skip the gpu upgrade and go with a new 5700X and a new kit of 3600 ddr4
you can recoup your money and if your ram really is @ 2400mhz you'll see an amazing boost while making your system relevent for years to come

2400 can still be sold for a reasonable price, well your ram is slow but you'll still get 30-50% of the price of a proper ram kit. Not only is your ram speed very low for ryzen its of poor quality. ballistics is junk frankly.

Dont get me wrong i'd buy it in a pinch but its low end with poor timings and very basic speeds.

Maybe get a 32GB kit of 4 sticks of 8GB @ 3600 ram or better. 2 sticks that are dual rank
Here is a video explaining the difference by someone with far more information than I can pretend to have

View: https://youtu.be/AGux0pANft0?t=79


regarding ram speed
here is a video of 3200 vs 3600 Mhz

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RnO2RxgJFBU

the difference is substantial in the video and going to 3600 from 2400 is a 50 % boost in ram speed.
In the video they explain how timings are actually more valuable than ram the ram speed difference of 400Mhz

If you don't cheap out ballistic style you'll have timings that beat your 2400mhz ram.
The frame rate isn't likely to scale to much beyond what you are seeing in the video, but if you keep your setup you wont see a frame rate boost to the same effect.

the 2070super is a great card for 144op if you don't mess with ray tracing as much.

It's really too bad for your friend but a cpu and ram upgrade is what you should be looking into exactly as
alexbirdie suggested.

You'll get a big boost in performance keep your entire system relevant and maybe gpu prices will come back from clown world where they were during the virus outbreak of unspecified origin.

At this time I can only suggest the gpu upgrade if you insist on ray tracing and even then you need new ram to see any improvement over your current card which is being held back by 2400mhz ram.

Here is zen 3 ram scaling. It's a much faster card than yours but look at the fps difference of up to 40 frames

View: https://youtu.be/Im0us9Oh82o?t=531

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGux0pANft0


Im only spamming you because I just bought a gtx 1060 for 200 cdn 140-160 usd ... the money went to charity but dont overpay like i did you money isn't going to charity.\, but your 2070 super would be with no frame rate gains but you will get actual ray tracing performance without a fps drop.

 

[spentshells]

sorry my connection went bonkers, Im not quite sure what happened with these videos but watch them all

 

[Karadjgne]

Dont get me wrong i'd buy it in a pinch but its low end with poor timings and very basic speeds.

Ballistix may very well be on the lower end, out of the box, but uses micron Rev E, and done right is an absolute monster at OC. With 2400MHz ram, I'd not be surprised if it couldn't get in the low to mid 4000 range, 3600 shouldn't be an issue. And have decent timings.

View: https://youtu.be/XeDRz3mRIfs

Ryzen 5000 series has a preference for dual rank-dual channel, so if using 16Gb dual rank sticks, best to use 2x. If using 8Gb single rank sticks, best to use 4x. If you happen to get 8Gb dual rank sticks, best to use 2x.

 

[anon7mous]

Monitor resolution? For 1080p, anything higher than the 2070Super is basically wasted, the 2070Super, 3060ti are mid level 1440p cards. If you are 1440p or 4k, then a 3080 or higher is better suited.

A 2070Super should land somewhere between a 4050 and 4060, so a 2 tier upgrade you'd be looking at a 4070/4070ti, or for this gen that's a 3080/3080ti class card. Anything less and the performance is close enough to not be worth the price.

Your buddy might be happy with your card, but if you don't get value for the upgrade, he ends up with the better end of the deal.

I'm playing on 1440p and 144Hz. You are right, I kinda do want to help him out although I know I'm getting the worse end of the bargain.

maybe try to activate an xmp profile in your bios
if 2400 is the actual speed
I'd definitely suggest you skip the gpu upgrade and go with a new 5700X and a new kit of 3600 ddr4
you can recoup your money and if your ram really is @ 2400mhz you'll see an amazing boost while making your system relevent for years to come

2400 can still be sold for a reasonable price, well your ram is slow but you'll still get 30-50% of the price of a proper ram kit. Not only is your ram speed very low for ryzen its of poor quality. ballistics is junk frankly.

Dont get me wrong i'd buy it in a pinch but its low end with poor timings and very basic speeds.

Maybe get a 32GB kit of 4 sticks of 8GB @ 3600 ram or better. 2 sticks that are dual rank
Here is a video explaining the difference by someone with far more information than I can pretend to have

View: https://youtu.be/AGux0pANft0?t=79


regarding ram speed
here is a video of 3200 vs 3600 Mhz

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RnO2RxgJFBU

the difference is substantial in the video and going to 3600 from 2400 is a 50 % boost in ram speed.
In the video they explain how timings are actually more valuable than ram the ram speed difference of 400Mhz

If you don't cheap out ballistic style you'll have timings that beat your 2400mhz ram.
The frame rate isn't likely to scale to much beyond what you are seeing in the video, but if you keep your setup you wont see a frame rate boost to the same effect.

the 2070super is a great card for 144op if you don't mess with ray tracing as much.

It's really too bad for your friend but a cpu and ram upgrade is what you should be looking into exactly as
alexbirdie suggested.

You'll get a big boost in performance keep your entire system relevant and maybe gpu prices will come back from clown world where they were during the virus outbreak of unspecified origin.

At this time I can only suggest the gpu upgrade if you insist on ray tracing and even then you need new ram to see any improvement over your current card which is being held back by 2400mhz ram.

Here is zen 3 ram scaling. It's a much faster card than yours but look at the fps difference of up to 40 frames

View: https://youtu.be/Im0us9Oh82o?t=531

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGux0pANft0


Im only spamming you because I just bought a gtx 1060 for 200 cdn 140-160 usd ... the money went to charity but dont overpay like i did you money isn't going to charity.\, but your 2070 super would be with no frame rate gains but you will get actual ray tracing performance without a fps drop.

I have to say this came as a surprise. I didn't imagine RAM frequency would have nearly as big of an impact on FPS. It definitely makes sense to squeeze some more FPS out of my RAM and wait for new GPUs to come out.

I have two options here:

1. Overclock mine
2. Buy new one. Do you have any specific kit you would recommend? Should I go 16 GB or 32GB? I mostly use this site to buy hardware. Is it wort going more than 3600 or CL16?

Ballistix may very well be on the lower end, out of the box, but uses micron Rev E, and done right is an absolute monster at OC. With 2400MHz ram, I'd not be surprised if it couldn't get in the low to mid 4000 range, 3600 shouldn't be an issue. And have decent timings.

View: https://youtu.be/XeDRz3mRIfs

Ryzen 5000 series has a preference for dual rank-dual channel, so if using 16Gb dual rank sticks, best to use 2x. If using 8Gb single rank sticks, best to use 4x. If you happen to get 8Gb dual rank sticks, best to use 2x.

I might try overclocking my RAM before getting a new kit. I did OC multiple GPUs and CPUs but never RAM. Any specific guides or videos you mind recommend to help me out with the OC?

 

[anon7mous]

I got an update.

I watched a few videos and read some guides how to OC my RAM. I managed to get a stable 3600 MHz OC.

I did a FurMark for 1440p before and after OC and this is the result:

I don't know if I did something wrong but the increase in FPS was only 2%.

My current RAM situation looks like this:

Not sure if I screwed up the OC or if my RAM is just not up to the task.

 

[4745454b]

Can you do 3200 or 3400 on CL15? What voltage did you use?

Sometimes max OC isn't the best.

 

[anon7mous]

Can you do 3200 or 3400 on CL15? What voltage did you use?

Sometimes max OC isn't the best.

I used 1.365 and tested if the system was stable.

 

[4745454b]

Stable != fastest.

 

[anon7mous]

Stable != fastest.

I tried with 3400 and there was literally no difference. Furmark shows average of 102 FPS on 1440p. Could it be that I did something wrong or RAM really not bottlenecking my system?
I'm kinda confused with the results.

Any recommendations how should I proceed with my upgrade?

 

[spentshells]

I tried with 3400 and there was literally no difference. Furmark shows average of 102 FPS on 1440p. Could it be that I did something wrong or RAM really not bottlenecking my system?
I'm kinda confused with the results.

Any recommendations how should I proceed with my upgrade?

Nice work on the ram! Now for the cpu? Sounds like you saved some money not buying new ram, now I wouldn't bother with new ram kit buying dual rank or 4 sticks the gains aren't as substantial.

That small of a frame rate increase might be related to 1 of two things.

Unstable overclock of the memory or @ 1440p allows the card to stretch it's legs without cpu bottleneck.

I just watched this video this morning. 5800x3D while pricey seems like it could be worth while.
It very clearly shows your current cpu can handle a lot more card I think with your memory overclock you might have been going down the right path @ 1440p by getting a new faster card.
Simply put pricing and new cards on the way, maybe wait and see?

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2HqE03SpdOs&t=636s


This is all very interesting stuff!

Again nice work on the ram!

Test for stability
https://www.tomshardware.com/how-to/how-to-test-ram

 

[anon7mous]

Nice work on the ram! Now for the cpu? Sounds like you saved some money not buying new ram, now I wouldn't bother with new ram kit buying dual rank or 4 sticks the gains aren't as substantial.

That small of a frame rate increase might be related to 1 of two things.

Unstable overclock of the memory or @ 1440p allows the card to stretch it's legs without cpu bottleneck.

I just watched this video this morning. 5800x3D while pricey seems like it could be worth while.
It very clearly shows your current cpu can handle a lot more card I think with your memory overclock you might have been going down the right path @ 1440p by getting a new faster card.
Simply put pricing and new cards on the way, maybe wait and see?

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2HqE03SpdOs&t=636s


This is all very interesting stuff!

Again nice work on the ram!

Test for stability
https://www.tomshardware.com/how-to/how-to-test-ram

Thank you! It was also very interesting and informative for me too. I did some research on the weekend and saw that people even run 6800 xt and 3080 with my CPU and it barely bottlenecks on 1440p.

At the moment I could sell my 2070 super for ca. 350€ and get an 6800xt for 750€. Not sure if it's worth it but it would be an increase of 50-80% of FPS depending on the game.

The alternative is to wait and see what happens with the next gen cards but then I would probably have to change the PSU and the CPU and in the end everything.

My goal is to always have at least more than 60 FPS. Long term speaking I'm not sure what is the smart play here. Wait or just upgrade now and be happy for a couple of years. Waiting might end up being long if the new cards are gonna be out of stock.

EDIT: Typos

 

[logainofhades]

Can you do 3200 or 3400 on CL15? What voltage did you use?

Sometimes max OC isn't the best.

CL16 3600 is normally on par with CL14 3200.

OP: You may need to change your infinity fabric clock to 1800mhz.