Valve May Be Crafting a Way to Play Windows Steam Games on Linux

[jimmysmitty]

I really dislike when people assume there is no support other than community support for Linux. Free versions of Linux, yes you'll be reaching out to the community. But Red Hat Enterprise has support if not better than Windows. Also if you have an issue on Windows you're going to some form of community support, either its Office support, Steam support, Nvidia support, they're all 'community' forums and I'll tell you right now that Microsoft doesn't have the best support staff either. I don't know anyone that has called Microsoft Support for a Windows 7,8,10 issue relating to Steam/Nvidia/etc as its not their product to support. The vast majority of Windows users reach out to a community forum of a sort or google it..its funny same thing happens for Linux users. Now only if Microsoft made free OS's like Linux does.

Don't forget SLES (SUSE). Their Enterprise products, relied on by many large scale compute grids, has changed parent ownership a few times, but has nonetheless always offered outstanding product support. Not to mention a willingness to make modifications and enhancements as a direct result of specific customer requests (try and get that with Microsoft).

Actually a ton of the features and changes for Windows 10 are typically thanks to the Insider Program. And on the Enterprise end, its very different. Microsoft does work closely with its partners. Otherwise they wouldn't keep them very long. Its why Windows XP is still supported for some companies and not the mainstream, as in Microsoft will write updates for those companies for XP.

Going for convenience has cost people a lot more privacy than they realize. As far as I know, Linux distros don't report my shopping habits to advertisers, ask to analyze every web site I visit, or otherwise invite third parties to stick their noses in my business. For a variety of reasons, I'm a stickler for staying legal, but that hasn't prevented any number of law-abiding citizens like me from having their lives screwed up by some self-important parasite or armed thug anyway, perhaps "just because they can;" so, I prefer to keep my personal details on a need-to-know basis.

The problem is though with anything popular it eventually becomes like the others. Remember Google when it launched? Unlike the big search engines and offering such a different way to find stuff. Now they like everyone else sell data.

If Linux ever got that big, Microsoft big, in the consumer sphere it would eventually do the exact same thing. All it takes is one greedy bastard to start it and the others will see the money and say "Yes, more please".

Have to disagree with you there...RedHat or other Corporate Linux Distros would, as you say, almost certainly sell out their customers if they could make a buck, but unlike with Microsoft's proprietary owned code, other Linux Distros would NOT, and because a viable Linux alternative would be available, it would put pressure on RedHat to NOT engage in bad behavior so readily.

In fact, that's why owning RedHat stock hasn't made any typical investors rich (though I see the stock HAS been on a bit of a tear recently after being a total dog for nearly a decade).

Again when they have the same market control as Microsoft it can easily change.

I know of one Linux distro, actually two, that can show it. Android and iOS. Both are Linux based kernals. Both are run by companies that figure in the bottom line before the consumer. Both are companies that once used to be hailed as consumer champions. Apple is worth a ton more than a consumer champion company should be worth.

It may never happen. But at the same time I don't ever see Linux overtaking the mainstream consumer PC market or PC gaming market.

 

[mlee 2500]

I really dislike when people assume there is no support other than community support for Linux. Free versions of Linux, yes you'll be reaching out to the community. But Red Hat Enterprise has support if not better than Windows. Also if you have an issue on Windows you're going to some form of community support, either its Office support, Steam support, Nvidia support, they're all 'community' forums and I'll tell you right now that Microsoft doesn't have the best support staff either. I don't know anyone that has called Microsoft Support for a Windows 7,8,10 issue relating to Steam/Nvidia/etc as its not their product to support. The vast majority of Windows users reach out to a community forum of a sort or google it..its funny same thing happens for Linux users. Now only if Microsoft made free OS's like Linux does.

Don't forget SLES (SUSE). Their Enterprise products, relied on by many large scale compute grids, has changed parent ownership a few times, but has nonetheless always offered outstanding product support. Not to mention a willingness to make modifications and enhancements as a direct result of specific customer requests (try and get that with Microsoft).

Actually a ton of the features and changes for Windows 10 are typically thanks to the Insider Program. And on the Enterprise end, its very different. Microsoft does work closely with its partners. Otherwise they wouldn't keep them very long. Its why Windows XP is still supported for some companies and not the mainstream, as in Microsoft will write updates for those companies for XP.

Going for convenience has cost people a lot more privacy than they realize. As far as I know, Linux distros don't report my shopping habits to advertisers, ask to analyze every web site I visit, or otherwise invite third parties to stick their noses in my business. For a variety of reasons, I'm a stickler for staying legal, but that hasn't prevented any number of law-abiding citizens like me from having their lives screwed up by some self-important parasite or armed thug anyway, perhaps "just because they can;" so, I prefer to keep my personal details on a need-to-know basis.

The problem is though with anything popular it eventually becomes like the others. Remember Google when it launched? Unlike the big search engines and offering such a different way to find stuff. Now they like everyone else sell data.

If Linux ever got that big, Microsoft big, in the consumer sphere it would eventually do the exact same thing. All it takes is one greedy bastard to start it and the others will see the money and say "Yes, more please".

Have to disagree with you there...RedHat or other Corporate Linux Distros would, as you say, almost certainly sell out their customers if they could make a buck, but unlike with Microsoft's proprietary owned code, other Linux Distros would NOT, and because a viable Linux alternative would be available, it would put pressure on RedHat to NOT engage in bad behavior so readily.

In fact, that's why owning RedHat stock hasn't made any typical investors rich (though I see the stock HAS been on a bit of a tear recently after being a total dog for nearly a decade).

Again when they have the same market control as Microsoft it can easily change.

I know of one Linux distro, actually two, that can show it. Android and iOS. Both are Linux based kernals. Both are run by companies that figure in the bottom line before the consumer. Both are companies that once used to be hailed as consumer champions. Apple is worth a ton more than a consumer champion company should be worth.

It may never happen. But at the same time I don't ever see Linux overtaking the mainstream consumer PC market or PC gaming market.

Well, you yourself said it: There's real competition in the Linux Space. There's not in the Windows space. And that's what can and in allot of cases does make a difference.
It's why Valve keeps trying (largely unsuccessfully) to explore Linux platforms or games, as a hedge against getting squeezed out by the Windows App store.

 

[kenjitamura]

Again when they have the same market control as Microsoft it can easily change.

I know of one Linux distro, actually two, that can show it. Android and iOS. Both are Linux based kernals. Both are run by companies that figure in the bottom line before the consumer. Both are companies that once used to be hailed as consumer champions. Apple is worth a ton more than a consumer champion company should be worth.

It may never happen. But at the same time I don't ever see Linux overtaking the mainstream consumer PC market or PC gaming market.

Both iOS and MacOS are based on BSD, not linux. With BSD it is not only possible, but entirely likely, that it will be abused in the way Apple has abused it and that's because of its license which isn't copy left like the GPL.

Android has its own special brand of manipulating consumers that Google pretty ingeniously put together. Since they can't stop Linux alternatives to their OS they built killer apps and restricted them to being installed by default by approved OEM's. These Apps that consumers and OEM's have inextricably tied their systems to are what keeps people beholden to Google on smartphones.

 

[mlee 2500]

Again when they have the same market control as Microsoft it can easily change.

I know of one Linux distro, actually two, that can show it. Android and iOS. Both are Linux based kernals. Both are run by companies that figure in the bottom line before the consumer. Both are companies that once used to be hailed as consumer champions. Apple is worth a ton more than a consumer champion company should be worth.

It may never happen. But at the same time I don't ever see Linux overtaking the mainstream consumer PC market or PC gaming market.

Both iOS and MacOS are based on BSD, not linux. With BSD it is not only possible, but entirely likely, that it will be abused in the way Apple has abused it and that's because of its license which isn't copy left like the GPL.

Android has its own special brand of manipulating consumers that Google pretty ingeniously put together. Since they can't stop Linux alternatives to their OS they built killer apps and restricted them to being installed by default by approved OEM's. These Apps that consumers and OEM's have inextricably tied their systems to are what keeps people beholden to Google on smartphones.

I'm trying to think a single instance of a BSD variance that's not a total win and I cannot...Barracuda Commercial security appliances, MacOS, FreeNAS...they're all winners great in my book, and allot more focused on providing a quality product then leveraging my privacy, especially compared to other platforms.

 

[mitch074]

I'm trying to think a single instance of a BSD variance that's not a total win and I cannot...Barracuda Commercial security appliances, MacOS, FreeNAS...they're all winners great in my book, and allot more focused on providing a quality product then leveraging my privacy, especially compared to other platforms.

MacOS and iOs are both based on a Mach kernel and use both GNU and BSD code - mixed in with their proprietary stacks. But they ARE UNIX-like - and as such, do not require much effort to support Linux software either.

As for my assumption that Steam would use whatever wrapper was most convenient, I've been validated: Photon is a Wine fork (a mix'n'match of Wine-devel and extra projects like dxvk etc.) developed in partnership with Codeweavers (the "owners" of Wine).
I've tried it: after enabling the Steam client beta channel I moved my Doom install from Steam/wine over to Steam/Linux - I got most of my settings and all my savegames restored, and performance (using Vulkan) was great. I use the latest stable Mesa build on a reference RX480 8Gb (with extra cooling) and the game was smooth as butter in 1440p and Ultra settings (except for a few effects, like per-objet motion blur, that I don't care about, and v-sync which is pretty much useless considering my screen can't go past 60fps - and the game is consistently over 80). I'll soon try an unsupported game (probably Sleeping Dogs) to see what gives.

 

[mlee 2500]

I'm trying to think a single instance of a BSD variance that's not a total win and I cannot...Barracuda Commercial security appliances, MacOS, FreeNAS...they're all winners great in my book, and allot more focused on providing a quality product then leveraging my privacy, especially compared to other platforms.

MacOS and iOs are both based on a Mach kernel and use both GNU and BSD code - mixed in with their proprietary stacks. But they ARE UNIX-like - and as such, do not require much effort to support Linux software either.

As for my assumption that Steam would use whatever wrapper was most convenient, I've been validated: Photon is a Wine fork (a mix'n'match of Wine-devel and extra projects like dxvk etc.) developed in partnership with Codeweavers (the "owners" of Wine).
I've tried it: after enabling the Steam client beta channel I moved my Doom install from Steam/wine over to Steam/Linux - I got most of my settings and all my savegames restored, and performance (using Vulkan) was great. I use the latest stable Mesa build on a reference RX480 8Gb (with extra cooling) and the game was smooth as butter in 1440p and Ultra settings (except for a few effects, like per-objet motion blur, that I don't care about, and v-sync which is pretty much useless considering my screen can't go past 60fps - and the game is consistently over 80). I'll soon try an unsupported game (probably Sleeping Dogs) to see what gives.

hmmm. My only experience with Wine was in it's very early and primitive state WELL over a decade ago, when I installed the FreeBSD port for. It was really more of a novelty then...one which might be able to run very simple Windows programs without major driver dependencies.

Sounds like it must be pretty robust now.