Question What 12th gen CPU should I upgrade to ?

[PaddyMcpadington]

Hi everyone,

I currently have a i5-9600kf cooled by a Corsair AIO 240mm & an RTX 2070 Super in a Lian Li Q58 case.
I'm considering upgrading to 12th gen Intel for its less lower TDP and its 20% improvement per core for performance and hoping that would improve in-game FPS.


My current system gets way too hot and the AIO transfers so much heat into the case chassis it becomes too hot to touch on top, So I suspect my current cpu must be thermal throttling.
I only casually game on the following games: World of Warships, Overwatch, Halo: Master Chief collection, Minecraft and some Lego games.
I never have much running in the background except for basic stuff like Chrome and Spotify.
I play on a 1440p @ 165hz monitor.

Is a an i3-12100F a sensible upgrade considering it only costs £89 ? Or is an i5-12400F for twice the amount the better option? I will probably upgrade in 2-3 years time anyway, as I only bought my current i5 a couple years ago.

 

[siaan312]

You do not want to go down in the amount of cores. an i5 12400F is a good choice, but does NOT run cooler than the i5 9600kf, it has a similar TDP.

Also, hotter AIO != hotter CPU.
Think about it, if the heat is in the AIO, it means that heat is not in the CPU.
A better cooler will heat the case more, since it trasnfers the heat from the cpu into the chassis.

You should run a benchmark and check your cpu temps, something like prime95 small fft.
With that AIO you should probably not exceed 80C after 20 minutes.
I believe your cpu is fine just fine, but if you would still like an upgrade, do not go for i3 since it has less cores.

 

[Why_Me]

Hi everyone,

I currently have a i5-9600kf cooled by a Corsair AIO 240mm & an RTX 2070 Super in a Lian Li Q58 case.
I'm considering upgrading to 12th gen Intel for its less lower TDP and its 20% improvement per core for performance and hoping that would improve in-game FPS.

My current system gets way too hot and the AIO transfers so much heat into the case chassis it becomes too hot to touch on top, So I suspect my current cpu must be thermal throttling.
I only casually game on the following games: World of Warships, Overwatch, Halo: Master Chief collection, Minecraft and some Lego games.
I never have much running in the background except for basic stuff like Chrome and Spotify.
I play on a 1440p @ 165hz monitor.

Is a an i3-12100F a sensible upgrade considering it only costs £89 ? Or is an i5-12400F for twice the amount the better option? I will probably upgrade in 2-3 years time anyway, as I only bought my current i5 a couple years ago.

12400F + B660 board

https://ark.intel.com/content/www/u...2400f-processor-18m-cache-up-to-4-40-ghz.html

i5 12400 / 12400F gaming benchmarks.

 

[PaddyMcpadington]

You do not want to go down in the amount of cores. an i5 12400F is a good choice, but does NOT run cooler than the i5 9600kf, it has a similar TDP.

Also, hotter AIO != hotter CPU.
Think about it, if the heat is in the AIO, it means that heat is not in the CPU.
A better cooler will heat the case more, since it trasnfers the heat from the cpu into the chassis.

You should run a benchmark and check your cpu temps, something like prime95 small fft.
With that AIO you should probably not exceed 80C after 20 minutes.
I believe your cpu is fine just fine, but if you would still like an upgrade, do not go for i3 since it has less cores.

I'll start stress testing it now and see what I get in 20-25 mins.
The case is tiny and improving cooling isn't really an option, Maybe I could upgrade the fans from corsair RGB to Noctua ones.
I can't switch to air cooling as I have only 67mm clearance which isn't enough for the best low profile coolers.

 

[Why_Me]

I'll start stress testing it now and see what I get in 20-25 mins.
The case is tiny and improving cooling isn't really an option, Maybe I could upgrade the fans from corsair RGB to Noctua ones.
I can't switch to air cooling as I have only 67mm clearance which isn't enough for the best low profile coolers.

That case doesn't leave many options to improve the airflow which is pretty typical of ITX cases. This case in the link is new to the market and it's going to sell well imo (mATX case).

https://www.ebuyer.com/1535665-frac...microatx-tempered-glass-pc-case-fd-c-por1m-06

Pop Mini Air

Fractal fuse flair with function in the new Pop series of cases that doesn’t skimp on aesthetics or flexibility. The entire series offers a solid foundation and excellent build quality, giving all users plenty of options and room to maneuver.

www.fractal-design.com

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aukcnCb-64U

 

[PaddyMcpadington]

So after 25 minutes of stress testing the CPU cores not 1 of them went above 78c. The AIO temp said it didn't go above 37c but the RAM went up to 48c. I think the CPU on its own is a adequately cooled but when the GPU is active and the PSU is hot, they both push warm air up into the Radiator. So temps accelerate quickly under gaming.

 

[PaddyMcpadington]

That case doesn't leave many options to improve the airflow which is pretty typical of ITX cases. This case in the link is new to the market and it's going to sell well imo (mATX case).

https://www.ebuyer.com/1535665-frac...microatx-tempered-glass-pc-case-fd-c-por1m-06

Pop Mini Air

Fractal fuse flair with function in the new Pop series of cases that doesn’t skimp on aesthetics or flexibility. The entire series offers a solid foundation and excellent build quality, giving all users plenty of options and room to maneuver.

www.fractal-design.com

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aukcnCb-64U

That does look quite nice that case, I'll have a look into it. Its a shame as I bought the Lian Li q58 only beginning of this year lol.
I have so many empty cases including a Define R6 and a corsair 680x, But they're both too big.

 

[Nighthawk117]

Hi everyone,

I currently have a i5-9600kf cooled by a Corsair AIO 240mm & an RTX 2070 Super in a Lian Li Q58 case.
I'm considering upgrading to 12th gen Intel for its less lower TDP and its 20% improvement per core for performance and hoping that would improve in-game FPS.


My current system gets way too hot and the AIO transfers so much heat into the case chassis it becomes too hot to touch on top, So I suspect my current cpu must be thermal throttling.
I only casually game on the following games: World of Warships, Overwatch, Halo: Master Chief collection, Minecraft and some Lego games.
I never have much running in the background except for basic stuff like Chrome and Spotify.
I play on a 1440p @ 165hz monitor.

Is a an i3-12100F a sensible upgrade considering it only costs £89 ? Or is an i5-12400F for twice the amount the better option? I will probably upgrade in 2-3 years time anyway, as I only bought my current i5 a couple years ago.

12400F is a more sensible use of money if you want to play at high refresh rates. However something is seriously wrong with your system if you can't control a 9600KF with a 240mm AIO. Is the CPU overclocked at all?

 

[RodroX]

12400F is a more sensible use of money if you want to play at high refresh rates. However something is seriously wrong with your system if you can't control a 9600KF with a 240mm AIO. Is the CPU overclocked at all?

The few reviews I found on internet shows that systems build aorund this case works on the hot/very hot side while gaming. And OP its runing an RTX 2070S which drop the hot air inside the small case.

Another question for OP will be, Does your radiator gets too hot to touch while gaming, or is it too hot all the time?

If it is too hot all the time, then there could be an issue with the pump.

 

[Nighthawk117]

The few reviews I found on internet shows that systems build aorund this case works on the hot/very hot side while gaming. And OP its runing an RTX 2070S which drop the hot air inside the small case.

Another question for OP will be, Does your radiator gets too hot to touch while gaming, or is it too hot all the time?

If it is too hot all the time, then there could be an issue with the pump.

It does seem a bit warm for the CPU from the couple of reviews I've read but not disastrously so, I did wonder too if the pump was having problems. Still don't know if the 9600K is running at stock or not, if it were overclocked that would explain a lot.

 

[Nighthawk117]

Few things to check:

1. Is the pump working correctly, you can check with HWMonitor to see what the Pump RPM is.
2. Is the pump plugged into the right connector on the motherboard, you want it to run at a constant speed. If it was plugged into the CPU fan header it won't do that.
3. How are the fans on the AIO orientated, are they pushing air through the radiator and out of the PC, or are they pulling air into the PC?
4. Is the CPU overclocked or running in stock config?

 

[geofelt]

Lots of thoughts:
I read that your main motivation is to improve in game fps.
Some games are graphics limited like fast action shooters.
Others are cpu core speed limited like strategy, sims, and mmo.

For starters, run a simple test:
Run YOUR games, but lower your resolution and eye candy.
This makes the graphics card loaf a bit.
If your FPS increases, it indicates that your cpu is strong enough to drive a better graphics configuration.

Since you suspect that cpu is an issue, run the cpu-Z bench test and look at the single thread rating.
For a 9700K it should be around 592:
https://valid.x86.fr/bench/akzkcv/1
Most who submitted tests, will have overclocked their 9600K.
If you test significantly less, you could possibly be thermal throttling.

Love Lian Li quality and the case. It is one of the few where I support aio cooling.
Is you aio radiator mounted to draw in outside air or to expel the heated cpu air?
I think you want the expel option to get hot air out of the case asap.
The heat from your graphics card needs to be expelled.
Were you able to mount a 120mm fan on the bottom?

To test for thermal throttling, run Hwmonitor while gaming.
Look at the minimum cpu temperature of your 6 cores.
It should be around 10-15c. over ambient if your cooler is working well.
Ambient is the temperature inside the case and will be higher than room temperature.
If you see a few cores in red at 100c. You are throttling.
The good news is that you keep on running instead of stopping.
If throttling, possibly your aio is failing. They do not last forever. Air intrudes and pumps can get clogged or start to fail.

To the question of 12th gen processors.
A I3-12100 would be a modest upgrade.
It has 8 threads vs. 6 and a passmark rating of 14540/3550 vs. 10914/2809.
The last number is the single thread rating which is the more important for games.
The I5-12400 has 12 threads and a rating of 19538/3531.
Both come with a stock cooler.
I would be inclined to try them first if you have augmented airflow with a bottom intake fan. LGA1700 needs an adapter for your current aio cooler.
The socket has different spacing holes and the chip is lower.
Most cooler vendors will send you one free or for a modest charge.
While the F suffix processors may be some $25 cheaper, I think that integrated graphics is a good insurance in case of a graphics issue.

You will need a new ITX motherboard.
I would avoid the cheap H610 units in favor of the B660 or Z690 motherboards.
Buy a DDR4 based motherboard and you can reuse your DDR4 ram. Performance is the sams as with the more expensive DDR5.

 

[PaddyMcpadington]

Few things to check:

1. Is the pump working correctly, you can check with HWMonitor to see what the Pump RPM is.
2. Is the pump plugged into the right connector on the motherboard, you want it to run at a constant speed. If it was plugged into the CPU fan header it won't do that.
3. How are the fans on the AIO orientated, are they pushing air through the radiator and out of the PC, or are they pulling air into the PC?
4. Is the CPU overclocked or running in stock config?

Sorry I've been away for a few days and now Im back.
So to answer quite a few of the questions,

1.
HWMonitor doesnt display the Pump RPM in my system, However Corsair Icue software does, and I can change the pump RPM between Quiet, Balanced and Extreme, which in my system is 1980rpm, 2450rpm & 2920 rpm. I do hear it change tones in my system when I alternate between them. So I'm confident the Pump is working.

2.
Yes I've just opened up my system to check. The pump is plugged into the pump header on the motherboard and one of the radiator fans is plugged into the CPU fan header and the remaining fan is controlled by the AIO and as such I can only control 1 fan from the ICUE software.

3.
The fans are set to pull air from the case and vent out the top.

4.
I haven't personally overclocked it in this system, it has been overclocked in larger cased systems, if there was any overclock its most likely just what the motherboard can do, however its not a Z board and its in eco mode. So I doubt any.

 

[PaddyMcpadington]

Lots of thoughts:
I read that your main motivation is to improve in game fps.
Some games are graphics limited like fast action shooters.
Others are cpu core speed limited like strategy, sims, and mmo.

For starters, run a simple test:
Run YOUR games, but lower your resolution and eye candy.
This makes the graphics card loaf a bit.
If your FPS increases, it indicates that your cpu is strong enough to drive a better graphics configuration.

Since you suspect that cpu is an issue, run the cpu-Z bench test and look at the single thread rating.
For a 9700K it should be around 592:
https://valid.x86.fr/bench/akzkcv/1
Most who submitted tests, will have overclocked their 9600K.
If you test significantly less, you could possibly be thermal throttling.

Love Lian Li quality and the case. It is one of the few where I support aio cooling.
Is you aio radiator mounted to draw in outside air or to expel the heated cpu air?
I think you want the expel option to get hot air out of the case asap.
The heat from your graphics card needs to be expelled.
Were you able to mount a 120mm fan on the bottom?

To test for thermal throttling, run Hwmonitor while gaming.
Look at the minimum cpu temperature of your 6 cores.
It should be around 10-15c. over ambient if your cooler is working well.
Ambient is the temperature inside the case and will be higher than room temperature.
If you see a few cores in red at 100c. You are throttling.
The good news is that you keep on running instead of stopping.
If throttling, possibly your aio is failing. They do not last forever. Air intrudes and pumps can get clogged or start to fail.

To the question of 12th gen processors.
A I3-12100 would be a modest upgrade.
It has 8 threads vs. 6 and a passmark rating of 14540/3550 vs. 10914/2809.
The last number is the single thread rating which is the more important for games.
The I5-12400 has 12 threads and a rating of 19538/3531.
Both come with a stock cooler.
I would be inclined to try them first if you have augmented airflow with a bottom intake fan. LGA1700 needs an adapter for your current aio cooler.
The socket has different spacing holes and the chip is lower.
Most cooler vendors will send you one free or for a modest charge.
While the F suffix processors may be some $25 cheaper, I think that integrated graphics is a good insurance in case of a graphics issue.

You will need a new ITX motherboard.
I would avoid the cheap H610 units in favor of the B660 or Z690 motherboards.
Buy a DDR4 based motherboard and you can reuse your DDR4 ram. Performance is the sams as with the more expensive DDR5.

So I ran the CPU-Z Bench, Very small test, And it gave me a score of 504 not overclocked obviously. And this is not long after the PC being turned on, so its not hot.
I will check the gaming tests later and compare with HW Monitor to see if its thermal throttling.

I have not managed to mount a 120mm fan at the bottom of the case, Even running a SFX PSU, there's just not enough space away from the cables.

 

[PaddyMcpadington]

So another thing to note is that after my pc has been idling for a couple hours and locked with no use. I come on and check HWmonitor and min temperature for any cpu core 37c and max 40c. The package min is 40c and max 54c. Ambient room temp is probably around 20c.