What should I upgrade for BF4?

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Razerium

Honorable
Aug 16, 2013
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10,690
Hey everybody,

I'm looking to upgrade my PC, so I can record and play BF4 at ultra settings 120fps .
Here is my current setup:
Intel i7-2600K CPU @3.4 GHZ 4 Cores (64 Bit)
16gb RAM-Super Talent
AMD Radeon HD 7970
230gb SSD
1,000gb HDD
Corsair CX600 Power Supply
LG Optical Drive


I have a budget of $1,000. What are the upgrades I can do? Please tell me. I'm going to be recording AS WELL AS playing BF4 ultra settings 120fps Help me out!

PS: no processor overclocking!!
 
Solution


Well, as said, we don't have the properly-cooled 290xs yet, so I can't give you an exact figure, but based on current information, it would appear that you'd get around a 30-40% improvement over a 7970. Honestly, as said, a second 7970 would be cheaper and give better performance than a single 290x, though admittedly it would be less upgradeable.





Okay, I'll give you more info about my motherboard and stuff in 12 hours or so, I need to get home first.
Pleased don't give up on this thread :)
 


No rush and no worries. I've been involved in threads that took a week and two and a half pages of responses to sort out. You can count on me to see things through.
 


UPDATE:

Hey guys, I got some more info about my build

My motherboard is Gigabyte GA-Z77K
I also have a Corsair CPU cooler, but I don't know the model of it.
And I realized, I have a Radeon HD 7950

My budget is still $1000

I want to be able to play BF4 at ultra and be able to hit extremely hih amounts of FPS...

I have a picture of my build, but it's very very blurry. (My iPhone wouldn't focus)

Help 😉
 


There are no Gigabyte motherboards with the designation GA-Z77k, to my knowledge. Might it be something like the GA-Z77X-D3H?

Well, the 7950 is a bit lower-tier than a 7970, but in the end it still comes down to this: if 70-80ish FPS is sufficient, adding a second 7950 and upping your PSU is the best route. If you're looking for something closer to 120, a pair of non-reference cooler R9-290s would be my recommendation, along with a significantly larger PSU, though that will obviously be significantly more expensive. However, both of those assume a CrossFire, so those recommendations may change depending on what your motherboard is.

If you could post the picture, that would be very helpful.
 


Sorrry, the motherboard is the D3H :)
I'll make sure to take a better picture. So you don't believe I should just get a better graphics card but instead I should crossfire? And a large PSU of course. I'd really like a very very powerful PC, and that's why I'm upgrading it. Btw, My budget can go up to $1,500 if you think I should get more upgrades to be able to get a very powerful PC.

I'm also thinking about multiple monitors, if that changes anything 😉
 


For the degree of performance you're looking for, you're going to need CrossFire/SLI no matter what you do. No GPU on the planet can give you 120 fps consistently in demanding games, doubly so if you're thinking about a multi-monitor gaming setup.
I don't think that it'll be necessary to go past $1,000 to get all you're looking for, though. A pair of properly-cooled 290s is pretty close to the maximum amount of power you're going to get, no matter what, although a pair of 290xs or (god forbid, given the price) 780 Tis would technically outperform it. I'm rather doubtful that any of the aforementioned options would get you 120 fps on three screens, however.

Edit: Additionally, that motherboard should be fine for CrossFire, I believe, so we're all good there.



That's quite incorrect. As the many owners of 120 and 144hz monitors (myself included) can attest, there is a noticeable difference between 60 and 120 fps, though not quite as noticeable as the difference between 30 and 60.
 


Okay so a pair of 290xs is the answer? And what kind of PSU would that take? And so my processor enough? And what kind of cooling would it take? Is it hard to setup? My computer right now has okay air flow...
Sorry for so many questions but,

Isn't it even harder to properly setup two or 3 monitor setup?
Ps: I don't want 120fps on 2 or 3 monitors haha that's crazy! Just around 80 would be awesome!!

So could you make a pc part picker list on what I should order?

And finally, thanks a lot 😀
(you'll get best answer for sure)

Sorry for so many questions 😉
 


I don't think that the 290x has demonstrated sufficient advantage over the 290 to warrant the increased price tag, so I'd recommend dual 290s.
A 1000w PSU should see you in good stead for that, though 1250w seems to be around the same price for the brands I'd recommend (SeaSonic and XFX), so you might as well go with that.
Your processor should be alright, unless you're keen to spend another thousand on an LGA 2011 setup. As a general rule, anything around an i5 in performance (which your processor is) is fine for gaming. OCing it a bit would likely get you a little further, but you're indicated disinterest in that, and it should be alright as it is.
You'd want very, very good cooling. Hawai'i runs hot, and throttles under high heat. I would not recommend buying until the better coolers come out (which should be towards the end of this month), and it might be worthwhile to upgrade to a better-cooled case (the Rosewill Thor V2, NZXT Phantom 630, and Cooler Master HAF X all being sterling options in that regard), though the case you have may well be fine. What is your current case?
Not having ever used a multi-monitor setup, I couldn't tell you, though from what I hear it's not all that hard. I'm not really a fan of having bezels in the middle of my view, myself, but to each his own.
Well, 80 fps should definitely be quite viable, with either 290s or 290xs.
Sadly, I cannot make a list for you to order, as the 290s that I would recommend (most likely the ASUS DirectCU II or Gigabyte Windforce variants) have yet to be released. The only 290s on the market at the moment are the reference-cooler ones, and (as some of TH's most recent articles show) that cooler will not allow the GPU to work to perform to the best of its ability, and I thus cannot recommend it, particularly for a CrossFire.
Don't worry at all about having a lot of questions, if I weren't happy to answer questions, I wouldn't be responding to them on this forum. I'm here to help, and happy to do so. :)
 


So I should get dual 290's and a 1000w PSU?
 


Yes, though, as said, you'll want to wait for the end of the month and the non-reference coolers. I'd also like to know what case you have, as two 290s will generate a hell of a lot of heat, and you may need to upgrade your case if the current one has poor airflow.
 


I don't think I'm gonna do it... It's too complicated... Unless you can convince me that's it's easy. I won't do it. Sorry dude, but I think I'll just stick to what I have right now. But I think I'll just get new everything... Maybe triple 780ti once I sell more stocks. Also, what do you think of the thermaltake level 10 GT-Bay EATX

Check out my new thread, I'll need you help :)
http://www.tomshardware.com/answers/id-1878517/full-tower-gaming-case.html
 


Uh, it's not really terribly difficult. As a matter of fact, there is literally nothing involved in installing a pair of new graphics cards and a new PSU which would not be involved in building a new system from scratch, if that's what you're saying.
I also wouldn't advise either the 780 Ti or a triple SLI. More than two GPUs tends to lead you into shaky waters as far as stability is concerned, and the 780 Ti is just not good value for money.

All that said, what you have at the moment is entirely fine, your system is still better than 95% of what's out there, and if you're not wanting to upgrade at the moment, I could certainly understand why.
 


I'm just scared of the cooling part.
 


Sadly, there's not really any getting away from that. At the high end, things run hot. Don't worry too much about it. With a really solid case (NZXT Phantom 820/630, Cooler Master HAF X, Rosewill Thor V2, etc.) and a pair of well-cooled cards (ASUS DirectCU II and Gigabyte's Windforce rarely disappoint), you can sort that out. Worse-case realistic scenario is that the heat will make the cards throttle, and that's unlikely to the point that I would discount it with a good case and the right coolers on the cards.
 


Im just worried of not cooling it enough, and I know liquid cooling is too hard
 


Well, liquid cooling isn't as hard as you might think, but, as said, a solid stock cooler and a good case will cool pretty much anything on the market. The cards that really have heat issues (7990, 290, 290x) are those that don't have non-reference coolers (yet). Once the various brands put their best coolers on them, the R9-290/xs will be amazing.
 


So I should crossfire these?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?gclid=CILJurve7roCFShyQgodXB0AIA&Item=N82E16814202043&nm_mc=KNC-GoogleAdwords&cm_mmc=KNC-GoogleAdwords-_-pla-_-Desktop+Graphics+Cards-_-N82E16814202043&ef_id=Um6jXQAAAUZFUR3K:20131118161853:s

Does it come with the crossfire part?
And should I get a new motherboard/processor? Maybe a new Amd processor (Since mine isn't so good?)
Maybe a new case as well, with more fans and things...

Could you add the links of the parts? Couple fans, (preferably with some led's), graphic card cooler, new case, stuff like that...


What do you think of this processor??
http://www.amazon.com/AMD-FD9590FHHKWOF-FX-9590-8-Core-Black/dp/B00DGGW3MI/ref=sr_1_6?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1384791872&sr=1-6&keywords=amd+processor
 


I would not recommend CrossFiring (or even purchasing) any Hawai'i GPU (that is, 290/290x) cards using the reference cooler (that silly, red/black affair with the single red fan). It has been repeatedly shown to be insufficient to allow Hawai'i to reach its full potential.

The 290/290xs don't actually require a CrossFire bridge, as I understand it, due to the new CrossFire technology they use. According to AMD, it also helps resolve microstutter, which is nice.
I would not recommend a new processor or motherboard. The only justification I could think of for a new motherboard would be the release of DDR4 RAM, which, admittedly, is swiftly oncoming. When that drops, it would be advisable to upgrade to a new processor and motherboard, but until then what you have is pretty much as good as it gets. Intel hasn't meaningfully innovated on their i7s and i5s in the past three generations, and your current CPU is better than anything AMD has on the market.
You have my standard recommendations in your other thread regarding case, I believe: the NZXT Phantom 820, NZXT Phantom 630, Cooler Master HAF X, and Rosewill Thor V2 are all stellar cases. However, if there's a specific requirement or aesthetic you're looking for that those don't meet, I'd be happy to pitch additional options.

I can most certainly offer links, but I cannot link any graphics cards, as all the 290/290xs on the market are reference cooled, which as said is a no-go, what fans I would recommend would vary by case, and I have not yet determined what you are looking for in a case.

That processor is atrociously overpriced, runs excessively hot, and does not offer nearly enough performance to justify its cost. I would strongly recommend against it.
 


Well the processor is $540 off so I thought it was a good deal, I'm thinking maybe liquid cooling? For the cases I'm looking for some sweet looks and good fan. Full tower would be very nice 😀
So I shouldn't buy the 290x yet, what about getting liquid cooling graphic card system? Would that fit in my case?
When do you think DDR4 will come?

And also, no new mobo right? Is mine good enough for more ram?


I make youtube videos so that's why I really want a powerful PC. I'm not a famous Youtuber, but I still want to be "future ready".

However, I'm growing so slowly so I don't think I'm ever going to be anything haha 😀
 


Discounts can be deceiving, though I can understand your confusion. For reference, the FX9000s are, functionally speaking, just overclocked variants of the FX8350. Flashy, but the performance just isn't there.

Well, I can't tell you what looks good. Some people like NZXT's smooth, futuristic style, some like the blocky, aggressive styling on Cooler Master's stuff, some like the professional look of Corsair or Lian-Li, etc. Looks are down to preference. I'd encourage you to look at the towers I mentioned (and, if you want some variety, also at Corsair's Obsidian line, SilverStone's Fortress and Raven series, Fractal Design's Define series, and Thermaltake's Chaser series), and see what you like. From there, we can work to find the best-performing option for you, which might potentially include swapping the lackluster fans on a case you like the aesthetic of, depending on how things go.

Liquid cooling is the best cooling you can get, if you're willing to work at it. A custom loop will offer cooling that can't be beat, but you'd have to modify your cards (to remove the stock coolers and add the water blocks) and void the warranty in the process, to say nothing of the basic costs of a good loop. It's a lovely way to spend your time and money, but liquid cooling requires a lot of commitment, to the point that a lot of people (myself included) eschew it altogether. I would note that a good stock cooler (or even an aftermarket air cooler, such as the Arctic Accelero Xtreme III, though that brings in voiding the warranty again) will be fine for cooling any graphics card, including in CrossFire, so long as you have good case airflow.
Now, regarding fitting a liquid loop in your case: short answer: yes. Long answer: Yes, but what exact radiators and fan configurations you could manage would vary based on what case you ended up using. In something like a Corsair 900D or other liquid-cooling specialized case, your options are functionally limitless. In something more air-centric, like SilverStone's Raven series, you'd be quite limited in what you could put together. It all varies by the specific case you're working with.

Current viewpoint is that DDR4 is coming with the next generation of processors (Broadwell and Haswell-E, for Intel), though I'm not sure about AMD. That would mean sometime next year, though I don't believe that we have an exact date.

If you wanted to use DDR4, you'd need a new motherboard, but if you mean for the moment, you don't per se need one. However, looking at the specs for your current motherboard again, I note that you only have PCIe 2.0 at x4 for your second GPU, which would almost certainly bottleneck a high-end card like the 290 or 290x. You might want to consider upgrading to something with at least x8/x8 if that bothers you, though if you'd then be upgrading again for DDR4, I wouldn't go for it. While you wouldn't be getting maximum value for money from your GPUs initially, even with the bottleneck dual 290/290xs will be far more than you need for gaming (and even recording).

I feel you there, mate. I'm actually a YouTuber as well (with a glorious total of 17 subs), and I know where you're coming from. That's why I have dual 7970s myself, actually. When I got my rig, they were the best single GPU you could get, much as the 290x is at current (in my opinion, at least). Being prepared is always worthwhile, in my opinion.

Don't worry, if you hang in there long enough and keep producing solid content, the subscriber base will come. Well, that's what I tell myself as I edit yet another video to get 15 views, anyway. In the end, I think that the secret to making it on YouTube is enjoying the content creation process enough to do it even when you're not getting fame, money, or acclaim. That lets you keep going a lot longer than the people who expect to hit it big quite just by doing crappy Minecraft Let's Plays (no offense meant if you're a Minecraft LPer).

By the way, what do you use for editing? I use Premier Elements, myself, and I saw a surprisingly large performance increase when I upgraded from 16GB to 32GB of RAM. If slow rendering is why you're looking towards a new processor, getting more RAM might be a simpler solution (though, as said, with DDR4's imminent arrival, it may be better just to endure and wait).
 


So the processor is a no go zone? I thought it was very good, an 8 core 4.6ghz processor is just amazing! I'm torn between what to do, buy it or leave it.

As for the case, I've done some research and I quite like the look of the cooler master HAF x. It a nice case expect I'd prefer a transparent window so I can lolok at my hardware! (I'll also have a fan controller, and I'll replace the default red LEDs with some color changing ones, if I can do that) what do you think?

I don't think I'll be getting DDR4 memory, as it's probably going to be super expensive to start with, and I doubt games will start to use the advantage of DDR4 memory until quite a long time.

As for the 290x, I'm not sure if I should go for either a 290x or a 7990, since there're almost the same price, etc.. I might only go for one video card, as they are pretty expensive... Seeing how hard liquid cooling is, I might not go for that, at least not for the graphics card. For the processor that's seems very easy so I'll do it. I might get some air cooling for the graphics card though, something like that. What do you think?

And finally, for youtube I'm not going for money at all. In fact, I've been asked by partnering companies to join them, but I refused as I don't want to get into the entire money/business and contracts stuff. I have 140 subscribers and 4,500 views but 8 views (I deleted two videos) myself, but I seem to be struggling to get one or two more subscribers. I'd love to see your channel; would you mind if you give me the link? Oh and also I use Sony Vegas (the $60 version). I have some okay render times though...

Thanks a lot for your help Jack!

Hopefully we can work stuff out one day :)
 


Ah, but the thing is, eight cores and 4.6GHz for an AMD processor is not equal to eight cores and 4.6 GHz on an Intel, nor even to the "mere" six cores and 3.4GHz of the 4930k. The processor you have now is around the same performance as that one, and you could beat it handily with overclocking if you wished to.

The HAF X is a damn solid case, I've got to say. I don't use one myself, but I've had one on my table for the past month (long story, that), and I can definitely appreciate both the aesthetics and the performance. It actually does have a window, by the way, it's just L-shaped, conforming around a fan mount which blows onto the GPUs. If you want to change the colour, the only thing you'd need to remove would be the front fan, which has red LEDs, but fortunately many good options exist for replacements. From there, you could either get differently-coloured fans, add an LED system like the NZXT HUE, or both.

I wouldn't expect DDR4 to be massively expensive, but you're definitely right that it won't be a big gain in gaming. I'll be trading up, myself, but I can definitely understand choosing not to.

I wouldn't recommend the 7990 in almost any circumstance. It costs more than a pair of 7970s/280xs, which are equal if not better in all regards except for space consumption (two cards taking up 4-6 expansion slots instead of 2). As for the 290x, if price is a pressing issue (or, honestly, even if it's not), the R9-290 may well be the better option. Honestly, if I were buying GPUs now, I'd grab a CrossFire of 290s (once the appropriately-cooled versions were released, of course). That said, a single R9-290x should be absolutely fine for your needs, particularly with an overclock on it.

Liquid cooling a processor isn't actually that much easier than liquid cooling a GPU if you're talking about a custom loop, but processors have the advantage of not requiring warranty-voiding modification to support non-stock coolers, which makes things like closed-loop liquid coolers a much easier route than they are with GPUs. The HAF X is a pretty good case for that, for reference, though if you don't intend to OC your processor, you wouldn't actually need anything better than the stock cooler. That's your call, obviously, however.

Ha! You're a more honourable man than I am. I'm definitely in it for the money, at least in part. What can I say? I have tuition to pay.
Sounds like your channel is doing pretty alright, at least by comparison to mine. Mind linking me it? I'm quite intrigued, I must admit.
I'd be happy to link you my channel, but I don't like to connect my online identities too much. If you send me a PM, I'll give you a link to my channel in response (due to TH's shitty coding, I can't actually send PMs, only respond to them).
Well, if your times are okay with you, that's great. Maybe I should look into Vegas, actually. I love the interface on Premier, but I get pretty impatient waiting for things, particularly when I'm working on my backup system, which only has an 8350.

I'm always happy to help. If anything, this sort of relatively concrete tech stuff ("4770k > FX8350", "770 > 7970") is a relief from the damnable subtleties and relative values of my everyday life.

I'm sorry that we're not moving as fast as you might like, though. In the past, I've tended to shepherd folks towards a relatively quick, simple solution in threads I've responded to, but I often felt that left them without everything they were looking for, so I'm trying to be less heavy-handed these days.
 


Don't worry about not finding a solution, at least when we find one I'll be sure that I wasn't trolled and I'll know that somebody really took time to answer considering every option. So let me just do a little recap of what we're looking at to upgrade:
I'd like a new case. I changed my mind and probably would prefer something quite fancy and modern. I was looking at NZXT's Phantom line. Not sure which one though...
-Second, we're upgrading the graphics card, and we're looking at the 290x once they get better coolers for it. How long do you think that will take? And do you think I could instead have just a ton of fans? Could that be enough to cool down my computer? I'd mostly likely get a Fan Controller then aswell. Are you sure the 290x is good? It's a maybe a bit expensive, especially when I'm going to buy two on a $1,000 budget.
-Motherboard. Is an upgrade needed? I'm wondering...
-Processor: No upgrade needed? 4 Cores isn't much but it IS intel...
-Cooling: So I was thinking water cooling for the processor, (Is that hard) and maybe some air cooling for the graphics card.

Do you think all this could be done within a $1,000-1,100 budget?

Also, I've sort of messed up on the whole "Don't link your accounts" because all of my accounts for every single website (almost) are named lolOptix.

But yeah, here's my youtube. Feel free to like, subscribe and tell your friends about it, because my "fanbase" is quite small and seems to be un-willing to grow. That said i'm stuck at around 140 subs...
www.youtube.com/lolOptixHD

Thanks 😉