[SOLVED] Which is the better system for general use (video, way too many tabs open, etc) & more future-proof?

[johnnyb4x]

I'm in the market for a new general-use desktop. Trying to stay around $700 or under. I've narrowed my choices to two systems (but I'm open to suggestions!) They're both HP because I've had good luck with them previously (& terrible luck w/ Dell), but I'm not stuck on HP. Had looked at going with a custom company like ibuypower, cyberpowerpc, xidax, etc, but they all seem to build gaming rigs, which I'm not looking for.

System #1: https://www.officedepot.com/a/products/7814504/HP-Pavilion-TP01-0066-Desktop-PC/?cm_cat=967589 - $579

Item #	7814504
Manufacturer #	6YQ86AA#ABA

Color	Natural Silver
Depth	11.93 in.
HD Capability	Yes
Height	13.28 in.
Width	6.12 in.
Bluetooth Enabled	Yes
Graphics Type	Dedicated
Included Software Titles	30-day McAfee LiveSafe™ trial
Liquid Cooling System	No
Maximum Memory Capacity	32 GB
Maximum Turbo Speed	4.4 GHz

Memory	8 GB
Memory Card Reader	Yes
Memory Type	DDR4 SDRAM
Microphone Jack	Yes
Model	TP01-0066
Number Of HDMI Ports	1
Number Of USB Ports	9
Operating System Version (Details)	Windows 10 Home
Optical Drive Type	DVD+/-RW
Ports	USB 3.1; USB 2.0
Processor	AMD Ryzen 7
Processor Brand	AMD
Processor Cache	32 MB
Processor Model	AMD Ryzen™ 7 3700X Processor
Processor Number Of Cores	8-Core
Processor Speed (Base)	3.60 GHz
Product Condition	New
Product Line	Pavilion
Storage Capacity	256 GB
Storage Type	Internal
System Memory (RAM)	8 GB
USB Generation	USB 3.1; USB 2.0
VR Ready	No
Warranty	1-Year Limited
Wired Connectivity	10/100/1000 Ethernet
Wireless Connectivity	802.11ac; Bluetooth
Brand Name	HP

I like this one because of the obvious... Ryzen 7 3700X in a sub-$600 system. Graphics card is so-so, mobo is AMD Mini ATX B550A, lower end but ok for my purposes. PSU is only 310W, but it's gold. RAM is only 8gb & it's CL 22, so would probably swap that out at some point. Would use the 256GB SSD as boot drive & add my own internal standard HD for storage. From my research, M2 connections are taken up by the ssd & wifi card.

System #2: HP Omen Obelisk customized build https://store.hp.com/us/en/pdp/omen-desktop-pc-875-0030qd-4wp44av-1 $669 as I have it configured

[TR]
[TD]Base[/TD]
[TD]OMEN by HP Obelisk Desktop PC - 875-0030qd[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Operating system[/TD]
[TD]Windows 10 Home[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Processor[/TD]
[TD]9th generation Intel® Core™ i5-9400 Processor[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Memory[/TD]
[TD]HyperX® 8 GB DDR4-2666 SDRAM (1 x 8 GB)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Storage[/TD]
[TD]1 TB 7200 rpm SATA[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Secondary storage[/TD]
[TD]No Secondary storage[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Graphics card[/TD]
[TD]NVIDIA® GeForce® GTX 1050 Ti (4 GB GDDR5 dedicated)[/TD]
[/TR]​

Additional Specs

[TR]
[TD]Intel® Optane™ memory[/TD]
[TD]16 GB NVMe™ Intel® Optane™ Memory for storage acceleration[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Third storage[/TD]
[TD]No Third storage[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Chassis and Power supply[/TD]
[TD]Shadow Black tower with 500W Bronze efficiency power supply[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Networking[/TD]
[TD]802.11a/b/g/n/ac (2x2) Wi-Fi® and Bluetooth® 4.2 M.2 combo[/TD]
[/TR]​

From the base config I upgraded from the i5 8400 to the i5 9400 (I know there's not much difference btwn them, but it was $10 for a newer chip) and added the 16GB of Optane memory (a free upgrade currently). I like the Ryzen 7 processor better on the 1st system than the i5, & the SSD. I'd likely add a SSD to this build as a boot drive & toss the 1tb. Graphics seem to be comparable. Ram is HyperX so I'm assuming it's better than the 1st system, but haven't double-checked. The Optane memory is the main advantage of this system for me, but don't have any personal experience w/ it yet.

Thoughts, suggestions??

 

[Karadjgne]

#2. For general purpose use, and not higher end gaming, the 3700x is wasted. There's very few programs that will take decent advantage of the core count, games happen to be some of them. So unless your general purpose includes a fair amount of rendering or editing or other such core+ programs, a 6core cpu is going to be fine

 

[johnnyb4x]

#2. For general purpose use, and not higher end gaming, the 3700x is wasted. There's very few programs that will take decent advantage of the core count, games happen to be some of them. So unless your general purpose includes a fair amount of rendering or editing or other such core+ programs, a 6core cpu is going to be fine

Agreed on the Ryzen 7 being overkill, but you think the other system is still better despite being $100 more?

 

[DSzymborski]

You also want to leave room to replace the RAM. 8 GB is not sufficient if you need to open up that many tabs for some bizarre reason.

 

[Rogue Leader]

OK, I'll bite 10,000 tabs? There is nothing about 10,000 tabs being open that is general use.

Why would you have that many tabs open and how in the world would you manage it?

 

[Karadjgne]

Since the second build is tailored, dump the 1Tb storage and get an SSD instead. No sense paying for something you aren't going to use. Optane memory is a cache. Everything you are working on gets moved through it, so works at a seriously faster pace. When it has time, it moves the data to more permanent storage, so even a hdd doesn't affect your times.

With the first build, unless that ram is 3600/3733MHz, cl22 is going to be a 3-legged dog. Ryzens love faster ram, and higher CL. For 3200MHz you should be looking at 16, 14 would be better, and for that 3700x you'd not be doing anything any favors by going with less than 3600/18. Which I doubt that motherboard supports as it's most likely a H-310 or B-350 chipset with updated bios which will support a 3700x, but cut it off at the knees.

At the end of the day, just to bring that pc upto being able to do that cpu justice on an equal footing will cost far more than the 100 extra for the second build. Intels don't mind faster ram, or lower CL, but don't rely on it for performance gains like Ryzen does.

The 3700x in that HP is like stuffing a race engine in a daily-around town-driver, where the speed limit is 60kph. Without motherboard/ram support, it's wasted, no better overall than a 3400G

 

[Colif]

what browser anyway? Chromes max is 9000 tabs before it won't run anymore - https://redstapler.co/how-many-tabs-can-be-open-in-chrome/

 

[Karadjgne]

10k tabs would be so small on the toolbar you'd spend more time searching for the right tab than just opening up a new one. More than 20-50 tabs is a pain

 

[johnnyb4x]

You also want to leave room to replace the RAM. 8 GB is not sufficient if you need to open up that many tabs for some bizarre reason.

For sure. If I get the 1st system, I'd likely replace the stock ram w/ a better quality 16gb stick. If I go with system #2 I'd prolly just add a matching 8gb hyperx stick.
(& I don't need to have a crap-ton of tabs open all at once, it's more of a bad habit I've resigned myself to)

 

[johnnyb4x]

OK, I'll bite 10,000 tabs? There is nothing about 10,000 tabs being open that is general use.

Why would you have that many tabs open and how in the world would you manage it?

10k might be an exaggeration...

 

[johnnyb4x]

what browser anyway? Chromes max is 9000 tabs before it won't run anymore - https://redstapler.co/how-many-tabs-can-be-open-in-chrome/

Ok, 10k tabs might be an exaggeration, but I love that someone found the limit out

 

[johnnyb4x]

Since the second build is tailored, dump the 1Tb storage and get an SSD instead. No sense paying for something you aren't going to use. Optane memory is a cache. Everything you are working on gets moved through it, so works at a seriously faster pace. When it has time, it moves the data to more permanent storage, so even a hdd doesn't affect your times.

With the first build, unless that ram is 3600/3733MHz, cl22 is going to be a 3-legged dog. Ryzens love faster ram, and higher CL. For 3200MHz you should be looking at 16, 14 would be better, and for that 3700x you'd not be doing anything any favors by going with less than 3600/18. Which I doubt that motherboard supports as it's most likely a H-310 or B-350 chipset with updated bios which will support a 3700x, but cut it off at the knees.

At the end of the day, just to bring that pc upto being able to do that cpu justice on an equal footing will cost far more than the 100 extra for the second build. Intels don't mind faster ram, or lower CL, but don't rely on it for performance gains like Ryzen does.

The 3700x in that HP is like stuffing a race engine in a daily-around town-driver, where the speed limit is 60kph. Without motherboard/ram support, it's wasted, no better overall than a 3400G

Thanks for the advice on the Ryzen!
With the 2nd build, I was thinking of buying a ssd myself & cloning windows onto it for boot. Here's the price if I went through HP for the ssd though (NVMe M.2): 128gb for $10, 256 for 60, 512 for $160. Thoughts?
also, it'd be an extra $150 fro them to throw a 2nd stick of 8gb hyperx ram into it for 16gb total.

 

[johnnyb4x]

10k tabs would be so small on the toolbar you'd spend more time searching for the right tab than just opening up a new one. More than 20-50 tabs is a pain

Yup, might've been exaggerating w/ the 10k, but I'm sure I hover around 100 on any given day.
Not proud of that mind you...

 

[DSzymborski]

Yup, might've been exaggerating w/ the 10k, but I'm sure I hover around 100 on any given day.
Not proud of that mind you...

Actually, the original makes more sense now. You just didn't realize when using a bit of artistic hyperbole that there are actually really wacky people out there that literally want to use that many tabs! There was a guy a few weeks ago who wanted to know the best budget CPU for a setup to run A HUNDRED VIRTUAL MACHINES.

I'd still definitely do 16 GB though in any 2020 build.

 

[Rogue Leader]

10k might be an exaggeration...

It may be, but hang around here long enough and you'll find the guy who actually wants that.

Yes it has happened.

+1 on 16gb, really its a minimum for a reasonably good build these days.

 

[johnnyb4x]

It may be, but hang around here long enough and you'll find the guy who actually wants that.

Yes it has happened.

+1 on 16gb, really its a minimum for a reasonably good build these days.

I've read stuff on here before, this is my 1st post though. Already made a mental note to keep the hyperbole in check.
Agreed on the 16GB, the question is do I have HP do it for a $150 upgrade cost, or just find the matching stick on newegg or something & pop it in myself?
& any thoughts on the ssd question I posed to Karadjgne?

 

[johnnyb4x]

Actually, the original makes more sense now. You just didn't realize when using a bit of artistic hyperbole that there are actually really wacky people out there that literally want to use that many tabs! There was a guy a few weeks ago who wanted to know the best budget CPU for a setup to run A HUNDRED VIRTUAL MACHINES.

I'd still definitely do 16 GB though in any 2020 build.

Yeah... sorry about that. This is my 1st post. I'll keep the hyperbole to either a minimum or a clearly ridiculous level.
Agreed on the 16GB, should I pay the $150 to HP or just source a matching stick on newegg or something & pop it in myself?
& any thoughts on the ssd question I posed to Karadjgne?

 

[Karadjgne]

For ram, that's iffy. HP won't add another stick. They'll pull (or not install) the original single stick and put a new 2x stick kit in. There's far to great a chance that mixing ram will end up with less than great results, and they guarantee a stable pc on delivery. So the end result is a factory matched pair. Or you can add a stick yourself and pray it's compatible. You could literally try 100 sticks and not get a compatible set.

I've had ram, sent to me by Corsair, exact same in every aspect, 9 numbers apart on the production code and no compatibility at all. Refused to work together. I've had ram of different speeds, voltage, timings, vendor, model put together in a pc that worked like a champ. When ppl mix kits, add another ram, there's only one guarantee, there are 'No' guarantees at all. Totally pot-luck.

Favorite SSD is the Crucial P1. For the price it's unbeatable value. Best SSDs are the Samsungs, but you'll pay a premium for them. NVMe or Sata would be your choice, depending on what slots are available. For a general use pc there's not all that much difference you'd notice. 256Gb minimum, 500ish + is recommended. I spend far too much effort in space saving on my 128Gb, which includes redirecting installs to other drives, seperating game folders etc.

 

[Rogue Leader]

I've read stuff on here before, this is my 1st post though. Already made a mental note to keep the hyperbole in check.
Agreed on the 16GB, the question is do I have HP do it for a $150 upgrade cost, or just find the matching stick on newegg or something & pop it in myself?
& any thoughts on the ssd question I posed to Karadjgne?

You're not going to be able to find the exact matching stick unfortunately. I mean you may find the same model number, but that doesn't mean it will work

The issue with memory is its a gamble. You may buy a second stick and it just works. Or you may buy it and it doesn't (which is the more likely situation). For the $150 cost though your best route would be just find a 2x8gb set with the same specs as the ram that comes in the system and REPLACE the ram they send you. It probably will cost you less than $150 and it will definitely work properly.

As for the SSD 128gb is too small, 256 minimum, those prices are a bit high but to not have to deal with cloning and stuff it actually sounds worth it.