News Worldwide Graphics Card Supply Improves, But High Prices Linger

[Admin]

Even as supplies of high-performance, discrete GPUs seemingly improve around the world, prices are taking long to come down.

Worldwide Graphics Card Supply Improves, But High Prices Linger : Read more

 

[hotaru251]

not a shock.

3rd party sellers know they are hot and will keep price gouging em (scalpers and the stores themself)

This is why you can expect next gen to be costlier as currently there is no desire for lower prices (as anyone involved in it make more this way)

 

[bigdragon]

I took a quick look around at online retailers. Some of them have several GPUs in stock and listed as shipped and sold by the retailer. The prices are about the same as the scalpers though. Looks to me like the retailers and/or AIBs just decided to cut out the scalping middlemen and do it themselves. The GPU crisis continues.

 

[watzupken]

Prices are unlikely to drop drastically in my opinion. The reasons are because,
1. Crypto prices fluctuates - Just like what we saw in around June to July last year, crypto prices fell briefly and went right back up. Graphic card prices also dropped briefly and shot back even higher

2. Because manufacturers, distributors and retailers know that there is a pent up demand by gamers, they are in no hurry to lower prices. All the AIB partners made record profits despite the supposed "supply chain disruption" because they likely sold highly inflated GPUs to miners from their backdoors, and drop a few GPUs in retail, also at a marked up price.

 

[spongiemaster]

I took a quick look around at online retailers. Some of them have several GPUs in stock and listed as shipped and sold by the retailer. The prices are about the same as the scalpers though. Looks to me like the retailers and/or AIBs just decided to cut out the scalping middlemen and do it themselves. The GPU crisis continues.

GPU's sitting on a shelf don't make anyone money. Without more profitable mining, it looks like current prices are too high for the market. Retailers will need to come to their senses quickly and drop prices. I'm not talking fire sales, but the first retailers to hit price points down the pole will maximize their profits. First to 90% over MSRP will get the sales, then someone will have to hit 85% to get the next group and so forth.

 

[btmedic04]

sadly, i dont believe prices will drop and if they do, it wont be much. ive been saying this since november 2020 that amd and nvidia will be raising msrp after seeing what consumers were willing to pay scalpers. amd and nvidia want that piece of the pie and thats why we didnt get a launch price for the 3080 12gb or vaporware 3090 ti. Those were market tests to see how much the consumer was willing to spend

 

[Kj1985]

The hundreds of cards sitting on shelves are all 6500xt's. 😆

 

[Darkbreeze]

Worldwide Graphics Card Supply Improves, But High Prices Linger

Of course they linger. Because AMD and Nvidia figured out that they can RAPE board partners, and board partners will pay it, because board partners can RAPE the public. They learned this from the scalpers but upped the game. If these resellers can command these prices for them, we can too.

It's shameful and to be honest I'll ride my current card until the wheels fall off before I give any of these companies another cent that I don't absolutely have to.

 

[InvalidError]

sadly, i dont believe prices will drop and if they do, it wont be much.

Prices will drop by however much they need to for retailers to move inventory. The only reason prices are so high is because crypto miners bought everything they could. Now that miners are taking a break from cleaning out shelves, cards sitting on shelves are a liability: the retailer likely got their cards at a premium themselves and those cards need to go while they can still make a profit over whatever they got them for from their distributor. If they don't, they'll have to eat losses to clear inventory. Same goes for distributors who themselves may have bought inventory at inflated prices from manufacturers and manufacturers who bought their parts at inflated prices, rinse and repeat for every other rung of the supply chain ladder.

At the extreme end of sales slow-downs, you start having issues with AMD and Nvidia still having to eat the cost of their wafer supply agreement even if their sales drop to zero, so they cannot allow sales to drop that low either, same for AIBs whose contract likely include mandatory minimums too. If demand slows down too much, warehousing costs and inventory liabilities will pile up.

There is supply-side pressure to keep inventory moving smoothly. If you don't price your inventory to sell while inventory is starting to pike up everywhere, someone else will and then your chances of recovering the inflated prices you may have paid for your stock are gone which will only get worse as next-gen launches get closer and ETH PoS threatens to unleash a torrent of retired cards on the used market at substantially discounted prices.

 

[Endymio]

retailers are now starting to accumulate unsold inventory, which should mean we are entering a period where the supply/demand equation can kick in again....

The law of supply and demand never stopped working, Mr. Pires. Why do you think prices rose so sharply in the first place?

 

[Endymio]

Of course they linger. Because AMD and Nvidia figured out that they can RAPE board partners, and board partners will pay it, because board partners can RAPE the public.

Step off a high cliff, and you'll get raped by the law of gravity. Slam your Prius into a tractor-trailer and you'll get raped by Newton's laws of motion. Touch a hot stove, and you'll get raped by the laws of heat transfer. Ah, those pesky laws of nature.

 

[Old Molases]

I havent been able to buy myself a new GPU till date and its been 3 years I am stuck with 1050ti. I just the they normalize soon, so that I can treat myself with an upgrade.

 

[harryneil25]

Look like i have to wait one more year

 

[alceryes]

Of course they linger. Because AMD and Nvidia figured out that they can RAPE board partners, and board partners will pay it, because board partners can RAPE the public. They learned this from the scalpers but upped the game. If these resellers can command these prices for them, we can too.

It's shameful and to be honest I'll ride my current card until the wheels fall off before I give any of these companies another cent that I don't absolutely have to.

This, in a nutshell.

It's in AMD's and NVIDIA's hands. All prices outside of founder's edition and reference cards are just a multipliers of MSRP and GPU 'tray prices'. They made their choice when NVIDIA released the 3080 Ti with a 42% price markup for an only 12% performance increase. vs. the standard 3080.

 

[spongiemaster]

They made their choice when NVIDIA released the 3080 Ti with a 42% price markup for an only 12% performance increase. vs. the standard 3080.

And yet, the cards are still getting listed for 50%+ above that MSRP by retailers. Newegg has two 3080Ti's in stock as of this post. One for $1900 shipped the other for $2000 shipped. Blaming Nvidia for that pricing is just dumb. If Nvidia had set the MSRP for the 3080Ti at $900, instead of $1200, those two cards would still be selling for $1900 and $2000, because that's what the market said they were worth. AMD cards on the other hand, have been selling for twice MSRP from retailers for a while which would indicate that AMD raised the prices behind the scenes rather than releasing new models with a higher MSRP.

 

[alceryes]

And yet, the cards are still getting listed for 50%+ above that MSRP by retailers. Newegg has two 3080Ti's in stock as of this post. One for $1900 shipped the other for $2000 shipped. Blaming Nvidia for that pricing is just dumb.

I disagree. Both NVIDIA and AMD COULD produce more reference/FE cards and set the base price lower. They choose not to for the sole purpose of maximizing their profits.
Exhibit A: https://www.cnbc.com/2022/02/08/fac...idia-market-cap-now-eighth-biggest-in-us.html

If Nvidia had set the MSRP for the 3080Ti at $900, instead of $1200, those two cards would still be selling for $1900 and $2000, because that's what the market said they were worth.

Since this alternate reality didn't come to pass, this is purely speculation.

AMD cards on the other hand, have been selling for twice MSRP from retailers for a while which would indicate that AMD raised the prices behind the scenes rather than releasing new models with a higher MSRP.

It sounds like you're defending what I said...? I did mention reference/FE cards AND GPU tray prices.

 

[Endymio]

I disagree. Both NVIDIA and AMD COULD produce more reference/FE cards and set the base price lower.

How can they "produce more cards" when essentially every advanced-node fab in the world is already running at 100% capacity?

 

[spongiemaster]

I disagree. Both NVIDIA and AMD COULD produce more reference/FE cards and set the base price lower. They choose not to for the sole purpose of maximizing their profits.
Exhibit A: https://www.cnbc.com/2022/02/08/fac...idia-market-cap-now-eighth-biggest-in-us.html

They don't because it is terrible business to compete and massively undersell vs your partners. The 3080Ti exists because board partners asked for it. It's not a coincidence that there is no FE model. Board partners didn't want to have to price their cards so low because of NVidia's comically low FE prices based on where the market went after they were released.

Since this alternate reality didn't come to pass, this is purely speculation.

Incorrect. We look can look at 3080 prices to confirm I'm right. 3080's are typically selling for $1600 to over $2000 on ebay right now. MSRP is $700. 3080Ti's are selling for pretty much the same price on ebay. As you said, they have very similar performance and the market has thus decided they should cost about the same regardless that one has an MSRP that is 42% higher.

It sounds like you're defending what I said...? I did mention reference/FE cards AND GPU tray prices.

For AMD, you may be right. We'll likely never know, but for Nvidia we can tell you aren't.

 

[alceryes]

How can they "produce more cards" when essentially every advanced-node fab in the world is already running at 100% capacity?

They pay more for fab time.
Even before Covid times, these facilities were usually making something all the time. Whether it's lower profit electronics/vehicle chips or higher end CPUs, GPUs and such. Because of their cost to build, maintain, etc., fabrication plants need to be making something, all the time. They have production schcedules that go out 24+ months. If you want your chips made NOW you pay more - simple as that.

 

[alceryes]

Incorrect. We look can look at 3080 prices to confirm I'm right. 3080's are typically selling for $1600 to over $2000 on ebay right now. MSRP is $700. 3080Ti's are selling for pretty much the same price on ebay. As you said, they have very similar performance and the market has thus decided they should cost about the same regardless that one has an MSRP that is 42% higher.

You're missing the supply part of my argument. 😉 Maybe I should've been more clear. We would need much greater supply of reference, FE, and tray GPUs AND both MSRP and tray prices to not be a greedy grab for money by NVIDIA and AMD for the prices to be lower.

I've said it before, I think the RTX 3080 for $699 is the last of the reasonably priced top-end-performance GPUs we will ever see. Maybe if crypto crashes hard (like sub $10k) there will be a rush of used mining GPUs on the bay but that'll be it.

 

[spongiemaster]

You're missing the supply part of my argument. 😉 Maybe I should've been more clear. We would need much greater supply of reference, FE, and tray GPUs AND both MSRP and tray prices to not be a greedy grab for money by NVIDIA and AMD for the prices to be lower.

Supply has nothing to do with how these GPU's are priced in relation to each other. The market isn't going to pay more for a 3060 than a 3080 even if the 3080 is readily available and the 3060 is hard to find. If the prices get even remotely close, people would buy the 3080. The 3080 and 3080ti are selling in the same ballpark because they perform basically the same for mining and that's what the market is willing to pay for that level of performance. What the MSRP is set at for either card is irrelevant to the market.

 

[alceryes]

Supply has nothing to do with how these GPU's are priced in relation to each other. The market isn't going to pay more for a 3060 than a 3080 even if the 3080 is readily available and the 3060 is hard to find. If the prices get even remotely close, people would buy the 3080. The 3080 and 3080ti are selling in the same ballpark because they perform basically the same for mining and that's what the market is willing to pay for that level of performance. What the MSRP is set at for either card is irrelevant to the market.

'Supply and demand' is a cornerstone of basic economic principal, but ok, we'll just have to disagree.

 

[InvalidError]

Even before Covid times, these facilities were usually making something all the time.

Not all of the time. Before semiconductor shortages went out of control, the target was to keep production lines busy 80-90% of the time, the other 10-20% of the time used for preventive maintenance, tooling changes, spare capacity for rush and surge orders, etc. To run at close to 100%, they have to extend maintenance intervals, minimize tooling changes, give up on the ability to fulfill surge/rush orders and all other sources of down-time, which can have costly consequences further down the line.

 

[drivinfast247]

How can they "produce more cards" when essentially every advanced-node fab in the world is already running at 100% capacity?

So they say.

 

[VforV]

Crypto bounced back (BTC was $33k two weeks ago, it's $44k now) as expected, like it did so last summer too, after it crashed hard and people thought it's over. Those that celebrated too early again are now very sad, because of their naivety.

Between miners, individual scalpers, store scalpers, AMD and nvidia scalping themselves, substrate and other components shortages , shipping issues and increased shipping costs - this is the result.

The only way gamers can buy "cheap-ish" GPUs going forward is to get them at launch at MSRP in the first few minutes. That's it. Next day, probably gone, next week most likely gone (either the "cheap-ish" price or the availability of the GPU at that price). Of course those MSRPs need to be decent and now 2x bigger than now in the first place.

This is the reality of GPUs in 2022 and going forward. I would be amazed if prices get better this year... or next year, for that matter.