Think the surface pro sounds great, but does anyone think it would be a good option to have a 13 inch screen for doing work in the desktop environment? 10.6 seems small to work with office apps or anything not designed for the start screen (metro)....
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skaz
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Great write up.
I agree with you. I think peoples perception of what tablet should cost has obviously been influenced by current and past gen technology. There's nothing wrong with that, but it is something I hope consumers realize eventually. The niche market of tech heads such as all of us on toms, will understand this more quickly then non-techies, general consumer, whatever you want to call it.
The problem is that the general consumer, is well, the mass market, the main focus, the typical deciding factor on how products are made and sold. For example, theoretically, if a $900 tablet fails to impress the general consumer, chances are we're not going to see many more of said tablet in the future. Regardless if it's a good product or not. I'm not saying its right, but that does appear to be how the market flows.
RT simply annoyed me. When I first learned and grasped the concept of RT I kept telling myself, people won't like this. I basically took my confusion between RT and non-RT, before I learned about it, and then imagined the response from the general consumer. They portrayed the surface as a do it all tablet, and then released RT only. I just didn't see the benefit in that. Maybe to hit Christmas season because Intel wasn't ready for the Pro surface?
Either way, I understand the technology within the soon to be released surface pro, and I'm excited. I hope this CPU meets expectations in regards to handling windows 8 on the surface. If it does, I'm sold.
I agree with you. I think peoples perception of what tablet should cost has obviously been influenced by current and past gen technology. There's nothing wrong with that, but it is something I hope consumers realize eventually. The niche market of tech heads such as all of us on toms, will understand this more quickly then non-techies, general consumer, whatever you want to call it.
The problem is that the general consumer, is well, the mass market, the main focus, the typical deciding factor on how products are made and sold. For example, theoretically, if a $900 tablet fails to impress the general consumer, chances are we're not going to see many more of said tablet in the future. Regardless if it's a good product or not. I'm not saying its right, but that does appear to be how the market flows.
RT simply annoyed me. When I first learned and grasped the concept of RT I kept telling myself, people won't like this. I basically took my confusion between RT and non-RT, before I learned about it, and then imagined the response from the general consumer. They portrayed the surface as a do it all tablet, and then released RT only. I just didn't see the benefit in that. Maybe to hit Christmas season because Intel wasn't ready for the Pro surface?
Either way, I understand the technology within the soon to be released surface pro, and I'm excited. I hope this CPU meets expectations in regards to handling windows 8 on the surface. If it does, I'm sold.
How about they put in an i3, give back an hour or so of battery and cut the price $100? Would sound better to me anyway...
[citation][nom]edlivian[/nom]Disclaimer: im not an apple fanboy, I do not own any apple devices.But for $1030 (with keyboard) I rather get MBA.imo, I think $1000 is too much to spend for a type of device I like to upgrade every 2-3 years.I like to spend $600-700 for an ultrabook[/citation]
You are missing the point. The Surface is both a desktop and a tablet.
You are missing the point. The Surface is both a desktop and a tablet.
CaedenV
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[citation][nom]innocent bystander[/nom]If something goes wrong with it it's a $1K brick.Personally that's why I'll never understand the appeal behind tablets. I want my gear fixable. Even if it's just a laptop I'd like to know that I can replace the screen, HDD, memory, keyboard, etc.Tablets just seem... useless.IB[/citation]
Exactly! I love my nice big repairable desktop at home, and for on the go I use the cheapest laptop/netbook/tablet that I can find that will get the job done. I have to upgrade more often as the specs get outdated quickly, but it is still ~1.5-2 years per upgrade. Even if I upgrade (or break/loose) my cheap laptop every single year, I would only be out $300 per year, and that is way easier to swallow than $1000+ every 2-3 years.
In a few years when portable innovation slows down a bit (and they are built more durable) then I will consider getting a portable device that is more expensive. But for now I will just plan on beating it to hell in a year, and replacing it, and keep important stuff on the desktop that has a nice simple quiet life without all of the fuss of being thrown around, stepped on, sat on, crushed/scratched/etc that my portable devices have to deal with.
Exactly! I love my nice big repairable desktop at home, and for on the go I use the cheapest laptop/netbook/tablet that I can find that will get the job done. I have to upgrade more often as the specs get outdated quickly, but it is still ~1.5-2 years per upgrade. Even if I upgrade (or break/loose) my cheap laptop every single year, I would only be out $300 per year, and that is way easier to swallow than $1000+ every 2-3 years.
In a few years when portable innovation slows down a bit (and they are built more durable) then I will consider getting a portable device that is more expensive. But for now I will just plan on beating it to hell in a year, and replacing it, and keep important stuff on the desktop that has a nice simple quiet life without all of the fuss of being thrown around, stepped on, sat on, crushed/scratched/etc that my portable devices have to deal with.
CaedenV
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[citation][nom]gaiaswill[/nom]How about they put in an i3, give back an hour or so of battery and cut the price $100? Would sound better to me anyway...[/citation]
If you are happy with an i3 then go with the SurfaceRT. Sure it does not run x86 apps, but it would get you the battery and GPU that you would want.
If you are happy with an i3 then go with the SurfaceRT. Sure it does not run x86 apps, but it would get you the battery and GPU that you would want.
thecolorblue
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thecolorblue
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[citation][nom]bystander[/nom]So what you are saying is that having a table form factor and digitizer is worth $0 and should be given free?Whether you want to buy it is one thing, but it definitely has features to make it worth more than your laptop.[/citation]
no, he said overpriced.
...which it is
no, he said overpriced.
...which it is
This is almost what I've been waiting for. If it has 512 levels of pressure sensitivity then it is An artists/designers perfect computing tool to compliment a desktop PC. Try buying a Wacom device that draws on the screen... its $800 starting and that is just for the screen/pen, you still need to attach it to a computer. I know convertibles have been around for awhile now, but I feel this is a better form factor overall.
Waiting till this Surface Pro gets a Haswell refresh!
Waiting till this Surface Pro gets a Haswell refresh!
NuclearShadow
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With how fast new generations of tablets get released it seems a waste to pay that much for one.
obsama1
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It's a good tablet, and it does combine the Ultrabook and tablet but you mustn't forget that it's only 64GB, typing on the keyboard while it's propped up is a bit akward, and it gets 4hr. of battery life. A touchscreen Ultrabook would come in at only $100 more than this with double the storage, double the battery life, and it would be easier to type on on your lap.
Well the fact they aren't selling well, to the point MS has cut their order to the factory in half seems to indicate the public feels the price is too high. So that tells me this article is wrong, the customer is always right. I think Windows 8 is ugly and that is also adds to the problem of the tablet.
dare2blink
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[citation][nom]abeM[/nom]Think the surface pro sounds great, but does anyone think it would be a good option to have a 13 inch screen for doing work in the desktop environment? 10.6 seems small to work with office apps or anything not designed for the start screen (metro)....[/citation]
You can easily plug it in to a bigger monitor/tv when the need arises. For me the 10 inch form factor is perfect for mobility and to use outsider the house, but when I get home I will probably plug it in to my Tv to work on photoshop
You can easily plug it in to a bigger monitor/tv when the need arises. For me the 10 inch form factor is perfect for mobility and to use outsider the house, but when I get home I will probably plug it in to my Tv to work on photoshop
dare2blink
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[citation][nom]obsama1[/nom]It's a good tablet, and it does combine the Ultrabook and tablet but you mustn't forget that it's only 64GB, typing on the keyboard while it's propped up is a bit akward, and it gets 4hr. of battery life. A touchscreen Ultrabook would come in at only $100 more than this with double the storage, double the battery life, and it would be easier to type on on your lap.[/citation]
You can get 128 Gb version for 100 more than the 64 Gb version and you can even further expand it with na sd card. I also seriously doubth that a normal ultrabook will have double the batery life since the surfasse pro has the same batery life as a macbook air. It is also easy enough to type on you lap with a type cover, although admitidly not as easy as a normal ultrabook, but then again you can´t use na ultrabook as a tablet at all,
You can get 128 Gb version for 100 more than the 64 Gb version and you can even further expand it with na sd card. I also seriously doubth that a normal ultrabook will have double the batery life since the surfasse pro has the same batery life as a macbook air. It is also easy enough to type on you lap with a type cover, although admitidly not as easy as a normal ultrabook, but then again you can´t use na ultrabook as a tablet at all,
dare2blink
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[citation][nom]littleleo[/nom]Well the fact they aren't selling well, to the point MS has cut their order to the factory in half seems to indicate the public feels the price is too high. So that tells me this article is wrong, the customer is always right. I think Windows 8 is ugly and that is also adds to the problem of the tablet.[/citation]
They are selling very well, the report that you are refering to has been revealed to be nonsense and based on a rumor that turned out to be false
They are selling very well, the report that you are refering to has been revealed to be nonsense and based on a rumor that turned out to be false
catchercradle
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I can see that there are people who would use this and gain from it. I don't see anything that will take me away from open source however. I am also not prepared to spend that much on something that as others have noted could turn into an expensive if pretty brick.
ojas
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Well, in general i do agree that the Surface Pro isn't overpriced, and is mostly pretty competitive with most ultabooks in its segment. But where i disagree with the ultrabook comparison is the keyboard and screen size. A notebook is popular device for a reason.
So is the pro overpriced? Well, slightly. I think the 128GB one should have been for $900. And, charging $100 over the price for a 64GB SSD is ridiculous, it should have been less than 50. Heck, you can get a decent 120GB SSD for ~$110 now, that too at retail. Anyway, if i ever get one i'll throw in a 32/64GB SD card along with the 64GB model, seems more economical, and fine for storing music/movies that can do with slower transfer rates.
Second thing that's overpriced is the $130 half-assed keyboard they call a type cover. $130????? You get full sized mechanical keyboards for the same price! It should have been more like $30, or even free with the Pro.
And i must nitpick from the article, because? Well, because.
As far as the Surface Pro is concerned...it has an SSD, and Win 8 hibernates by default.
EDIT: I had written more, but it didn't post (awww). Basically his last para comprises three BS points and one valid point (kinect), if anyone wants an elaboration i'll be happy to provide one.
So is the pro overpriced? Well, slightly. I think the 128GB one should have been for $900. And, charging $100 over the price for a 64GB SSD is ridiculous, it should have been less than 50. Heck, you can get a decent 120GB SSD for ~$110 now, that too at retail. Anyway, if i ever get one i'll throw in a 32/64GB SD card along with the 64GB model, seems more economical, and fine for storing music/movies that can do with slower transfer rates.
Second thing that's overpriced is the $130 half-assed keyboard they call a type cover. $130????? You get full sized mechanical keyboards for the same price! It should have been more like $30, or even free with the Pro.
And i must nitpick from the article, because? Well, because.
Which is nothing to be proud off. Tablets are barely worth that much. High end tablets should start at a base price of $400. I believe Apple and its consumers are to blame for making Paul Henningsen's budget gaming PC look cheap, even though it offers at least 10 to 20x more performance. No i'm not being a regular apple hater. Before the iphone came out for $600+ in my country, the highest end phones would cost $500. Now they all try to compete. So yeah, suffer from high prices now, it's your own doing.
Not really. It's not, in fact. It's a tablet PC with an attachable keyboard. An ultrabook is a thin notebook. The surface doesn't have a proper keyboard, which is the biggest difference.
I know you're an apple fanboy, but please. My computer boots as fast as my ipod does, and i'm NOT joking. For the rest, WHAT LOADING TIMES? (HINT: SSD).
As far as the Surface Pro is concerned...it has an SSD, and Win 8 hibernates by default.
EDIT: I had written more, but it didn't post (awww). Basically his last para comprises three BS points and one valid point (kinect), if anyone wants an elaboration i'll be happy to provide one.
Any future computers for me are going to have to be i7 or better for the processor. I have 2 i7s right now, and it is an enjoyable experience to have that level of power. You can easily do multiple tasks without breaking a sweat. Every day my computer experience is as high as I could ever want. If they build it, I would opt for a 10 or 12 core processor with 16 gig of ram. I can't afford a BMW, but could probably afford that and would.
cercuitspark
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[citation][nom]ddpruitt[/nom]Or you can buy an actual tablet PC that's bigger, more powerful, runs x86 apps, and is the same price.[/citation]
Or, you can read about the fucking product...
The Surface Pro can run x86 programs... And it's the cheapest of the good x86 tablets...
Or, you can read about the fucking product...
The Surface Pro can run x86 programs... And it's the cheapest of the good x86 tablets...
sfbayshane
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[citation][nom]bigdragon[/nom]What I really want to know is why I should purchase the Surface Pro rather than the Samsung ATIV 700T. It appears to me that the ATIV has more levels of pressure sensitivity (1024 vs 256), a place to stow the stylus, a larger screen, better battery life, and hinges like a traditional laptop when the keyboard is attached as opposed to a kickstand. What makes the Surface Pro better? All I see is that it's a little cheaper.[/citation]
Where did you read 256 levels of pressure? I Imagine its the same exact tech as the Samsung. (http://www.slideshare.net/SOFTPROGroup/microsoft-surface-pro-electronic-signature-softpro-signdoc-mobile). The pen doesn't have a silo which I'm not that happy about but if the magnet dock for it is strong enough then it should be fine. (Also the surface pen includes an eraser stock, samsung does not) At first I favored the keyboard dock of the ativ but after its release the reviews of the keyboard are terrible, what's the point if it doesn't work? not to mention the surface will surely get a similar hard keyboard dock in time. I'm pretty sure they even opened licensing for third party companies to use the docking port. The build quality of the surface is infinitely better and more planned out than the ativ.
As far as battery life, so far it's only speculation that the battery life will be half of the surface rt (and not much less then the ativ maybe the same or better at comparable brightness).. but I'm hoping the release of the surface pro is delayed due to them planning to use the newer 10w ivy bridge chips. Which would substantially increase battery life over the ativ maybe by 2 full hours or more. At the price, for what this tablet offers its a great deal. I and many other online bloggers, were actually expecting it to cost way more, in the 1200 range upon release. I'm not knocking the ativ I was actually confident I was going to buy it, but I'm glad I waited because it seems to be having a messy launch and many problems. For the price I think I would rather buy the surface but we will see how it does when it's released, it's between that and the helix. The only real downside which isn't substantial is the screen size is one inch smaller. However this will be taken care of when they release the 14 inch version of the surface with haswell later in 2013. That is my dream machine.
Where did you read 256 levels of pressure? I Imagine its the same exact tech as the Samsung. (http://www.slideshare.net/SOFTPROGroup/microsoft-surface-pro-electronic-signature-softpro-signdoc-mobile). The pen doesn't have a silo which I'm not that happy about but if the magnet dock for it is strong enough then it should be fine. (Also the surface pen includes an eraser stock, samsung does not) At first I favored the keyboard dock of the ativ but after its release the reviews of the keyboard are terrible, what's the point if it doesn't work? not to mention the surface will surely get a similar hard keyboard dock in time. I'm pretty sure they even opened licensing for third party companies to use the docking port. The build quality of the surface is infinitely better and more planned out than the ativ.
As far as battery life, so far it's only speculation that the battery life will be half of the surface rt (and not much less then the ativ maybe the same or better at comparable brightness).. but I'm hoping the release of the surface pro is delayed due to them planning to use the newer 10w ivy bridge chips. Which would substantially increase battery life over the ativ maybe by 2 full hours or more. At the price, for what this tablet offers its a great deal. I and many other online bloggers, were actually expecting it to cost way more, in the 1200 range upon release. I'm not knocking the ativ I was actually confident I was going to buy it, but I'm glad I waited because it seems to be having a messy launch and many problems. For the price I think I would rather buy the surface but we will see how it does when it's released, it's between that and the helix. The only real downside which isn't substantial is the screen size is one inch smaller. However this will be taken care of when they release the 14 inch version of the surface with haswell later in 2013. That is my dream machine.
sfbayshane
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[citation][nom]bigdragon[/nom]What I really want to know is why I should purchase the Surface Pro rather than the Samsung ATIV 700T. It appears to me that the ATIV has more levels of pressure sensitivity (1024 vs 256), a place to stow the stylus, a larger screen, better battery life, and hinges like a traditional laptop when the keyboard is attached as opposed to a kickstand. What makes the Surface Pro better? All I see is that it's a little cheaper.[/citation]
Where did you read 256 levels of pressure? I Imagine its the same exact tech as the Samsung. (http://www.slideshare.net/SOFTPROGroup/microsoft-surface-pro-electronic-signature-softpro-signdoc-mobile). The pen doesn't have a silo which I'm not that happy about but if the magnet dock for it is strong enough then it should be fine. (Also the surface pen includes an eraser stock, samsung does not) At first I favored the keyboard dock of the ativ but after its release the reviews of the keyboard are terrible, what's the point if it doesn't work? not to mention the surface will surely get a similar hard keyboard dock in time. I'm pretty sure they even opened licensing for third party companies to use the docking port. The build quality of the surface is infinitely better and more planned out than the ativ.
As far as battery life, so far it's only speculation that the battery life will be half of the surface rt (and not much less then the ativ maybe the same or better at comparable brightness).. but I'm hoping the release of the surface pro is delayed due to them planning to use the newer 10w ivy bridge chips. Which would substantially increase battery life over the ativ maybe by 2 full hours or more. At the price, for what this tablet offers its a great deal. I and many other online bloggers, were actually expecting it to cost way more, in the 1200 range upon release. I'm not knocking the ativ I was actually confident I was going to buy it, but I'm glad I waited because it seems to be having a messy launch and many problems. For the price I think I would rather buy the surface but we will see how it does when it's released, it's between that and the helix. The only real downside which isn't substantial is the screen size is one inch smaller. However this will be taken care of when they release the 14 inch version of the surface with haswell later in 2013. That is my dream machine.
Where did you read 256 levels of pressure? I Imagine its the same exact tech as the Samsung. (http://www.slideshare.net/SOFTPROGroup/microsoft-surface-pro-electronic-signature-softpro-signdoc-mobile). The pen doesn't have a silo which I'm not that happy about but if the magnet dock for it is strong enough then it should be fine. (Also the surface pen includes an eraser stock, samsung does not) At first I favored the keyboard dock of the ativ but after its release the reviews of the keyboard are terrible, what's the point if it doesn't work? not to mention the surface will surely get a similar hard keyboard dock in time. I'm pretty sure they even opened licensing for third party companies to use the docking port. The build quality of the surface is infinitely better and more planned out than the ativ.
As far as battery life, so far it's only speculation that the battery life will be half of the surface rt (and not much less then the ativ maybe the same or better at comparable brightness).. but I'm hoping the release of the surface pro is delayed due to them planning to use the newer 10w ivy bridge chips. Which would substantially increase battery life over the ativ maybe by 2 full hours or more. At the price, for what this tablet offers its a great deal. I and many other online bloggers, were actually expecting it to cost way more, in the 1200 range upon release. I'm not knocking the ativ I was actually confident I was going to buy it, but I'm glad I waited because it seems to be having a messy launch and many problems. For the price I think I would rather buy the surface but we will see how it does when it's released, it's between that and the helix. The only real downside which isn't substantial is the screen size is one inch smaller. However this will be taken care of when they release the 14 inch version of the surface with haswell later in 2013. That is my dream machine.
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