3dMark scores for Ti4200

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cryo

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May 3, 2001
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A friend just bought a Gainward Ti4200 (after previously owning a lousy Radeon 9200 SE). He did the upgrade following my advice (he wasn't willing to spend some extra bucks, so the best choice was a Ti4200)

The game performance is ok, but I'm a bit worried about the 3dMark scores (yeah, I know, they're not very relevant, but anyway..)
The score in 3dMark 2001 SE is around 7100 (lower than my ex 9000 Pro), and in 3dMark 2003 b.340 is about 1200-1300 (don't remember exactly)
Before the tests, he reinstalled the OS, so the Catalyst "legacies" are not in question. I am not 100% sure that he installed also the AGP drivers (told him to do so, but not sure if he did).

I've looked on the net for similar results, but the results I found were varying greatly. I believe that the 3dMark 2001 score should be something like 9000.
The system is a 2.0 GHz Celeron, with 512 DDR. The system is for sure CPU bound, but still, i think the score is too low even in this case.
If someone has a quite similar system, or it knows how it should perform, I would be gratefull for some thoughts...

P.S. I should try the video card in another system, with better CPU, but he is among the very few guys in my gang having NVidia cards... the rest of us have Radeons... and I don't exactly feel like reinstalling windows just to clear the mess NV drivers leave behind.

"I cannot give you a brain, but I can give you a diploma"
- The Wizard of Oz, talking to the Scarecrow<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by cryo on 04/29/04 05:28 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
 
Did you reinstaled the os with a formatt? If not you may now have a mix of drivers in your pc!

P4-2800->FSB800, Asus P4P800, 512DDR-400, Radeon 9800 Pro - 128Mb
 
My first impression was, whoa something is wrong. But when I see the cpu is a Celeron 2.0GHz, it makes me think it's not performing too much off what's expected.

For 3dmark2001se, the newest NV drivers knock about 1000 3dmarks off of the scores from say the 4403 drivers. If the drivers are set at defaults, he has the newest drivers, and the bios isn't really tweaked; then I can see those kind of scores. With 4403's I would expect around 8000+ on that system. But in 3dmark01, the cpu power makes a huge difference. And the Celeron 2.0GHz is far below an Athlon XP1600+.

IMO, the 4403's are the best drivers for a Ti4200. The perform the best in most older games. I use 4523's if need be on newer games, but would only go newer if needed.


Of course, it's a Ti4200, so why not enable coolbits and make her run a little over spec. And since he has a DDR celeron, check what P4 that mobo will support. That will make a huge difference over that Celeron if he can use a "B" (533 bus) P4.



ABIT IS7, P4 2.6C, 512MB Corsair TwinX PC3200LL, Radeon 9800 Pro, Santa Cruz, TruePower 430watt
 
Also, is it a 64MB, 128MB, or an 8X 128MB? The 4X 128MB will score lower than the 64MB or 8X because of slower memory clocks.


ABIT IS7, P4 2.6C, 512MB Corsair TwinX PC3200LL, Radeon 9800 Pro, Santa Cruz, TruePower 430watt
 
good points there Pauldh.
I will try to see the results with the 4403 drivers (he was using some reference drivers on a CD, until I brought him the latest forceware drivers. The bios isn't really tweaked, as you said, because it's not my machine, and I didn't have the time to take care of it.

You're 100% right about the processor power and 3dMark 2001. I am only getting 14500-14900 points with my Radeon 9800 Pro and an Athlon XP 1700+ o/c-ed at 1750 (way below the potential of my card). I am getting however the normal ~5500 points in 3dMark 2003 at stock speeds (much less processor dependant benchmark).

I won't get too deep in overclocking the Ti4200 or using deep tweaking, because, as I said, it's not my machine, I was just a little disapointed by the scores. After reading your opinions and a little more searching on the net, I came to the conclusion that, while it's not very good, it can be considered quite normal, given the situation (poor processor, not using the best drivers etc). I have seen a few scores like this on FutureMark ORB. Also, the 1200-1300 on 3dMark2003 looks quite normal, considering that a Ti4600 pulls around 1600-1700 (and on a better setup).

P.S. the OS reinstall was a "clean" one, not overwrite, so I can guarantee that there were no driver remains from ATi.
And the video card is a 64 MB one (so no AGP 8x)

"I cannot give you a brain, but I can give you a diploma"
- The Wizard of Oz, talking to the Scarecrow
 
3dMark2001 is very CPU dependant. The Celeron is probably holding him back a couple thousand points in 3dMark 2001SE.

As far as 3dMark2003, that score is about right. The Ti4200 isn't a directX 9 card and won't do well in DirectX 9 games.

________________
<b>Radeon <font color=red>9500 PRO</b></font color=red> <i>(hardmodded 9500, o/c 340/310)</i>
<b>AthlonXP <font color=red>~2750+</b></font color=red> <i>(2400+ @2.2Ghz)</i>
<b>3dMark03: <font color=red>4,055</b>
 
what kind of mobo do you have???

i had a POS mobo for a while and it dropped my r9600pro marks a significant number(like 1500 points)

now i have a 8ipe1000pro ver.2 (donthave the 9600p anymore) but when i did, the marks had a excellent increase.

<A HREF="http://www.cameronwilliamson.com" target="_new">-={Apostalic Alcoholic.}=-</A>
 
IMO, the 4403's are the best drivers for a Ti4200. The perform the best in most older games. I use 4523's if need be on newer games, but would only go newer if needed.
Click to expand...


you can tell when people have done thier own testing =)


thats exactly the same as me.. i use 45.23 now because i play alot of UT2004 and i find the opengl performance to be a bit better

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<A HREF="http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/you.html" target="_new">please dont click here! </A>
<A HREF="http://www.subhi.com/keyboard.jpg" target="_new">This is you, interweb junky</A>
 
With my Barton running at 200x11.5=2300MHz, I get slightly above 12,000 with my Ti4200... the card is overclocked to 546/290

With a PCI ATI 9100 on a Celeron 2.0 GHz on my sister's computer, I got ~6,000...

There are lots of other factors in my two numbers, but the celeron cpu is a huge factor...


<font color=red><b>NF7-S/Mobile Barton 2600+
210x12.5 1.808v SLK900A
1GB Corsair XMS PC3200
Sapphire 9500np@9700np</font color=red><font color=black>
NF7-S/Barton 2500+
200x11.5 1.76v
512MB XMS PC2700
XFX Ti4200
 
With aggressive memory settings I get around 10,000 (everything at stock speed)

Athlon XP1800+
GeForce4 Ti4200 64MB
Abit KR7A (VIA KT 266A at 133MHZ DDR) mobo


He that but looketh on a plate of ham and eggs to lust after it, hath already committed breakfast with it in his heart. -C.S. Lewis
 
<A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k1=7677017" target="_new"> 3DMark2001se</A>

Overclocked Mobile XP2500+ @ 2.6GHz GF4Ti4200 320/640




ABIT IS7, P4 2.6C, 512MB Corsair TwinX PC3200LL, Radeon 9800 Pro, Santa Cruz, TruePower 430watt
 
I hate to say this, but that might not have been the best advice, although you had no way of knowing in advance. I have RMA'ed several of these Ti4200 cards over the past year, beginning with one that I pulled out of my own system. The cards appear to run fine for about a year, and then begin to overheat (no matter how well, or how often that you clean them), causing massive display corruption. It's as if they have been overclocked until damaged.

While I can't tell you the exact particulars of why the cards are failing ... that these cards are beginning to fail, and regularly ... of that I am most certain. I suspect that Gainward is beginning to get tired of me contacting them whenever a previous customer calls me and complains of the monitor display becoming speckled with red dots and stripes; icons bitmaps degrading and becoming unclickable, and lockups and/or extremely slow frame rates in games.

I suspect that the capacitors on the cards are not of the best quality, and this is affecting the card's memory when it overheats.

Fortunately, Gainward has given me no grief whenever I send back a card, but since I installed quite a few of these in mid-range systems late in 2001 and the first few months of 2002, I am not at all happy to get feedback from my customers about a problem like this, and I expect to hear from several more users before I'm done replacing the cards.

Perhaps your friend will have no problems, but I felt I should make you aware of what may happen in the future, simply FYI.

Toey

<A HREF="http://forums.btvillarin.com/index.php?act=ST&f=41&t=328&s=91c282f2e5207e99b7a652ee13b3512a" target="_new"><font color=green>My System Rigs</font color=green></A>
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Thanks Toey, it's the first time I hear about this...
Are you referring precisely to Gainward, or to Ti4200's in general?
As far as I know, Gainward was a pretty serious nVidia manufacturer (a little below MSI or Leadtek)

Anyway, for that money he couldn't get anything better here.. Luckily, he has a 2 years warranty for the card, in case something happens.

"I cannot give you a brain, but I can give you a diploma"
- The Wizard of Oz, talking to the Scarecrow
 
I'm talking about the Gainward cards, only.

Because of this, if I install an nVidia graphics card in a system, these days ... I stick with LeadTek.

2 year warranty, huh? I haven't bought from Gainward since the cards started failing, but the warranty used to be three years. So much for quality control.

I hope your friend doesn't run into any problems, but if he does ... at least he'll have some idea of what is happening in advance, and won't be struggling to come up with an answer.

Toey

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why do you sign your posts, your name is up on the top left anyways

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<A HREF="http://www.subhi.com/keyboard.jpg" target="_new">This is you, interweb junky</A>
 
Habit.

Toey

<A HREF="http://forums.btvillarin.com/index.php?act=ST&f=41&t=328&s=91c282f2e5207e99b7a652ee13b3512a" target="_new"><font color=green>My System Rigs</font color=green></A>
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<A HREF="http://forums.btvillarin.com/" target="_new"><b><font color=purple>BTVILLARIN.com</font color=purple></b></A> - <i><font color=orange>Your Computer Questions Answered</font color=orange></i>
 
Hey, no need to make me feel bad about my 12,000 points in 3DMark01SE... It took me a long time to get that high... your Ti4200 must just rock... obviously you have much better ram than I...

<font color=red><b>NF7-S/Mobile Barton 2600+
210x12.5 1.808v SLK900A
1GB Corsair XMS PC3200
Sapphire 9500np@9700np</font color=red><font color=black>
NF7-S/Barton 2500+
200x11.5 1.76v
512MB XMS PC2700
XFX Ti4200
 
Well, it blows out my other Ti4200's also. It's the only one that breaks 300/600 without issues. I had run it at 300/600 without testing the max. When i discovered the memory does 640, I was quite shocked. It was an Asus that came clocked a bit higher by default. And it was a refurb that cost me under $90 at least 6 months ago. Gotta love that.

It still blows for 3dmak03 of course. :frown:


ABIT IS7, P4 2.6C, 512MB Corsair TwinX PC3200LL, Radeon 9800 Pro, Santa Cruz, TruePower 430watt
 
I got FarCry over the weekend and I am very pleased at the Ti4200's performance in the game... it looks awesome, too, but just not as awesome as my modded ATI 9500...

The Ti4200 cards live on...

<font color=red><b>NF7-S/Mobile Barton 2600+
210x12.5 1.808v SLK900A
1GB Corsair XMS PC3200
Sapphire 9500np@9700np</font color=red><font color=black>
NF7-S/Barton 2500+
200x11.5 1.76v
512MB XMS PC2700
XFX Ti4200
 
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