Question 5800X3D and RTX 3090 microstuttering in every game

[ttencza]

Hey all!
This is a long one so get ready! (TLDR at bottom)

I’ve finally jumped back into having a desktop and my experience has sadly been underwhelming to say the least. I purchased a prebuilt pc off Facebook marketplace from a guy that builds/sells rigs back in October. The specs were (Ryzen 3700x, HP Rtx 3080, 16gb 3200 ram, AsRock x470 master SLI/ac, 750w psu, 500gb ssd, 2TB HDD) I planned on using this for some flatscreen and Vr gaming, along with MSFS in vr.

The rig ran pretty well, but then started to stutter sometimes which is especially annoying in vr. I figured it was due to lack of ram since I was easily hitting 80-90% ram usage with my Quest 2 headset in MSFS.

In January, I installed another kit of 16gb ram (same model) and it seemed to help a little, but the micro stutter was still there. I messed with bios settings because I figured my 3700x was bottlenecking my 3080. The bios tweaks smoothed the gameplay out a little but wasn’t perfect. I figured my windows might be the culprit so I reinstalled windows which did nothing.

Next, I went ahead and purchased a Ryzen 5800X3D and a Arctic Liquid Freezer 240mm AIO thinking that would fix everything. After installing, I had the same micro stutter and I was stumped. I started thinking that adding another kit of ram with different serial number was causing an instability (windows memory diagnostic showed some errors). I sold both kits on Facebook marketplace and bought a 2x16 kit of the same model. That didn’t fix the issue either and I noticed neither of those kits were on my motherboards QVL.

I am aware that QVLs are not the end all be all for memory compatibility, however the asrock board didn’t list a single 2x16 kit or one at 3200mhz. This led me to throwing even more money and parts at this already expensive machine! I purchased a new Gigabyte x570s Aorus Elite ax motherboard hoping it would have better ram support. With that upgrade, I also got a Samsung 980 pro 1tb m.2 ssd since I had to reinstall windows again. These parts didn’t solve the issue either, so I started trying to upgrade other ones.

Next, I sold my 3080 and got an EVGA 3090 XC3 for only $100 more than what I I got for the 3080. The 3090 noticeably increased my fps while in Vr MSFS and Dirt rally 2.0 but still had the occasional stutter. I used DDU and reinstalled latest Nvidia drivers and even tried older versions that are known to be good.

My next suspect was the PSU being either too underpowered or bad since my lights in the room would flicker under load (more on this later). I bought a new Corsair RM850X psu and wired everything up to only get disappointed again.

At this point, I’m desperately trying to figure out what’s causing the stuttering so I’ve been thoroughly testing different bios, windows, and nvidia settings with no luck at all. I then find that even this Tforce 2x16gb kit of ram is not specifically on the Gigabyte motherboard QVL so I try to find one with good reviews that’s on there.

I returned my Tforce ram to Amazon and purchased a kit of G.Skill Trident Z Neo 2x16gb 3600mhz cl16. These noticeably increased my fps in every game however I was still getting microstutters! This ram isn’t on the QVL either but G.Skill has my motherboard on their compatibility list (which I figured was enough).

Next, I’ve been noticing that my lights flicker in my room when my computer is under load. The lights flicker in sync with the stutter which is odd. I pulled up MSI afterburner and was monitoring my hardware and noticed that my GPU was dropping power %, utilization, and wattage when these stutters were happening (I will attach a video of this happening in MSFS flat screen).

This led me to think my apartments power is dirty and causing some issues. I tried my system on a different circuit with no luck. Naturally, I went and bought a 1500w pure sine wave cyber power UPS. The UPS was nice because it showed my outlets input/output voltage and the total watts my system was pulling (about 550W under load with monitor plugged in too). The voltage of my outlets were ranging from 118v down to 114/115v under load which should fall into the +/- 6v that is standard range. The system still stuttered and the lights in the room still flickered.
Next, I put the UPS into battery test mode where it runs off it’s internal battery. This made the lights in the room stop flickering but the stutter was still happening. I returned the UPS and tried another new Corsair RM850x just in case I somehow got a faulty one. It didn’t fix the issue.

At this point, I started looking back at other parts and trying to troubleshoot them. I noticed a coil whine coming from my GPU that would cut in/out with the stuttering. The EVGA card is still within its warranty but I wanted to make sure before I waste time sending it in for an RMA.

I also sent logs to AMD customer support where they told me they saw Kernel 141 errors “that could be related to GPU hardware or drivers” so I had a buddy bring his Rtx 3070ti and we tried it in my rig (after using DDU). The stutters were slightly less noticeable but still there and the coil whine was still there. This led me to start thinking that the flickering lights and utilization dropping is due to the cpu or something throttling.

I built the system outside of my case to troubleshoot. I tried installing ram in different slots, only one stick, gpu in different slots, reseating CPU. No matter what igave me the same results.

As a final push to rule out everything, I bought ANOTHER 5800X3D and a MSI MPG x570s Edge max wifi mobo. I built these outside of my case and it ran slightly smoother but still had these micro stutters.

I decided to put the system back in the case and keep the MSI mobo because it actually charges my quest 2 where the gigabyte didn’t. I’m returning the Gigabyte mobo, and the second 5800X3D (thanks Amazon).

At this point, I am out of ideas on what’s causing this stutter. Everyone has been hyping up the 5800X3D but it’s just not running smooth AT All. Are my expectations too high? It has this stutter in every game no matter what my settings are. Is my new ram causing an issue not being on the mobo QVL and only the G.Skill one? Even Rocket league was stuttering despite getting 680fps uncapped.

I’m tempted to go back to team blue because I’ve never really been let down using my old i7 4770k. The only thing is that people are saying the 5800X3D is better than intel for MSFS and simulators (which I primarily use). I really want to keep the X3D though if I can!

Thanks for reading this GIANT post. I left out some troubleshooting things I did to keep it from being 10 pages. I will list all the troubleshooting steps and system specs below.

The current build:

• Ryzen 5800X3D (replaced 3700x)
• Arctic liquid freezer 240mm aio (replaced amd wrai
• Evga rtx3090 xc3 (replaced old HP3080)
• G.Skill Trident Z Neo 32gb (2x16) 3600mhz cl16 ram (replaced tforce 16gb (2x8) 3200mhz,)
• Msi mpg x570s edge max wifi motherboard (replaced AsRock X470 master Sli/ac, and Gigabyte Aorus x570s elite ax)
• Corsair RM850x 850w 80+ gold psu (replaced evga 750w)
• Samsung 980 pro 1tb m.2 ssd (top pcie slot)
• LG Ultra Gear 1440p 144hz 27” gaming monitor (connected to DisplayPort)

The issue:

• Micro stuttering in numerous games (vr and flatscreen
• Coil whine on GPU cuts in/out with stutter
• Lights in room flicker with stutter
• Gpu power %, utilization and wattage drop with stutter

Games affected:

• Rocket League (capped frames 143fps)
• Battlefield 1
• Battlefield 2042
• Contractors vr
• Onward vr
• Dirt Rally 2.0 vr
• Microsoft flight simulator vr/flatscreen
• Oculus home/menus vr (moving hands around stutters)

Software troubleshooting steps (easiest to hardest) :

• lowering game settings
• Setting nvidia control panel settings (high performance power, high performance texture, shader cache 100gb, vr pre rendered frames…etc)
• Updating drivers (chipset, graphics from amd and nvidia websites)
• Reinstalling gpu drivers DDU
• Installing older version Nvidia drivers
• Stopping unnecessary background services in windows
• Game mode off
• HAGS: off
• HPET: off
• Updating bios
• Trying previous versions of bios
• Reinstalled windows about 15 times using USB media creation tool (formatted all drives and made fresh installation with chipset drivers/ graphics drivers)
• Tried different methods of installing drivers after fresh windows installation. (Mainly followed Jayz2c “what to do after building pc” video” )
• XMP: on
• XMP: off
• Manually setting ram speed/ FCLK speed
• SMT: off
• SVM: off
• CPPC: enabled
• CPPC preferred cores: disabled
• Forcing pcie to gen 4
• Resizable bar: on
• Above 4g decoding: on
• Amd Ftpm: off
• Trusted platform module: off
• Amd cool n quiet (Msi PSS): off
• Flashed Vbios using nvflash
• Flashed higher watt power limit Vbios to gpu (went back to stock to avoid damaging card/ voiding warranty)
• undervolted GPU with Msi afterburner

Hardware troubleshooting (chronological order):

• Added 16gb of same model ram to existing 16gb tforce 3200mhz ram
• Added 16gb of same model ram to existing 16gb tforce 3200mhz ram
• Tried tforce 32gb kit (2x16) 3200mhz ram
• New cpu/cooler (5800X3D 240mm Aio)
• New gpu (Rtx 3090)
• New PSU (850w)
• New mobo (gigabyte x570s aorus elite ax)
• New ram (G.Skill trident z neo 32gb 3600mhz)
• Tried pc in different rooms (different circuit)
• Tried a 1500w UPS
• Doublechecked PSU (bought/returned another one)
• Tested friends Rtx 3070ti
• Hooked all power connections directly to psu (I normally have cable extensions)
• Built system outside of case
• Reseated and repasted CPU
• Tried ANOTHER mobo (Msi mpg x570s edge max wifi)
• Tried ANOTHER cpu (5800x3d)
• Tried one stick of ram
• Tried ram in different slots
• Tried GPU in different slots
• Disconnected all peripherals
• Tried different ports on gpu

TLDR:
I purchased a prebuilt pc off Facebook marketplace back in October 2022 and had some stuttering. I added some ram thinking it would fix it and it did not. I upgraded to a 5800x3d where it still did not fix the stuttering (despite having plenty of headroom). I then kept throwing money at it and it still stutters no matter what game or settings! I swapped the 3080 for a 3090, new motherboard(s) new ram, psu…etc I replaced everything about twice and have been troubleshooting for 2 months straight. Were my expectations for “the best gaming cpu” too high? Or do I need to suck it up and just buy a 13th gen intel because I’ve already spent this much. Any help is welcome because I’m out of ideas.

Thanks in advance!
Here is a video of the issue in MSFS. My MSI monitor is showing the power drop with each stutter.

 

[hotaru.hino]

The fact the lights are dimming when there's stuttering to me indicates the card is hitting a transient power spike. Though these usually get up to 600-700W, which even combined with the rest of the system, plus a monitor or two, this should still be within the normal limits of a typical circuit's power capacity (I believe the figure for most homes in the US is 1500W).

While I'm not an expert in electricity delivery at the home, my first suggestion is to try to find another circuit in the place that isn't being used as much, plug only the PC in it, and see if things are better.

 

[ttencza]

The fact the lights are dimming when there's stuttering to me indicates the card is hitting a transient power spike. Though these usually get up to 600-700W, which even combined with the rest of the system, plus a monitor or two, this should still be within the normal limits of a typical circuit's power capacity (I believe the figure for most homes in the US is 1500W).

While I'm not an expert in electricity delivery at the home, my first suggestion is to try to find another circuit in the place that isn't being used as much, plug only the PC in it, and see if things are better.

I’ll definitely try to take the pc to my buddy’s place to see if that fixes anything.
I already tried the pc on a different circuit in my apartment with no luck.
With the transient gpu spikes, would it be a good idea to get a larger PSU? Do you think a 1000w be enough? When I was using the UPS the highest wattage my system pulled was 550w. So there should be enough headroom for my PSU right?

 

[hotaru.hino]

With the transient gpu spikes, would it be a good idea to get a larger PSU? Do you think a 1000w be enough? When I was using the UPS the highest wattage my system pulled was 550w. So there should be enough headroom for my PSU right?

I'd say yes to getting a power supply upgrade, as 850W with an observed power spike of 600+W could push the power draw of the PC close to 100% of that PSU, if not more depending on what's going on.

I wouldn't trust the UPS unless you know how it monitors power draw. The transient spikes tend to be very short at around 20ms or so, and if the UPS is sampling at a low rate, it'll miss it.

 

[ttencza]

I'd say yes to getting a power supply upgrade, as 850W with an observed power spike of 600+W could push the power draw of the PC close to 100% of that PSU, if not more depending on what's going on.

I wouldn't trust the UPS unless you know how it monitors power draw. The transient spikes tend to be very short at around 20ms or so, and if the UPS is sampling at a low rate, it'll miss it.

It did seem like the polling rate of the UPS was slow so that makes sense. I’ll try to exchange my 850w for a 1kw psu and go from there.
I appreciate the info!

 

[klavs]

It did seem like the polling rate of the UPS was slow so that makes sense. I’ll try to exchange my 850w for a 1kw psu and go from there.
I appreciate the info!

I'd get a high quality power supply and from your specs it looks like an 850W is enough (unless you OC).

 

[ttencza]

@hotaru.hino
I just stopped by Best Buy and picked up a Corsair Rm1000x psu and hooked everything up. It’s still stuttering under load and making the lights in the room flicker.

Here are some pics of OCCT monitoring the stutters. I have the monitoring settings set to 1ms refresh to see if there are any weird spikes. Looks like I’ll be returning this power supply and sticking with the 850w.

I’ll try and take the pc to a friends house to test if power is the issue. If not, then I’m pretty lost with what the cause is. The outlet voltage (read from a digital multimeter is 114 and dropped to 113 for a second which I believe is not ideal.

My next suspect is the ram which isn’t on my motherboard QVL. It was on the G.Skill website but I have a feeling that isn’t as accurate because the Msi website has different compatibility based on the CPU.

I’m thinking that somehow my ram is causing the cpu to be a little unstable and cutting the load to my GPU. The lights flickering could just be a symptom from my gpu being throttled. That’s just a guess from my limited understanding on how things work.

 

[AirBobOne]

I had this excact same problem! Games would have a weird stutter, and when i opened the long summary on Rocket League, I saw a constant interval of 5 sec between the stutter.
( Context: I hadn't paid for a Windows key)
While trouble shooting, I noticed that after a restart of the PC, the Windows watermark would have vanished, and coincidentally also the stutter in my games.
I was convinced that unpaid Windows wouldn't have an effect on performance, but I could recreate (and remove) the stutters with the restart, so I paid for a license, and ever since the problem was gone.

But even though we have identical symptoms, I do feel like yours is power related. Is it possible for you to bring your PC to your friends place, or have your friend bring his (I assume perfectly fine) PC to yours? That way you can fully determine where the problem is.

 

[ohio_buckeye]

Also make sure you don’t have pending windows updates. Those can slow your system as well.

 

[ttencza]

Well guys, I’m officially out of ideas. I tried new ram which is specifically on my motherboard QVL and took the pc to my friends house. The same issues occur and we even swapped GPUs. Looks like I’ll probably just be getting rid of everything and going to a 13700kf. I’m pretty bummed because everything on the internet says the 5800x3d is the better cpu 🤦🏼‍♂️

 

[Zizo007]

If you already updated bios to latest bios, it could be the motherboard. I had a similar issue with a 2080 Ti and a Ryzen 3700X, for me the stuttering started after I accidently plugged a USB device into the Ethernet port, there was a spark and it probably shorted smth in the motherboard. I changed the motherboard and issue fixed. If that doesn't work try changing the GPU.

 

[Zizo007]

Oh my bad, I just read you already tried a new motherboard and a new GPU. Out of ideas, sorry.

 

[ttencza]

Oh my bad, I just read you already tried a new motherboard and a new GPU. Out of ideas, sorry.

All good! I’ve been troubleshooting this for 2 months and have read just about every forum on this topic . Looks like I may just go with intel this time around.

 

[klavs]

All good! I’ve been troubleshooting this for 2 months and have read just about every forum on this topic . Looks like I may just go with intel this time around.

The 13700KF chip should be able to deliver similar performance, even when you eco mode it to be less power hungry.

I checked the DDR5 performance with the chip, and as far as I could determine, the DDR5 5600 CL 28 sticks seems to be the sweet spot with regards to performance/price for most current games, for both AMD and Intel.

I would RMA the X5800X3D though, as it seems many people with a setup similar to yours have no issues with stuttering - only some do.
If you RMA it, and the new chip doesn't stutter, then please provide feedback here.

 

[ttencza]

The 13700KF chip should be able to deliver similar performance, even when you eco mode it to be less power hungry.

I checked the DDR5 performance with the chip, and as far as I could determine, the DDR5 5600 CL 28 sticks seems to be the sweet spot with regards to performance/price for most current games, for both AMD and Intel.

I would RMA the X5800X3D though, as it seems many people with a setup similar to yours have no issues with stuttering - only some do.
If you RMA it, and the new chip doesn't stutter, then please provide feedback here.

That’s good to hear that the 13700kf has similar performance. I was getting a little bummed out reading how everyone else is having an amazing experience with this chip and didn’t want to “downgrade”.
Also, I actually have already bought another 5800x3d with a new motherboard and SSD, but was still experiencing the issue somehow. At this point, I’m super confused if this is normal or if I’m somehow screwing up the windows installation or something.

 

[klavs]

I bought another 5800x3d with a new motherboard and SSD, but was still experiencing the issue [stuttering] somehow.

It seems to be a known problem that AMD promised to solve by May 2022:

AMD acknowledges Ryzen stuttering issues on Windows 10 and 11 - gHacks Tech News

AMD has confirmed that an fTPM bug is causing Ryzen systems to stutter on Windows 10 and 11. The company says it will fix the issue by May.

www.ghacks.net

The article includes a possible fix, to turn off TPM or to switch from fTPM to dTPM:

What about users who are facing problems right now? Well, AMD has mentioned a workaround that users may try. Affected users can optionally switch from fTPM to a hardware TPM (dTPM) module. This fix is not exactly user-friendly, as it requires a TPM 2.0 header on the motherboard. The other issue is that the hardware chip, the TPM module that you need to buy, is not exactly cheap. The TPM chips can cost about $50 to $100.

RANT: I've seen these kind of promises not being held, for more than a decade one driver after the other getting released that promises to fix the problem, one generation after the other. As I said, I only found a few recent reports of stuttering similar to yours with your setup, so it may be fixed. The problem may be caused by how you setup your system (firmware, drivers, the order in which you install your drivers, windows update messing with your drivers, CPU Configuration, OS version, software and settings, etc).