AMD CPU speculation... and expert conjecture

[de5_Roy]

Yes very true, but also Llano was 2 years late. But it is one solitary instance and the platform is so cheap you won't be losing a lot of money. I don't think AMD directly endeavored to screw people, it was a matter of the technology outgrowing the platform and as above it was late, very late.

the apus are indeed aimed at entry level segment. the problem was that competing intel platform (lga 1155) offered upgrades all the way to a 3770k (at present) from a lowly celeron. the igpu performance was very lacking(still is) on intel's side but when llano came out, sb pentiums and entry level discreet cards offered similar entry level performances. amd was silent about the future of fm1 for a long time. fortunately, trinity should be getting two upgrades counting richland.

I don't think AMD directly endeavored to screw people

i really wish if it was true. unfortunately every corporation would do this given any opportunity.

 

[sarinaide]

I did an article on the duopoly of the x86 market with AMD targeting value orientated market with a large pool of unique and value rich processors and platforms, while Intel target the now deminishing performance market. Neither company encroaches on the others domain.

For AMD their product diversification includes APU's and Athlons for FM2 giving outstanding bang for buck at next to no cost that Intel just simply cannot compete with. The FX targets mid to high level users with healthy platforms.

 

[BeastLeeX]

Its an impressive piece of technology that will make its way to mainstream APU's down the line, the DDR5, Quad Channel IMC is impressive to which one wonders why not on DT APU.

The graphics card is basically a Radeon HD 8770. If the PS4 released today, it would look extremely nice for a budget gamer (Since people say it's got a 7850 in it). Sadly it releases Q4, the same time that new graphics cards are coming out, meaning that it will be equal, or slightly better then the 8770. Also I doubt it will run 1080p with 60 fps, after time the fps number might go down, and you will also be on low settings.

 

[gamerk316]

The graphics card is basically a Radeon HD 8770. If the PS4 released today, it would look extremely nice for a budget gamer (Since people say it's got a 7850 in it). Sadly it releases Q4, the same time that new graphics cards are coming out, meaning that it will be equal, or slightly better then the 8770. Also I doubt it will run 1080p with 60 fps, after time the fps number might go down, and you will also be on low settings.

The GPU in the PS4 looks to be routhly equivalaent to a 7870, with a higher memory bandwidth.

That being said, the CPU...really isn't that impressive. I suspect you are going to see most games target 30 FPS @ 1080p 4xAA as a result. Also interesting:

http://www.pcper.com/news/Editorial/Unreal-Engine-4-Demo-PS4-Reduced-Quality

Already seeing reduced quality demos for the PS4, which I suspect is due to the CPU side of the house. Something to watch going forward.

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

Ive wondered about the 60/1080 as well.
I think it will be more of a dev call than anything, as to the larger picture of each game, and what theyre trying to accomplish

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

I think its too early as to the cpu, but doing 60 at 1080, thats alot to ask down the road, tho there are rumors of better consoles coming sooner as well, and not going 7 years

 

[truegenius]

1080i instead of 1080p !

 

[gamerk316]

I think 60/1080 will depend on the game and how much graphical work goes into it. I think at the end of the day, visual quality > 60/1080. I expect 1080 to be standard, but 60 won't be.

 

[de5_Roy]

AMD Reveals "Temash" SoC for Tablets
http://vr-zone.com/articles/amd-reveals-temash-soc-for-tablets/19098.html

AMD working on HD 7600 card
http://www.fudzilla.com/home/item/30618-amd-working-on-hd-7600-card

 

[-Fran-]

The move from FM1 to FM2 is the same as LGA1156 to LGA1155. AMD has it's reasons, but most of us don't give a rat's ass about them, really. Same when s758 went to s939.

Anyway, bring DDR4 and I'll change my A8. I even had to underclock it because summer was making it so unstable it was irritating. Temps were too damn high.

And mayan, it doesn't matter how they use the technologies. They exist for people to use them. Good or bad, you get the extra eye candy for a price, off course. If they are never used, then they (devs) won't get the knowledge on how to improve the coding for the techs. It's a matter of time, but sometimes it's hard to wait

Cheers!

 

[truegenius]

why did amd replaced the fm1 socket this early ?

 

[-Fran-]

why did amd replaced the fm1 socket this early ?

Wiki:

"The socket is very similar to FM1, based on a 31×31 grid of pins with a 5×7 central void, 3 pins missing from each corner, and a few additional key pins missing. Compared to FM1, two key pins were moved, and one more is removed, leaving 904 pins.[3]"

So, I'm guessing that someone told them: "add 1 to the socket name and drop some pins, they work better that way for selling them". Hahaha.

But, I don't remember the *real* reason for the change to be honest.

Cheers!

 

[sarinaide]

OMG complaining about FM1 to FM2, just sell your FM1 off classifieds and buy a FM2. Hell Asrock dropped the FM2A85X extreme 6 to $90, the Extreme 4 to $75 (absence of Lucid MVP). BioStar A85X Hi-Fi is a good board at a steal, this platform for its features makes FM1 look really old.

Athlon II 740 cost $50 and the 750K under $100, the 5600k dropped to 100 odd and the 5800k to $115 odd all in all great little processor units for absolutely nothing.

 

[-Fran-]

Why would I do that? I love my A8. I'm just bitching about AMD leaving me with no "simple" upgrade path.

Cheers!

 

[sarinaide]

Llano is only decent in some regards, the x86 on the higher end parts is good to and extent but its iGPU is slaughtered, this is shown up in GPU bound games where the HD7660D is like 35% average faster, Richland will add 15%+ to that so looking at 50-55% slower iGPU. Again Llano was two years late but AMD still have to sell the product or lose, so those who got the goose egg will either stick or move on to FM2.

It appears that Steamroller FX and A Series is on schedule and performance is being met, they will start early phase ES chips soon enough. They are targeting a minimum of 15% on the x86 side if that is linear then you have your highest end part matching the 3770K which will be a fantastic result for AMD. Kaviri iGPU is touted at 50% over Trinity, 35-40% over Richland, that is very size able. AMD is doing fine under the radar, though there are those that seem to be over expectant.

 

[de5_Roy]

llano and bulldozer's delay pushed back amd's whole roadmap, not juat llano. steamroller was supposed to come out in 2011-12, now it's (expected) launching in late 2013.

 

[sarinaide]

Thats the issue, Hector and his cronies bottlenecked development until it was two late and AMD cannot roll out Llano for 2-3 years while Trinity and Kaviri parts were in process hence the change. AMD did address this and were apologetic but in the world of tech things move forward and AMD have been so stable its hardly something to be alarmed about.

 

[griptwister]

Does anyone know if AMD has a GPU planned to answer to the GTX Titan (or GTX 785).

 

[BeastLeeX]

Does anyone know if AMD has a GPU planned to answer to the GTX Titan (or GTX 785).

They already do, just buy 2 7970's or the better $1000 cards (7990 and 690)

 

[Cazalan]

I did an article on the duopoly of the x86 market with AMD targeting value orientated market with a large pool of unique and value rich processors and platforms, while Intel target the now deminishing performance market. Neither company encroaches on the others domain.

That would be AMD's dream if it were true. Intel isn't targeting the performance market, they're targeting everything. From tiny Atom SoC's to cheap Celerons/Pentiums, to Xeons. Products from $12 to $4000.

 

[simon12]

Intel are targeting ultrabooks if they didn't care about the TDP they could release much better desktop CPUs. From what I have read about haswell there top performance CPU wants to scale from desktops to ultrabooks with even better battery life so thats what they develop CPUs for good power performance ratios, pure performance and performance/price are secondary.

 

[esrever]

That would be AMD's dream if it were true. Intel isn't targeting the performance market, they're targeting everything. From tiny Atom SoC's to cheap Celerons/Pentiums, to Xeons. Products from $12 to $4000.

intel **** blocks itself by purposely disabling features. Thats why intel still has so much competition at the low end. Especially when you consider pricing.

 

[mayankleoboy1]

It appears that Steamroller FX and A Series is on schedule and performance is being met, they will start early phase ES chips soon enough. They are targeting a minimum of 15% on the x86 side if that is linear then you have your highest end part matching the 3770K which will be a fantastic result for AMD. AMD is doing fine under the radar, though there are those that seem to be over expectant.

Is that 15% IPC improvement, or 15% improvement stock clocks Vs. stock clocks ? If that 15% is 5% IPC+10% clocks, SR is mostly meh. If that 15% is pure IPC , its going to be quite an achievement. Power consumption be damned.

Kaviri iGPU is touted at 50% over Trinity, 35-40% over Richland, that is very size able.

Which also means that Richland is mostly a "sidegrade" over Trinity ? (1.5*100/1.35 = 1.11 )
Just saying, but if someone has bought a Trinity, and then buys a Richland , he will prolly going to be disappointed by the sidegrade. So how will AMD convince him to buy Kaveri ?

 

[Cazalan]

Which also means that Richland is mostly a "sidegrade" over Trinity ? (1.5*100/1.35 = 1.11 )
Just saying, but if someone has bought a Trinity, and then buys a Richland , he will prolly going to be disappointed by the sidegrade. So how will AMD convince him to buy Kaveri ?

They're not expecting people to upgrade from Trinity to Richland. Richland is just a refresh.

Kaveri is a new process (TSMC 28nm) and a new core (Steamroller). A potentially much bigger performance gain if they can keep the clock speeds up.

 

[sarinaide]

Does anyone know if AMD has a GPU planned to answer to the GTX Titan (or GTX 785).

They don't need to, the Titan represents very poor value for money and according to the rumors the HD8970 and GTX 780 will be equally if not more powerful at a lower cost. This was Nvidia's cheap trick to claim single fastest GPU and to try milk revenue in a very slow year for GPU's.

That would be AMD's dream if it were true. Intel isn't targeting the performance market, they're targeting everything. From tiny Atom SoC's to cheap Celerons/Pentiums, to Xeons. Products from $12 to $4000.

And how many Intel low cost solutions actually represent good value for money over an entire setup, sure they have x86 performance but thats about it. The rest is dull and drab and the quality of Motherboards down in the $50-120 range is beyond shocking. If a person has only $250 odd for board, chip and RAM AMD offerings make far more sense. It is why Intel apart from on Toms and Anandtech occupy no market sub $200 because their offerings are just BORING.

Is that 15% IPC improvement, or 15% improvement stock clocks Vs. stock clocks ? If that 15% is 5% IPC+10% clocks, SR is mostly meh. If that 15% is pure IPC , its going to be quite an achievement. Power consumption be damned.

Kaviri iGPU is touted at 50% over Trinity, 35-40% over Richland, that is very size able.

Which also means that Richland is mostly a "sidegrade" over Trinity ? (1.5*100/1.35 = 1.11 )
Just saying, but if someone has bought a Trinity, and then buys a Richland , he will prolly going to be disappointed by the sidegrade. So how will AMD convince him to buy Kaveri ?

1) Not really sure, talk about overall general computing performance. Some sources say 15% others 30% but I do think AMD are setting for a minimum of 15% accross the board and throught the product line over previous parts. I have tediously sat and done the math on flat 15%. While single threaded performance will still be behind Intel, the rest of the performance differentials are very good. What has not been looked at is the factor of what AMD are doing with Cache and IMC improvements and the effect that will have. Overall if SR sits in and around that SB/IB territory it will be quite impressive.

As for power, SR is expected to utilize RCM so will see the proper benefits of it, I would assume though the power numbers will drop irrespective.

2) If you don't own a Trinity part then Richland is very feasible to go to, it has enough performance yields to be a step up on Trinity without costing more.

5-7% CPU gains, 15-20% IGPU gains and around 10% better IMC overall probably 7-10% better