AMD Flies the European Flag After Intel Fine

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[citation][nom]scarywoody[/nom]Either way for the people claiming AMD lost market share is BS. When AMD had a better chip they gained market share and the only thing holding them back was they couldn't supply their customers with enough chips. Their yeilds were terrible and even if they had more customers they wouldn't automatically have more chips.[/citation]
+1 QFT
 
Interesting conversation. It has amazed me over the last several days how much emotion people have put into their reactions to the EC's ruling. Clearly, the implications of a decision like this are important to us all.

As a member of the web team that put up the image, I can honestly say that there wasn't any emotion behind it. It's just a flag that happens to depict where the verdict took place. If it were a US decision we probably would have used an American flag. The main point was to communicate the importance of the ruling to our audience. In a few days it will be replaced with whatever else we find important (processors anyone?) and it will be business as usual.

Like I said in my tweet to Jane, I really hope everyone doesn't read too much into it. We understand there are differing, strong opinions on both sides of the issue and we'll continue to do our best to inform our customers, shareholders and employees on how this ruling impacts them. AMD always welcomes your feedback on anything we post publicly so let us know when we put up something that you don't agree with and we'll try and do better on the next go around.

Anyway, thanks to Jane for taking the time to comment on our site 🙂 and you guys for caring so much to discuss it. Keep debating it. It's great to work in an industry where your potential customers care this much. It's why I love working at AMD!

Have a good one,
Chris
 
I think it's 100% awesome. People say AMD is being childish, not compared to nVidia saying the CPU is dead and the rest of their rubbish. At least what AMD is gloating about is true!
 
As a long-time buyer of AMD CPUs, I am as disappointed at the EU decision as I am at AMD for engaging in expensive legal wrangling that profits no one except lawyers. The EU decision will *raise*, rather than lower costs, and *retard*, rather than accelerate technological growth. I hope AMD and its new Arab owners will spend their oil dollars developing new technologies, not old legalities.
 
[citation][nom]zerapio[/nom]Please find me a quote from a company executive stating his company received "loyalty" payments.[/citation]
"Intel denied the charges related to rebates offered as long as manufacturers agreed to obtain the majority of their processors from Intel as well as paying them to either to delay or cancel the launch of AMD based products."

Ya, you're right. The EU is totally making up all these accusations about Intel just to get some money. [/sarcasm]

Why would a company exec come clean to accepting these payments anyway? It would make their company look bad. And why would the EU make false claims about Intel. I'm sure they have evidence to support their story. It's not like they're fining Intel for just a couple bucks, ya know.
 
[citation][nom]dman3k[/nom]AMD is an Arabian company??? The last time I checked UAE only own 8% of the company share and the rest is American.[/citation]
Ok, so you only gave $16 instead of $200 to Al Qaeda when you bought that PII. Happy now?
 
The people who say they do not support Intel due to "unethical business practices" are most likely the same people who do their game shopping at Gamestop....and we all know what goes on there. I have yet to see AMD get their act together since the beginning of the decade. I am not an Intel fanboy, I'm a fanboy of whatever company produces the best, most reliable product at the lowest price. This little show of "Ha Ha, we won something finally" is something they should save for when they can actually produce products better than Intel. As of right now, it just makes them look desperate for attention.
 
AMD is the poor kid who works his ass of and gets a B, while Intel is the rich kid who cheats and gets an A. It just so happens that the rich kid got caught this time, and now he has to pay.

I'm no fanboy. I own Intel and AMD processors. But some people don't realize that it's hard to make breakthrough technology when the competition has a near monopoly of the market, in turn soaking up most of the money.

But let's be honest, AMD's marketing leaves MUCH to be desired.
 
Well, if intel will no longer play dirty, manufacturers would choose their cpu/chipset vendors according to their true benefits...
If AMD doesn't gain market share from now on, what can you say?

AMD has to see this as a critical time, when they really have to provide a competitive alternative to intel's offer...
If AMD's problem right now is lack o cash for RD, expect them to sue intel...

Other than that...
"SAN FRANCISCO (Reuters) - Shares of Advanced Micro Devices Inc jumped almost 8 percent on Monday on news that European regulators were preparing to fine larger rival Intel Corp for anti-competitive practices." ... http://www.reuters.com/article/hotStocksNews/idUSTRE54A5GC20090511

Where else can they get more cash from?
Is that their only problem?

They definitely need an ace up one of their sleeves, or else their image will have to suffer when they no longer can blame anyone for their lack of growth...

And I surely hope they've got more than one, we need a strong competition in cpu/platforms market.

 
Lots of hard feelings here...

- this fine means that on average every computer buyer in the EU would 'get back' approximately $2.35 (as said by someone above), in the form of less taxes raised by states to pay for their contribution. AMD raised the problem on behalf of customers, but didn't (yet) sue Intel directly (interested third party, if you will);

- the OEM payments were done in the form of 'we cut our prices by 50% if you buy only our chips': in short, an OEM giving choice to customers would result in pricier goods, and an OEM not entering such a deal would find himself at a competitive disadvantage - except if it sold only AMD/Via chips (which isn't good either, as Intel had/has a bigger marketing clout than AMD);

- complimentary to the above point, most of the Intel OEM deals were done under NDA, so as not to make an OEM company 'look bad';

- there were less hidden tricks used by Intel at one time, such as 'offering' Rambus chips along with their processors. According to European laws, such practise is called 'bundling' and all components of a bundle must be independently priced (a bundle is considered to be a package of elements that can otherwise be sold separately; a car can hardly be sold without tires, but it can be sold without a GPS). Accordingly, this offer stopped very rapidly - as Intel was found to 'overcharge' for its CPUs when sold out of the bundle.

So now that Intel has been found guilty of harming competition, AMD can sue them directly for damage - but so does Via, and any other x86 CPU maker. AMD will probably be the only one able to effectively do so however, since Intel can't rescind their x86 license without finding itself unable to sell x86-64 processors (AMD developed the extended 64-bit instruction set).
 
To clarify a few aspects:
- both companies have adjusted their pricing according to the performance of their current products, higher/lower when they had the better/lesser product.
- intel was the only one to apply illegal tactics, when they were the (qualitative) underdog, strong-arming (by offering bonuses/incentives or threatening to withdraw them to) manufacturers and distributors/dealers to drop or delay AMD products from their offerings. When they finally got a better product, this tactic was dropped (early 2006). The EU fine is strictly for these illegal actions.
- american companies (still) have to comply to the regulations of the countries in which they are selling products, unlike the us government's self arrogated "right", to exclude from prosecution, of their military personnel's wrongdoings, by other sovereign countries judicial system, in defiance of international and national law.

As for the commentators, a few categories can be distinguished :
- the fanboy: he will defend his idol, and attack the perceived enemies, to the end of world, being impervious to any logical argument.
- the flag waving (american) idiot: any non-american flag, glimpsed in his visual field, produces an immediate violent reaction, he believes that the police states of america is the center of the world, his only world.
- the main stream (disinformation) propaganda junkie: he believes that the islamofascists/commies/russians/etc. are the (pure) evil - the current obsession being the Al CIAda mith - and must be fought by all means.
Common to all this categories is the adoption of the old bolshevik motto: Who isn't with/like us, is against us...
 
... do you all remember the times, when AMD Athlon FX-60 waz tha CPU to do all the benchmarks of new hardware like HDD's an videocards??? It's like i7 today!!! Tha difference iz, tha Atholon FX-60 and other AMD CPU's waz denied the access to costomers... but it waz tha badass CPU @ that day...
 
Litebulb, just to you know I have nothing against you. I'm just arguing the point.
[citation][nom]LiteBulb[/nom]"Intel denied the charges related to rebates offered as long as manufacturers agreed to obtain the majority of their processors from Intel as well as paying them to either to delay or cancel the launch of AMD based products."Ya, you're right. The EU is totally making up all these accusations about Intel just to get some money. [/sarcasm]Why would a company exec come clean to accepting these payments anyway? It would make their company look bad. And why would the EU make false claims about Intel. I'm sure they have evidence to support their story. It's not like they're fining Intel for just a couple bucks, ya know.[/citation]
The issue is that a company is being fined and I have yet so see evidence. You're buying into the EU side of the story solely because you're "sure they have evidence". Why even have trials? The EU is never wrong./sarcasm
:)
I'm going to abstain to point fingers until the waters are clearer because this whole thing reeks of FUD.
 
I have no problems with it. So what they want to gloat a little bit let'em. It's not like their calling intel a bunch of names, and that kind of stuff. Now I'm no lawyer, but you would think this would help AMD's case if they made one against intel in the EU.
 
They have been doing this for years (that, industrial spying, etc etc). Now we finally start to get aware of it.
 
You missed at least one category, Ossie - you forgot the rabid anti-American bigot whose only exposure to American people or culture has been one-sided television specials and "friend of a friend" stories.

On the topic at hand, sure, AMD could have taken a more subtle tone, but when misfortune falls on the company that has tried through various and sometimes criminal means to destroy their company, you can't expect the folks at AMD to remain too cool about it.
 
For those whining about the fact that AMD was charging $1000 for their high end dual cores back in the early days of release...not to difficult to understand. As was noted they held the performance crown at the time, and thier desktop and server parts were interchangeable, they still charge $1000+ for their highend server chips.....more complex, better performance, lower power on higher clocks...extended instruction sets used only in workstation and server enviorments.

Where AMD is going out of their way to extend backwards compatibility, intel busts out a new socket with every new chip. Every 3 or 4 months they release a "new" highend chip that has 5-10% performance bump over older chips that cost 1/5th the price.

The cross licensing agreement between AMD and intel allows AMD to use x86 instruction set, and intel gets to use AMD's multicore archictecture, IMC design, and though they don't use it, i think hypertransport as well as x86-64....essentially they got the nehalem design from the agreement. With 32bit finally going extict....AMD will quickly be further down the losing end of that deal. But hey, intel trys to exploit a loophole with the AMD/foundry situation and say AMD breached the agreement....

Intel does many things well, instances where it includes cpu design are few and far between and rarely can be attributed to Intel's own innovation. Even when they have had the ambition to do something innovative, they have failed.

Itanium 64, joint venture between intel and IBM formed in 1992. They spent $2 BILLION...every year until it's launch in 2001. $18 billion dollars in R&D, they convinced microsoft to release an OS specifically for the IA64. They sold around 8000 machines. Why? Because thier 64 bit code....was not supported by ANY software. Users had the option to run it in 64bit mode, leaving them with no software to utilize, or they could set it to emulate 32bit mode....which left them with a very expensive machine that was 40-50% slower than mainstream 32bit chips.

The Timna, announced in 97 due to launch in late 98/early 99, was intels second attempt at a chip with an IMC, as well as a cpu/gpu in a single package. They went with RAMBUS memory for their IMC....upon doing a production run, they found a design flaw in the IMC, delayed the release reworked the design, did another production run...and the problem persisted. At this point they scraped Rambus and went with SDRAM...did a production run....and, surprise surprise the design flaw was still there. They scrapped the project in 2001 which was around the final delay of the...

Pentium 4 release! The chip that will scale to 10ghz. Too bad that it's performance gains took a nosedive clocked past 1.8, and it was being outperformed by AMD barton core chips that consumed something like 1/4th the power, ran at 2/3rds the clock and had double the memory performance of Intels DDR2 P4's....and then they overclocked with no effort to boot. Upon AMD launching the FX-55 it was discovered that intel would have to put out a 5.2ghz P4 (twice the FX-55 clock) to be on par in most area's of performance...and it would only require about 350w's compared to the FX55's 90w.

2001, intel's trifecta of contribution to the IT comunity

Intel doesn't work towards progress in performance and design, they work towards keeping the market tailored to what falls in their capabilities. Vista for example was designed with AMD/ATI hardware in mind as it was intended to be a 64bit OS exsclusively. The beefy UI overhead was supposed to be offloaded to the DX10 GPU...but wait, thats not fair cause intel's IGP's could barely render XP, and they had no prospect of a DX10 IGP....so that got dropped....tesselation, same reason....performance gains designed around an IMC....oops no no drop that too. 64bit oh no, intel doesn't have any 64bit chips to compete with AMD's. So they run a smear campaign on 64bit..5 or 6 years after they failed with IA64..and they ressurect a 32bit chip to improve on....P4? no no p3? well yeah bit's an pieces...p2? nah...ooo yes that's it.

The pentium pro. They had to go back to the best they had to offer in 1997 to release the Conroe in 2006. Which is a round about way of intel announcing "well, we discovered that between the pentium pro, and the p4...we really didn't do anything substantial enough to improve on....cause the rest was just crap" Instead of investing their substantal resources into developing a 64bit chip to compete with AMD, they put out an amazingly performing 32bit chip. Since AMD didn't really care about 32bit performance (shown by the fact that when comparing 32bit and 64bit versions of an app AMD sees a 17-25% performance gain in 64bit computing over 32) and this allowed software developers to stick with what they already had and knew well, it kind of hindered Vista's acceptance. People trying to run Vista ultimate with 2gigs of ram on a 32bit cpu are of course going to be dissapointed, it was never intended to be run under those conditions. With the C2/C2Q which included token 64bit performance, it's the same deal, small performance gains if any running 64bit over 32bit.

So here we are, with intel who bashed AMD's single die, multi core design, use of an IMC, hypertransport approach 6 years ago....using near identical architecture with nehalem.....after AMD told them how to do it. They don't have anything to trade now when AMD makes another innovative breakthrough, and they dont seem on the path to make any of their own. AMD is merely playing Intels game, and it's about damn time.
 
So now Intel is going to be fined and pass the cost on to the consumers around the world. This is causing the consumer harm. When will the EU be brought up on anti-trust charges by causing harm to the consumer?
 
[citation][nom]iocedmyself[/nom]ran at 2/3rds the clock and had double the memory performance of Intels DDR2 P4's[/citation]

I think you meant dual DDR not DDR2. =) from your time reference points around that statement I don't believe DDR2 was out at least not officially then if at all.
 
With all of the recent crap that has gone down I think it is justified and I don't think it is childish. I heard of and saw things a lot more childish when the current US president won. Believe me if I posted some of that stupidity I would be banned.
 
What's all this trouble about ... AMD won .. great! .. lets hope for better prices from both companies!! If anything is to be question this should be about the writer's motivation. Maybe Jane McEntegart is an Intel fun, or on Intel's payroll, or just a sore loser, regardless if AMD is a worst winner! Do we really care? NO! What we care for is good products at good prices.
 
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