AMD Phenom II X4 965 BE vs. Intel Core 2 Duo E8600

[fazers_on_stun]

cool. Price decrease of the PII 965. But how long though. For the I5. Surely it can't be "a couple of weeks". Is there any news about when they will come out. If a 3.6ghz phenom II comes out is there any point in buying it? It's like going back to the single core processor times where intel brought ridiculously highly clocked pentium 4s in to attempt to match the AMD ones.

According to this, Sept. 6th for the i5 750. In time for the 'back to school' upgrade market. As for AMD dropping their 965 price, that is mere speculation on my part, although some knowledgeable people on other forums agree with me .

 

[fazers_on_stun]

Architecture? Man, what the hell is wrong with you people? Core2 has no IMC, no L3 and has an outdated FSB that brings huge latencies and slow memory response. I'd say PII pretty much has superior architecture compared to Core2. Performance is similar, but architecture is miles better. Even Phenom I architecture was better, but not performance. I7 has the best architecture on the consumer market. Period.

I think Nashsafc meant core architecture, but I'll let him speak for himself .

P2 is still based on the aging K8 core architecture - 3-issue decoder vs. 4-issue for Core2, less efficient OoO execution/branch prediction than Core2, etc. See here for more information. What has really helped P2 compared to P1 is the process shrink to 45nm, so that AMD could add a much larger L3 cache, comparable in size to the huge L2 cache for 45nm Core2. And while the FSB doesn't scale as well as hypertransport does in multi-processor rigs, esp. >2s, it does well enough on single-socket desktops if you jack up the frequency.

AMD won't have a really new arch until Bulldozer appears, sometime in 2011.

 

[Xan81]

*sings*

This is the war that doesn't end... yes it goes on and on my friend.
Some people.....

For the purpose of the point I'm trying to make, I will only refer to Newegg.com (NE) for pricing. I URGE you to shop around and not make impulse-purchases.

Look, Intel processors will give you better overall performance, but at a premium price.

I run a home-business (I guess you could say) building people computers. I have a $5k line of credit on Newegg.com and burn through it fast, averaging over $10k in purchases a month. In other words, I've configured my share of machines both enthusiast and budget.

Here's the bottom-line: Budget. Be a grown-up and before you click the "Check-Out" button for the purchase of a new machine, make a budget -=AND STICK TO IT=-.

When you go to buy computer parts, the rule for buying any computer part is this: buy the best you can afford.
For a basic system, here are the parts you need:
CPU, Motherboard, Memory, GPU, PSU, Sound, Cooling, HDD, Enclosure, OS, ODD

It is rather silly to mention a budget if you're planning on overclocking. Why? Because you're ditching the warranty and killing the lifespan of your CPU. Save $40 on a "lesser" CPU just to overclock isn't a clever move, seeing that your CPU will always run the risk of self-destructing with a shorter lifespan, and a manufacturer that tells you "too bad".

Anyways. Onward. Prices as of 10/31/2009@ 08:36 hrs. Prices do NOT include shipping.

I made a budget of $1k to see what I could throw together at NE. Here's what I came up with:
Common components:
Western Digital Caviar Green WD10000CSRTL 1TB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Hard Drive -Retail - $94.99
XFX HD-489X-ZSFC Radeon HD 4890 1GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video Card - Retail - $199.99
Antec Basiq BP500U 500W Continuous Power ATX12V Version 2.01 Active PFC Power Supply - Retail + Antec Three Hundred Black Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case - Retail - $96.94
CORSAIR XMS3 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model CMX4GX3M2A1600C8 - Retail - $109.99
Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit 1-Pack for System Builders - OEM - $106.99
LITE-ON Black 24X DVD Writer Black SATA Model iHAS-324-98 - Retail - $31.99
Sound is included on motherboards.
Cooling is included with CPU and Enclosure.
Total for Common Parts: $640.89

Intel:
ASUS P5P43TD Pro LGA 775 Intel P43 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail - $94.99
Intel Core 2 Quad Q9505 Yorkfield 2.83GHz LGA 775 95W Quad-Core Processor Model BX80580Q9505 - Retail - $229.99
Total for Intel: $324.98 ($965.87)

AMD:
MSI 770-C45 AM3 AMD 770 ATX AMD Motherboard - Retail - $79.99
AMD Phenom II X4 965 Black Edition Deneb 3.4GHz Socket AM3 140W Quad-Core Processor Model HDZ965FBGIBOX - Retail - $195.99
Total for AMD: $275.98 ($916.87)

PRICE DIFFERENCE: $49, with AMD offering you savings. /shrug

FUTURE SAFENESS: (Max CPU on these platforms)
Intel: Intel Core 2 Quad Q9650 3.0GHz LGA 775 95W Quad-Core Processor Model BX80569Q9650 - Retail - $329.99 ($100 more than included in the above Intel sample)
AMD: - Included.

I'll say it: One could call me a "fanboy" (whoever made up that word must be tarred and feathered) for AMD... or you could just know that I like MONEY. I have 5 machines in my home: 1 for gaming, 2 for productivity, 1 server for NAS, and one to keep the wife off my other 4. Only my server and the productivity machines are Intel-based. The reason is simple: Those machines make me money and pay for themselves. They're allowed to be expensive - they've earned it.

I'm not playing sides for either manufacturer. Most of these eraser-fights can easily be solved by asking 2 questions: What are your other components? [&] How much did your rig as a whole drain you for?

Quit pitting specific parts against each other. Someone else on this topic mentioned (and I paraphrase), "The strength of the [machine] is only as fast as its slowest component." So very, very true. Why else would Windows Vista/7 "Performance Score" be based on the lowest component's score?

OH! One last thing... someone made a fool of themselves by saying that liquid-cooling is useless, but gave no configuration example. For that person, I challenge them to give this liquid-cooling set-up a shot (as I have this rigged to my server):

Buy a liquid-cooling kit.
Buy extra-long hoses.
Buy an "upgraded" (more powerful) pump.
Buy a window A/C unit.
Put the radiator in front of the A/C unit.
Turn the A/C unit on.
😗 Frosty.

You really need not buy that extra stuff, except maybe the hoses. Just having your radiator OUTSIDE of your machine is effective to get heat out of the box (and away from the GPU, Memory, HDD, etc.)

Cheers!

 

[elieli22]

Thank you for sharing your knowledge with us.
I know if I had extra money I might have bought the i7.
But since I don't have extra money and I need a powerful system.
I will buy an Amd Phenome II X4 + ddr3 2 X2GB + AM3 board. I need fast Hard drives and HD encoding/decoding card. (this alone will add 200$ to my system).
I thinking on saving and using my old 400W PSU and my old case....
I need the money.

Do you know the difference between win fast pxvc1100 and intensity pro? (they are priced about the same 180$-200$)


Have a good day.

 

[Ivo Gelezarov]

GEEK WAR FTW