AMD Piledriver rumours ... and expert conjecture

[Reynod]

We have had several requests for a sticky on AMD's yet to be released Piledriver architecture ... so here it is.

I want to make a few things clear though.

Post a question relevant to the topic, or information about the topic, or it will be deleted.

Post any negative personal comments about another user ... and they will be deleted.

Post flame baiting comments about the blue, red and green team and they will be deleted.

Enjoy ...

 

[truegenius]

Llano and BD are two different archs, don't confuse them. BD uses SMT which places two threads on the same 'module', which many argue equate more closely to traditional cores and the FX-8xxx is really a 4c/8t design.

😀
now i got it
i was confused as fx-8xxx suggests me like a true 8 core design, but basically it is a 4c design

 

[de5_Roy]

just realized this:
an amd apu backed by powerful mobile ram (a hybrid of vram and ram) would be awesome. or may be a little vram cache for the igp.
the way llano performs with faster ram.
amd starts their own branded ram.
amd uses rambus' xdr ram in their upcoming gfx cards.
amd almost made to apple's air.
llano kicks intel's igp's ass.
intel is scrambling to build a market for ultrabooks.
add all of the above and amd's potential in mobile market becomes clearer.
intel could be kicked off air or macs just like nvidia was brought back. may be that's why intel wants to build a market for ultrabooks.
but amd has a higher chance to make ultrabooks better with their apus and prices.
trinity now seems more potent. cannot wait.

 

[-Fran-]

Not that RAMBUS has a very good track record, but they DO own a truck load of RAM related technology patents.

Their main one just got struck down though, and RAMBUS stock tanked like 60% immediatly afterward. I fully expect them to go under within the next year or so as a result.

There's no way they'll go down. At most they'll be bought by Intel, IBM or Samsung.

Unless you mean that going "under" means "they'll be bought", which in that case, I fully agree.

If they're bought, I really wonder if the nature of the beast will change, lol.

Cheers!

 

[truegenius]

just realized this:
an amd apu backed by powerful mobile ram (a hybrid of vram and ram) would be awesome. or may be a little vram cache for the igp.
the way llano performs with faster ram.
amd starts their own branded ram.
amd uses rambus' xdr ram in their upcoming gfx cards.
amd almost made to apple's air.
llano kicks intel's igp's ass.
intel is scrambling to build a market for ultrabooks.
add all of the above and amd's potential in mobile market becomes clearer.
intel could be kicked off air or macs just like nvidia was brought back. may be that's why intel wants to build a market for ultrabooks.
but amd has a higher chance to make ultrabooks better with their apus and prices.
trinity now seems more potent. cannot wait.

it looks like a deal betwen amd and intel

((story (joke) :lol:
intel said to amd: hey amd i have a plan according to which you should go with portable machine and i will go with desktop.
amd replied: sounds great.i think we have a deal my friend. OK done))

 

[lilcinw]

Maybe RAMBUS will become cheap enough for AMD to buy (where they would come up with the cash I have no idea) and we could begin to see APUs with cheap, high bandwidth RAM (no license fees).

 

[we1shcake]

Maybe RAMBUS will become cheap enough for AMD to buy (where they would come up with the cash I have no idea) and we could begin to see APUs with cheap, high bandwidth RAM (no license fees).

omfg this, amd would love that. they could get the full performance out of the graphics in the apu for not much money

 

[-Fran-]

RAMBUS is just part of the guys behind RAM technologies, remember that.

I don't remember all the companies that have and share patents for them now, but I just used RAMBUS as the most known one.

If they need to get in bed with a RAM patent holder, it doesn't have to be RAMBUS at all. I'm sure someone could enlighten us in that department.

Cheers!

 

[phatbuddha79]

The days of Intel charging up our a$$e$ again are coming back again closer with each passing day. That's not to say AMD wouldn't or hasn't but they kept each others' prices in check.

 

[Chad Boga]

http://hexus.net/business/news/corporate/32779-amd-make-move-mobile/

Whilst ostensibly this may be referring to the same issue, I think the write up in this link is of far more interest to the implications of what this all means.

http://news.softpedia.com/news/AMD-Not-Competing-With-Intel-Anymore-Goes-Mobile-237103.shtml

It looks like the history books will have Bulldozer as being AMD's Frankenstein Monster, a Monster that ultimately led to the demise of its creator.

 

[gamerk316]

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2011/11/29/hardocp_readers_ask_amd_bulldozer_questions

Interesting response from AMD, if you like marketing speak.

Though, stright from the horses mouth:

Mike Butler, Senior Fellow Design Engineer, AMD: It is also important to note that the "Bulldozer" architecture is configured and optimized for server throughput.

 

[gamerk316]

Question: Odds NVIDIA buys AMD within the next decade? Seems crazy, but it makes a LOT of sense, especially if NVIDIA is serious about breaking into the CPU market...

 

[de5_Roy]

won't nvidia face anti-trust regulations if they buy amd? they won't have any competitors in the discreet gfx/pro/workstation gfx market.

 

[Mousemonkey]

won't nvidia face anti-trust regulations if they buy amd? they won't have any competitors in the discreet gfx/pro/workstation gfx market.

ATi may return if it were to be split off and kicked out into the cold.

 

[lilcinw]

If NVidia wanted an x86 license I think they could find one somewhere besides AMD. VIA would fit in with them better I think.

 

[gamerk316]

won't nvidia face anti-trust regulations if they buy amd? they won't have any competitors in the discreet gfx/pro/workstation gfx market.

Nope. Intel sells more then 50% of all GPU's, so even if NVIDIA kept the ATI portion of AMD, they'd still control less then 50% of the GPU market.

If NVidia wanted an x86 license I think they could find one somewhere besides AMD. VIA would fit in with them better I think.

I believe the Via license is non-transferrable.

 

[viridiancrystal]

woh woh woh.... Nvidia is thinking about entering the cpu market? 😵 damn, do they have the money for that being a mainly gpu company?

 

[lilcinw]

Does non-transferable mean that they would forfeit it if they were bought?

Whatever happened to the Cyrix license?

Edit: Nevermind, according to wikipedia they never had one.

 

[gamerk316]

Whatever happened to the Cyrix license?

Cyrix is part of Via, due to sale by National Semiconductor [who merged with Cyrix prior].

Oh, as an update, Via's ten year licenese agreement to make X86 processors ends in 2013.

 

[lilcinw]

Yup, catching up on x86 history right now.

post before google = bad

 

[jdwii]

Duh? Isn't that why they fired their previous CEO?

Anyways, I see them trying to push a reduced Trinity, rather then licensing ARM. I also predict, like all "low power" X86 offerings, it will be a failure in the mobile market. [X86 simply does not scale down very well...it wasn't designed with power efficency in mind.] Hence, I'm prediciting a disaster of epic proportions for AMD going forward.

I find this comment to be some what false how can Intel keep scaling down x86 but Amd can't with their APU? Plus its way more possible for Amd to work with arm then Intel working with them.

SO I guess Intels no longer a target? Is he basically saying screw the CPU market? Because last I checked thats where they can make the most money.

I think this means screw the high-end market. Amd can fight off Intel with their new APU's. They should also team up with arm.

 

[gamerk316]

I find this comment to be some what false how can Intel keep scaling down x86 but Amd can't with their APU?

APU = weak X86 core + strong integrated GPU. As a pure X86 processor, its horrible due to the cost overhead of its GPU portion. Makese sense as a system on a chip, or laptop setup, but not otherwise.

And I was saying that in general, X86's design does not scale well to low power tasks. See Atoms almost total failure in the low power smartphone market.

Plus its way more possible for Amd to work with arm then Intel working with them.

So after all the marketing BS about Fusion, which in theory should be well suited to smartphone markets, they should just become another ARM manufactuer?

 

[jdwii]

Question: Odds NVIDIA buys AMD within the next decade? Seems crazy, but it makes a LOT of sense, especially if NVIDIA is serious about breaking into the CPU market...

Why would this happen Amd is having their best year in a long time, Hell they may even make a profit this year as a whole. Every Quarter that's gone by Amd made a profit. Like i keep saying their graphics/APU's will keep them profitable if they don't go to crazy on spending. Also if them they team up with Arm they could make a little more money and even get into the Lower-end market more.

 

[jdwii]

I find this comment to be some what false how can Intel keep scaling down x86 but Amd can't with their APU?

APU = weak X86 core + strong integrated GPU. As a pure X86 processor, its horrible due to the cost overhead of its GPU portion. Makese sense as a system on a chip, or laptop setup, but not otherwise.

And I was saying that in general, X86's design does not scale well to low power tasks. See Atoms almost total failure in the low power smartphone market.

Plus its way more possible for Amd to work with arm then Intel working with them.

So after all the marketing BS about Fusion, which in theory should be well suited to smartphone markets, they should just become another ARM manufactuer?

They need to do both, Produce Arm CPU's and also integrate their graphics into the Arm processor. And they should also produce APU's for Laptops. Arm+AMD graphics for tablets(and smart Phones) and APU's for netbooks/Laptops.

 

[Cazalan]

woh woh woh.... Nvidia is thinking about entering the cpu market? 😵 damn, do they have the money for that being a mainly gpu company?

They're already shipping CPUs. Look up Tegra 2, Tegra 3. They're looking to take over the cell phone market.

 

[Cazalan]

won't nvidia face anti-trust regulations if they buy amd? they won't have any competitors in the discreet gfx/pro/workstation gfx market.

That doesn't matter much. The whole market is moving to integrated graphics. Cell phones, tablets, laptops, desktops. By the end of next year every CPU shipping will have integrated video.

You'll only need discrete video cards for multi-monitor displays and that market isn't that big.