Are people getting spoiled?

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lolz~~~ i'm outta here till my R9600pro~~~ and then i'm gonna ask u fanATics a s***load of questions!! BE PREPARE AND BE SCARED! VERY SCARED! especially those other R9600pro owners out there~~ (Grape ur the first one i'm picking on 😀)

despite all that. i'm still 120% nVboy 😀
Coolsquirtle, in another thread said:

the 9600XT is just there so i can laugh at it when i o/c my R9600pro like crazy and kicking it's ass <b><font color=red>😀</b></font color=red>
That's a pretty wide grin for an 120% nV fanboy that's being forced to suck ATi's cock by owning a 9600 Pro card.


My OS features preemptive multitasking, a fully interactive command line, & support for 640K of RAM!
 
"spoiled" is a relative term.

Like, if you can afford to eat breakfast, you're "spoiled" compared to someone in a third world country...

But that doesn't mean I should stop eating breakfast.

We live in an industrialized country and the standard of living is very high. We don't have to apologize for that.

Similarly, graphics technology has advanced to levels so high that todays bargain basement 3d accelerators for the masses(i.e. the radeon 9000/9200 & Geforce FX 5200) can kick the pants off of the top-end solutions of only a couple years ago (i.e. the Geforce2 GTS, which, like TKS says, rocked the Graphics card world at the time and had absolutely no competition).

Does this make the Geforce2 GTS useless? Far from it. Tons of games will play well on a GTS at 800*600 and sometimes even 1024*768... the original Max Payne, anything based on the quake 3 engine (with lower settings on some of the newer titles), the need for speed games... hell, all of the old standbys.

BUT if I'm going to recommend a graphics card to some poor uneducated noob on a forum like this one, well... I've got to go with what I feel is right. And if someone professes to want to play games, I'm certainly going to recommend at least a Radeon 9xxx or Geforce FX 5200 because the good 'ol GTS is a DirectX 7 class card and they'd be missing out. And the 9xxx and 5200 are pretty darn cheap, IMHO.

There's just too much info to pass on in a single post, and most of it wouldn't be understood by a newb anyhoo, so we have to deliver a very watered down synopsis, I think.

To summarize: Are we spoiled? Sure we are.

But that's a good thing, just like it's good that we can afford breakfast.

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Radeon 9500 (hardmodded to PRO, o/c to 322/322)
AMD AthlonXP 2400+ (o/c to 2600+ with 143 fsb)
3dMark03: 4055
 
Cleeve brings up a very good point. I don't think I can argue with that one bit.

My OS features preemptive multitasking, a fully interactive command line, & support for 640K of RAM!
 
I used a joystick:) It's the ONLY way to play Mechwarrior!

SIGNATURE: Stop asking people "whats up" or "hows it goin", you know you don't give a sh*t. And noone cares how you're doing either.

"We are far less than we knew." - Bright Eyes
 
And uh, I forgot what I was going to say but I can assure you it was extremely meaningful and eye opening, and could have changed your life if you let it, as I am a great philosopher and writer. But the greatness of my thoughts is too much to handle, and they have escaped me. I shall try to capture them and bestow their genius upon you at a later time. Peace.
ROFL.

--
<A HREF="http://www.lochel.com/THGC/album.html" target="_new"><font color=blue><b>This just in, over 56 no-lifers have their pics up on THGC's Photo Album! </b></font color=blue></A> :lol:
 
Are we jaded/spoiled. Perhaps. This question has come up before, I know we've talked about being jaded and taking things for granted before.

The thing is , should those of us who grew up with Commadore P.E.T.s , APPLE ][s and IBM PCs all with Monochrome monitors simply be satisfied that we have colour? What about those with Vic20s, etc.? Or those who's idea of electronic gaming was SIMON or Coleco Handheld?

The thing is not this or that SUX, it's this or that is/isn't worth the money. And that's not an easy question to answer.

<i>Fragglefart</i>, still defends the FX5900U, and that's his prerogative, however it's no so much that it's a CRAP card, it's simply not worth the premium they want and when compared to the competition it currently has, it IS an inferior package. Now things may change when DX9.1 comes out, or if the new DETs bring all they promise, but that's a risk, and based on some past events it's not certain anything will change for the better.

As for <i>CoolS'</i> comments about the upgrades, that can be the case, but some people like myself and Eden, have always advocated; 'DON'T buy a card in anticipation of a Game YET to be released, try and upgrade only once the games you buy aren't able to play on your current hardware. Of course the exceptions are; a) once in a blue moon purchases not wanting to be obsolete too soon, b) people looking to simply buy an all new rig. c) people who have someone else footing the bill, and d) people who simply want the very best (for whatever reasonS).
I have <A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=373987#373987" target="_new">advocated buying an R9600P to upgrade from a GF4ti</A>, but that was a very specific case, and even then I added a few caveats. Almost every time I'll stick with general categories: R9100/FX5200, GF4ti, R9600P, R9700np, R9800Pro. Now jumping from one category to the next one up doesn't warrant any great money expenditure IMO, and even then it's likely not going to be noticeable upgrade. Do alot of us slag the FX series, yes indeed, but I feel with ample 'objective' reasoning/points. I used to be a proponent of the FX5600U rev.2 as it did seem like a slightly superior card in some case, and I couldn't pick a winner in that category, UNTIL the DX9 results confirmed that there may be some shortcomings that now place it squarely behind the R9600P IMO. Now I agree that people saying (unless they are doing so jokingly, which some of us will do with the regulars all the time) that people should immediately RMA a card because it's not quite as good as another, that's ludicrous of course. However if someone is having problems with a card that are of a nature that they have to return the card anyway, or there is a chance that they could get a fairly large amount of money back from returning their purchase,why not advise them to do so? Of course you'll always have the people who will just say RMA that POS and get THIS instead, but anyone taking that at face value really needs to become a little more worldly in the ways of tech.

Are we spoiled, not if you payed for the technology yourself, and you earn the money you spend to replace it. Me I'm happy with my R9600P, however I would sell it/give it away tomorrow if I could slap an (R423 w/ PCI-EX adap.) in it's place (should the performance be much better than the R360) because I'm interested in it's features (even if it's a while before I exploit them fully, but it would be a longer term hold).

As for the 'expert' knowledge, seriously, everyone needs to take everything everyone says with a grain of salt. Heck even some of the stalwarts have their skeptics, as it should be. Being creative has it's place, but recommending a Xabre simply to change the monotony isn't a good idea either. I prefer being creative in the humourous sense, so that things aren't as dry (hopfully).

I think the main thing is to try and be genuine in your posts. I'd rather have an honest mistake (like yours) than someone who goes out of their way to misrepresent the facts, but does so by abusing their vast knowledge and experience. But that's just me I'm trying to learn, while trying to share what I'm learning, I hope that's why many would be here. But perhaps that's my own naïveté showing through.

BTW, if knowledge comprehension AND experience ARE proportional, then wouldn't knowledge and experience be proportional through 1/comprehension? :tongue:


- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com" target="_new"><font color=green>RED</font color=green> <font color=red>GREEN</font color=red></A> GA to SK :evil:
 
I agree with Ape of course, but i'd just like to add that I think my 9500 PRO is better than his 9600 PRO.

------------------
Radeon 9500 (hardmodded to PRO, o/c to 322/322)
AMD AthlonXP 2400+ (o/c to 2600+ with 143 fsb)
3dMark03: 4055
 
Nope.

Just using the opportunity to rub it in a little.

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Radeon 9500 (hardmodded to PRO, o/c to 322/322)
AMD AthlonXP 2400+ (o/c to 2600+ with 143 fsb)
3dMark03: 4055
 
And my 9700pro @ 9800 pro speeds pwnz them both.

Mwahahahaha!!

<A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k1=7000747" target="_new"> 3D-2001 </A>
<A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k3=1284380" target="_new"> 3D-03 </A>
<font color=red> 120% overclocker </font color=red> (cheapskate)
 
ROFL. :tongue:

<A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k1=7000747" target="_new"> 3D-2001 </A>
<A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k3=1284380" target="_new"> 3D-03 </A>
<font color=red> 120% overclocker </font color=red> (cheapskate)
 
good point cleeve...Now I want some cereal :tongue:

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<b>I'm not normally a religious man, but if you're up there, save me, Superman! </b> <i>Homer Simpson</i>
 
Yeah I completely agree. Especially the part on GF2 GTS is a piece of crap comments and similar.
I was insulted by a member here when I said the GF4MX (a gf2 core) performed 'admirably' in games on my P4 system.

In fact I was laughed at for it...I don't feel those people have been gaming on the PC for many years, nor been involved in the 'enthusiast' crowd for very long.

I don't honestly know alot about video and how it works (though I did learn alot about tilebased rendering@anandtech forums and I was quite the fanboy for kyros) but I know about the cards, the performance, the prices and the history because I've been an enthusiast for all my life, I'm only 21 but I started on a commodore 64 at a very young age, taught myself QBASIC (which I doubt the noobs here havent even heard of) at the age of 10 and have done many nerd things that I'm sure some of you can relate too like d/l games off of BBS's and chatting on prodigy was so cool.

I doubt many here could even tell me (without a google search) about rendition, what they did and their importance in the industry. Which is honestly a pretty interesting story.

The problem probably stems from the great influx of popularity in PCs during the mid 90s, when "multimedia PCs" took off and everyone ran out to buy a gateway 2000 with windows 95.
And those ppl didnt probably catch on to the enthusiast part of it until much later.
So they dont REALLY know all the history.
It woudl be nice to find others who wrote batch files to create their own installations of games in dos (i did so for my dad to easily install autocad10) and spent hours getting the most efficient use of their upper memory block and high memory area.. because memmaker (when it came around) simply sucked at doing it.

So you have some people with very short insight in the computer world and thats the majority.
For many of us, it also can change your outlook on intel considerably because you might have had to pay the prices they used to charge before AMD became a force for example. At the same time you have to have a certain amount of respect for them and MS because they created what we have today. For me sometimes the MS bashing gets annoying also.

I could be wrong, because I consider myself a newcomer to the PC arena, most of the stuff I've experienced is not that old really...and if I'm new that means alot of the people here are alot newer. Ok I'm done ranting as I dont know if i even have a point.. but I got to reminice (yep spelled wrong) for a few minutes!

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I just tell it like it is and some can't handle it. If your experience is different, well congratu-fukulation.
<b>I’M NOT A ATI FANBOY, I’M NOT A NV FANBOY, I’M A STABILITY FANBOY</b>
 
speaking of the geforce2 gts.....
I don't understand how people can say that it sucks?? and that it sucked when it came out!!! That card is awesome!!
I personally have never owned one, but i have 3 friends that STILL use them!! and they can all play ut2k3 just fine!! and that came out only half a year ago. something like 3 years after the geforce 2 gts was released.
 
Yeah your right, it rocked. I've said this before but I wish I woudl have never bought my Geforce3 after my GTS.. it was incredibly expensive, at launch it was even slightly slower than a GF2 Ultra.
The GF2 days were good times.

But my longest lasting 3d card had to have been the GTS, I think I could have used one and been happy up until HL2/Doom3 release.
I wouldnt have purchased 2 9800s but I wasnt expecting HL2 to be pushed back!
I assumed that while a GF2 couldve got you through the kickass DX6/7 era of games, and the rather lackluster DX8 era (IMHO).. a R300+ would last you through the DX9 era and probably DX10 as well as a GTS did in its time.

Now I am starting to believe that the NV40/R400(?) cards are the ones to buy for max longevity. As their hardware will be tuned even more so for HL2/D3, and those games will define what will become the DX9/10 era.
I doubt valve/id will build all new engines until DX11 is about due.

Hehe theres my speculation.
My point (I think) is that a 9800Pro or R400 should last you as long as a GTS did. But probably not as well as the GTS, it was exceptionally fast in its day.

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I just tell it like it is and some can't handle it. If your experience is different, well congratu-fukulation.
<b>I’M NOT A ATI FANBOY, I’M NOT A NV FANBOY, I’M A STABILITY FANBOY</b>
 
Yeah but once again, for the price they usually charge for the likes of the MXs, can't say I'd ever recommend one, nor congratulate someone for buying on recently.

There's a big difference between being a useable card, and being a good buy. The more people that find that out the better IMO.



- You need a licence to buy a gun, but they'll sell anyone a stamp <i>(or internet account)</i> ! <A HREF="http://www.redgreen.com" target="_new"><font color=green>RED</font color=green> <font color=red>GREEN</font color=red></A> GA to SK :evil:
 
oh no, we were talking about back when it was released.
the 4200 would be the min. i think any of us would recommend actually blowing money on.

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I just tell it like it is and some can't handle it. If your experience is different, well congratu-fukulation.
<b>I’M NOT A ATI FANBOY, I’M NOT A NV FANBOY, I’M A STABILITY FANBOY</b>