[Build Log] Mini-ITX PC - Middle School

[zeyuanfu]

Are you sure the cost is 375$?

 

[DonkeyOatie]

No. That's merely what I was told, and find hard to believe. Maybe it was just the computer that cost that much, but I'm having trouble even getting to that price.

 

[RazerZ]

- Yes, Trinity/Richland supports 2-4 monitors and that motherboard has 3 display outputs so it can work with three monitors.
- Yes, the "K" series denote an unlocked processor
- I believe it's either the Athlon X4 750k or 760k

 

[zeyuanfu]

My theory would be that unless the person who gave you the price of that computer is one of your superiors, the competitor is understating the price for you to offer a lower price to be able to compete with them, thus offering lower-end components.

 

[zeyuanfu]

- Yes, Trinity supports 2-4 monitors and that motherboard has 3 display outputs so it can work with three monitors.
- Yes, the "K" series denote an unlocked processor
- I believe it's either the Athlon X4 750k or 760k

Unless I`m VERY wrong, Athlon X4 CPUs don`t have any integrated graphics.

 

[RazerZ]

I never said they did.

 

[zeyuanfu]

Then why mention motherboard display outs when they can't be used?

 

[RazerZ]

The A8 has an integrated gpu... it can make use of the motherboard display outputs.

The 750k/760k would need a discrete graphics card capable of running triple monitors.

 

[zeyuanfu]

You kinda said that you ''believe it's either the Athlon X4 750K or 760K''...

 

[RazerZ]

Yes. It's one of those CPUs minus the integrated graphics. Let's not overcomplicate things.

 

[DonkeyOatie]

Zeyuanfu. I think you are losing the big picture. The information we have says:

Modern dedicated graphics processor.

If this is the discrete GPU we think it is, then the CPU does not need an iGPU. In the proposed builds I'm doing, I stop when I run out of money, and the GPU is always the last item I choose so I can select the best possible unit with the remaining budget.

I'm getting the information from a parent who considered getting the course for their child, but did not. It is only a vague recollection.

I'm working in an 'upright' industry. We strive for maximum success and, after costs and overheads, there is no profit to be made. We are all interested in bigger pies. From a practical aspect, they have no clue what I'm planning and would have no reason to mislead someone who might be a client. The only competition that exists is the market making choices based on what is being offered. People who take my course may do so because it is cheaper, better, or nearer (for three).

RazerZ, any GPU can run three monitors if it has Eyefinity, right?

I still don't think that an APU is a modern dedicated graphics processor but, semantically, perhaps it is.

 

[RazerZ]

Depends on the number of outputs it has, the motherboard (if talking APUs), and whether or not it has a display port. Eyefinity tech. only works with a max of two non display display port outputs.

Actually looking back at the motherboard in that build, it has no display ports so using eyefinity it can run two monitors. It technically can run three monitors, but I'm not sure how well it would work for gaming if they were monitors of different sizes.

 

[DonkeyOatie]

So we must be looking at AMD GPUs with Displayport? The cheapest seems to be a 260.

 

[zeyuanfu]

I doubt a 260 can handle BF4 with triple monitors at a steady 60 FPS.

 

[DonkeyOatie]

I'm thinking that it must be each one, independently.

Can it run something on triple monitors? (BF3?, Arma, ...) Yes (but not at 60FPS or 1080p)
Can it run something at 60 FPS? (MineCraft) Yes (but not on three monitors or 1080p)
Can it run something at 1080p (anything) Yes (but not at 60FPS or on three monitors)

And at about $80, the 260 still blows the budget.

 

[zeyuanfu]

If it's all three at the same time, though, that kinda brings us back to my theory of price understatement.
It IS possible that the people at the competition made it sound like it's all at the same time and not independently.

 

[RazerZ]

So we must be looking at AMD GPUs with Displayport? The cheapest seems to be a 260.

Seems like it. Maybe a R7 250x??? (not sure).

They're definitely cutting corners someway or the other, if they actually deliver what they claim to. Your proposed questions seem like a fit for the build's description.

My guess is that they are stretching the truth in some areas. By quad core with overclocking, they could even mean an AMD Sempron 3850. The powerful 450W PSU could be nothing more than some Raidmax junk unit. It's powerful enough to start a fire when it explodes :lol:

Or maybe they're getting the OS free through some sort of program with Microsoft?

 

[DonkeyOatie]

Sempron? That's the old AM1 isn't it? Is that still useful?

 

[RazerZ]

AM1 is relatively new since it came out this year. The Sempron is of the Kabini lineup. It just re uses the old Sempron name. It's powerful enough to work for a basic use pc, and with a graphics card added it could do some light gaming.

 

[DonkeyOatie]

Sorry for the confusion. I though Sempron was an 10 year old CPU. (Since I knew of it )

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: AMD 3850 1.3GHz Quad-Core Processor ($36.00 @ Amazon)
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-AM1M-S2P Micro ATX AM1 Motherboard ($28.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws X Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-2133 Memory ($59.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Seagate Barracuda 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($50.49 @ OutletPC)
Video Card: MSI Radeon R7 260 1GB Video Card ($69.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Rosewill REDBONE U3 ATX Mid Tower Case ($24.99 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: Apevia 450W ATX Power Supply ($19.99 @ Mwave)
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium SP1 (OEM) (64-bit) ($88.98 @ OutletPC)
Total: $379.41
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-12-06 12:09 EST-0500

Still about $125 too expensive! Unless that's it ($375) and the tuition is extra.

Can that do any of what has been claimed (even with a squint and a following wind)?

 

[RazerZ]

Just the thought of that Apevia PSU makes me uneasy.

Across three monitors the only game that would probably run ok would be minecraft, but even that I'm unsure of. For one monitor it should run light games which aren't very tasking on the CPU. Not recommending it by all means though, just giving my thoughts on its capabilities.

 

[DonkeyOatie]

Of course RazerZ. I'm glad this discussion is off the main-line. It might give children the wrong idea.

This is actually very good for me if we are right. My computer is much sounder than this. This is starting to look like a Boson, only worse. (which I though was impossible).

Let's be generous and put in an Antec Basiq 450.

 

[DonkeyOatie]

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: AMD 3850 1.3GHz Quad-Core Processor ($39.98 @ Newegg)
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-AM1M-S2H Micro ATX AM1 Motherboard ($32.98 @ OutletPC)
Memory: G.Skill Ares Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($54.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Seagate Barracuda 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($51.49 @ OutletPC)
Video Card: MSI Radeon R7 260 1GB Video Card ($69.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Antec VSK-3000 MicroATX Mid Tower Case ($24.99 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: Antec 450W ATX Power Supply ($29.99 @ Newegg)
Total: $296.41
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-12-07 13:31 EST-0500

OK. This is getting to the right place, but has no OS and has a bunch of rebates and discounts.

I think that it technically meets everything (expect the OSs) if we look at every claim as an independent issue. (60FPS in something, 1080p in something, and three monitors in something)

My system lacks the GPU but is fundamentally sounder. To make mine do what they say they can do, you could probably just add a 270X and add an OS.

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i3-4150 3.5GHz Dual-Core Processor ($97.27 @ NCIX US)
Motherboard: ASRock H97M PRO4 Micro ATX LGA1150 Motherboard ($82.98 @ Newegg)
Memory: G.Skill Sniper 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($78.95 @ OutletPC)
Storage: Seagate Barracuda 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($51.49 @ OutletPC)
Case: Azza SIRIUS ATX Mid Tower Case ($40.98 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: Antec Neo Eco 520W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply ($52.98 @ OutletPC)
Total: $404.65
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-12-07 13:37 EST-0500

To actually do anything useful, they need to change the GPU, CPU, and PSU.

 

[zeyuanfu]

I think the Sempron might bottleneck some mid-end GPUs.

 

[DonkeyOatie]

Probably will, but we aren't really using mid-end GPUs. I think the 260 is below the middle.